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Adobe, Omniture in hot water for snooping on CS3 users

arstechnica.com — A suspiciously-crafted URL disguised as a local IP address has caused an outcry over how Adobe's usage statistics are being gathered.

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  • 2ktj, on 12/31/2007, -1/+82Hmmm...time to add
    127.0.0.1 192.168.112.2O7.net
    to my hosts file...
    • artificialgrey, on 12/31/2007, -91/+2Time to switch to a decent OS
      • retral, on 12/31/2007, -8/+27Hasn't there been enough windows-bashing? Everyone knows it's the only OS that has wide game support.. and isn't bad for anything else (except for security, I guess).
        • prophetpimp, on 12/31/2007, -4/+33unless a person is a total idiot then even security is fine.
      • darkecho, on 12/31/2007, -3/+18Assuming you are talking about Windows. You do know that the hosts does exist is more than just that operating system right?
        • Tippis, on 01/01/2008, -0/+12...come to think of it, what OS these days *doesn't* use a hosts file? O_o
      • JasonMaloney101, on 12/31/2007, -2/+17My BeOS system has a HOSTS file, you insensitive clod!

        /gets dugg down for using a slashdot joke
        • Muncher, on 01/01/2008, -1/+4According to Wikipedia, Linux and Mac OS X do too.

          /doesn't bury Jason, as he agrees is unfamiliar with slashdot humor
        • srg13, on 01/01/2008, -0/+1"According to Wikipedia, Linux and Mac OS X do too."

          Ever wondered why the hosts file on Windows is in a folder called 'etc'? Take a look at /etc/hosts in any Unix or Linux system...
      • Skooma714, on 01/01/2008, -2/+6CS3 won't even work on Linux. So you're right.
    • scottschiller, on 01/02/2008, -1/+1You'd be best off adding just 2o7.net, thus blocking the whole domain. It's used all over the place on the web - mostly cookies and ad junk if I'm not mistaken. Better yet, look at stuff like DNSKong from http://pyrenean.com/ - for win32, if you're interested in blocking stuff at the DNS level (basically Hosts but more flexible, filters etc.)
  • Dumbledorito, on 12/31/2007, -0/+93I just want their thrice-damned updater to go take a long walk off a short pier. I've turned the thing off (or so I've thought) multiple times, and I'm tired of the popup. It's come back from the dead more times than the Star Trek franchise.

    My Adobe products work just fine. If there's a problem or I feel like it, I'll update, thankyew.
    • Daniel591992, on 12/31/2007, -3/+20Wow. I'm glad I'm not the only one...
    • antdude, on 12/31/2007, -1/+9This is true for all the software for me. I still use Office 2000, Nero v5, etc.
    • Chirp08, on 12/31/2007, -0/+4it hasn't yet sucessfully installed the "flash lite" upgrade, which is ironic considering i dont even know WTF "flash lite" is, considering I have Flash Professional installed. Maybe thats why it keeps ***** crashing, and I force quit it before it even finishes opening these days. Annoying as hell, I wish I didn't need it, but photoshop still has a few bugs in leopard which is making me have to check for updates often :(
      • brianez21, on 01/01/2008, -0/+1Flash Lite is a mobile version of Flash player, so I'm assuming that would be the developer's plugin/API/whatever that it is trying to install.
    • FutureGuy, on 01/01/2008, -3/+2After looking at all the evidence I conclude its M$'s fault. (S replaced with $ to make me look cool)
  • UnstableMind, on 12/31/2007, -3/+74WTF mates? I think I need to show my wife how to use Gimp instead now. I paid $700 for my version of CS3 and I'll be damned if they treat me like Microsoft. I think usage and statistics are ok, as long as the end-user turns it on. Not this ***** of hiding.

    Also, I have to admit, that's pretty damn in-genius tricking of the hostname/IP. I'd expect this from an cracker/script kiddie, not a professional multi-billion dollar/year corporation.
    • DCUK, on 12/31/2007, -5/+60http://thepiratebay.org/tor/3822199/Adobe_Premiere ...

      Spend $700 on crack or something worthwhile.
      • ryodoan, on 12/31/2007, -4/+35I dont really have a problem with people pirating software if its for private usage, but if you are going to use it to make money in any way then you should either buy the software or look into open source alternatives.

        If nobody buys the product then they are going to stop working on it.
        • senatorpjt, on 12/31/2007, -1/+9Yeah, I just use it to remove herpes sores from cheap porn.
      • Ymeg, on 01/01/2008, -7/+1Personal integrity. Look it up some time.
        • jjremy, on 01/01/2008, -1/+7No one actually BUYS photoshop. $999? That's insane.
      • bradkovach, on 01/02/2008, -0/+1I believe you just broke the Digg TOS. I'm telling.
    • xenixninja, on 12/31/2007, -14/+8Get GIMP now and throw out Adobe. I turned my back on them for months ago.
      • sekhui, on 01/01/2008, -2/+7gimp is a ***** train wreck. i want to like it, i really do. but it's just not as good.
      • BossKey, on 01/01/2008, -2/+4The GIMP is proof that free open source does not always result in the best solution.
      • Markpdotcom, on 01/01/2008, -2/+1Even the gimp version of photoshop , gimpshop: http://plasticbugs.com/ is a buggy load of crap. It would be amazing if it would work, but it doesnt :(
    • Rikkochet, on 12/31/2007, -3/+6Read the comments from the Adobe engineer more closely - it doesn't sound malicious at all, though the 192.168 rubbish soudns suspicious on part of Omniture.
      • jakem1, on 01/01/2008, -0/+2Except that Adobe paid Omniture for their services and Adobe developers programmed the URL into their own product. Sure, Omniture have come up with a clever way to trick people but it was up to Adobe to decide to make the most of it.
    • rebotfc, on 12/31/2007, -8/+34Sorry but GIMP will never be a replacement for photoshop it is just too damn awkward to use.
      • senatorpjt, on 12/31/2007, -13/+9Only if you're used to Photoshop. I used gimp before I ever tried Photoshop, and I thought Photoshop was awkward.
        • Markpdotcom, on 01/01/2008, -3/+2And that helps the hundreds of thousands of photoshop users how?
    • gdstudios, on 12/31/2007, -9/+1Omniture is a hit-tracking company that allows you to track clicks and such inside flash movies. If this is enough of a threat to you to use GIMP, then you might want to get off the internets completely. DIGG USES TRACKING COOKIES!!! OHMIGOD!!! JUST LIKE EVERY OTHER SITE ON THE WEB!!!
    • Flashman, on 12/31/2007, -6/+12I showed my wife how to use a gimp and we've never looked back. Got his own box and everything.
      • safesolvent, on 12/31/2007, -2/+5oh. i see what your doing there. i think.
      • truspect0r, on 01/01/2008, -6/+11Your wifes a man?
        • thomashauk, on 01/01/2008, -4/+3The gimp is you idiot...
          That was the punchline, you know, the funny.
          • truspect0r, on 01/01/2008, -2/+1Thanks Captain Obvious. I wouldn't have known.
    • jakem1, on 01/01/2008, -5/+2It's not really fair to claim that Microsoft do the same thing. With the exception of the recent stories about Windows Update, which were more of a beat-up than anything else, Microsoft always ask your permission before taking anonymous information about their products.
      • Markpdotcom, on 01/01/2008, -0/+7Thanks Bill... I didn't know you posted here ;)
    • zongamin, on 01/02/2008, -0/+1Just get Little Snitch.
    • dansen926, on 01/22/2008, -0/+0I find it interesting how unfounded comments and news items make their way onto the Internet. I just started working for Omniture, and I understand their tracking procedures pretty well now. Apparently, Adobe uses a built-in IE component to display news and a page served from Adobe servers. Hence, Omniture tracks any webpage from Adobe. Simply opt out of the 2o7 tracking cookie in IE, and you're good to go :)
  • fabulodude, on 12/31/2007, -0/+39Omniture is one of the poorest-run businesses I've ever seen. After Google launched its own free analytics software (which now is considerably improved and a direct competitor to Omniture), execs from Omniture came to my university. I asked them point-blank about their new competition and what they're going to do about it and they replied that they could care less about Google. Well, AOL, Yahoo! and plenty of others are proof enough why such an attitude can put you out of business.
    • mythicflux, on 12/31/2007, -1/+9Except Omniture isn't competing in the free analytics market. They are competing in the enterprise analytics market. These are contracts worth millions of dollars from Fortune 500 companies. If you honestly believe that Google Analytics is just as capable as Omniture's SiteCatalyst or Visual Sciences HBX (which is being used by Digg BTW) then you have know nothing about web analytic tools.
    • BluKnight, on 01/01/2008, -0/+4I use both Omniture SiteCatalyst (SC) and Google Analytics (GA). GA has a very aesthetic appeal and is great for basic site tracking usage. But when it comes to analytical power, Omniture has an extremely powerful suite of tools. In addition, they can integrate with other companies (Genesis) and their Engineering Services Group can slice and dice chunks of raw data to customer specs.
  • johnshooter, on 12/31/2007, -6/+28I'm shocked this hasn't received more attention from diggers. This is a downright dirty business tactic and Adobe should not get a bye.

    Maybe you should have titled your post MOST SHOCKING ADOBE TACTIC, EVER, EVER!
    • Sil369, on 01/01/2008, -0/+5don't forget BREAKING
    • Markpdotcom, on 01/01/2008, -0/+5Adobe has a long history of bundling ***** with their products, for a short while the flash player was bundled with WeatherBug, spyware crap. Users revolted, they removed it. Then they moved on to forcing users to use their own downloader software to get their demos/updates, still in use (I think they provide an option on how you want to download now). Then finally they bundled the yahoo toolbar with their downloads, an absolutely pointless deal only done to line their pockets.
      Its unfair that they own all the major professional design tools for new media production (I'm amazed they were allowed to acquire macromedia!).
      ***** adobe! Its all about making a profit for them, it has never been about helping their consumers!
      • ISIfunded911, on 01/01/2008, -2/+2That is capitalism, plain and simple. The stock-holders ask for a steady growth of profits. Every year! By any means necessary, because there is no morality, no place for life or human values in the rules of accountancy. The rules of accountancy have more power than all the laws over life on Earth. As a result, life on Earth is suffering terribly.
        Watch the documentary called The Corporation if you do not understand that capitalism is the most insane society ever created!
        http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=1920121189 ...
  • PaulSu, on 12/31/2007, -13/+5What I want to know if we can sue the company responsible for this?
    • sockpuppets, on 12/31/2007, -3/+4Oh please.
    • Ataxia87, on 12/31/2007, -2/+19I'm going take action on this. I want to use pirated software without hassle from the company I stole it from!
      • turpenine, on 12/31/2007, -1/+5I have an actual licensed copy of photoshop thank you very much.
        then again I am a designer so my making money depends on the tools i use.
      • DestroyFascism, on 12/31/2007, -1/+3And you think 2.5k is value for money?
    • jakem1, on 01/01/2008, -0/+4It would also be interesting to know whether this breaches the UK's Data Protection Act which is supposed to deal with the theft of information in situations like this.
  • thedzigner, on 12/31/2007, -1/+18I hate to read stuff like this. What gives software companies the right to think they can sneakily monitor end users? All in the name of marketing strategies, so they know how to better cater for our needs...dirty rotters!
  • ithejosh, on 12/31/2007, -19/+5Digg me down, meant to hit reply.
  • xistboi, on 12/31/2007, -2/+19Glad this is finally getting some traction!

    http://uneasysilence.com/archive/2007/12/12789/

    People just wrote me off as a psycho paranoid tinfoil hat person. I just wanted to let everyone know Adobe was doing something not clearly disclosed and wanted people to explore it!
  • blackjack75, on 12/31/2007, -1/+39When you installed the software you agreed to a bunch of things written in a language no human can understand. I am pretty sure they have the right to ring at your door and reclaim your liver, not to mention spy on you shamelessly.
    • dinobot, on 12/31/2007, -2/+7Your liver. It's a large, uh… glandular organ in your abdomen.
      • fyngyrz, on 12/31/2007, -1/+3...goes well with some fava beans and a nice chianti.

        slupslupslupslupslupslupslup
  • ryanshepherd, on 12/31/2007, -2/+29http://phoenixlabs.org/pg2/ - PeerGuardian 2
    Thanks to http://peerguardian.sourceforge.net/lists/p2p.php being listed in my block lists, Omniture has been BLOCKED, and I didn't even know it! Thanks PG!
    • applemachome, on 12/31/2007, -1/+7PeerGaurdian is amazing. I recommend it for everyone. Now I have more reason.
    • Qumahlin, on 12/31/2007, -7/+4PG is a tool for idiots administered by idiots. They block large swaths of IP addresses for no reason other then rumors. I remember when users were bombarding dslreports.com with messages on various ISP forums because they couldn't get to various websites...all turned out to be people using peerguardian and it's ***** blocklist.
      • Markpdotcom, on 01/01/2008, -2/+1Have you heard of the phrase: "Better safe than sorry"?
    • jjremy, on 01/01/2008, -1/+1Still no Vista version of PG?
  • Tyger11, on 12/31/2007, -2/+7Don't run your system with a default HOSTS file; use a replacement like the one here: http://www.mvps.org/winhelp2002/hosts.htm

    That site has long since been blocked.
    • diggsahole, on 12/31/2007, -0/+3That's probably the most comprehensive null route host file I've ever seen. FTW, thanks.
  • spunquik, on 12/31/2007, -1/+5delete
    adobeweb.dll
  • shinelikeitdoes, on 12/31/2007, -6/+13ok. seriously. if you think you can come close to accomplishing things in GIMP that you can in photoshop..you ARE a gimp.
    be outraged if you wish, but dont let it turn you into a babbling idiot.
  • thebass, on 12/31/2007, -21/+0you are all crying because adobe wants some usage statistics?
    ***** off.
    ***** digg

    DIGG IS NOT LIVEJOURNAL, IT IS NOT A PLACE TO WHINE.
    well it is now i guess.

    read your terms of use
  • natewitt, on 12/31/2007, -0/+9thank god for pirates.
  • gdstudios, on 12/31/2007, -8/+1Stop freaking out. It's the same thing as web tracking (which is also harmless), but it's in your program - and it's tied to 3 simple (non-mandatory) clicks. This is not an invasion of privacy. It's a simple hit counter, but it's in flash instead of in the web page. Buried.
    • mythicflux, on 12/31/2007, -0/+4Little does the average Digg user know that the same technology is in use on this site. Digg uses Visual Sciences HBX (A former competitor to Omniture, who just bought VS a few months ago)

      If you want to confirm just view the source of this page and search for the phrase "hbx"
    • smek2, on 12/31/2007, -0/+3Sorry, but what if a graphic designer doesn't WANT to be tracked? I don't like the idea applications send data without my consent or knowledge via internet. There's another name for these kind of programs.
      • mythicflux, on 12/31/2007, -1/+1Accept most of these analytics tools are designed NOT to track unique information. Most of that information is stripped during the data collection phase. And before you ask I know this because I use a major enterprise level analytics tool daily in my job. There is know way to identify or find any details with the tool I use.
        • Markpdotcom, on 01/01/2008, -1/+1Thanks for putting my mind at ease. Feel free to enter my computer when ever you please and take any info you want. As long as you make sure you can't tell it came from my computer that's good enough for me!
          /sarcasm
          • mythicflux, on 01/01/2008, -2/+1Accept that Javascript by it's very nature cannot access your computers files. Thanks for putting my mind at ease by confirming for me that you know jack ***** about how your computer works. Maybe some day you'll have an informed opinion that based on actually understanding what you are taking about.
          • Markpdotcom, on 01/01/2008, -1/+1I read that as "Waaaaaaaahhhhhhhhhhh I'm a total douche, trying to get rich out of spying on people, waaaaahhhhhh!"
            And who the ***** mentioned javascript you absolute ***** tard!
  • smek2, on 12/31/2007, -2/+2I'm glad i stopped using Adobe products after Photoshop 7.0.
  • darnit, on 12/31/2007, -0/+1http://www.omniture.com/privacy/2o7
    • IphtashuFitz, on 01/01/2008, -0/+2That's a pretty lame explanation that they're providing. The ONLY reason for a domain like 2O7.net and a DNS entry like 192.168.112.2O7.net is social engineering. If all they're doing is storing cookies, etc. they could use a more obvious domain name like cookies.omniture.com or www.omniture-cookies.net. There is NO reason for them to use the DNS entry that they do other than to try to trick people who stumble across it. Hell, they could use cookie.2O7.net, and they SHOULD be using something like that to prevent confusion among end users. About the only purpose for this trick is so that when software firewalls like Norton or Symantec detect a connection attempt they pop up a message like "should I allow a connection to 192.168.112.2O7.net?", which is obviously an underhanded attempt to trick a user into clicking on "allow".
  • Biker803, on 12/31/2007, -1/+2I was installing an update of Java earlier today after I initially read the article and at the end of the install my firewall popped up asking me to allow a connection to a similar looking address (with the 2O7.net at the end.) Sounds like a counter more than anything, though.
  • EmailAddress, on 12/31/2007, -0/+4People care about 2O7 vs 2o7 ?????

    I'd care about having to pay roughly $1000 for a product and some company is gathering stats on me, without my knowledge or my permission.
    • blazes816, on 01/01/2008, -0/+1I'm sure they have your permission. Remember that EULA nobody reads?
  • DestroyFascism, on 12/31/2007, -4/+1OMniture = CIA front company......? 0000oooooo
  • WheelchairDude, on 12/31/2007, -4/+5It's probably because of stupid F'ING RIAA...
  • diggsahole, on 12/31/2007, -8/+3Outcry? Hot Water? Really?? Welcome to the world of Web Analytics.

    Omniture and their 2o7.net domain aren't new... in fact, they're several years old. In a previous life coding high volume e-commerce sites for major retailers, several of my clients used Omniture and their 1x1 transparent GIF/Javascript combo to track and trend user behavior. The amount of data they offer is ridiculous and their reports are beautiful -- I could tell in my e-commerce flow where users would change their mind and back out. I knew how long users were spending on each page filling out information or browsing. This data is priceless when it comes to millions of people buying things from your company on the web, and any company who is serious about it uses something similar.

    This is the first time, however, that I've heard of Omniture code in a program. Many programs, without your knowledge, phone home to report usage stats, check for updates, and retrieve dynamic content. This recent Adobe realization isn't underhanded, trickery, or dark arts magic...

    Buried for hysteria.
    • cr3ative, on 01/01/2008, -0/+3It IS underhanded!

      A website, I can quite happily accept will be tracking me. It comes hand in hand with browsing.

      I don't expect a program designed to manipulate photos and drawings to be tracking what I'm doing!
      • diggsahole, on 01/01/2008, -1/+3I'm sure Adobe is interested in each mustache you draw on pictures of GWB. :-p
  • agoodfellow, on 12/31/2007, -3/+1OMG, you mean the stuff I'm doing on my computer is being tracked!? The software, that I didn't write, is doing things in the background I'm not aware of? Crazy.
  • senatorpjt, on 12/31/2007, -0/+3This sort of thing would be acceptable if Photoshop were free. Maybe.
    • sixthree, on 01/01/2008, -0/+6I seriously doubt the majority of digg users using PS have paid for it...
    • bubba9999, on 01/02/2008, -0/+1It's only acceptable if it's disclosed and you explicitly agree to allow it.
  • PaulSu, on 12/31/2007, -2/+2This remind Sony tactic
  • Brad324, on 12/31/2007, -4/+1I'm still trying to find a serial for CS3. Everything I'm finding is giving me viruses.
    • KungFuJesus, on 01/01/2008, -0/+6how the ***** are you getting viruses from a serial?
      • Brad324, on 01/01/2008, -2/+2generators
        • Damien79, on 01/01/2008, -1/+1If a keygen can breach your security YOU have big ***** problems, and are probably better of paying for the *****
          • Brad324, on 01/01/2008, -0/+1holy get laid, man. They haven't breached my security, they just exist, and don't generate any keys.
  • themoosejuice, on 01/01/2008, -0/+6Easy, just use these to show and block apps that want to call home.

    To block:
    Mac = Little Snitch
    PC = F-Secure
  • Betrayer, on 01/01/2008, -2/+2Brilliant... just brilliant... ive often wondered how adobe has been slowly taking control over the internet they just STEAL all the good ideas and call them there own.
  • HCviolence, on 01/01/2008, -0/+7It's ironic that people used to pirate programs because it was free BUT they were afraid of getting a virus or spyware.
    Now people pirate software BECAUSE they are afraid of unwanted software and spyware.
  • wayback09, on 01/01/2008, -0/+0It'd be a concern for most if they actually bought their Adobe software.
  • xkingADROCKx, on 01/01/2008, -2/+4whilst this is shocking, you can't blame them massively as think how many people pirate their software. BTW if you think gimp is better than photoshop, then you are a total dick.
    • Mike89, on 01/01/2008, -0/+1And for good reason. The pirated users (typically) don't have to put up with this *****.
  • bfdhud, on 01/01/2008, -0/+1Oh Noes! my warez
  • obxjdt, on 01/01/2008, -0/+1I use Linux, but I have to say, I always thought Adobe was on the up and up.
    Who can you trust when everyone's a crook?
    The Gimp is another option that is free for all platforms.
  • KnightCrawler, on 01/01/2008, -0/+1Any good outbound firewall will block it. Can also be blocked on the router.
  • Siegfriedson, on 01/01/2008, -0/+1Use Zone Alarm or another third party firewall to prevent to prevent your...*ahem*...legally-owned applications from phoning home.
  • Brymcon, on 01/02/2008, -0/+0GIMP!!
  • tvolpe78, on 01/02/2008, -0/+1I've built several web pages with Omniture and the crazy looking IP address is standard. Philips uses Omniture pretty regularly on their sites. If you go around the web with a web proxy running (e.g. Charles : http://www.xk72.com/charles/ ) you'll see these calls listed.
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