What is Digg?612 Comments
- adamgetsawesome, on 01/04/2008, -4/+234People really need to start reading manuals for what they purchase... Unsecured networks are the new blinking 12:00 on a vcr.
- doshindude, on 01/04/2008, -55/+269If you're stupid enough to not encrypt, then you deserve to have people piggybacking off you.
- qetuo, on 01/04/2008, -9/+92Its wrong to hack into someone's network, if you cant just gain access to a certain network by selecting it, move on and leave it alone. But if the network is open, and all you have to do is select it, and you have access, then i don't see a problem in doing so. At the end of the day if you only want to allow certain people to access your network, then close and lock the imaginary door on your network!
If you use an open network that you do not pay for remember respect! Respect the network, don't use things that will use a lot of bandwidth. - floridiot2, on 01/04/2008, -17/+93So using the internet and shooting someone is equal now?
I think a better one would be having your front door open, with a big sign in front of your house saying "OPEN HOUSE". - holyskeleton, on 01/04/2008, -15/+90I use it because I can. bitches.
- omelette, on 01/04/2008, -3/+77Please, I'm sick of people using the "you left your doors unlocked, its your fault" analogy... it only reinforces people's thoughts that using an open network is stealing. The truth of it is that there is a handshake that occurs when joining an open network that is an emphatic granting of permission. A more correct analogy would be having a butler letting people into your house that you don't want there... you can't blame the people there... you just forgot to tell the help that you didn't want to be disturbed. The truth is, the piggy-backers knocked on your door politely, someone answered and said, "hello, come in, have some tea." If you don't want people coming in, instruct the person who answers the door to turn people away. Simple as that.
- inactive, on 01/04/2008, -2/+53What is up with all of these generic comments? Are these bots or just idiots?
- cyberdependent, on 01/04/2008, -0/+45I've got a question for the great mass of individuals here smarter than I...
I bought a used 54g router a few years back from the repair shop I worked at. Plugged it in and it worked with nothing on my part, so I figured I'd just leave it... as long as what I wanted worked okay, no harm no foul! Well, recently our connection kept getting slower and slower. Finally I downloaded a manual and logged on to my router to see that I was hosting quite a few leaches. Turned on WEP and stopped SSID broadcasting and *whammo* my net speeds were back up.
But now I'm feeling a bit of ethical remorse... I live in a very poor neighborhood where many children live in relative squalor for America. Personally I believe that access to the internet and the information it contains is among the best chances for some of these kids to be able to do well in school, see value in knowledge over drugs or guns, or at least be exposed to the fact that a world does exist outside of our 'hood... but I don't want them dragging down my bandwith using P2P or whatever.
Is there a way to only "partially" secure my network... perhaps allowing anonymous logging on to a certain bitrate or something? Even if it means buying a second router?
Sorry, I know this isn't really the right place for this sort of thing, but I know whomever felt compelled to comment on this article must know a heck of a lot more about wireless networking than I (I left IT 6 years ago for Law... so my networking experience pretty much ended with Appletalk! LOL!) - reversekilled, on 01/04/2008, -17/+58Don't forget, if you invite your friends to your house and let them use your internet connection while they're over, you're committing a crime!
- williamdyer, on 01/04/2008, -8/+46In my town, I have to post signs revoking permission for hunting on my private property, otherwise it is OK to hunt. "Private" does not mean "exclusive unless otherwise stated."
- LOCK3D, on 01/04/2008, -8/+45One doesn't need to take years of schooling to figure out how to set up security on a wireless router, they simply need to RTFM.
- ToastPop, on 04/17/2009, -15/+48I don't think any of my relatives would have the slightest idea how to set up a wifi network securely, and it's not because they are stupid, it's because it isn't common knowledge for someone who doesn't use computers a lot.
You demonstrate the unfortunately typical arrogance of an I.T. specialist. You're the kind of person that makes me ashamed to be associated with this profession. When you go to the doctor, he doesn't look down on you for not knowing what is wrong with you, he helps you, and that is the attitude I.T. specialists should also have. - joshuaer, on 01/04/2008, -0/+31 "Stealing WiFi Internet access may feel like a victimless crime, but it deprives ISPs of revenue,"
Does any one else see other companies using this model to make more money.
car pooling and taking the bus is a crime since is deprives gas stations money.
Swimming in a lake is a crime it deprives the gym of money.
crashing a party is a crime it deprives bars of money. - ronygenius, on 01/04/2008, -6/+37if your unsecured wifi signal comes over onto my property (my home) why should i not use it. it is like someone leaving a nice table at the trash becomes public property
- tidu, on 01/04/2008, -0/+30It's good that the floors in your home are thicker than two exterior walls.
- rubberfactory, on 01/04/2008, -0/+28i've been using my neighbors free connection for months. i almost baked him cookies to thank him. maybe i'll do that when i move out.
- wvdavis, on 01/04/2008, -0/+25What's a VCR?
- munkyxtc, on 01/04/2008, -0/+25Well I let people piggy back off of my connection the network name is FREE INTERNET; so people understand they can freely connect and do whatever...I'll take my chances they are are out just trying to find a network to download movies/music etc.
- StaticThunder, on 01/04/2008, -1/+26FBI: Don't care, its your account. Come with us.
- MioTheGreat, on 01/04/2008, -11/+36The difference is that an open wifi network quite literally screams out to the world: "I'm here! Connect to me!"
- omelette, on 01/04/2008, -6/+30Please, I'm sick of people using the "you left your doors unlocked, its your fault" analogy... it only reinforces people's thoughts that using an open network is stealing. The truth of it is that there is a handshake that occurs when joining an open network that is an emphatic granting of permission. A more correct analogy would be having a butler letting people into your house that you don't want there... you can't blame the people there... you just forgot to tell the help that you didn't want to be disturbed. The truth is, the piggy-backers knocked on your door politely, someone answered and said, "hello, come in, have some tea." If you don't want people coming in, instruct the person who answers the door to turn people away. Simple as that.
- SublimeRuin, on 01/04/2008, -6/+30From my desk I pick up 15 different wireless networks. 3 are unsecured and completely open, if you don't want someone else using it - than close it. It's like leaving a basket of fruit out and expecting people to NOT eat it. Or bringing a box of donuts to the office and leaving them in the meeting room and expecting that they all be there later.
- dgh1973, on 01/04/2008, -2/+25"If you're stupid enough to not encrypt, then you deserve to have people piggybacking off you."
Stupid like a fox... insecure wi-fi networks can also be used as bait to steal session, cookie, and other information from the piggy backer. Then it's the piggy backer who is the fool. - inactive, on 01/04/2008, -11/+34"she was dressed provocatively your honor, she wanted to get raped."
- KDAY12, on 01/04/2008, -0/+23"Hey, how did these Internets get in my house? I didn't put them here. They are in my house, so I guess they are mine."
- Xanium4332, on 01/04/2008, -2/+24Exactly, if they don't want me to use it, then build a Faraday cage to prevent the signals from passing onto my property.
Infact, the argument can be turned on it's head. Who gave them permission to fire radio waves through my property anyway. I bet if I got a torch and shone it through my neigbour's windows 24/7, they'd get pretty pissed, so why is it okay with radio?
Also, 2.4Ghz is an open frequency, anyone can use it, so all these arguments of 'if it's not yours, you can't use it' are bogus, because the 2.4Ghz band is EVERYONES. - askjeffro, on 01/04/2008, -1/+22Excellent reply, well said.
- aliengoods, on 01/04/2008, -4/+25If you put your trash on the curb, it is in the publics domain, and any one of your neighbors has the legal right to look through it. With WiFi, which is very easy to secure (at least so Joe Sixpack can't connect), you're putting your bandwidth on the curb. Also, I wouldn't call it stealing as bandwidth is only limited at any one instance. If you're not using it, you lose it, so if you leave your network open and someone uses bandwidth you weren't using were you really harmed?
Oh, and I pay for my internet and have a very secure WiFi network. - Orion682, on 01/04/2008, -4/+25You ignore the fact that there are indeed people who willingly share their wifi, and you missed their point about radio waves. Look up laws regarding 1st amendment rights about TV and radio signals. Their "pervasiveness" gives them special legal standing, and it it not equivocal to property.
- slvrbullet87, on 01/04/2008, -0/+20We're gunna need a bigger router
- loganm10, on 01/04/2008, -8/+27i think its just like radio, if someone is broadcasting an unencrypted wireless signal then it is fair game. You dont need a radio stations permission to use their signal
- roystgnr, on 01/04/2008, -7/+26You're allowed to use anything that the owner gives you permission to use, even if you don't own it.
WiFi routers are NO DIFFERENT than any web server you use, in that they provide an automated way for the owner to announce that that permission has been given. If you or your computer sees such an announcement, you shouldn't be required to telephone the owner too just to make double extra sure that they really meant it. - haleym, on 01/04/2008, -4/+23So I was at my mom's house the other day - I'd set up her wireless router in the past w/ WPA encryption and my laptop was already configured to connect to it, so I assumed that's what I was connected to. After a couple hours of browsing, I realized that I'd actually auto-connected to a neighbor's open access point and had been using it the whole time. Was I being unethical?
- forcedfx, on 01/04/2008, -4/+22My roommates and I have our PS3 running off our neighbors open wireless network to play Call of Duty 4 online since the signal is stronger than our wireless. My neighbor's signal is 80% versus our's being 25%. (damn walls and floors)
- sholt, on 01/04/2008, -1/+19Short answer: No.
Long answer: No, you have no right, just like you have no right to fix their car without their permission. - ussoldier, on 01/04/2008, -2/+20I think you should go turn yourself in to the authoritys. Go down to the local police station and turn yourself in. Otherwise, this transgression is going to gnaw on your soul for the rest of your life, eating away at your soul until it becomes a decayed, rotting mass of unethical perversion. You'll end up some old bald fat guy surfing porn through stolen wifi in a van by the side of the road, living in his own filthy and surviving off of cheetoes and Coke. Its your soul in the balance, bro! Don't start down that slippery slope of unrighteousness!
- javanate, on 01/04/2008, -3/+20But in this case, someone "using" your WiFi isn't really "entering" your property - If your window's open, don't complain about me looking in from the street to watch your TV. If you have a problem with it close the blinds.
- lostmongoose, on 01/04/2008, -4/+21Why is this being dugg down? it's very much in the manual. I have yet to purchase a wireless router that doesn't have even the basics for setting up WEP in the manual.
- Error601, on 01/04/2008, -12/+28Not true. You don't own a shopping mall yet the unlocked door is an indication that you can come in and use it. The same follows for wifi since it's common for people to run open systems they want others to use.
- signal15, on 01/04/2008, -1/+17I believe you can install OpenWRT on that device and have it do throttling.
- noahhoward, on 01/04/2008, -1/+16It makes perfect sense, unless they are within plain view of the house how are they to know it is private without some sort of sign? There is a slight difference with this because obviously someone owns the router, but if you can't see the router how are you supposed to know if it is open because someone forgot or neglected to secure it or if it is truly open for anyone to use? You cannot differentiate between the two.
- rmxz, on 01/04/2008, -0/+15@ChrisDigital: Yeah - to summarize for the guy here.
1. Download some of the third party software for the 54G - the default cisco firmware doesn't support it. I hear good things about DD-WRT, but I had used a different one.
2. Look for their QOS features they can give priority to your computers. As a side benefit you should also be able to configure it so your low priority activities (downloads) don't interfere with your higher-priority activities (gaming, etc).
3. Make sure you enable your firewall (doesn't need to be a separate box - at least the software firewall on windows) on the "inside" of your network between your computer and the wireless router. By default I think the firewall on the routers is between that device an the internet; but now you'll be letting untrusted computers on the "LAN" side of the router.
I think that's about it. Anything else? - inactive, on 01/04/2008, -50/+65Ars technica keeps making these ridiculous fallacious arguments about everything.
All the arguments of this article are fallacious for a simple reason: the concept of property.
If you don't own it, you can't use it without the owner's permission. You can make all kinds of ridiculous arguments about any aspect of this, but the fact remains that if you don't own it, you can't use it without the owner's permission.
Shoulds and woulds are not arguments, they are wishes.
If it's not yours, you are not allowed to use it. - Boondoggle, on 01/04/2008, -3/+18Well I've got a spring on my property. The water flows off onto other lands. Is it stealing for others to use that water? I've got all I need.
Is it "my" water when it is on my land? How about when it is "broadcast" downstream?
I could build a dam and make a lake or a bottling plant to prevent that water from leaving my property without compensation. Would that be Immoral?
Much like I paid for the land, and paid EXTRA because it had a natural spring, unprotected wireless is paid for by someone, but usage of it does not necessarily mean additional cost to the provider or stealing. - redmaxx, on 01/04/2008, -2/+16@MioTheGreat
No, it doesn't. It advertises the fact that a network there exists, but it is in no way saying "Connect to me!" You're confusing the broadcast of the network's existence with an invitation to join. Do you walk into every house you see that has a party going on? No. - dextrocardia, on 01/04/2008, -2/+16If an apple from my tree falls into your yard, it's yours. It's been common law for centuries. If I turn up my stereo loud enough for you to hear it from your property, are you stealing the song if you don't cover your ears?
If my wifi signal bleeds into your property, and I don't secure it, then you have the right to use it. Comparing this to entering someone's house is disingenuous. - Slashriffs, on 01/04/2008, -3/+17FBI knocks at door: We believe you're pirating massive amounts of illegal movies online.
Me:Really? my wifi is open so it could be anybody. goodbye. - NotOptium, on 01/04/2008, -1/+14Great apology. Definitely acceptable.
- rmxz, on 01/04/2008, -0/+13"Is there a way to only "partially" secure my network... perhaps allowing anonymous logging on to a certain bitrate or something?"
Yes - it's commonly called Quality of Service or QOS if you're googling.
For the 54G I believe both DD-WRT and Sveasoft both provide QOS features so you don't even need a second router. - roystgnr, on 01/04/2008, -1/+14Your analogy doesn't even go far enouh, unless the basket has a sign on it saying "Free fruit", and somehow broadcasts this announcement incessantly to anyone within a 100 foot radius.
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