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20 Comments
- matt770, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3Use the torrents if you can...
- inactive, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1Maybe I haven't understood this stuff well enough, but I've never really felt comfortable with the idea of working in a format where stuff mostly happens automagically or under the hood (and I use perl - go figure!). I'm not a professional programmer and I'm certainly not the most experienced, but I really prefer having total control over everything that happens each step of the way. This whole "on rails" stuff just makes me feel like the magic wizard is doing everything for me.
- LninYo, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1Excellent and informative! Definitely worth a look!
- inactive, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0Well, I guess in my mind I'm thinking "What can it do for me". I run an auction site in which performance, query speed, handling transactional database procedures and a lot of other things are absolutely necessary. All the Ruby on Rails / Django stuff i have seen has been centered around "you can make a blog or a news site!" rather than something more along my alley.
I've been working on rewriting my site (maybe 20,000 lines of code) and I'll probalby stick with Perl because it's the language I know best. But I sure could be swayed if there was some reliable and slick system that could design the kind of interfaces and flexibility that I need. - jacobian, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0Seumas - just so you know, Django was designed from the ground up for performance. We serve up around 15 million hits a day, and that's from two servers (web + database).
As for the magic part: it's a trick tradeoff -- if a framework does too little for you, you're going to waste time doing boring tasks; if it does too much, you'll never know what's going on. We're in the middle of some pretty big changes to Django that (hopefully) will make what magic there is clear and consistent.
Still, I'd advise against actually trying Django yourself. You'll get addicted and have your previous comments proven, wrong, and that's never fun :) - UziMonkey, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0Rails doesn't implement everything for you. The things that happen automatically are very primitive. For example, if my most Post has_many :comments, a post object will have a comments method to access those comments. Other than that, I think the "smart defaults" might be what you're talking about. In the above example, my comment table has a post_id, which by default when using has_many with posts, will connect the two tables (with or without an actual foreign key restraint on that post_id column). All of these smart defaults can be overridden though, they're there only to make the most common use the easiest.
While I do see why people like smaller, easier to understand software, the ease of programming with Rails outweighs that concern for me. And you definitely don't have to worry about Rails not being expressive enough, that for sure... - Don_Quixote, on 10/12/2007, -1/+1"Ruby is only useful if it is on rails.
Ruby without rails is inherently dangerous and should not be used in applications such as cell phones."
I'm afraid you have no idea wtf you're talking about. - buckaroo, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0> prefer having total control over everything
That means you write in assembler, down to level of manipulating registers. (I have, many years ago in 6502, but I don't mind giving up some control so that I can actually finish a program :-) - inactive, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0"That means you write in assembler, down to level of manipulating registers. (I have, many years ago in 6502, but I don't mind giving up some control so that I can actually finish a program :-)"
I think it's more that I don't like the idea of some genie figuring out how to implement my tables and objects and how to access my data. Then agian, maybe these things have far more flexibility than I know (I have only looked into them briefly and watched an old tutorial last year).
At least if I do something, I know how I broke it. :) - diggity_dank, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0Django rocks! Learn Python... now... stop reading! GO!
- inactive, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0I was told that if I tried to learn python, all my perl friends would beat me into a coma with pillowcases full of soap.
- ironcamel, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0Python rocks! I must learn Django... now!
- matariel, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0Let's see how many buzz words we can fit in a title.
- ph713, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0[Especially targetted at Seumas above]
Catalyst @ http://catalyst.perl.org
To quote an actual user from the Catalyst marketing hype front page:
"This is by far the most useful and easy to use MVC Framework, I've ever seen... It is View and Model agnostic (to suit your habits), simple, powerful, practical to use AND easy to extend. All I can say is : Just give it a try..." - HardBap, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0How does Django compare to TurboGears? http://turbogears.org/
- martinus, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0Does the video show a fight between the Django and Rails developers? It would be really bloody mess, but I think Rails would win.
- holovaty, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0HardBap: TurboGears is also in Python, but it's a piecemeal combination of unrelated parts, whereas Django, like Rails, grew out of a real-world project and is a single piece of software (albeit decoupled -- you can use the individual bits, such as the template system, on their own).
Also, Django is quite a bit faster, performance-wise, and has a ton of niceties for the Real World, such as a caching system and the production-ready admin interface. TurboGears' "admin interface" -- it's a stretch to call it that -- is *far* from production-ready; it's more like a PHPMySQL clone useful only for developers.
Go with Django. :) - skabber, on 10/12/2007, -2/+0
- kinkysexradio, on 10/12/2007, -2/+0+digg for ruby
+digg 'cause I live in Chicago! - jmccorm, on 10/12/2007, -4/+0Ruby is only useful if it is on rails.
Ruby without rails is inherently dangerous and should not be used in applications such as cell phones.
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