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74 Comments
- Pacotheparrot, on 10/12/2007, -22/+97This not democracy. Never has been. It's a republic. If it was a true democracy we'd vote on everything and there would be no "representatives".
- inactive, on 10/12/2007, -8/+81Bush has little to no say in how he travels that is the Secret Services job.
- KenMo, on 10/12/2007, -28/+86Come on Bush haters. Every politician does this kind of thing (R and D).
Clinton tied up an airport once because he was getting a haircut.
Just let the hatred die down just a little bit and you will live longer. - DyDx, on 10/12/2007, -6/+57@jdb252 and doddilus:
The USA is a Republic. Don't you ever pay attention to the most basic of brainwashing devices, the Pledge of Allegiance? "And to the REPUBLIC, for which it stands.."
Also, see the first 3 definitions of republic on dictionary.com:
1. a state in which the supreme power rests in the body of citizens entitled to vote and is exercised by representatives chosen directly or indirectly by them.
2. any body of persons viewed as a commonwealth.
3. a state in which the head of government is not a monarch or other hereditary head of state.
Sound familiar?
A republic is essentially a representative democracy. But it's still a republic. - doddilus, on 10/12/2007, -6/+53@Pacotheparrot
Thats called a direct democracy. Digg is a direct democracy. Would you want your government run like Digg? - Lindsay, on 10/12/2007, -15/+41Kudos to the state of Virginia for not allowing the HOV closure.
- BullyJack, on 10/12/2007, -4/+25I was delayed at Logan International Airport in Boston for 8 HOURS because Air Force Two was sitting on the runway. The Evil Algore was the reason for it. He was the Vice-President at the time.
- Cascading, on 10/12/2007, -0/+20A quote from Benjamin Franklin; "Democracy is two wolves and a sheep debating what they are going to eat. Liberty is a well-armed sheep taking exception to the outcome of the vote."
- rkzda, on 10/12/2007, -5/+25Read the article moron, then comment.
- pawchikapawpaw, on 10/12/2007, -4/+23so when bill clinton was president, he was stuck in a traffic jam, too?
- RadiantBeing, on 10/12/2007, -8/+24@bjason82, please save your partisan rage for another website. You make it sound like every former President walked where ever he went, chatting with The People along the way, sharing food and drink with them, and leaving smiles and laughter in his wake. The President is the most powerful and important leader in America. As such he has special security needs and can't afford to waste time sitting in traffic. Furthermore, Democracy doesn't mean everybody ought to be the same, it means they have equal political rights. Big difference.
- roosterjm2k2, on 10/12/2007, -7/+21I love Idiots..
When you hate someone so much that you go out of your way to avoid the facts and bash them, your opinion becomes about as valuable as a hemorrhoid.
You could at least read the article...and some of the other comments. Bush doesnt make that call, the Secret Service does...and bush cant even order the SS around...they take only orders from themselves... - pawchikapawpaw, on 10/12/2007, -4/+18I love how DyDx's comments were dugg down even though he accurately described the type of government for the US. Ignorance is bliss, indeed. The more you don't know, the more accurate your worldview looks.
- inactive, on 10/12/2007, -11/+23I want to point out that this was at the request of the secret service, not the president himself; for those that say he is selfish.
- brundlefly76, on 10/12/2007, -0/+10@pacotheparrot
The system you describe is not 'true democracy' - it is direct democracy, ochlocracy, mobocracy, or anarchy. If you dont understand why direct democracy doesnt work in a country with 300 million people, you need to take a Political Science class.
Its really sad how many people agreed with you, because the observation of a direct democracy being some sore of panacea is pretty much the litmus test of a fundemental lack of understanding of political science, global hisotry, and especially the foundations of the US constitution.
I highly reccommend reading 'The Federalist Papers' - it is basically the documention of the founding fathers debate on how the constituion should be structured. Read it, and you will realize that the founding fathers were actually a light year ahead of you in their knowledge. - Gundabad, on 10/12/2007, -2/+12I've seen senators shut down highways, and a whole wing of a HOSPITAL closed and reserved as a precaution, just because Clinton was going to be in NYC. These sorts of thing happen every single time a major politician, no matter what the party, travels.
If you read the article you would see that secret service backed off the idea once they realized that due to setup and breakdown, the closure would have to last six hours, so it was a non-issue. If you want to jump on the "I hate Bush" bandwagon go ahead and digg though. - mabhatter, on 10/12/2007, -1/+9historically, US presidents are assinated by poor, individual citizens acting alone. From McKinely killed by a upset job seeker, to JFK killed by a book stock boy, US assinations are more heat of the moment than premeditation... somebody going "postal" and just happens to get a lucky shot at the big man. The president is historically more likely to get killed "drive by" in tied up traffic by "road rage" than by an Al-Queda or other terrorist organization. That's why the Secret Service treats actual citizens with such distain. We're more unpredictable than all the other "enemies" for the state put together.
- ChadN, on 10/12/2007, -1/+8@KenMo
FWIW, the Clinton LAX haircut delay story was false (either a misunderstanding, or a fabrication). I remember it being talked about when it was retracted, and here is the first Google link I found which bears that out:
http://politus.blogspot.com/2004/04/debunked-clintons-haircut-at-lax.html
The original reporting of this non-event was quite memorable to me, since some idiot morning zoo radio *****, one called 'Mancow' (I think), drove a car onto the San Francisco Bay Bridge during the morning commute, stopped, got out, and got a haircut in the middle of traffic, as a kind of parody/protest of Clinton's haircut. NEEEEEEEEDLESS to say, it hardly made them any friends (but it did get a lot of attention). In any case, this meme that Clinton delayed flights in order to get a haircut, is bogus. - Wolfboy, on 10/12/2007, -0/+7The Secret Service made the request for the road to be closed for the president's motorcade. Regarding the president, the Secret Service's prime mission is his safety, regardless of who he happens to be, Bush or Clinton, Republican or Democrat.
Road closure is the standard procedure for when the president travels by car.
The Secret Service's practices and mission sometimes clash with political and practical reality. That's all that happened here. - inactive, on 10/12/2007, -1/+8The terms "democracy" and "republic" are not mutually exclusive.
There are many forms of democracy, all of which are perfectly valid forms of government:
* Deliberative democracy
* Direct democracy
* Participatory democracy
* Representative democracy
* Social democracy (also a political movement)
* Soviet democracy
Just in case some of you might be confused about where the United States of America fits in--it is a representative democracy. - schwit, on 10/12/2007, -1/+7Anybody who thinks the president has any input in matters of his own or his family's personal security has no clue how the secret service works or its powers. BTW, the roads would have been closed if the secret service had persisted ... they have that kind of power. Just look at the DC owned roads around the whitehouse that were shutdown permanently(confiscated) to ensure a larger security perimeter. This was done because the Secret Service wanted it. DC could not stop it.
The presidential travel method should always default to airborne unless there's a good reason to do otherwise.
I live in Northern Virginia. - toddhenkel, on 10/12/2007, -0/+6Did anyone notice how the Post writer mentioned the heroic staff "worked late into the night" to resolve this 'disaster in the making'? Then the article states near the end that it was resolved by 7 pm?
Wish *our* late nights at the office ended at 7 pm... - Abennobashi, on 10/12/2007, -0/+4Yeah I live in Boise too, and, frankly, if the road system up here didn't suck ASS, we might be able to get somewhere, even with the freeway shut down. Oh, how long was it shut down for again? An hour? Maybe you should blame the Idahoans (their word, not mine) for not be able to decipher a freeway from a cattle road. Point one, Idaho sucks, I really need to move back to California. Point 2, stop acting like you know everything, because you, unlike me, are a native born Idahore, and really need to go outside and see the rest of the world or something.
- zacmccormick, on 10/12/2007, -5/+9almost funny!
- Tsujigiri, on 10/12/2007, -1/+5He flew in? Did he wear his flight suit?
- LukeD, on 10/12/2007, -1/+5@fredrated:
Based on my in depth knowledge of the interplay between Secret Service and the White House gained during my many many hours watching every episode of The West Wing ( :P ), I believe I am right in saying that when it comes to things like this, the SS tell him what he's doing and if he objects, they _try_ to find an alternative that doesn't compromise security and that. He doesn't decide how he gets to travel, he gets to ask for it to be changed. - xgravix, on 10/12/2007, -1/+5I live in northern virginia; it can't be overexaggerated how much of a disaster it would have been had those lanes been closed for that long. Easily 1000 times as much fuel as the helicopter bush used to get to the event would have been wasted by cars sitting in traffic.
I can't believe it was even considered. - fredrated, on 10/12/2007, -1/+5And the secret service is like some completely seperate organization from the Presidents office? If the president was making the request himself would you expect him to pick up the phone and call?
- Bozodog, on 10/12/2007, -1/+4Unfortunately this kind of thing happens all the time.
I live and work in Hollywood, and twice the area around my office was closed off because Clinton was having a fund raising dinner at a restaurant (owned by a supporter) near by.
We could do no business because the secret service closed off all streets for two blocks around the restaurant. Not just during the meal, but for 2 hours before and after.
Killed our business for that day, and no reimbursement for lost sales. Clinton makes money and we loose.
No different for Bush. He had a fund raiser at a private home near here, and while it didn't bother us, the secret service closed down the streets there also.
The freeways are closed down too every now and again when whatever President drives through Hollywood, but not always. Why only sometimes? I don't know.
The President works for us. Stop closing our community and killing our business when ever what-ever Republicrat President is begging for money. - toddhenkel, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2That there are too many nutcases out there that would take a shot at him or her...
- Koosebane, on 10/12/2007, -1/+3"What does this say about your country when the President is afraid to travel amongst his own people?"
We are very free, very dangerous and very well armed.
Which leads us directly back to why we are very free. - fredrated, on 10/12/2007, -3/+5No, he took the helicopter, which is what Bush was forced to do.
- creektown, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1im glad the president was told no its about time wether its him personaly or his "administration" someone needs to put him in check and we the prople are the ones with the duty to do so.
let him fly through or sit in traffic like an american. but hes done enough to make our day suck without messing up traffic. - ChadFM, on 10/12/2007, -4/+5Traffic in this state is already terrible, in Nova and in the Hampton Roads.
I couldn't imaging the traffic backups that would come as a result from this. - Remagen, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1Exactly, especially when the leader of the "loyal opposition" promises to buy the bullets for the killers
- inactive, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1@BullyJack
"I was delayed at Logan International Airport in Boston for 8 HOURS because Air Force Two was sitting on the runway. The Evil Algore was the reason for it. He was the Vice-President at the time."
I'm sure our pollution prophet Al Gorce was just using Air Force 2 to block the take-off of all the other Caribou killing commercial airliners. I expect that Al Gore then put on his back pack and hiked to his ultimate destination. - roosterjm2k2, on 10/12/2007, -2/+3Im in HR man...traffic isnt that bad. I've lived alot of places...VDOT may not be able to figure out how to take care of a road BEFORE its an ice sheet (yeah, i slid down the High-rise bride this winter) ... but they do have a pretty good clue on traffic management. The fact that they declined the request is a sign of that...
I've lived in and visited many other place, as far as rush-hour trafic around not only the largest Naval Station, but 2 major cites as well...ill drive this anyday. Go to CA for a vacation and tell my why there are traffic jams @ 2am??? - Tsujigiri, on 10/12/2007, -1/+2Yeah, while I see your point, most of our presidents have been pretty shy to do that since Kennedy. Too many weirdos with guns.
- DatDamWuf, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1If you live around D.C. you'd know why this is such BS, our traffic is horrible and I know Bush has someone to look at this stuff. I think what bothers me most is that we (the taxpayers) are paying for every fundraising trip the pres goes on. And it's not just Bush, it's every pres and don't forget the congress! Let's ask our congressmen/women to pass a bill that these trips must be paid for by the individual or the campaign of the person they are stumping for. See what kind of response you get to that.
- Iandefor, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1"Bush *DIDN'T* block the HOV lanes and he still gets ripped for it. The degree and intensity of left-wing rage and lunacy grows by the minute. You guys are starting to sound a lot like a mashup of Osama Bin Laden, Hitler, Pol Pot, and John Kerry."
Godwin's law is proven again!
Seriously, though, what the majority of us left-wing moonbats are annoyed at is that the SS should feel that it was even an option to block off such a vital traffic system for so long for *one* man. What I'm seeing most people talking about is the SS, not the president. - inactive, on 10/12/2007, -3/+4The Treasury Department should not have access to that type of power.
- pabloD, on 10/12/2007, -2/+3Heads of state do have extraordinary travel requirements, for many many reasons, but I take serious exception to their attempting a stunt like that just to be able to make a political fundraiser at Ed Gillespie's house.
effin' politicians. A plague on society, regardless of party affiliation. - zonk3r, on 10/12/2007, -5/+6Why should we as tax payers pay the travel expenses for presidents to support their political affiliations in the first place? I don't care what party it is that's doing it, I don't want to pay for it.
These guys want to go do their extracurricular activities on their own dime and time fine, so be it. - kuzotz, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0The same can be said about people from California, and how they see themselves as coming from teh center of the universe, and how everyone else is stupid.
REally now... Californians are ***** pricks. No one in oklahoma really likes the ones that brag aobut being form beverly hills and how everythiong sucks here...even though its true oklahoma does suck ass, but stilll..
Californians shouldn't be saying such things....... They can't even handle their energy problem during heatwaves. ***** Oklahoma took the worse beating from the heatwave,and we had no power problems. - estee065, on 10/12/2007, -3/+3What does this say about your country when the President is afraid to travel amongst his own people?
- bjason82, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0See you all are under the pretense that I subscribe to the farce that is the LEFT-RIGHT conception in America. This liberal/conservative thing is nothing more than an effort of the elite to divide and conquer. In fact, I am conservative and voted for bush in 2000..I attend a christian university and am a lover of the freedoms we enjoy in America. But my problem is with the people at the top, who are citizens like the rest of us, that think they are above everyone else because they were born wealthy and their family is influential in business and government. If you really knew your stuff you'd know that BUSH and CLINTON play for the same team, but you're so propagandized and brainwashed into thinking democrats and republicans are diametrically opposed that you cannot see the truth when its right in front of your face. Read international news sources, the American media is nothing more than a propaganda tool of the elite who run the western economies and largely influence their governments.
- foolfromhell, on 10/12/2007, -1/+1'@doddilus:
"Thats called a direct democracy. Digg is a direct democracy. Would you want your government run like Digg?"
--Ummm...No joke, it might be better in a lot of ways"
Then there would be hundreds of laws that say Wiretapping is legal.
and Rednecks would be running the country and proposing laws.....
Atleast the senators of redneck states are moderately smart...... - DSPGeek, on 10/12/2007, -1/+1@KenMo: The Clinton haircut story was debunked a long time ago. Turns out right-wing commentators were making ***** up.
@BullyJack: Suuuuure Gore held up Logan inside AF2 for 8 hours. If that had actually happened Faux News would still be screaming about it. - kuzotz, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0Most people are commenting on the SS.....They don't even take orders from the president. I say this because Bush knows its political suicide to cut off a vital system that allows the local economy to operate.
- yujie, on 10/12/2007, -1/+1Traffic is even horrible with the HOV open, stop and go just to travel up or down a for miles with no reasons at all along I-95. It gets much worst after Potomac mills area when there is no HOW. I wish people can drive better or just don't drive at all. what is the point at looking at someone changing tire? Anyways, glad it never happen. Yesterday it took me 1.5hrs to travel from Tyson's corner VA to river rd Potomac MD (2.5 miles) :(
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