What is Digg?72 Comments
- inactive, on 10/12/2007, -1/+4Bash microsoft for a lot of things; security, ignorance etc...but I have no idea why people still bring up stability. Have you guys even tried winxp? I've had it since launch and it crashed on me once. Before OSX, mac's were the symbol for all things unstable.Atleast windows showed a BSOD, if a mac froze(and it did so often) it'd just sit there providing the user with no information. Anyhow it's great that Microsoft is building an OS from the ground up but it'd prolly be a side project. They'll prolly milk Windows till they can get no more out of their users, kinda like videogame sequels...we'll prolly be at Final Fantasy XXXIV and Resident Evil XXI and Halo 15 before anything significant happens with Singularity
- beaversit.com, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1They're writing the OS in a new language? God, I hope it's Klingon! Those dialogues and menus would RULE!
- beejay54, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1I'm a bit of a mac zealot myself. But this does sound interesting, there is no reason why the biggest software company in the world shouldn't be respected by us geeks. Our biggest complaint is that Windows is un-dependable and un-stable. I use OS X everyday, but windows does 'feel' a little faster (who knows once these Intel macs come out), but windows definitely is still flaky.
- xenlab, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1"I still say what the world needs is a minimalist OS that supplies the bare minimum services to get a computer running, and let 3rd parties supply all the rest."
they do. it's called linux. - linuxmatt, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1This is pretty old news, but still diggworthy. Here's a link to the movie on MSFT's Channel9:
http://channel9.msdn.com/Showpost.aspx?postid=68302
And in terms of innovation, this was done with Java years ago. Neat to see MSFT put their resources behind such a concept. - physivic, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0or money... I think non-OS experts like myself would benefit from a direct comparison to UNIX derivatives and this new SIP paradigm.
- Uber-Geek, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0Honestly, that's what Windows Vista should have been all along. We are fine with XP right now, start working on something from scratch now. We're only on Service Pack 2 for XP, doesn't 2000 and NT have like 6 or 7 SP's already?
- lordsandwich, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0I'm guessing this is a pure-research endeavor for the time being, and not an official development path. Otherwise Vista is an even bigger turkey than we'd imagined.
- KaptainKarst, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0What a concept "Reliable"....
- boinko, on 10/12/2007, -1/+1I think the best thing Microsoft could do at this point is look beyond Windows -- literally. I'd bet some cash that folks at Microsoft are saying this, too -- that once Vista is out, the best thing to do is move beyond -- abandon -- the 'Windows' brand.
- Prod_Deity, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0MSFT is to research is what military is to intelligence
- Elranzer, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0Since Microsoft eventually does copy evertyhing Apple does, maybe just maybe this is Microsoft's attempt at porting their OS to a UNIX-type platform.
Once the two big boys (Mac OS X and Windows) are both based on UNIX, and with Linux out there too (and Macs running on x86 now), we may finally see some real "singularity" and portability between computing platforms and enter a new age. - jav1231, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0This could be MS seeking to explore new avenues and design techniques. What I find interesting is that there are no screenshots and really nothing particularly tangeable. The big question is that if they are starting from the ground up to write a dependable OS, what does this say of Vista? That's it status quo. No?
- gaspero1, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0"Have you guys even tried winxp?"
I run Windows XP via Virtual PC in Mac OS X on my Powerbook. It's actually quite stable after removing about 45 unneccessary services that were turned on by default. After turning the network completely off in Vitual PC it's nice and secure now too. - inactive, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0would it be a removable singularity? a pole? or an essential singularity?
- Dracos, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0MS finally figured out that they can do anything they want with BSD?
"Singularity" is typical MS thinking... they want this OS to be everything.
And I agree with boinko: someone in Redmond knows that Vista is doomed. - HeWhoIsPale, on 10/12/2007, -3/+3The current one is based on performance?
- raindog469, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0OK, I'm no fan of Microsoft, but announcing the beginning of development of Singularity now, as they're ramping up Vista, is different from them announcing Cairo almost 15 years ago.... how exactly?
It doesn't mean they're releasing something right after Vista. It means they're getting back into operating system R&D and (like many other pie in the sky OS projects.... can you say GNU?) the collateral achievements will probably amount to more than the final OS. - RWVolkl158, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0While this is definitely a good thing, how about we get Vista finished up before we start talking about this eh? Possibly without taking any more features out? Thanks MS!
- Sirocco, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0This seems to preclude the possibility of compiler optimization, which is probably where they're assuming their performance penalties come from.
I still say what the world needs is a minimalist OS that supplies the bare minimum services to get a computer running, and let 3rd parties supply all the rest. - isalpha, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0Hmm, it's written in C#. Nothing wrong with that, but I'd hoped for something a bit more revolutionary...
Microsoft has employed a lot of experts from the Haskell community so I thought it might be based on Haskell. To see what an OS based on Haskell looks like see House (http://www.cse.ogi.edu/~hallgren/House/). For reasons why you might care about this sort of thing, read:
http://www.jwz.org/doc/worse-is-better.html
"The good news is that in 1995 we will have a good operating system and programming language; the bad news is that they will be Unix and C++." - Namco, on 10/12/2007, -1/+1Microsoft jumped the shark with Windows ME.
But what ever happened to the OS they were developing that combined Windows CE, ME, and NT? It was going to be called Windows CEMENT if I recall correctly. - drwilliams, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0Interesting, in theory at least. Seems like they are using software protection (like Java, as mentioned above) versus the hardware protection found in all modern CPU's.
Even though I am not an expert, it seems kind of scary to have EVERYTHING running in ring 0 and thereby completely bypassing the hardware protection. While hardware protection might not be the ultimate solution in the quest for a truly secure system, why not use it if it is available?
The only reason I see to be running applications (i.e. user-mode stuff) at ring 0 is to prevent the overhead of context switches between different rings...that is performance (exactly what they said this OS is NOT about). - bitz, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0Right now
Microsoft research = Producing better Drm = only focused on pleasing the media companies = screwing users and consumers as much as possible
Anything good for us users will not be coming from Microsoft anytime soon.
Such as a os like linux, you know something clean, secure, lacking any advanced drm "protection".
Microsoft like many companies are not focused on the customers needs, but instead on their own agendas and in Microsoft's case taking care of a few large groups such as governments and corporations.
Microsoft and its Windows os is not geared towards home users at all and probably will never be. - FunHeadlines, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0Sounds good. Microsoft should move beyond Windows, but their corporate customers will never allow that.
Besides, if Microsoft decided to make Singularity their top priority after the release of Vista, and put all their teams on it full-time, we could expect an announcement of a beta release in Q1 2008, followed by a new announcement of Q1 2009, and then a slippage to Q4, followed by a greatly abbreviated version of Singularity (basically Vista with the trash icon replaced by a black hole icon) released in 2010.
OK, I'm just having fun. In fact, if they dumped the cruft of Windows and started from scratch, they could do some great things. It's the Windows anchor that holds them down. - cybertron3, on 10/12/2007, -1/+1I think it is more unpredictability... more fun that way...
But seriously, they need to get Vista out BEFORE they dedicate resources to this. (Unless they are planning on it being a total failure so it wont matter) - TC-14, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0What's up with all the "Winzdoze" slagging? Jesus, there's such an increase in the anti-Microsoft fellowship its unbelievable. Windows XP isn't a that bad operating system. In fact I coudl guarantee that over 50% of this sites visitors use a version of Windows.
Sure, I think all Operating Systems have their advantages and disadvantages, Windows has a high amount of software available for it yet it is most prone to viruses and such, and you may complain about its GUI but I like it. Mac OSX is a simplicit OS which has a nice GUI but it can be a bit slower than what Windows is since more resources are spent on its GUI. Also OSX doesn't have the software availability that Windows has, although it does have some exclusive software just like Windows and Linux have. Most Linux distros are totally free, highly secure and for me, has been a very responsive OS. However its probably the most complex of the three Operating Systems and things such as compiling from source is goign to be difficult for the average home user, although good enough for those better-than-average users.
Sure, Vista may be taking some of its GUI from OSX, but isn't that a good thing? If people like the look of OSX and fin dthat Vista looks similar, then surely thats a step in the right direction that Microsoft are learning a thing or two about GUIs from Apple? Shame that some people here only care about being 'l33t' and 'anti'-Microsoft' and 'Linux geeks' or 'I buy anything that has a lower case i in front of it'.
Good to see Microsoft creating a development operating system. Hopefully they uncover something good which we can all benefit from. - kidlinux, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0Microsoft would have abandoned Windows a long time ago if it didn't entail the near certainty of giving up their monopoly on the OS market.
- gab00n, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0How can you comment on OS X if you've never used it you tard? Windows Vista has some cool new features so they shouldn't give up on it yet. All they need to do is trim it down, get it stable, release it and then finish the other features they wanted to add and slowly release them.
- Crazyguy, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0Are they trying to undercut Vista?
- Cander, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0Thanks for proving my point Prod Deity and bitz. Complete ignorance of what MS Research is. Too busy to throw in your trolling quips than to actually know what you are talking about.
- inactive, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0>Bash microsoft for a lot of things; security, ignorance etc...but I have no
>idea why people still bring up stability.
i guess my answer would have to be:
>Have you guys even tried winxp?
>Before OSX, mac's were the symbol for all things unstable.Atleast windows
>showed a BSOD, if a mac froze(and it did so often) it'd just sit there >providing the user with no information.
No. You are re-reporting microsoft FUD. Which shows the desperation for
finding a rationalization to call XP ok. Compare it to an OS that was is
not used. - BackRub, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0MS can call it SOS! sounds about right...
- frem001, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0they had a discussion about it and now it's a development. O_K
- pondster, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0Just watch, Vista is going to be the MS BOB of the new generation! LOL
- apersaud, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0Hmm.. operating system based on an object oriented programming language.... where have we heard this before..... (NeXT Computer)
- NGNR, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0I hope they are not referring to a gravitational singularity, because once you cross the event horizon at the Schwarzschild radius, there is no return. If you do, I will see you than at the point of infinite space-time curvature, more precisely, I will be able to see ALL OF YOU [singular].
- Sirocco, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0Yes, may I *PLEASE* have an OS that doesn't consume 30% of my system resources and ~25% of my CPU cycles just running services I don't even NEED?
- zenghost, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0well...if this is all true, hopefully windows will do something right for once...from the start.
- monkeymagik, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0wtf? they haven't even got XP right and vista/longhorn is over 2 years late!
- Cheeze_Head, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0Small OS that works? eh?
http://www.menuetos.net/ - etruscan, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0Bear in mind this is a research development, and I don't think it's really planned to see the light of day. MS will not "abandon the Windows brand" any time soon, but it would be nice to see them rebuild it from the group up and literally trim it down to something leaner and meaner.
- azar, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0@ math_Genius
I didn't know OS X was lacking self confidence. Dumbass. - Cander, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0Why does hardly anyone understand what MS Research is?
- Trjn, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0""Everyone knows OS X is secure and stable"
Dumbass. Every one knows OSX is insecure, ugly and unstable."
Why aren't you the little troll?
Anyhow, if OS X is so insecure then why can you count the amount of viruses on it with the fingers on one head? And its not solely because of its small market share, there have been some security issues, but none exploited to my knowledge.
As for stability, the only times my iBook crashes is when I connect to my brother's WinXP box and either something happens on the router or his computer which kills that connection without warning.
And finally, ugly, a subjective term AT BEST but a completely null point considering the vast amount of skins available for every OS that is in common us so if you don't like the look, you can change it.
As for the actual subject, I assume this is simply a research project, considering its done by MS research, undoubtably it won't be released to the public, but the consequences of it might prove interesting, but I swear I heard that one of the reasons that Vista was delayed for so long was because they had to rebuild it from scratch.
So, the rebuilding from scratch thing isn't what interests me, its what they decide to change about future OSs that they make based on what they find out from this. - chosenone-, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0Erm... yay!
- brett.evans, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0HAHAHAHA might as well get started now because the current one is taking 7 years.
- Jarda, on 10/12/2007, -1/+0Lets hope itsn't something related to a UNIX.
- ProAm500, on 10/12/2007, -1/+0OMG M$ Windoze is teh suxzors....
Now hopefully the haters will chill out......
But I agree boinko, I kinda thought they would start doing this....its time to move away from the Windows brand all together....I thought Blackcomb was the next down the line though....oh well, anyway, maybe they will leave some people behind, but they need to move forward... -
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