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227 Comments
- yakski, on 10/12/2007, -51/+92The US is becoming less like the democracy our forefathers started and more like a Nazi Germany every day... the erosion of free expression has been horrendous under the current Bush regime... the American people need to wake up and smell the coffee before we are nothing more than another China..
- venusian, on 10/12/2007, -60/+98What's the point of the lawsuit? The ticket was already thrown out in court. She won.
Emotional distress? Really? - ISurfTooMuch, on 10/12/2007, -8/+44To be obscene, a work must meet all three of the following conditions:
1. Whether the average person, applying contemporary community standards, would find that the work, taken as a whole, appeals to the prurient interest,
2. Whether the work depicts/describes, in a patently offensive way, sexual conduct or excretory functions specifically defined by applicable state law,
3. Whether the work, taken as a whole, lacks serious literary, artistic, political, or scientific value.
BTW, this test was created by the U.S. Supreme Court in Miller v. California.
In this particular case, I think the message on the bumper sticker would have a hard time meeting any of these standards of obscenity, let alone all of them. However, keep in mind that this case is NOT about obscenity. That issue has already been resolved with the charge being thrown out. What's at issue now is whether the woman's civil rights were being violated, and this will probably turn on whether the initial ticket was politically motivated. I'm sure the police officer and the county will deny it, so this will be interesting to watch. - slipknotrobb, on 10/12/2007, -15/+47@knupso
That's the stupidest comment I've ever heard.
Yeah, freedom of speech is all fine and dandy until you say - oh my god - a CURSE word!
Like I said, that's the stupidest comment I've ever heard. - FuzzyBunny, on 10/12/2007, -19/+50Check out the poll next to the article asking if obscene bumper stickers should be illegal. The results are actually split 50-50. Who are all these people who would be willing to limit our civil rights just so they don't have to see a few naughty words?
- LacY, on 10/12/2007, -5/+36I may be wrong, but I could swear when this originally came out that I read that the bumper sticker in question actually said "I'm tired of all this BUSH**" -- asterisks and all, and that was the main reason it actually was thrown out in court--because implying an obscenity is not the same as displaying it.
- knightcrawler75, on 10/12/2007, -15/+45Free speech is overrated. I would gladly give it up in order to prevent the 1 in 1 billion chance that I may get blown up by a terrorist. If only we could wage a war on lightning. Then we would be truly safe. I would definitely let the gov tap my phone if it could prevent me from getting struck by lightning.
- cafzal, on 10/12/2007, -35/+63Hard to believe that they would do that to her. I have seen many "obscene" bumper stickers, plus what her said (CNN censored it even when it was in quotes!) was not to bad (and wasn't far from the truth). I say go for it lady!!
- yakski, on 10/12/2007, -8/+34The totalitarian regimes of China and Nazi Germany have alot in common when it comes to suppression of free speech and individual freedom as well as in the use of prison and torture to suppress dissenters. It hardly matters that they are in different political spectrums when the results on the individual are basically the same. As to those that think Bush no longer has any influence, one only needs to see how the Christian conservatives support him and his policies without reservation to know that he has millions of people willing to support him no matter the effect on civil liberties.
- inactive, on 10/12/2007, -5/+31@ karmatic
I stand by my earlier comments that you are simply uninformed.
You have to have a memory that spans more than four weeks. People have to break away from this silly notion that what our government does 'does not apply to them'.
Just so you know (because I'm sure you don't), 'The Military Commissions Act of 2006' abolishes habeus corpus, gives retroactive immunity to the Bush administration for possible war crimes, and pretty much destroys the Bill of Rights.
Once this bill is signed in to law (any day now), The Supreme Court will no longer have the legal authority to hear cases pertaining to national security... So the innocent people that have been detained in the name of the war on terror will not have a voice and will not be set free.
How is this different from the mass detainment of Jews?...or the mass detainment of Japanese Americans by FDR. Concentration camps do exist in America... See for yourself.
http://video.google.com/videosearch?q=concentration+camps
So don't you come to me and tell me that I'm a moron when you haven't done any research... I won't have it.
And I'm a Liberterian, not a Democrat. Democrats are as much to blame for the current geo-political structure as the Republicans are. - ubuwalker31, on 10/12/2007, -13/+37@antoniojvr
People like you are allowing our rights to free speech get trampled. You say she shouldn't have gotten the ticket, but that the cop should have told her to take it off her car.
I'm sorry sir, but if a cop comes up to me in his uniform, he has the full power of the State behind him, and is acting under the color of law. That is why it is a question of restriction of free speech, since it is a government official unlawfully telling me to shut up! - ISurfTooMuch, on 10/12/2007, -6/+30Yes, the poll is unfair, but that's nothing new for CNN. In case anyone hasn't seen it, it asks:
Should bumper stickers containing obscenities be legal?
It seems a straightforward question, but it isn't. As I said in my other post, for something to be obscene, it must meet a specific test set forth in Miller v. California. Now, one could argue that a bumper sticker could indeed contain an obscene statement, and I guess it could. However, I seriously doubt that words such as "damn", "*****", "*****", "hell", or any other you could think of has ever been or ever will be ruled obscene on a final appeal.
And besides, any statement that is obscene has no First Amendment protection and is already illegal. So, if you analyze the poll question, it's basically asking whether statements that are, on their face, illegal should be illegal. OK, now that's actually a good question to be asking because it can start a discussion on whether our current obscenity laws are too restrictive. However, I seriously doubt the clod who wrote that question was thinking in those terms. No, he or she was likely referring to swear words, such as the ones listed above. However, these aren't obscenities, but I guess that fact would be too complicated to impart to the people CNN is trying to reach.
Oh, how I wish these stupid poll questions had a space to leave feedback. Oh, the fun I could have. - pgoetz, on 10/12/2007, -5/+27@venusian
Yes, getting a ticket causes emotional distress and having to go to court costs time and money. An old cop saying during the Vietnam war protest days was "you can beat the rap, but you can't beat the ride", meaning that you might be found not guilty, but they're still going to f with you by arresting you and taking you to jail. The only way to stop this kind of nonsense is by suing. Well, there's violent revolution, too, but I'm assuming we see this as a less desirable option.
- inactive, on 10/12/2007, -13/+29@ karmatic
rofl, if you're going to insult a political affiliation at least learn to spell it correctly.
And BTW, this country IS becoming fascist very quickly... If you fail to see that then you are simply uninformed.
And most people would agree that Michael Moore is a douchebag. Stop polarizing everything you buffoon, there's more than just two parties. - Engival, on 10/12/2007, -10/+24Non-censored version: http://www.prankplace.com/bushgags.htm
scroll to the bottom of the page to see (what I assume to be) the original bumper sticker.
"I'm tired of all the *****".
I also like CNN's poll when you view that article. "Should obscene bumper stickers be allowed". Where's the missing option of, "What does that have to do with this non-obscene bumper sticker?" - Abx0r, on 10/12/2007, -11/+25OHHH NO, IT HAS '*****' WRITTEN ON IT! Call the WAAAAMBULANCE!
- fgsfds, on 10/12/2007, -2/+15@nrvous250gt: When you start hearing lines like "It's not so bad, you haven't been dragged out into the street and shot for dissent", that's generally a sign that things are getting pretty bad.
- UsernameTaken, on 10/12/2007, -7/+20But where else would you like him to butt ***** you?
- OzvS, on 10/12/2007, -19/+32venusian, what do you mean "what's the point of the lawsuit"?
It's for our benefit as well as hers. The point is, don't ***** with the "little" people. - VinceNoir, on 10/12/2007, -3/+14@venusian
Actually, getting it thrown out of court is the very least that should have happened. Someone should fire the ***** criminal who gave her the ticket in the first place. Then, someone should go after the people in that department who allowed this to even progress to being a court case. The cop should also have to publicly apologize to the woman for his lapse in judgement. Preferrably on TV where he can be humiliated for his stupidity. And finally, both the cop and the woman should be given the following bumper stickers:
Woman: "Freedom Wins"
Cop: "I'm Un-American"
For a start anyway... - antoniojvr, on 10/12/2007, -12/+22Really? Yet you get away with what you just said. Interesting.
- neszis, on 10/12/2007, -12/+21When I read "obscene anti-Bush bumper sticker" I was actually ready to play devil's advocate for the cops. But on reading the bumper sticker, it's still totally inane to give her a ticket for that. Sue, sue, sue!
- yakski, on 10/12/2007, -3/+12@nrvous250gt
Apparently you know little about the politics of the suppression of free speech. It hardly matters if your totalitarianism is from Communist China or Nazi Germany since both regimes disdain free expression and are/were willing to imprison people for disagreeing with the State and expressing that disagreement. Though China is moving toward a less Communist more democratic state, it is hardly there and suppression of freedom of speech continues there. - venusian, on 10/12/2007, -17/+25@OzvS
The ticket was thrown out. The legal precedent was upheld. The "little" people have already won. Now the lady is looking for a payday. - dBLiSS, on 10/12/2007, -10/+19She should be jailed!! Won't someone think of the Children!!!!
- inactive, on 10/12/2007, -15/+23Nice bumper sticker. Should find out where she got it.
- MadEnvoy, on 10/12/2007, -1/+9This is actually some pretty old news that is just making it to CNN and has been on digg before (no, i'm not claiming dupe! This story is about how she is set to sue).
Georgia law actually prohibits lewd or profane stickers or decals on vehicles. As far as I'm concerned, the word "*****" isn't lewd or profane, *****, I use it all the time!
Here are the links for further insight:
http://onlineathens.com/stories/032406/news_20060324055.shtml
http://www.digg.com/tech_news/***** - xutopia, on 10/12/2007, -6/+13@antoniojvr What black and white answer! I think the problem with America is that people are either strongly for or strongly opposed to everything. They do not understand that there exists a gray area in everything.
I guess you'll vote either Democrat or Conservative. Either be a "Good" Christian or a "Materialist" Atheist. Hey... either you are with us or you are against us. Let the decider decide. - borninda818, on 10/12/2007, -15/+22If something is obsene, the average 8 year old will see it and say "mommy what is that" and mommy will have a hgard time responding
If it contains a hidden message, especially one that isn't that bad, it is not obsene.
O yeah...dont vote in the poll thing on the side. The question is not fair. - JEWigs, on 10/12/2007, -6/+13I'm an atheist but most of the christians I know are a lot more materialistic than I am. I think it comes from expecting to be rewarded (i.e. I'm a good person so I get rewarded by going to heaven.) As an atheist (IMO), you don't look for a reward for doing the right thing. You do it because it's the right thing to do.
Edit - Sorry - off topic - digg down if you want but I took offense to the "Materialist Atheist" comment. - OwdenBowden, on 10/12/2007, -1/+7"What's the point of the lawsuit? The ticket was already thrown out in court. She won." the point is about the fact that your life, liberty and pursuit to happiness (in this case a bumper sticker) has be compromises. Even wasting a second of your time when in fact you should not have been stopped is a violation of your rights. And for those of you who say that "you do not like it" then do not look at it. It is your choice to read the profanity or not. For a country founded upon choice we sure are doing every thing to eliminate the right of choice. I choose to now end this rant.
- Karyyk, on 10/12/2007, -1/+7Apparently not, judges included.
That being said, good taste (or the lack thereof) isn't something I want to see legislated. The minute you start telling other people what they can or can't do when it comes to their individual rights, is the minute you invite the same to be done to you. My rights have been eroded enough as it is, I don't want to invite it to happen further.
Emotional distress though? Come on... If this woman was truly emotionally distressed by this (sure she was...all the way to the bank), I'd hate to think what would happen when some real trouble befalls her. The only reason this is even being Dugg is because it has the word 'Bush' in the title carrying a negative connotation. That's the secret to having your story Dugg these days... - NICU, on 10/12/2007, -8/+14Don't get mad at the woman - get mad at the lawyer who probably jumped at the chance to sue. The police were clearly in the wrong writing her a ticket for a law that was ruled unconstitutional 16 years ago. But any lawyer who thinks this case is worth money is a dirtbag looking for a payday. The officer should be reprimanded and trained that unconstitutional laws shouldn't be enforced. I hope the case gets thrown out so that damn lawyer doesn't get any money.
- klpowell, on 10/12/2007, -0/+6You don't know he was... some communities have laws on their books about public display of obscene language you don't know if that was the case here and if it was the cop would have been obligated to write this ticket.
- strebormj, on 10/12/2007, -1/+6I am against laws restricting freedom of speech viz. bumper stickers, but it's worth noting that the story was written by the radical Associated Press, the woman detests President Bush (and probably Republicans, conservatives, and "neo-conservatives"), and her lawsuit was filed by the ACLU, a communist vanguard protecting "civil liberties" only when it suits their subversive agenda.
I wonder what the response on here would have been like had the woman had a bumper sticker that made an "obscene" comment about a minority group, the woman detested members of a minority group, and the lawsuit were filed by some imaginary legal association actually dedicated to protecting freedom of speech, regardless of how un-PC the speech in question is.
I suspect we'd see a lot of "free speech" advocates demanding laws against "obscene" bumper stickers then. - tylerjames, on 10/12/2007, -6/+11the issue is that it's bull$hit to run around giving people tickets for no reason
this woman was smart enough to stand up for herself, and it should be acknowledged that power was being abused and rights were being ignored
i imagine there are others who have been placed in such situations and just taken the fine and continued living under the impression that they'd better keep their mouth shut if they don't want to pay a fine - lickmygiggle, on 10/12/2007, -2/+7Here in Massachusetts there was something like this that happened rather recently.
The issue was with a "honeywagon" that had the company's slogan "***** Happens" in rather large, friendly letters across the back of the truck. After some complaints from some soccermoms, the police asked the truck owner to remove it. He didn't though, and nothing came of it, because he really does have the right to say whatever the hell he wants on his own truck. - Lumiras, on 10/12/2007, -13/+18*****? *****?
That's not even clever.......it doesn't even make much sense. I understand what they're getting at, but come on, there are much funnier ways to make obscene bumper stickers about the president - klpowell, on 10/12/2007, -1/+6So its a violation of her freedom of speech to be asked to remove this sticker but its a violation of your rights if I want to put a nativity scene where you can see it? Oh how there is always two sides if you want to accept free speech then that applies to everything and tell the ACLU to get their business out of the freedom of religious speech.
- Cerebral, on 10/12/2007, -2/+7@eyeaml337
WTF are you talking about? You run around in circles in your own one paragraph post:
"The officer was obviously a moron but she is obviously taking advantage of things."
Actually the officer (who is there to protect the people and our rights) obviously took the law into his own hands and took "advantage" of his authoritative position. Also "So i guess she is sick of ***** but not her own *****..." where are you coming up with this stuff?
I'm sorry but at the least this woman should get back all the $ for her attourney, legal fees, paperwork etc. as well as there should be some action taken towards the officer. I know that when I didn't have my registration in my car (just updated and still had it on the counter in the house) it took me almost one whole day to go through the process of just going down to the courthouse, showing them my already issued registration, and paying parking and court fees... and all that was MY FAULT. This lady had to take her case to court just to get the ticket thrown out... and all because what... a cop didn't get the 6 year old memo?
There is a BIGGER PICTURE at play here than just a bumper sticker. Our freedoms are being eroded every day and you want to say that this lady is a bitch because she would like to protect herself and took an opportunity that came her way? - Jawood, on 10/12/2007, -2/+8I disagree.
What the problem is that the cops can basically do ***** like this with absolutely no penalty towards them. I wish I can find the story, but there was a cop who intentionally violated the Civil Rights of some protesters - I think he wouldn't give them a permit. When asked for a reason, he just said, I don't want a protest. When challenged, he said just responded with, "So sue me!"
This cop who violated this woman's rights received absolutely no penalty or reprimand for his action. In the meantime, this woman's Rights were violated.
THIS COP SHOULD NOT GET AWAY WITH THIS! HE WILL DO IT AGAIN! And the next person may not the have balls to fight it.
I agree with the lawsuit. And the whole "mental distress" or whatever is just to have grounds to file the lawsuit.
Sorry, folks but when the cops have no oversight and can pull this kind of ***** (the "Free Speech Zones" are so asinine!) we are in serious trouble and headed down a very dark path! - blingfinger, on 10/12/2007, -2/+6Since when is BUSH**, ***** or whatever it said a profanity. I've never seen that one in the dictionary.
- HarryBauzonia, on 10/12/2007, -3/+7I don't care to see it legislated either. It's better handled through societal pressure......which doesn't seem to exist anymore. I wish there were more people who believed in self-discipline and conducted themselves with some class.
I don't care for seeing crap like that for the same reason I don't like seeing trash laying beside the road or graffiti on a wall. Fat babymamas walking around Walmart in their pajama pants and flip flops, cussing into their cellphones make me feel the same way.
It's just scummy, trashy, and demoralizing. - Graeleight, on 10/12/2007, -10/+14I don't know what this woman wants. The ticket was thrown out because the law had already been ruled unconstitutional. This seems like a non-issue to me.
- Zlatty, on 10/12/2007, -4/+8true true
although there might be a coorelation between anti bush stickers and how much the police/state troopers are willing to pull you over ...
I say this as I got pulled over only when I had my 'f the president sticker' for a period of 6 months... and I have been speeding for 7 years throughout the mean streets of georgia... - inactive, on 10/12/2007, -3/+7The ACLU is trying to protect your freedoms you dolt...
- inactive, on 10/12/2007, -4/+8Her civil rights were violated by the state. If someone said "You no longer have the right to speak openly against our government." and that was overturned, you'd sue for emotional damages, too.
The thing is, if she wins the lawsuit, she would have sued herself and won. Where do states get their money, if not from the citizens? - JEWigs, on 10/12/2007, -1/+5@h00paj00
That's pretty much what I said as well. Thus the edit...
@Amebic
I don't think that's true. I was offended by the generalization and replied to it (as you took offense to mine and replied.) I don't think that my "crass generalization of Christians" was crass or a generalization. Statement of fact: the Christians I know personally are more materialistic than the Atheists I know personally. Opinion: I believe the causation of this is brought about by looking at life as a system of rewards and punishments. It could be argued that the expectation of reward for a good deed negate the good of the deed. If you live a "good life" in expectation of receiving eternal bliss, are you a better person than someone who lives a "good life" with no expectation of reward?
With that said, I would like to offer an apology to any Christians I may have offended. My beliefs (or lack thereof) are certainly no reason to give offense to others that may not hold the same beliefs (or lack thereof.) - inactive, on 10/12/2007, -3/+7How is it an immoral bumper sticker... People are so warped these days...
I would have done the same thing, if for nothing else, to get law enforcement off our cases and show them that we won't be trifled with...
THAT is the point of the lawsuit... Not to 'get a free ride' like you seem to assume. - LFAB, on 10/12/2007, -4/+8I think "*****" is obviously a racist slam against Asians...
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