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- gnuvince, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3
/meh
Ruby is nice, better than perl, not as mature as python, and not even close a contender as a PHP replacement.
Maybe Ruby can't replace PHP, however it's not because of some quality PHP has that Ruby hasn't. PHP is probably one of the worst designed language I've seen, some functions use the notation verb_noun, other use noun_verb, some function don't separate words with underscores and just leave everything in one long, impossible-to-read name, You have function names that are abbreviated (mainly to please the C people). You also have just one big namespace, OO sucks, not nearly as reflective as Ruby, etc.
PHP will continue to be king for quick and dirty pages, however many people are discovering all the advantages Ruby and Rails bring to building larger web applications. - jessestay, on 01/21/2009, -0/+2I don't get all the recent hype on Ruby on Rails. Perl has had similar MVC based systems out for just as long, and PHP has several as well. All of these including RoR are very young compared to the Java Servlet MVC frameworks also.
To me Perl's Catalyst trumps Ruby on Rails on many fronts, and is probably already familiar and much easier to learn than having to learn unfamiliar Ruby. I'd be willing to bet most programmers know at least some Perl whereas not many at all know Ruby. See Jesse Sheidlower's article on O'Reilly:
http://www.perl.com/pub/a/2005/06/02/catalyst.html
Of particular interest is his howto on creating an AJAX-based wiki in 30-lines of code or less. If that isn't fast and easy coding I don't know what is. - cdcarter, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1@shakin
Check out Basecamp.com, Backpackit.com, Tadalists.com, http://typo.leetsoft.com/trac/, Instiki.org, and 43things.com. All of them were developed in Ruby On Rails - rulethirty, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1Ya know.. people always compare RoR to PHP and whatever.. That's not accurate. RoR is a framework for Ruby. Let's compare RoR vs. MVC frameworks in any other language... I have to wonder if a lot of the hype is from people discovering the MVC pattern, or from the implementation of that pattern, ya know?
Anyway.. it's pretty fun to play with I suppose. - shakin, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1With all I've heard of RoR so far, I've yet to see a large scale RoR web app. Are there any examples out there? What about performance? The example sites at rubyonrails.com leave a lot to be desired.
- ErikB, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1I belive Ruby has been around as long as Python. 1993 or so.
- ForumTroll, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1I found Ruby on Rails to be great for smaller projects however it simply does not scale as well as some of the Java Servlet based MVC frameworks. This is probably because it is so young in comparison however it needs to improve it's scalability before it will start taking developers away from J2EE. Java really has a strong hold on enterprise level application development and the continuous improvement of Struts, Hibernate, Spring, JMF, the Apache Java projects and many others really help maintain this.
- SpookyET, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0For those of you who are using .NET, there is MonoRail that allows you to use this from C#.
For those of you who want the same experiece from Ruby, use Boo (boo.codehaus.org) and Brail (http://www.ayende.com/projects/brail.aspx). - toolio, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0At least ROR ensures MVC. All the PHP systems I've seen are two-tier hacks.
Correct me if I'm wrong... - ForumTroll, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0rulethirty: Good comment. I too believe a lot of the hype is people that are just starting to now see the benefit of a good MVC framework.
When used effectively a good MVC framework can make projects much easier to extend, maintain and scale. Most of the good frameworks also allow presentation to be mostly, if not completely, separated from the business logic which is a must for any good developer.
When developing scalable and maintainable applications; for the love of god please separate the business logic from the presentation layer. I've seen way too many applications where the business logic is just embedded directly into the presentation layer and it's just a mess to scale, update and maintain. =) - jmaziarz, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0@shakin
Also check out odeo.com - a nice RoR app that utilizes AJAX heavily. - wildjohn999, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0"PHP will continue to be king for quick and dirty pages"
I thought this title belonged to Active Server Pages? - RWVolkl158, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0I'm a python guy myself, but I'm glad to see Ruby getting some publicity lately.
- stuffedstich, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0PHP happens to be my favorite language.
- 200iso, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0@toolio
check out, sitellite: http://www.sitellite.org
@gnuvince
the function naming issues are annoying, but somewhat moot. php.net is awesome and i have never had an issue trying to find a function - gmosx, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0Well contrary to what some people want you to believe, there are several options for MVC frameworks. For example, have a look at Nitro (http://www.nitrohq.com) another Web Framework based on Ruby.
- gwjc, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0I love digg for the lack of moderation but this is just silly... jeez even /. wouldn't let you post another ROR story. What's next submitting a link to digg.com.. damn I'm doing it now.
- skoopmanschap, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0hardly news guys, hardly news.
- adam.lindsay, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0The syntax and flexibility of Ruby is what makes Rails. Otherwise, yes it is just a well done MVC. Mixed with ruby, it does deserve the hype. I have never built sites quicker. I have been doing this a long time, I remember testing in Mosaic and when ASP was in beta.
Scale? Well thats to be seen. Basecamp is awsome and seems to be serving quite a few people. Throw enough hardware at the problem and it should.
Manageablity, well its not like .NET and SourceSafe. But that isn't the audience.
In the end its quick to pick up and learn. Try it out. If you like it, cool. If you don't, cool as well. - inactive, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0Ruby on Rails is not a programming language. It's a neatly fitted addon for Ruby, which PHP has several.
Ruby on Rails is, and always will be, the designers programming language; meaning nothing hardcore, no real specific functionality, etc. It has commands to include JavaScript and CSS files for christ's sake. - jfro, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0simplest MVC web framework I've seen yet, nothing on PHP has really compared, not to mention the weakness of PHP vs Ruby
- gnuvince, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0Well, even if you don't want PHP compared with Rails, when compared with Ruby, the language, PHP still is the loser in my opinion. Ruby just has so much cool and very powerful stuff, an heritage from Smalltalk. For example, the Array methods are very cool (especially collect, select, reject, inject, etc.), blocks are killer, the meta programming makes complex stuff look almst trivial (that is how Rails does most of its magic, by creating methods at run-time to match the database tables' fields). There's definitly a lot of stuff that PHP, and other languages such as Java and C#, could learn from Ruby.
- rulethirty, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0ForumTroll: Which is what kinda sucks about php apps sometimes.. PHP's greatest strength is its unstructured nature.. Scalable? Sure, fast? sure whatever... Maintainable across an enterprise? Yeah f'n right.
And gwjc; I agree 100%.. I've decided you could post literally anything on digg and people are going to click that damn digg it link.. It's the only way to explain the pure and utter garbage that represents at least 25% of the material that gets posted. If I see one more person post a link to their own stupid ass blog.... well.. I'm not going to do anything... But I reserve the right to bitch about it. ;) - beowulf, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0-----
Ruby on Rails is not a programming language. It's a neatly fitted addon for Ruby, which PHP has several.
Ruby on Rails is, and always will be, the designers programming language; meaning nothing hardcore, no real specific functionality, etc. It has commands to include JavaScript and CSS files for christ's sake.
----
don this is an utterly ignorant point of view. I have spent a lot of time with development (asp, asp.net, php, jsp, etc.), and to say that Ruby has nothing special and nothing hardcore simply reveals your own ignorance. Ruby is a very well designed language, and rails is an incredibly well designed framework. There aren't very many frameworks out there as good as rails, and imo, Hibernate, Struts are not it. - kree, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0holy crap i cannot stand this guy's voice.
- gwjc, on 10/12/2007, -1/+0Oh well... digg outsmarted me.. won't even let you post a tinyurl to itself. I still can't believe this post is sitting at 248 diggs... how can some of the classic diggers be digging this.. why is Merovin down there? My Grandmother wouldn't think this story was new or digg worthy.. is there a conspiracy afoot?
- mdarby, on 10/12/2007, -2/+1This isn't news, nor is it a commentary on a subject. This guy just submits a link?
- etchalon, on 10/12/2007, -1/+0RoR is a nice framework, but from a design standpoint, it's just as horrible as the things it claims to replace (Struts, Hibernate, phpMVC, etc).
Problem is, so few web-scripters study design patterns that RoR is getting credit as some god-send thanks to it's MVC design. Any person of any remote level of talent/intelligence can replicate RoR's best features in just about any of the major web languages without too many problems.
It'll die out soon, one hopes. - mutant, on 10/12/2007, -2/+0/meh
Ruby is nice, better than perl, not as mature as python, and not even close a contender as a PHP replacement. - joseph, on 10/12/2007, -3/+0No thanks.
- DjOverEZ, on 10/12/2007, -3/+0Ignore my above comment, meant for the Yahoo music search digg.
- DjOverEZ, on 10/12/2007, -3/+0So, who wants to take bets on how long it will take for the recording industry to crack down on this service, calling it "Aiding in illegal downloading of music"?
- joshpeek, on 10/12/2007, -4/+0DUB-
http://digg.com/programming/Ruby_on_Rails_blog.
http://digg.com/programming/Ruby_on_Rails_v0.13
http://digg.com/programming/Railsday
http://digg.com/software/Ruby_On_Rails_-_Check_out_the_setup_video_
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