What is Digg?78 Comments
- MatttK, on 10/12/2007, -3/+21"And this is exactlly whats wrong with MS and Win, trying to kill competition by bundeling everything into bloated POS they call OS."
What the heck... half the anti-"m$" people whine that Windows is unsecure, while the other half whine when Microsoft tries to fix the problem.
The fact is that security is a core component of an OS. Anti-spyware, anti-virus, and a firewall all belong on the Windows CD. You shouldn't have to pay more to get functionality that is required for the basic operation of your OS. - zblackeagle, on 10/12/2007, -3/+20Hell, anything has to be better than Symantec.
I'm a mac person, but do family tech support for windows. I hate symantec. - chris9902, on 10/12/2007, -2/+17the biggest security risk to Windows is the user
* you've got mail *
oooohhh naked pictures of Jessica Alba in an .exe file from someone in Nigiria... how could this not go wrong. - silenceHR, on 10/12/2007, -13/+27why upgrade to Vista at all? who is forcing you?
i know i wont upgrade for sure.
And this is exactlly whats wrong with MS and Win, trying to kill competition by bundeling everything into bloated POS they call OS. No wonder Vista will need 1 GB just to run. - haumschd, on 10/12/2007, -3/+16Don't the have to actually release it first......maybe in 2008....
- estvir, on 10/12/2007, -4/+16yeah, like the average person will know how to, yet alone want to turn off uap, ie7's protected mode, 2 way firewall and so on.
- Promantarius, on 10/12/2007, -8/+19I'm not so sure mate, I think people will get so annoyed with the extra "security" that they'll end up disabling it in favor of the other programs anyway - I know I certainly won't be using it when I'm forced to upgrade to Vista.
- forty4, on 10/12/2007, -0/+10This made me wonder. If Microsoft got in so much trouble for Internet explorer because of competition issues what would keep antivirus/ spyware companies from doing the same thing Netscape or whoever filed that lawsuit did. I don't know if this would even be a possibility, but i started to think about all the antivirus/spyware programs included in oem's and how they would loose money.
- samdu, on 10/12/2007, -1/+11Two things:
1. MS already has a presence in the AntiSpyware space and it isn't good enough to be depended on by itself. Also, people are already used to installing third party antispyware apps, so the same barrier to entry for third party browsers isn't there.
2. Bundling AntiSpyware functionality is the exact wrong way to address the problem and really lowers my expectations of the security of Vista. The proper way to have done this would have been to make the underlying OS more secure, not tack on more bloat. I guess we'll see how secure it is, but this doesn't make me too optimistic. - ericab, on 10/12/2007, -1/+10Given Microsoft's track record with security (*ahem* or lack thereof) there is no way I'm going to trust them to secure my PC.
- oepapel, on 10/12/2007, -1/+9"I disabled security center in XP SP2, so troublesome..."
Disabling security center doesn't disable security. It just disables the process that checks to make sure that your security software is still running and hasn't been disabled. There's a big difference. - inactive, on 10/12/2007, -1/+8Gimme a break.
Why is it you turtleneck apple snobs always think everyone is copying you. Apple is not the "great innovator".
So what.. you have a slick GUI over a BSD based OS with security features that have been around way before OS X was NeXT.
It seems to me, Apple takes what's great from a user perspective in Windows, copies it and improves it, then takes the great security features from Linux, and copies it.. and voila. a new OS.
what the hell is original about that? oooh... you have the "automater". WHo the hell uses that thing? - DocDEB, on 10/12/2007, -1/+8Actually I think it goes:
Oooooo... naked pictures of Jessica Alba! < click click > - chris9902, on 10/12/2007, -2/+9Windows defender is free (this is built into Vista)
http://www.microsoft.com/athome/security/spyware/software/default.mspx
There is a product called Windows One Care that they charge for but it's very good.
http://www.windowsonecare.com/ - Phil246, on 10/12/2007, -1/+7i prefer the old ms antispyware to the new windows defender.
It just seems dumbed down :/ - cant stand using it now.
Give me an advanced config and tools to play with and i shall be happy.
You do realise linux programs can be made to work on windows? Since they are open source theres not much really preventing you from doing a windows port of them - infact several programs have a windows version themselves. - Yoshi39, on 10/12/2007, -8/+14"o knows 1GB, how ever will I find the space."
He mans ram space not hard drive space and yes 1gig ram is blotted - wmoisis, on 10/12/2007, -3/+9Like anyone takes onecare seriously: "Er...well were still working on the patch for the 236th major security exploit...but for just $50 a year you can get it patched now!"
Anyway, I already know an OS that doesnt need third-party anti-spyware/firewall/virus crap: Its called Linux. - kyriakos, on 10/12/2007, -3/+8Life's hard for microsoft. If their OS is not secure/firewalled people complain. If they include the security features people complain that it kills third-party products.
- sirber, on 10/12/2007, -4/+9I disabled security center in XP SP2, so troublesome...
- antdude, on 10/12/2007, -0/+5silenceHR: Eventually, you will have. Look at XP right now. Some newer games don't even run on 2K and 9x anymore. Supposedly some upcoming games for DirectX 10 won't work in XP due to lack of features. :(
- jer2eydevil88, on 10/12/2007, -0/+5Its a catch 22 because Microsoft really can't offer features that others aren't yet they need new features to compel people to buy Vista. If it wasn't security it would have been another industry they would have in their crosshairs.
- MrEcho, on 10/12/2007, -3/+7You have to think of the flip side of this...
Vista is going to have the very same issues as Windows XP, if they HAVE TO include this EXTRA software in the OS.
Yes in away security is going to be better in Vista, but over all where going to have issues. - estvir, on 10/12/2007, -2/+6microsoft's anti spyware program more or less receives nothing but good reviews, so i'm sure when properly integrated, further along in development & with ie7's protected mode you will have more or less 0 problems.
- inactive, on 10/12/2007, -0/+4yes that's what linux distro's do. But it's not about the executable, it's about user permissions. Which can be set in windows, just no one bothers b/c they're lazy and also b/c MS hasn't perfected they're "Run As" (another user) function.
- dioscaido, on 10/12/2007, -0/+4You can do this since Windows NT 4.0. Log in as an account that isn't in the Administrators group, and viola, you can't modify the system (c:windows, c:program files, registry's hkey_local_machine). The problem is that most people do the equivalent of running their primary account as root. Running as root in linux provides no protection to the system.
Vista will finally force people to stop running as root, and force application writers to stop needlessly requiring root access to run. - ahhell, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3I say Microsoft should be applauded for cutting into McAfee and Symantec's business.
Both of those companies make absolutely ***** products. - estvir, on 10/12/2007, -1/+4say hello to uac [user account control], it's more or less the same thing and it's in vista.
- Kwipper, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3Can't Microsoft just make it so that executables with their own installer will not have access to move or copy anyfiles into the windows directory? Thereby rendering the virus/trojan/spyware/whatever useless or at the very least (non OS damaging)? This is what Linux based OS's do right? (Feel free to correct me if I am wrong, for I am new to Linux myself.)
- adml_shake, on 10/12/2007, -3/+6as much as I love linux, let them get a big chunk of the market share and you'll start seeing the same things. Not in the number that you do for MS but a hell of a lot more for them overall.
- NCC1701A, on 10/12/2007, -6/+9OK, Let me get this straight.....
Microsoft is selling security software to protect users from the faults and security problems in their own software (windows and IE)?
Oh the irony! - RipperDoc, on 10/12/2007, -6/+9That's good. We shouldn't need to have anti-spyware/anti-virus programs in the first place so when MS now put it into their OS, I'm happy to uninstall those third party programs. MS might not do it perfect, but at least I don't have to bother.
- hunchback, on 10/12/2007, -2/+4Thanks for clearing that up man
- gleem, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2why is this such a bad thing? Why should we have to pay a 3rd party company for software to fix the holes in windows? Not for nothing, but people complain to much for the stupidest things. Honestly, if windows is to problematic for you to use or deal with, then switch to a different OS. If you are required by work to use windows, then find a different job.
- Rosewood, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2^^^ Isn't it beautiful?
- UnlivedPhalanx, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2Looks like I picked a good time to upgrade my computer...early '07 is looking better than ever.
- estvir, on 10/12/2007, -2/+4"and it isn't good enough to be depended on by itself."
yes it is .. or according to numerous user/tech site reviews; for example, http://antivirus.about.com/od/antivirussoftwarereviews/a/msantispy.htm, http://www.download.com/Microsoft-Windows-AntiSpyware/3000-8022_4-10353597.html, or just hit your favourite search engine and find your own. - estvir, on 10/12/2007, -2/+3vista isn't out, your comment [true or not] apples to past versions of windows.
your comment is invalid until vista is released. - nailbunny, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1there are a great deal of gtk apps that are available for both windows and linux, such as gaim, gimp, dia, openoffice, blender
linspire ain't exactly the flagship of the linux community. ain't exactly free either. now granted, intel and broadcom wireless cards tend not to work, unless you use their windows drivers through ndiswrapper. ati video cards aren't so great either. new toshiba satellites don't work for some reason. apart from that, i've had nothing but good luck installing ubuntu on multiple desktops and laptops over a couple lug installfests. - inactive, on 10/12/2007, -2/+3Microsoft Anti-spyware (now know as windows defender) sucks. It doesn't pick up half of what Lavasoft or Spybot does. Tis a shame too, when MS acquired that company, they had a decent product just ready for a nice evolution.. but that's been pissed away.
As for Windows firewall.. meh.. i like it. But I'd much rather configure my firewall on a router to be tight as hell and only allow in certain ports at certain times. (For instance, ports for Bit torrent is only open while i'm home, while VNC ports are open when i'm at work..hehe. ) Takes a bit more work, but it's a fairly secure way of doing things and once set up properly, you don't really have to mess with it again.
Windows firewall i will commend them on. Linux ships with Iptables, Mac ships with a firewall, i'm glad MS saw the need and met it with SP2. Too bad outflow traffic will be turned off by default when Vista ships.
I saw where MS Anti-spyware doesn't auto remove certain spyware when MS is in various talks to the company that created it. Looks to me their just helping out that company some more. Yay for data collection.
As for IE7. I'll applaud them for decoupling the browser from the OS. I'll applaud them for making Windows Updates part of Vista, and not require IE to access them. Bravo. But yeah, it still doesn't handle png alpha channels, still doesn't render CSS correctly, still doesn't pass the Acid2 test. I mean, glad to see they caught up with tabbed browsing, RSS integration, and it's a good thing they put in some anti-phishing tools... but as far as i'm concerned, i'll never touch a browser that functions of Active X again (which IE7 still does).
To me, these will be my steps up getting vista.
Uninstall IE7.
Install Firefox, Flock, or Opera.
Uninstall Windows Defender.
Install Lavasoft's Ad Aware and Spybot. Set spybot up for nightly scans.
Install AVG or Avast for anti-virus and set that up for a nightly scan.
Other than having the ability to uninstall IE7, it won't be that much more different than what i do to XP now. - MrDan, on 10/12/2007, -1/+2Chris9902:
Windows Defender is only free until the end of 2006, according to the current EULA anyway... - ProphetSix, on 10/12/2007, -1/+2"..eliminate the need to run separate anti-spyware or firewall software.."??? Like HELL it does!
Microsoft lags severely in anti-spyware and anti-virus abilities:
http://blogs.zdnet.com/threatchaos/index.php?p=294
Microsoft bought Claria, (Gator), and DOWNGRADED their threat level:
http://news.zdnet.com/2100-1009_22-5783926.html
Microsoft is WRITING legislation to allow companies personal access to your hard drive, all information on it, AND the ability to delete anything they find that they don't like, no questions asked:
http://www.digg.com/security/Microsoft_wants_access_to_your_private_information
Microsoft will charge $50/year for these "privileges":
http://www.digg.com/security/$50_a_year_for_Windows_security
Microsoft has already admitted that they can't handle spyware/malware, and that wipe and re-load is sometimes the best answer:
http://www.eweek.com/article2/0,1895,1945808,00.asp?kc=ewnws040406dtx1k0000599
And, if you don't pay the $50/year for Microsoft Defender, then the Windows Vista firewall will work, but one way only. No outbound inspections or even stopping spyware/malware from calling home. Wanna turn on outbound inspections? $50/year, EVERY year, or turn it on in the Windows registry. Easy enough for most who read Digg, I'd like to see your parents or grandparents do the same.
And these are the people you want to put in charge of YOUR security? I think not. And I SERIOUSLY doubt that this will have any impact on 3rd-party spyware/malware/anti-virus software companies. Like who you want to, but I wouldn't trust Microsoft.
When Vista comes out, and IF I upgrade, 4 stops:
1) Disable Windows firewall/Defender.
2) Zonelabs:
http://www.zonelabs.com/store/content/company/products/znalm/freeDownload2.jsp?dc=12bms&ctry=US&lang=en&lid=staticcomp_za
3) Ad-Aware:
http://www.download.com/Ad-Aware-SE-Personal-Edition/3000-8022_4-10399602.html?tag=lst-0-1
4) Spybot Search & Destroy:
http://www.download.com/Spybot-Search-Destroy/3000-8022_4-10401314.html?tag=lst-0-1 - goffy59, on 10/12/2007, -7/+8Ive tried every antispyware there is and most antiviruses.
MS Windows Defender owns every anti spy-ware out there! Before MS bought the technology from the Giant Company, they already were one of the bests. So they still are, and they just work for MS now. I haven't had problems with spy-ware in the LONGEST time! Ive never gotten a virus (seriously), I use Windows One-care live, before i used Norton Corporate and i don't see much of a difference. Id give it a chance, rather then speculate on something that hasn't come out. I don't see why people hate Windows XP. I do a lot of ***** on it and it works fine. Ive installed a lot of software, and i don't receive the errors some people complain about. Maybe some people are just stupid? That's what I'm beginning to think. People exaggerate on how bad Windows is. I saw my teacher work on a mac and had the same amount of problems. I told my dad to check out Inspire and see if that would replace what he needed, and that didn't turn out so well. I'm not saying Windows is the best (oh god no), but every OS has there problems. I'm pretty sure they are all level on problems. Just different areas which make it seem like one has more problems. Wifi doesn't fully work in Linux. Max doesn't run on Apple OSX. Heh i can go on. Windows cant run Linux software. One thing that makes me sad, is when i see all this great software on Linux and i cant make it work on windows. I'm not saying everything should work on windows. But windows users miss out on software/programs the good open source community creates. - hunchback, on 10/12/2007, -4/+5Are they going to charge a "subcription fee" of some sort for updates?
- dioscaido, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1Anti-Virus does not come bundled w/ Vista. It's part of the for-pay service called 'one-care'. Anti-spyware, on the other hand, is bundled.
- uownedge, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1I'm going to have to go ahead and call bull. Windows firewall and defender are crap now. Until I see some proof other wise, I am quite sure it will remain crap in 2015, when Vista is released, under new name, Venitian Blinds.
With windows terrible track record on security, I wouldn't trust it to hold out on it's own anyway. - miaow, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1as we saw with the windows update DDOS, it wasnt doing much good switched off on sheeps computers. they didnt have a clue it was there. And why switch it off default ??? (rhetorical question)
I was already using zone alarm in 99, and windows should have had the firewall in 95, along with other things like file/printer sharing switched off.
- jjallday, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1This was widely reported several weeks ago.
- estvir, on 10/12/2007, -2/+3they don't have too, they could not integrate defender and just sit there with ie7 [with ]protected mode and the other new features] and you'd be fine.
- IQ70, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1What you did not understand in your emotional outburst is that, by being a follower MSFT does not get sued for antitrust since the innovation has already found itseld in other OSes and it would be unfair for MSFT not having it in its own OS.
MSFT let IE languish for few years because there was no other viable option for customers. If IE had a search bar tied to MSN it would have been an antitrust case 5 years ago.
Things like desktop search, search bar in IE, media player with music store. They all exist on another OS already and MSFT cant be sued for antitrust on that basis. Kapish? - mscamara, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1Indeed the firewall was there since win 2000. Sure it was rudimentary, but enough to protect you from all the worms they've had since then, nimda, code red....It simply wasn't turned on by default. But it's been there all along...
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