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180 Comments
- burke, on 10/12/2007, -0/+9It really gets my goat how code can be patented. Copyrighted, hey, fine -- you obviously own the code, you you should be able to stop people from using it. But you shouldn't own the idea. It seems wrong, especially for new technologies. This is the kind of thing that makes the world a terrible place.
- burke, on 10/12/2007, -0/+6"A host computer, containing processes for creating rich-media applications, is accessed from a remote user computer system via an Internet connection. User account information and rich-media component specifications are uploaded over the Internet for a specific user account. Rich-media applications are created, deleted, or modified in a user account, with rich-media components added to, modified in, or deleted from the rich-media application based on information contained in a user request. After creation, the rich-media application is viewed or saved on the host computer system, or downloaded to the user computer system over the Internet."
My God. That basically covers anything innovative happening with this whole "Web 2.0" craze. - eridius, on 10/12/2007, -0/+4phebach: it's actually pretty different. The GIF stuff was on a specific algorithm, which is perfectly valid. The problem there is CompuServe let everybody use GIF for free to build popularity, then suddenly started requiring licensing to encode GIF. The problem here is AJAX is a natural evolution of the web, not a nonobvious invention, and the patent covers practically every possible usage of rich media. In other words it's ridiculously broad, almost certainly had prior art, and hopefully somebody will step up and fight it.
- LoungeActx, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3they are just talking about their technology. Goto www.balthaser.com and check it out. They made a program that lets you edit your own website through theirs. It's actually pretty cool for people that don't know much about internet technology.
it doesn't encompass EVERYTHING like the article claims. This articles is completely misleading, and the author should do it's homework before writing something ***** like that. NO DIGG - joeslice, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3I think this covers basically the whole notion of client-server architecture, where clients ask the server to do something, and the server does something. The only thing in this patent that's specific is the fact that it calls out the internet as the 'protocol' for this exchange. digg for the heads' up, but how in the world can someone say they "invented" _all_ of these technologies.
Hey I have an idea! How about some sort of a device that hooks up to your computer and makes something happen or responds to signals from the computer? I just patented mouse, keyboard, speakers, USB cameras, printers..... Honestly, that's about how wide-sweeping this thing is, only you are hooking up to a remote computer, not your local one. - theDamager, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3(hopefully someone will read these...)
You will not have to pay a license to use anything.
You will need to pay a license if you create an Internet-based program which allows you to log in, and use a set of tools in order to make a "rich-media" website or application.
Read things carefully before you try to raise a stink about it or insult people. - juandj, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3not the world, just US. US's patent office SUCKS
- sstidman, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2"This officially proves that hyperactive monkeys with inked rubber stamps labeled "GRANTED" and "DENIED" in each hand do, in fact, run the USPTO."
That's not true!! They DO NOT have a "DENIED" rubber stamp, only two "GRANTED" rubber stamps.
}:-P - carwashi, on 10/12/2007, -1/+3Did you guys actually read the patent. It only deals with the creation of rich media applications over the internet. It does not state anything about the use of such technologies. So basically the patent would cover things like alloing a user to create a Flash application over the internet instead of using the flash developer tools client software on your computer. Read the facts before you start flaming next time.
- ThomasTuttle, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2I just read the article. They didn't patent AJAX. They patented a specific web application. It's somewhat like a web page/site creator, but allows you to upload media to your account and create "rich media" applications using those files. It would be like "take your home movies and turn them into a spiffy but annoying Flash website". I don't know what falls under "rich", but Digg is probably not (it's just links and text descriptions). Maybe Flickr is. But this *doesn't* patent AJAX!
- burke, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2"All in all it makes pages longer to load."
Actaully, if you use moo.ajax (http://www.mad4milk.net/entry/moo.ajax ), you've only got about 3kB of Javascript, so WAY under a second added. If you were *really* anal, you could even trim a little of that out. It's easy as pie to learn, too. - 5blocksfree, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2I am formally declaring the patent office BRAINDEAD. I will be laughing as soon as the morons who won the patent try to enforce it. I will be laughing even harder if it isn't immediately thrown out, because it will aptly demonstrate how completely backward the country has become with respect to progress and technological advancement.
- phenbach, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2Does this mean they can ask Digg to pay licensing?
It is crazy that this was granted. This reminds me of the who CompuServe GIF royalty thing a while back. - McEvoy322, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2"Hmm maybe I should patent the internet"
Sorry, that belongs to Al Gore. :P - dvdgee, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2There is so much prior art on this, there is no way it could pass any real-world test. I first used "AJAX" style scripting, then called "Remote Scripting", on an enterprise app in 2000. At that time, there was already a large body of work online describing the various methods of doing this, most notably at Ashley IT's site, http://www.ashleyit.com/rs/main.htm, although I seem to remember reading a number of articles on Apple's developer connection and, I think, IBM's developerworks, at that time. Remote Scripting worked in Netscape 4.7x, it was a Microsoft/ASP technology. The more common and still widely used IFRAME Remote Scripting was also in pretty common usage for behind-the-firewall enterprise apps long over "half a decade ago".
- digitalunltd, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2I'm guessing not to many poeple here are patent lawers and don't know much of anything about patents. I don't know a lot but I do know a little, so I throw my 2 cents in.
Patents can be rediculous and still hold up in court, for example Amazon holds a patent on "one click buying" this means any company that want's to have there e-comerence site set up to have a one click buying option would have to get a licence from Amazon and Amazon can refuse to licence it. If they won't licence it then the e-comerence site is out of luck.
If your thinking, theres no way such a patent could be held up, its too monopolistic, well your right about one part. Patents are very monoplistic, unlike most US laws patents are designed to help companies create a monopoly. Patent laws were written durring the idustrial revolution for the specific purpose of helping companies create monopolies, back then there was no federal agency against monopolies.
So yes, patents suck, companies can apply for a patent and if they get it well you just better hope you are not doing anything simular. Becuase patent lawsuits are death to most companies.
Whats worse there are people who purposely submit patents just so that if any one every does somthing simular to one of the hundreds of patents they have submitted they go sue them. This is how they make thier living - and quite a good living.
disclaimer - I have taken one college class that just bareley talked about patents: Im not an expert. So don't quote me on the above, some parts probably are not acurate. - joebob, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2Another example of why the entire US patent system is outdated, uncoordinated, and incompentant to the task it is charged with.
- noelsusman, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2Wow....just wow....
Random guy: Hey, I have this code, actually a lot of different codes, that I want to get patented.
Patent worker: Wow!!!! That is like so amazing!!!! I have never even heard of any of this stuff before!!!! A billion patents granted to you. Well done!
Random guy: Thank you for your kindness and stupidity.
There's no way this will hold up - Ouroboros, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1If this is defensible, every web 2.0 company in the valley is moving to Vancouver. It's not too far, has decent pipes and colo facilities, and moving assets to Canada shouldn't be too hard for the various VC firms.
- Oakes, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1Frivilous patent - it'll be overturned by prior art.
- migsims, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1This is a bunch of total bs...
I'm now gonna patent the order I put the knife fork and spoon on my table, so every one in the U.S. will have to buy a license to put their eating utensils on their dinner table in my way... - Tmacman, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1http://www.balthaser.com./ is down.
me thinks it's the Digg effect. - nju0843, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1No DIGG...title is incredibly misleading!!!
PHOENIX, Feb. 12 /PRNewswire/ -- Balthaser Online(R) today introduced
Balthaser:Fx(TM), the first professional online design system for creating and
maintaining rich media web sites and interactive productions. Announced at
the DEMO 2001 executive conference in Phoenix, Balthaser:Fx provides a
powerful, easy-to-use, and cost-effective way to create engaging Macromedia
Flash(R)(TM) experiences. With its drag-and-drop interface and library of
thousands of rich media objects, Balthaser:Fx enables even amateur web
designers to deliver the benefits of Macromedia Flash content that combine
motion, sound, graphics and text for their communications and marketing.
Priced on a pay-per-project basis of $199, the online design system will be
available February 14th at http://www.balthaser.com.
"The future of the Internet is rich media," said Neil Balthaser, chairman
and CEO of Balthaser Online. "Balthaser:Fx enables even amateur web designers
to deliver high-production-value, TV-like online experiences."
"Balthaser:Fx not only creates Flash content, it is a Macromedia Flash
application," said Peter Goldie, vice president of product marketing for
Macromedia. "It is a great way for new rich media web developers to cut their
teeth with multimedia in an approachable manner."
-courtesy of prnewswire.com - M4tt3r, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1No...people you just don't get it.
They have a "service" that you sign up for so you can make a webpage with "rich-media".
The process and the service along with the scripts, and everything else associated with the site is patented. NOT YOUR SITE.
It's their service, not what's on your site, (unless you made it with THEIR service.)
I don't like this because if you read the patient, it's like patenting the "radio" and how it works with radio waves.
This cuts out all competition for the same type of idea or service, NO ONE else except them can do this. - MariusAgricola, on 07/15/2008, -0/+1Did nobody else notice this happened back in 2006? If they were going to sue people, we probably would have heard about it by now.
- inactive, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1This officially proves that hyperactive monkeys with inked rubber stamps labeled "GRANTED" and "DENIED" in each hand do, in fact, run the USPTO.
- wyoung, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1This could also cover every other website that has anything interesting about it, like Flash, Java, etc. This doesn't read like it's specifically AJAX stuff.
- SteveR4376, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1I guess I should apply for a patent for breathing and then charge everyone when they inhale.
- LucasOman, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1********* PLEASE READ THIS, EVERYBODY. *********
To quote theDamager:
"You will not have to pay a license to use anything.
You will need to pay a license if you create an Internet-based program which allows you to log in, and use a set of tools in order to make a "rich-media" website or application.
Read things carefully before you try to raise a stink about it or insult people."
********* PLEASE READ THIS, EVERYBODY. ********* - M4tt3r, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1"I guess I should apply for a patent for breathing and then charge everyone when they inhale."
You're going to need millions to pay off the Representatives and dish out to the lobbyist.
Good luck. :) - M4tt3r, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1Too funny,...
With all this corruption now a days, I just laugh it off.
It's alot healthier then pissing my self off. - diggm0nkey, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1Hmm maybe I should patent the internet
- nacho, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1I just patented creative thinking and written response. You all owe me money.
- gburch, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1I am familiar with this company and their "invention" I also worked at a company prior to their invention that did exactly what he did. I do not think this will hold up. I should state that I work for adobe but this view is my own...
- lachek, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1There are two problems with this story:
1) The creator is cited in the article as not understanding what his own patent covers:
"The broader claim is one that basically says that if you got a rich Internet application, it is covered by this patent."
As has been repeatedly stated, the patent does NOT in ANY way cover Flash or Java applets, nor Javascript, nor ANY technology used to design a rich-media web application, INCLUDING AJAX. It DOES, for good or bad, cover the method of creating a web-based technology which enables the creation of such applications by their users - a la Balthaser's pro:fx product. This is obvious if one actually reads the patent and not just skim the abstract (which is way too broadly written).
2) The story, as well as seemingly 95% of the readers and commenters, actually take this guy seriously instead of ousting him.
By spreading the falsehood that this patent covers AJAX, Flash, Java, and so on, the digg community is only serving to increase Mr. Balthaser's asking price for his ridiculous patent. Anyone who still remembers SCO vs the World is familiar with the strategy. Don't act like a bunch of Chicken Little's.
digg.com's use of AJAX is limited to simple customization of one's profile. This can hardly be construed as "rich media", and the methods used are completely different than those outlined in the patent.
I have yet to try Google Pages, but I suspect that their methods of webpage creation is different from pro:fx's methods. Keep in mind that Google is one of the "top-tier" names Mr. Balthaser was throwing around as a potential purchaser of their patent, and this announcement coiniciding with the release of Google Pages may not be a coincidence at all.
Basically, if some site used AJAX methods in exactly the same way as the patent outlines - the way pro:fx uses Flash, in this case - then the patent covers it. Otherwise, not. Claiming otherwise is achieving the opposite of what you're trying to achieve. - CamonZ, on 10/12/2007, -1/+2the title is a hoax. the company designed a web interface for designing websites, actually is pretty cool
- nju0843, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1If you read this carefully...this sounds more like a technology or process they developed to do some pretty cool stuff using these "Rich-Media" not necessarily putting a patent on the actual USE of the rich-media here is the summary of the patent:
i am replacing "rich-media" with "Flash"
A host computer, containing processes for creating Flash applications, is accessed from a remote user computer system via an Internet connection. User account information and Flash component specifications are uploaded over the Internet for a specific user account. Flash applications are created, deleted, or modified in a user account, with Flash components added to, modified in, or deleted from the Flash application based on information contained in a user request. After creation, the Flash application is viewed or saved on the host computer system, or downloaded to the user computer system over the Internet.
It seems these clever folks have found a way to possibly "host" rich-media applications on the web.
So if I have a java application or a cool AJAX application, I could upload my specifications of the
application using my "user-account" I can add, delete, or update my applications and view, save, or download them to my computer...voila! Seems pretty stinkin cool and fairly innocent!
Let's replace "rich-media" with "Flash" - fredclown, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1Bet the patent office's website goes against this patenty in some fashion. Ironic.
- lcarsdeveloper, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1I had a good read through the patent. It introduces it by saying that the average user doesn't have the knowledge to create websites using Flash, and their product is aimed towards them. It looks like a great product, their site is nicely done too. I personally don't use Flash much anymore, I prefer plain HTML (php powered of course!) sites, but it's an interesting idea nonetheless.
It's just a shame that the poster of the original article spent more time writing his attack than actually reading the patent description. I guess he just wanted to get dugg and make some money from his numerous ads. Mission accomplished man! - inactive, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1This is precisely why the world laughs at and ignores the actions of the U.S patent office. They have become an international embarrassment that are incapable of understanding technology. It's only a matter of time before they grant a patent for the intake of oxygen by mammals or they expunging of excrement by monkeys onto mammals breathing oxygen down below - yes the U.S patent office is probably considering these pending patents as I type.
I have to hand it to you Americans, though. For a land that claims they are the most democratic and free society in the world you sure love having your rights taken away from you by your elected leaders. And it just keeps getting worse by the day, Whatever happened to representation? Do your elected politicians even care about their constituents? You need to remind your representatives that your fed up with companies ruling the people by proxy. - jus1haz2, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1wow this is just *****...
- OneZeroZeroOne, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1Rich-media? What does that mean?
A patent for transmitting data via the HTTP protocol. Haha, now I've heard it all.
Flash was around like 10 years ago, wasn't it? - daltonvoss, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1This patent doesn't change anything. read it before commenting. That being said, software patents are as big a sham as the term AJAX.
- monticello, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1The only loser here is reading comprehension
- ermau, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1"Basically, what this means is that if use a remote connection to log into my server and create a Flash, AJAX or any rich media application and then use said remote connection to upload the contents generated on said remote connection I am in violation of the patent."
Exactly, which most people don't seem to get. This does not mean AJAX has been patented. This doesn't affect most AJAX applications, or flash for that matter. Title and description are misleading and obviously misinterpreted. - sedgemonkey, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1Any two-bit web designer in 1999 (let alone a developer) could create a "rich internet app" with Flash and PHP/ASP hence the patent has no merit. Ugh, it's like trying to patent the process of plugging your computer into an outlet.
Can I get a patent for pissing all over this moron's greedy and just plain evil plan to extort money from developers? - danboarder, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1for everyone who says "NO DIGGZZZ" etc realize that digg means you want this issue to be noticed, not that you agree with the patent... people digg this because it needs to be discussed and debated... and maybe then -- if the right people challenge it -- this patent will be invalidated.
- bbach, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1I swear the anit-patent zeolots are out in force... Read the damned thing first. Start with the title - do you note the words "design" and "create"? That describes what it is.. A method to "design and creation of rich-media applications via the internet". That is all, not Ajax, Flash, DHTML or anything else. It is a way to create things that have elements like that in it, via the Internet.
It may or may not be an absurd patent but READ THE TITLE OF IT. It is specifically for creating and designing websites online. That is it. It does not cover the Ajax, flash or any specific technologies themselves. It is using those things to create or design a website through a service like theirs.
Instead of "oh patents suck" bla bla bla... read the thing.
This has been noted many times above and most of the people here just keep babbling without putting a minute into reading the damned thing. - paulchu, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1way to completely plagiarize a news story and then post it here for diggs...
lame - inajeep, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1Does the Patent Office's website presenting the graphics and such associated with the patent, No. 7,000,180 in fact violate the patent?
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