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- mbabauer, on 10/12/2007, -14/+52Just one more reason I switched to Mac for my desktop and Linux (Gentoo) for my servers. Thanks M$ for all your hard work!
- phpirate, on 10/12/2007, -6/+33This is why you don't use anything from live. If you use the live services, you are supporting microsoft and killing google. If google dies, Microsoft once again owns a monopoly, and will have absolutely no reason to improve or innovative on those ripped off services since it doesn't benifit them.
The trend that google is showing is that they innovate and offer new free products without there being a market for competition (they are simply interested in increasing their userbase). - aggieandrew, on 10/12/2007, -1/+25Microsoft wants to be the only game in town. It wants to be what you use for everything. I wouldn't say it want's to control everything, it just wants to be what you use to control everything. It views EVERYONE as its competitor. Why does it view google as an enemy? Because they are the best at what they do: search and advertising. Why did they view Netscape as an enemy? Because it was best (at the time) at what it did. If you're the best at what you do in technology, Microsoft gets jealous and wants to bring you down.
Sorry, I tend to ramble when I'm bored. - scarolan, on 10/12/2007, -2/+19I have all but given up on MS Adcenter. I first tried to sign up with Firefox on my Linux laptop - no dice. Ok, so the next option is the User Agent Switcher Extension. Nope. I then tried IE with Crossover Office, but it hung on the signup page. Finally ended up using a virtual machine running Windows XP and was able to create an account. But this was just the beginning.
Their instructions for exporting and importing Google Adwords ads do not match what's on their website, so I hunted around for the proper template, unable to find it. After two or three calls to their tech support, someone gave me the wrong template file which I was unable to use. Then I called back again and finally got the right template file, copied my Adwords ads over and got ready to upload . . .
An error message comes back stating that the file I was uploading was not a valid Excel file. WTF? I had just created and saved this file in Excel a few moments before. Took a screenshot and sent them the screenshot along with the Excel file, and their tech support tells me that it won't work because my ads are longer than 30 characters. 30 characters? Thats only 4-6 words, yet if you enter your ads manually you get the full 70 characters.
Microsoft has got a LOOOOOOOOOOONG way to go to catch up with Google and Yahoo in terms of usability. MS Adwords is a pain in the ass to use even if you are using Microsoft(tm) approved software. They won't be getting any of our dollars for a while, cause I just don't have the time or resources to type in 2000 ads by hand. - thecwin, on 10/12/2007, -1/+16Actually there is a significant difference between showing a message (while still allowing them to access the page) that asks people get a near standards complaint browser that's free for nearly all major operating systems so that they can hope that one day they won't have to write hacks for IE, and refusing access to the site if you're not running a browser that is only available on one paid platform that runs on one type of system (x86).
- DevanJedi, on 10/12/2007, -7/+22I agree. This case is really extreme,; I think this is one of the first times they have directly harmed one division of their company in order to prop up IE. In the past, most behavior of this kind has had indirect detrimental effects.
- inactive, on 10/12/2007, -3/+17Excellent article.. This company rivalry is killing the people and Microsoft is having it's eyes fully closed. What a shame, this service does have potential.
@MS: Listen to your people, after all web 2.0 is all about that:: http://chronotron.wordpress.com/2006/04/30/hey-big-guy-are-you-listening/ - firehydra2k, on 10/12/2007, -0/+13I think Microsoft should stop wasting their time with IE and hand it over to Mozilla and Opera. They're not improving IE one bit to beat all other competition. IE pisses off computer illiterate users as well as a huge sore thumg for web designers.
And the fact that all they do is copy from others just pisses me off. - m00nmaster, on 10/12/2007, -6/+19*Calling all Digg users*
We need everyone to send a courteous feedback requesting that they stop sucking (Use your own terminology) and add support for non-IE browsers. An influx of feedback will force a change.
Send feedback here: https://adcenter.msn.com/Signup.aspx and click "Give us Feedback" - Herolint, on 10/12/2007, -0/+12It is exactly this Microsoft mentality that forced me over to Linux and BSD in the first place. I'll admit, I liked what I saw when I got there, but still...
Microsoft's tying everything it makes to everything else it makes and trying to make everything proprietary is why I won't use any of their products. If everybody had Microsoft's mentality, there would be no Internet, I wouldn't be typing this right now, and you wouldn't be reading it. - robbyt, on 10/12/2007, -4/+15I had to call them because their forms didn't support firefox. I spent a half hour with a guy who tried to help me find internet explorer for ubuntu.... :D
http://support.adcenter.msn.com/ - dtfinch, on 10/12/2007, -1/+12I swear, Microsoft doesn't want my money. They lock everything up so tight that they have nothing of value left to offer. And when that doesn't work they resort to "independent" studies, lobbying, FUD, and customer harrassment.
- r00tus3r, on 10/12/2007, -2/+12Personally, I don't use anything from Microsoft unless I'm at work, and even when I'm there, if I have the option, I run Linux. I simply can't take the fake security updates and constant threats of checking to see if my software is legal or not. Add to that the fact that windows comes with virtually NOTHING, and most linux distros these days come with everything you need (or have it easily available free of cost with FREE UPGRADES) it's really a no brainer. Why should a consumer have to pay hundreds of dollars for Micrsoft Office after already paying hundreds for their OS? Then, on top of that, be forced to pay MORE when it's time for an "upgrade" ?
- ViRaZ, on 10/12/2007, -5/+14Three main products to get:
Linux
Firefox
Open Office - babbling, on 10/12/2007, -2/+11Why do you want to give them feedback? They obviously did this on purpose, and since they did it on purpose, I don't really feel like they deserve to be told that they're shooting themselves in the foot.
- atdigg, on 10/12/2007, -3/+11Microsoft will win or die fighting. Microsoft will die if it wants to fight by supporting loser products like IE.
- 7of7, on 10/12/2007, -0/+8I can tell you're like me and only use Firefox, Opera, Safari, etc.. I have my UA set to IE for both FF and Opera and there are numerous pages that do indeed have a feature blocking AJAX popup that whines about IE. You know those annoying advertisements that aren't really popups that follow you down the page? There are quite a few sites that have those set to popup only if the UA is set to IE.
- philmunt, on 10/12/2007, -0/+8If Microsoft keep this sort of stuff up they'll monopolize themselves out of existance. I'd hardly call Adcenter a "killer app". Most Linux/Mac/Firefox/Opera users aren't gonna change there browser or OS over it. They really are costing themselves money.
- haxx4, on 10/12/2007, -2/+10Microsoft wants to control the way people view the Internet! Literally! Don't let it continue! Use an open-source alternative, although I must say Opera is an excellent browser.
- DevanJedi, on 10/12/2007, -2/+9This is true- and the only thing I would add to that is that in this case they are repeating their past behavior while clearly and immediately damaging another division of their own company.
- moochfish, on 10/12/2007, -1/+7Why would an advertiser want to put ads on a network that has problems supporting other browers? Even if their ads DID display in every other browser in the world, I may conclude otherwise if I see reports of advertisers getting blocked out of the service because they use a Mac. They may have most of the browser market, but it's still a big slice. That equates to 10% less revenue for an advertiser compared to an equivalent ad served on Google's network that everybody can see.
This is just a bad business move if they're doing it on purpose. My first assumption is that they developed it on IE and haven't had a chance to make it work with Firefox yet, but I can't speak on their behalf. - dtfinch, on 10/12/2007, -3/+8It's not covering the story in my firefox.
- ericpp, on 10/12/2007, -0/+5I wonder how much of this is actually Microsoft and how much of it is lazy web developers. I assume they are required to use MSIE for designing websites. Anyone whos designed a website knows that anything strictly tested under MSIE will probably not work in Mozilla/Firefox.
- saska, on 10/12/2007, -2/+6"I had to call them because their forms didn't support firefox. I spent a half hour with a guy who tried to help me find internet explorer for ubuntu.... "
Sorry, I call ***** on that one. I used the feedback form from Firefox. Then I used it from Opera. - saska, on 10/12/2007, -0/+4This is short-sighted and painful to watch. Designing an ad tracking system that does not track users of all browsers doesn't just mean they don't have to pay site owners for click-throughs or views. It means their customers won't have accurate statistics about view count or click-through, and I can't imagine it will be easy to get them to pay for inaccurate data.
- shmatt, on 10/12/2007, -0/+4well I use innovative products that AREN'T ripped off from more innvoative competitors who got there first.
- TheAttacks, on 10/12/2007, -3/+7I can't believe they would actually do something like that. I wonder what they would say if a Linux user, like myself, sent them the same email. Maybe they would just call me a hippy communist (is there such thing?). . .
- DevanJedi, on 10/12/2007, -2/+6Yeah, it was pretty shocking. I'm a Linux user too and I shudder at the thought :D
- merr, on 10/12/2007, -2/+6Hehe... that make me thinkg of this: http://explorerdestroyer.com/
- phpirate, on 10/12/2007, -1/+5"i support the best technology." The problem with that is, microsoft may add ajax and a few more flash things here and there, but the real innovation comes from google. Support the innovation and not the immatation.
- Tipa, on 10/12/2007, -0/+475% of a web developer's JOB is making it work with IE, FF, etc. My life would be a LOT easier if I could just use IE, but until IE is the only browser out there, I have no choice but to support them all. Microsoft web developers are still web developers and should do what all the rest of us have to. No excuse.
- ekstasis16, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3@EvilDoer: Are you f'in kidding me? OS X is an entirely different platform than Windows. If Apple doesn't want to commit resources to creating a whole different build of theit major apps, I can understand that. By your logic, I could complain that Microsoft isn't supporting Linux. Why can't I run Outlook on Ubuntu? Or how about Adobe not releasing Premiere for OS X anymore? Lots of companies are doing this. Supporting multiple platforms is a lot more expensive than having a website support multiple browsers on the same platform. Microsoft has just plain gone overboard on this one...
- seemsArtless, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3I sent a comment asking them to support FireFox, as I'm sure a bunch of other people did, so now we can see if it was just an oversight by the 'lazy web developers' or if it was intentional. (And come on, anyone who creates web pages for a living, even if it is just PART of their job, knows to test their work with the major browsers, on major platforms).
- greenflash, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3Microsoft has a lot of smart developers. I can't imagine that they would be so stupid to think that their web services only have to function with IE. Perhaps it is (unwritten) company policy. It worked in the past with regular windows applications, but it won't work for web applications and services. It is not a closed off environment anymore. Many Windows users like myself now use Firefox. Microsoft may still get a lot of users this way, but it will not be enough to dethrone Google or Yahoo. Frankly i think it must be frustrating for many Microsoft developers to know that their web apps will never be cool because most influential internet users don't use IE.
- diggnationdevon, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3Please comment on the article, no one cares about your personal experiences.
- acurism, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3I seriously have had it with Microsoft, I wish all of the people will start waking up out there as stop using their products.
- Haroldx, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2They're putting IE in front of their customers? Wow. In a few years they won't have anything.
- SpyDerMann, on 10/12/2007, -2/+4Guys, if you want to help the competition destroy Microsoft, try collaborating wit the ReactOS (a free alternative to MS Windows) project. I've heard they'll be participating in Google's summer-of-code.
www.reactos.org - toddhenkel, on 10/12/2007, -2/+4A google psa/red cross ad was covering a bit of the text when I viewed it. I typically attribute that to CSS layouts gone bad - not browser issues.
Stick to the basics for web designs please! - sirber, on 10/12/2007, -1/+3Erreur : checkLength is not defined
Fichier source : http://feedback.adcenter.msn.com/eform.aspx?productKey=adcenter&locale=en-us
Ligne : 1
Can't feedback!!! :( - jasutton, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2I don't have any reason to trust Digg as a source of info either, but I still read it. And besides, I went to the AdCenter website myself to see the problem in person. You can't get information more trustworthy than personal experience. :)
- MasterDwarf, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2Wow. Just wow. They really are getting rediculous. A very stupid business decision on their part, IMO.
- inactive, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2After 17 years, I've had enough of their crap when they decided to spy on my desktop without my knowledge or permission in the latest updates. I'm now a happy Ubuntu / Firefox / OpenOffice user at work and at home. *****-Off M$.
- ocram, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1"Microsoft has chosen the growth of IE over every other division in the company for 10 years now."
The only product's market share which has decreased in that time is IE, why will things be any different in the next 10 years? - einarf, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1What the hell are they thinking? Limiting their service to the most crappy web browser currently in the market? IE6 have been a nightmare for people trying to make web-content and design for quite some time now. Why oh why?
- astrotrain, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1Its just another way Uncle Bill likes to do business... he likes shoving things down ppls throats. Oh well if I can help it I just won't be visting those web pages. And if needed there is always the IE TAB extention for Firefox.
- 1337guy, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1"Thank you for taking the time to give us your feedback on Microsoft adCenter. We are committed to customer satisfaction and your feedback is very important to us. Please use the form below to provide us details about your suggestions. We will use it to keep improving the Microsoft adCenter platform. Due to the number of comments received, we cannot respond individually."
Hahaha, customer satisfaction? Actually they are NOT commited to customer satisfaction because they act like standards don't exist. Even the signup page with the browser error has 49 errors if you put it through the W3C validator. - MoreBonez, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1There is a difference between annoying and blocking users, but how many people would throw a fit if Microsoft did the former? To say that 7of7's argument is invalid misses the point.
- thefinger, on 10/12/2007, -1/+2I fear the day that MS dominates the market on toilet paper. We'll all be stuck using single ply.
- DevanJedi, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1No, you actually have no reason to trust me at all. Just try everything I say in my article for yourself- the links, the details and the screenshots are all there.
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