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Eclipse: Open-Source Tool Gains Traction To Help Build User Interfaces

informationweek.com — Until recently, Java tools have been employed for server applications but have been overshadowed by the popularity of Microsoft's Visual Studio.net toolset for end-user interfaces. The Eclipse Foundation has been attempting to counter that, given its strong, Java tool constituency, by setting standards and making available tools for an Eclipse RCP.

Who dugg this? Made popular Sep 11, 2006

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  • MySchizoBuddy, on 10/12/2007, -1/+4Eclipse is to CREATE UR OWN IDE. u can use it for C#, C++, ASP what ever u want. Adobe Flex was build on eclipse. So istead of creating a totally new IDE u just take eclipse, add ur own stuff and viola u have a complete ide.

    People should really read before yapping about java. Eclipse has nothing to do with java.
  • littlebiker, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3I think it's a very decent IDE/Interface builder. Check out this user poll on what's the fav. ide: http://www.tezaa.com/view/Your_favourite_IDE - ofcourse it doesn't beat Visual Studio - but gets quite close.

  • inactive, on 10/12/2007, -2/+4VI is a very powerful editor. If it had a manual, it would be even more powerful. If you need to learn VI, get Vim. They aren't the same but Vim actually does have a useful manual.

    VI will never be confused for an IDE.
  • skipunk, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1I am currently using eclipse RCP for a project I am working on and I must say it is pretty slick. The fact that it provides you valuable things such as update and online help features to use in your app, makes it a very worthwhile choice if you are going to be developing desktop Java apps. And the fact that it provides native widgets(through SWT) is a big plus also.
  • SmileyChris, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1I use Eclipse solely for Python development - the PyDev plugin is pretty solid.
  • Squeeself, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1As someone that uses Eclipse at work for development, I think the UI sucks. Really. Compared to other commercial platforms I've used, it's clunky, uses non-standard UI conventions (huh, F3 doesn't do Find Next???), and the configuration dialog feels like every Eclipse developer simply stuffed things in however they felt like and it usually takes me ages to find the setting I want. It has a LONG way to go to really be a good IDE in my opinion. I love the fact that there's a big open source IDE, and it has a ton of potential, but they really need to get some good UI people on board to revamp the thing. It feels like there haven't been any on the team at all (I'm sure there is, but they haven't been doing such a great job).
  • ucg1, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1Yeah, I kinda figured you were talking about IntelliJ which I've heard is really excellent (I haven't used it enough to form an opinion).

    I agree with the key settings like find next are a little awkward. They should at least make another set of keybindings that are more standard, if not change the default itself (and maybe add a set of "classic" keybindings for the originals). I've gotten used to the defaults, but I didn't particularly like the one for find next, and I've got some complaints about the find/replace dialog in general being a little weird.

    Couldn't hurt to get some UI improvements. For me, Eclipse is good enough (more like great enough), but then I haven't used IntelliJ IDEA, so maybe I just don't know what I'm missing.

    VS.Net's docking windows drive me crazy (no way to maximize a window into the main window like you can in Eclipse, and auto-hide doesn't work as well as it could), and I don't like most of the default keybindings; too many things I do regularly require two seperate keystrokes whereas I prefer a 2 or 3-key single-stroke combination. But at least keybindings I can change. In general I've had to change a lot of the defaults to get things how I like them, and still its not quite what I want.
  • quixotik1, on 10/12/2007, -3/+4..of the dodo?
  • l0ne, on 10/12/2007, -2/+3I might have to disagree, as I find Apple's Interface Builder mightily awesome and in some regards even better than VS (which has taken inspiration from IB at least in the areas of nonvisible objects and NIB/XAML).
  • blapierre, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1I thought we were talking about the platforms here.

    Regardless, yes I have used Visual Studio .NET 2003, 2005, and Eclipse. I found that Eclipse takes an incredible amount of time to load and is generally slow. On the other hand VS is very fast usually except when opening solutions that have many projects as well as many documents open. And of course the GUI design in Visual Studio is amazing.
  • Dutchmang, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1This is NOT an IDE discussion. Eclipse Rich Client Platform (RCP) is for creating desktop applications on the Eclipse runtime. One of its primary values is that it's a "middleware" platform that runs atop the OS -- so if you write an app for RCP, it runs across Windows/Mac/Linux automagically. If you recall the promise of client-side Java, it was write-once-run-anywhere, but you had to do the whole UI yourself so half the apps out there looked like they were drawn with a crayon. RCP actually interfaces with the OS for its widgets/menus, so you get a native look & feel.

    This is what the RCP idea attacks. Think about how MS imposes self-perpetuating dependencies between Windows, Office, and all other desktop apps, and this becomes clear as an open alternative for client software.
  • sillywampa, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1with the PHPeclipse, Aptana and SVN plugins, this has become my IDE of choice for both work and home. Web devs would do well to use this with the Aptana plugin. It is an excellent JS/css/html editor.
  • ucg1, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1@blapierre

    Have you used both VS.Net 2005 and Eclipse 3.x? VS.Net 2005 is amazingly slow and clunky (2003 was not like this, though). Eclipse 3.x is lightning fast in comparison.
  • shadearg, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1Eclipse may appear to be bloated if you use Eclipse SDK (120 MB download) (which includes source, examples and JDT). If you want to see how lean Eclipse can be, then download the Eclipse Platform Runtime Binary (33 MB download) and tailor the plugins to suit your development needs.
  • JEmerson, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1"Ever heard of GCJ?"

    GCJ/Classpath are an awesome technical achievement. But I really, really, wouldn't offer them up as a solution to slow bloated code. I've never seen gcj come out even close to sun's vm on linux, and that's also with the linux jvm coming in 3rd place on speed to both windows and osx fairly consistently.
  • gregcotten, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1Eclipse is a pretty bloated IDE/compiler.
  • comradechimp, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1Not exactly a massive choice on that poll. Where's IntelliJ IDEA, for instance?
  • Squeeself, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1IntelliJ for one. VS 2005 has a better UI, imho, even if it's missing a lot things that would make it much nicer (for example, Eclipse's text handling is definately superior, even if it doesn't come close to IntelliJ). The default keys may be changed, yes, but the defaults should really be a bit more standard than they are. That's the point.
  • ucg1, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1What commercial IDE's do you find better?

    Personally I love the Eclipse UI, but maybe what I expect from an IDE UI is different. Eclipse has a great UI, especially when I compare it to Visual Studio .Net 2003/2005 and JBuilder (maybe those are not the best comparisons). It has keyboard shortcuts for all kinds of useful functions. Don't like the default key settings? You can change any of them. Press CTRL-Shift-L at any time to see what keyboard shortcuts are available. Working with Java code is excellent, and once you learn all the keyboard shortcuts, you can write code much faster.

    The docking windows implementation is excellent. The perspectives concept works great (especially since you can save your own custom perspectives). The feature set is just amazing. Eclipse is just one of those IDE's you have to spend time to learn to fully appreciate it.
  • L0t3k, on 10/12/2007, -1/+1I was always a big fan of NetBeans before I moved over to VS Standard and .Net. I haven't tried it in a good long time, but I thought the UI on Eclipse itself, and the various components I was using, were terrible (remember... at the time). It might be time to try it out again though.
  • inactive, on 10/12/2007, -1/+1Never liked Java. Too damned many libraries and dependencies. My brain is crowded enough with math through DE, UNIX, C, C++ and Delphi.

    I like eclipse because it is extensible. There are all sorts of plugins are available for it.

    I USE the Borland Developer Studio because that's where the Delphi is. Borland could learn a thing or two from Eclipse. There are a few choice plugins that would make Developer Studio a whole lot nicer.
  • midwinter, on 10/12/2007, -2/+2You couldn't force me to use an IDE. Go vim.
  • cybersonic, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0That depends, if you are just using it for java. I build plugins for Eclipse to write ColdFusion and there are many ways to slice it depending on what you need. Its a great platform for other languages too.
  • diggwebq, on 03/17/2009, -0/+0I am a big fan of eclipse and of netbeans. I honestly cannot fathom why people would pay for jbuilder when either of these are available. However, I am forced to use JBuilder at work. I think Micro$oft and Borland should get a clue and release their IDEs as open source and focus on making money for integration tools and "strategery" based products that help integrate software engineering from concept to completion.
    http://www.zestrx.com/product/viagra-professional. ...
  • inactive, on 10/12/2007, -1/+1
    Dude, I like your moxy, but you need to understand that Eclipse is written in Java so it does have something to do with Java.
  • loquax, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0I am a big fan of eclipse and of netbeans. I honestly cannot fathom why people would pay for jbuilder when either of these are available. However, I am forced to use JBuilder at work. I think Micro$oft and Borland should get a clue and release their IDEs as open source and focus on making money for integration tools and "strategery" based products that help integrate software engineering from concept to completion.
  • inactive, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0Eclipse is an open source application framework. It's also the world's most extensible application framework. The very fact that it's written in Java is really irrelevant to its purpose. It's a pity that when the mildly retarded anti-social code monkey sees the word Eclipse their micro kernel automatically equates it to Java 1.0. Luckily, the code monkey, does not exit before leaving us a core dump of his favorite Java anecdotes. Silly, code monkey, Eclipse is for professionals.
  • inactive, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0It's always entertaining reading comments from code monkeys, with no post secondary education, on their understanding of Eclipse or Java. When you're an ignorant code monkey, you can't help but be funny. Now, get back to coding your input form, code monkey.
  • bcore, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0Borland have learned from Eclipse. The next version of JBuilder will be built on the Eclipse platform.
  • inactive, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0Hi Dutchmang,

    You've been modded down by a stupid code monkey. I modded you back up to +1. But, it's only a matter of time before another code monkey arrives.
  • inactive, on 10/12/2007, -3/+2i'll take blueJ over any other java ide anyday, i guess im the only one since its not even on that poll
  • lianos, on 10/12/2007, -3/+0... except for the fact that it's written/implemented in Java.

    But aside from that ... yeah ... nothing.
  • Plotinus, on 10/12/2007, -5/+2can't argue with the above comments - but on memory usage, footprint and speed dotnet can be spanked like a mewling baby ;-)
  • hutchike, on 10/12/2007, -7/+4Vi is the way.
  • Plotinus, on 10/12/2007, -4/+0true
  • tj9991, on 10/12/2007, -8/+3Call me when Java doesn't need a few megs of ram and a running virtual machine just to begin to run a Java application.
  • flump, on 10/12/2007, -6/+1Ever heard of GCJ? http://gcc.gnu.org/java/ The Java community doesn't want people with your attitude anyway, so don't check it out for our sake :) x
  • blapierre, on 10/12/2007, -6/+1Not by Java...
  • blapierre, on 10/12/2007, -7/+1Visual Studio .NET cannot be beat, especially when it comes to GUI design.

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