What is Digg?90 Comments
- wdbetts, on 10/12/2007, -0/+58"Never write when you can talk. Never talk when you can nod. And never put anything in an e-mail."
-- Eliot Spitzer - stragus, on 10/12/2007, -7/+52He tried to throw his weight around and it backfired. Let this be a lesson to other executives.
- ndm007, on 10/12/2007, -6/+42OK, Sottozero edited his idiotic comment just after I replied.
So mod me down. I deserve it. *hold arms in the air and falls to knees* - pype, on 10/12/2007, -4/+35I avoid tangles like this by throwing cups of hot coffee at my assistant until I see results.
Works like a dandy and HR is none the wiser. - inactive, on 10/12/2007, -1/+32"When one is writing a letter, he should think that the recipient will make it into a hanging scroll."
It's not Chinese though; it's from the Book of the Samurai. - canadianguy33, on 10/12/2007, -11/+38I think both the boss and the secretary were out of line.
- tHePeOPle, on 10/12/2007, -1/+25You are a true 'people person'. I admire your superior management skills and would like to subscribe to your newsletter.
- mage1129, on 10/12/2007, -0/+23There is an old heuristic when it comes to hiring upper management. If you see how they treat someone serving them in at a restaurant you will be able to gage how they will treat their subordinates at the company.
- lexbaby, on 10/12/2007, -1/+19Another reason this makes sense is that company executives are often the "face" of the company. If public opinion is that the CEO is a jerk, it's going to hurt your company no matter how competent he/she may be.
- TechCoder, on 10/12/2007, -1/+19Lesson to learn here. Emails are dangerous, its better to speak face to face.
- 5blocksfree, on 10/12/2007, -5/+20@jpwhitmore
I disagree. I think it's high time companies started looking harder at the kinds of people who are at the helm. CEO compensation is already WAY out of line, regardless of the company's actual performance. I'm often left with the impression that they think they are untouchable- that they can do no wrong. Well, guess what....someone just did, and maybe this will spark the beginning of some much-needed deflation of some very big egos. - tHePeOPle, on 10/12/2007, -3/+18@ndm007
Just for asking to be modded down, I'm modding your ass up. In your FACE ndm007! - groovepapa, on 10/12/2007, -0/+14Anyone else notice that the discription is misleading? Feel free to mod me down for this, but...
1. The president is not the president of a $10b company. He's the president of *one branch* of a $10b company.
2. The president hasn't lost his job - the article only implies that he will quit. Hu (the secretary) is the only one who has lost a job so far.
Modified title: "Regional president of $10 billion company causes turmoil because he was rude to secretary."
? - inactive, on 10/12/2007, -4/+17I can see how the secretary is finding it "difficult to find another job." Yeah, the CEO was a jackass, but I don't want someone who is going to CC everyone in the company no matter what the circumstances. She's clearly not qualified to be a secretary at that level.
- MrLobster, on 10/12/2007, -0/+12locking the door is a security issue
- MrLobster, on 10/12/2007, -2/+13The boss who was fired CC'd all the managers with his idiotic reprimand. The secretary just did a reply to all, standing up for herself. Yeah that's the kind of thing that will cost her that crappy job but at least she has her self respect and will surely find a better situation.
- chocolatespoon, on 10/12/2007, -0/+10I don't think he was fired cuz he was a prick. (There would be massive unemployment if this were true). He was fired because his little outburst went public and embarrased the company. (well, not fired....asked to resign) And I don't think the secretary was out of line, either. She made her point in a tactful, assertive manner, which is how you should address your higher ups. A good leader appreciates honest feedback.
- milesd, on 10/12/2007, -6/+16
I got the article to load....copy/paste
EMC China chief 'to quit' in email fiasco
Heads roll after boss is compared to Genghis Khan
Simon Burns in Taipei, vnunet.com 08 May 2006
ADVERTISEMENT
A minor dispute over a misplaced key which blew up into a public relations fiasco has reportedly ended with the resignation of the president of $10bn-a-year multinational tech company EMC's Chinese division.
The incident has underlined the dangers of private emails becoming public, and drawn attention to the cultural disconnect between foreign managers and local staff in China.
EMC declined to confirm or deny details of the case when contacted by vnunet.com.
According to Chinese media reports, the incident started when Loke Soon Choo, president of EMC China, returned to his office late one Friday evening in April to find himself locked out.
The Singaporean executive fired off a curt email to his secretary, who had already left the office.
"You locked me out of my office this evening because you assume I have my office key on my person. With immediate effect, you do not leave the office until you have checked with all the managers you support," Loke wrote, according to copies of the emails seen by vnunet.com.
The secretary, Rebecca Hu, emailed a blistering reply. "I locked the door because the office has been burgled in the past. Even though I'm your subordinate, please pay attention to politeness when you speak. This is the most basic human courtesy. You have your own keys. You forgot to bring them, but you still want to say it's someone else's fault," she wrote.
Hu copied her reply, along with Loke's original email, to all of EMC's staff in China. Someone copied the email to a friend outside the company, and during the next couple of weeks the email exchange was forwarded around other companies in China, apparently reaching thousands of people, some of whom posted it on online forums.
It became a cause of heated online debate, with some supporting Hu, but others accusing the secretary of being stubborn, irresponsible and unprofessional. Some of the attacks on EMC have nationalist overtones, as the firm, and Loke, are foreigners.
"Foreigners come to China to lord it over others, not to help China's economic development," said one forum participant. "They want to keep down our wages and give the profits to foreign executives and their headquarters."
Another pointed out that the boss had made the error of cc-ing several other staff on his original email to the secretary, thus turning a private reprimand into a public humiliation. - loveandrockets, on 10/12/2007, -2/+12That chick has balls. I've worked at jobs where a thing like that would happen and everyone would go "yessir, nosssir..." "Your forgetfulness is not the cause of this, it's someone else's fault of course! We'll get right on a plan to turn your stupidity into a five-meeting do-nothing discussion on what to do if this happens in the future.
That president can go suck it. - inactive, on 10/12/2007, -0/+7Wonder what his golden parachute was worth.
- roosh4, on 10/12/2007, -1/+8How do you think he treats his waitresses?
- ae3145, on 10/12/2007, -1/+8lexbaby:
Does anyone think that Steve Jobs is warm and friendly? I wonder what the jerk:nice guy ratio is of current CEOs. - sideral, on 10/12/2007, -2/+8That's true! I would not want to hire a secretary like her, and as the article says, she in fact is having trouble trying to get a new job :) I don't think the boss was rude, he was just being very direct. He was upset, but, what the hell, even being upset he didn't referred to the secretary in bad terms, just in an authoritative tone. I would have fired the secretary instead for not doing her job well. And if I had written that email, I would have been more rude.
- mage1129, on 10/12/2007, -2/+7You underestimate the power of words, as did this CEO. If he can be so reckless with his words that his secretary reacts in such a way then how is he to be considered when conducting business. Regardless the reaction of the secretary he should have put more thought into how he conducts himself. She was rightfully fired though.
- neozeed, on 10/12/2007, -1/+6sensitive emails being leaked on the internets is always a security issue.
- RexKwando, on 10/12/2007, -1/+6Holy Crap batman! This is funnier than hell.
I'm glad to see a "big-wig" get the can for arrogance! - milesd, on 10/12/2007, -5/+9Page 2...
Others online blamed the outburst on the pressure put on employees by the difference in pace between competitive foreign enterprises and the more slow-moving traditional Chinese companies to which they are accustomed.
"I think her reply expressed my own feelings," wrote 'Vanny', who works for a foreign firm and forwarded the email on as soon as she received it.
"I know forwarding it isn't good for the people involved: the more attention this receives, the worse it gets.
"But the pressure inside foreign companies is huge. We all feel a lot of tension when we're working. Even after work, we can't stop thinking about the office. My colleagues always look really stressed out.
"This stubborn secretary's email is like a shot in the arm. It's exciting. Seeing how she told off her boss, we can imagine doing the same. That feels wonderful!"
By the end of April, Hu had left EMC in what the company said was a " personal decision".
Chinese newspapers and TV began to pay attention to the debate. The Beijing Youth Daily tracked down Hu and interviewed her. She complained that all the publicity was making it difficult for her to find a new job.
By early May, the story had been repeated in hundreds of newspapers, news websites, blogs and discussion forums in China.
In addition to the PR fallout, some Chinese bloggers have suggested that a member of EMC's sales staff was fired because he had first forwarded the email outside the company, with a comment which appears to compare Loke to 13th century foreign invader Genghis Khan.
EMC declined to comment to vnunet.com on the details of the case. "This is an internal EMC matter. It is important to understand that EMC is a global company that stands for integrity and respect everywhere we conduct business," Stevy Ng, marketing communications manager at EMC Greater China, told vnunet.com.
Today, several Chinese publications reported that Loke would resign this week, citing unamed sources.
EMC, which makes storage systems, generated revenues of $9.66bn last year. The company, which prides itself on its good relations with its employees, has approximately 26,500 staff worldwide, according to its last annual report. - inactive, on 10/12/2007, -0/+4Two signs of unprofessionalism: He Cc'd all the managers, and told her off for his own mistake in a curt and impolite email. These CEO hot shot types seem to forget that a little humility and politeness go a long way. The guy deserved the boot. *****. I wouldn't want the likes of him in my company.
- dWhisper, on 10/12/2007, -2/+6How little power does a guy have to carry to lose a job like that? Most presidents have enough clout to turn this into a "discussion."
- Ythan, on 10/12/2007, -1/+5Coral Cache, like always.
http://www.whatpc.co.uk.nyud.net:8080/vnunet/news/2155655/china-email-embarasses-emc - bbear, on 10/12/2007, -1/+5The president made a costly mistake. When you want to be rude you do it in person or over the phone not via email which leaves a trail of evidence. On the other hand the assistant deserved to be fired for cc'ing the entire company on her email response. It must be hard to find a job as an assistant when you have a reputation of being extremely rash and stupid.
- gluteus, on 10/12/2007, -1/+5First, I would guess this wasn't the first time the boss was being a dick. Second, I thought the secretary should not have cc'd the whole company, that is, until the article explained the boss cc'd a bunch of other employees. He started it, and she merely trumped him. Third, the dumb turd didn't know the first rule of employee relations, namely NEVER piss off the secretaries. They are usually the lowest paid in the company, and without them the place would crumble to the ground almost instantly.
- ohnnyj, on 10/12/2007, -1/+5Why is this under the security category?
- alceria, on 10/12/2007, -1/+4All of you bitching about the secretary being out of line for fwding the email on apparently didn't read to the end of the article. The asshat CEO originally CC'ed a bunch of other execs along with her. (to shame her or get sympathy, I dunno which.)
At first I kinda thought she was being a little snotty too, but seriously, from now on she's supposed to call every manager there after they *leave* every day and make sure they are really gone for the day before she can go home? What, are they five years old? Give me a break. - 5thfreedom, on 10/12/2007, -1/+4Where are you guys getting that he was fired? The story clearly states that he resigned.
- scarper86, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3>locking the door is a security issue
That's fricking funny lol - ScottMitchell, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3Makes me think that this guy either let this discussion explode, or higher-ups were waiting for an excuse to fire his ass. In America, at least, all he'd have to do is make an apologetic email, say he was stressed out, use a phrase like, "I know now that what I said was wrong, and I am sorry for that."
But props to that secretary for sticking up. Everyone, regardless of their position, does deserve to be spoken to with some base level of human politeness. Moreover, one is within their rights to point it out when another addresses them in such an ill-fitting manner. - Cozmcphish, on 10/12/2007, -2/+5Stop your sass-mouth and unlock the door. That's why you get a check from the company, to do that thing called "your job".
- Canthros, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2Sounds like Mr. Loke screwed up, and possibly isn't good at accepting blame for his mistakes (welcome to the corporate world: many managers are excellent at blaming those below them for errors in management). Probably he wrote the initial email in the heat of the moment. These things happen. A message calling for a one-to-one conference the next morning would have been a better choice, and simply forgetting it and getting on with life would probably have been even better yet. In the future, the jerk should remember to carry his keys. I'd guess he's stepping down because of the PR problem caused by...
The secretary is a problem, too. Forwarding the message to the entire branch simply isn't appropriate. It's rude, unprofessional, and can cause (as it did here) major PR problems. Her response strikes me as unnecessarily rude as well, but could be understandable depending on past history (still not appropriate--save it for the quarterly review, or find a job working for someone who isn't a jerk).
Personally, I'm sympathetic to the secretary's frustration, but don't find her response to be even remotely acceptable. Their IT department should probably find out which person(s) forwarded the message outside the company, and management will need to deal with that appropriately, too. If it's only one or two, they probably get canned. If there's several or many, a pretty stern reprimand would be appropriate, reminding them that company email is not for personal use or outside consumption. - koick, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2Yeah, IN CHINA. In the US, CxOs can do whatever the hell they damn well please, including break the law!
- selloutvixen, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2Good for her. Maybe if the boss didn't CC all the other managers, it could've been kept between the two of them, but I guess we'll never know. If my boss was rude in an email and CC'ed all the other managers, I'd be humiliated at being scolded for something that wasn't even my fault so publicly. I probably would've reacted in the exact same manor.
I've been an office manager/admin for 3-4 years now, and I'll tell you, we're way underpaid and underappreciated. For all the standard work we do, we get stuff thrown to us that our executives are supposed to be doing. So, we end up doing executive work for minimum wage pay. When work > pay, you get fed up fast. - mpancha, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2What a load of b.s. Granted her boss was rude, but secretaries are rude to bosses and vice versa. It happens in every company. You don't send copies of company emails to anyone besides the intended recipients, you don't send personal issues to the whole company, you send it to HR. The secretary should be fired and black listed. The CEO/Boss, whatever he is, deserves a reprimand, but not a firing, he didn't leak the email.
- Friedbeef, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2Full text of the email can be found here....
http://www.shanghaiexpat.com/community/index.php?blog=20&title=emc_s_email_gate&more=1&c=1&tb=1&pb=1 - Nougat, on 10/12/2007, -2/+4Do they have golden parachutes in China?
- QueenOfSwords, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2This email would have just been the last straw.
- DrMindHacker, on 10/12/2007, -1/+2 The bottom line is that a boss is in charge of managing a business [a coordinated effort
between people to produce a value]. If he is incapable of managing his own affairs - keeping
track of his keys - and shifts responsiblity in his failure to do so, he does not deserve the
position he [somehow] acquired. The secretary's response was perfectly rational and bravo
for her for standing up to such neolithic incompetency. His tactical mistake was CCing others
but his strategic mistake was living under the delusion that a position within a company grants
him the right to treat others in an inferior manner. Perhaps his he should have had his mommy
make sure he takes care of his ***** before assumes the pretense that he is someone that
is capable of such on his own. - kupo19, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1thanks for the link. that gives a much clearer picture of what actually occurred.
- returnofmalv, on 10/12/2007, -1/+2Taking the blame from her boss wasn't part of the job description. His mistake, he should deal with it
- SlowOnTheUptake, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1Mr. Loke demonstrated:
1. Poor judgment - by reprimanding Ms. Hu in his impolite email. Also, beating up on a subordinate in front of others: the people he cc'd.
2. A inability or unwillingness to accept personal responsibility, an example of which he thoughtfully emailed to his staff.
3. Poor leadership - he let this thing spiral out of control.
Looks like he hit the trifecta, Enron could have used a guy like that.
Ms Hu, on the other hand, also showed remarkably poor judgment. She was right in sticking up for herself, but she also has an obligation to protect her boss and her company. She also turned this into a cultural conflict by cc'ing the people she did. She should not be in such a sensitive position.
EMC is better off without both of them. - asadsalm, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1My new Sig:
---------------------------------------
"Even though I'm your subordinate, please pay attention to politeness when you speak. This is the most basic human courtesy."
- Rebecca Hu
--------------------------------------- -
Show 51 - 90 of 90 discussions
© Digg Inc. 2009
— Content created and posted by Digg users is