What is Digg?Sponsored by Travelzoo
Take Advantage of Ridiculously Low Holiday Airfares view!
travelzoo.com - Flights $52 and up for Thanksgiving, Christmas & New Year. But move on it now.
233 Comments
- psykomf, on 10/12/2007, -7/+211geez, students these days are really stupid
- inactive, on 10/12/2007, -3/+151Not just students...
- GnuTzu, on 10/12/2007, -4/+118Should those who don't believe in free speech be censored?
- kooft, on 10/12/2007, -8/+70Personally I think saying that the 1st amendment goes too far is going too far and should be banned speech.
- david76, on 10/12/2007, -0/+57It's unfortunate they don't have a link to the actual survey or any actual questions from the survey.
- Junkyarddawg, on 10/12/2007, -3/+39Nothing that advanced. They just want people whose views they find offensive to shut up. They perceive themselves to be in the majority, and want to abuse that by shutting up minorities. They never reflect over the fact that they might well find themselves the guys with the impopular views, in the censored minority.
- inactive, on 10/12/2007, -2/+36First, 1/3 of students is not a majority, so saying "US students believe" is a VERY misleading headline.
Second, since when does the political opinion of a number of high school students matter? When I was in high school, I didn't have well-informed political opinions and, likewise, I couldn't vote. Once I had the responsibility and privilege to vote, I informed myself. Most high school students end up having the political opinions of their parents unless/until they inform themselves about the issues. - dclafleur, on 10/12/2007, -2/+33The problem is most students in America do not have the perspective to see what life is like where everything is filtered, where you can be sentenced to prison or death for your beliefs or your statements.
- i64X, on 10/12/2007, -0/+18Yeah, you know, the one that gives you the right to say that without being called treasonous.
- The_Wallbanger, on 10/12/2007, -12/+29I thought I read this before on Digg. The article is dated 9/17/06.
- R2C13, on 10/12/2007, -2/+19Having freedom means that you may encounter things you may not agree with. But for these idiots to say that it goes 'too far' just shows they have no experience in reality and don't deserve to enjoy these freedoms.
- tobsterius, on 10/12/2007, -1/+17The only downside to free speech is that it is granted to everybody. Even the idiots...
- inactive, on 10/12/2007, -1/+15........................................__........ ................................................
.................................,-~*`¯lllllll`*~,................................... .............
...........................,-~*`lllllllllllllllllllllllllll¯`*-,...................................
......................,-~*llllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllll*-,..........................
..................,-*lllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllll lllll......................
................;*`lllllllllllllllllllllllllll,-~*~-,llllllllllllllllllll.........................
................lllllllllllllllllllllllllll/...........;;;;llllllllllll,-`~-,....................
.................lllllllllllllllllllll,-*.............`~-~-,...(.(¯`*,`,..........................
...................llllllllllll,-~*........................)_-..*`*;..)..........................
.....................,-*`¯,*`)............,-~*`~................../...............................
.....................|/.../.../~,......-~*,-~*`;.................../..............................
.................../.../..../..../..,-,..*~,.`*~*..................*................... ..........
...................|.../.../..../.*`...................................)....)¯`~,. ...............
...................|./..../..../........).........)`*~-,............../.....|..)...`~-,............
.................././.../....,*`-,.....`-,....*`....,---.........../...../..|..........¯```*~-,,,,
.................(............)`*~-,.....`*`.,-~*.,-*.......|.../..../..../.......................
..................*-,.......`*-,...`~,..``.,,,-*.............|.,*...,*....|..................... .
......................*,.........`-,....)-,..................,-*`...,-*.....(`-,..................
........................f`-,........`-,/...*-,___,,-~*.....,-*......|....`-,...................... - littlebylittle, on 10/12/2007, -11/+25WTF? This is stupid bullsh*t propaganda, nothing more.
- Yellowcolorado, on 10/12/2007, -4/+17Their is a not so famous quote from a man you all have respect for. It went "Any man who is willing to give up Liberty for Security deserves neither Liberty or security." ---- That man, was Benjamin Franklin.....
I believe our founding fathers are turning in their graves at the mockery we have made of their freedom experiment. - thewaz, on 10/12/2007, -4/+17"In God We Trust"
my favorite example - rationalist, on 10/12/2007, -0/+12Curious worldview, venicerocco. Apparently, you believe that ideas have expiration dates, sort of like milk.
- repins, on 10/12/2007, -0/+12How about cultures that fawn over 2000+ year old documents?
- BryanUT, on 10/12/2007, -1/+12How the hell do you "abuse freedom"? I say you abuse freedom when you don't excersize your rights.
- inactive, on 10/12/2007, -0/+10I love seeing those bumper stickers that tout how they believe this is "one nation UNDER GOD!" (emphasis not added). Ask them if they are socialists, and they will say "hell no", yet the Pledge of Allegiance (which indeed is a socialist act) was written by a socialist, but even better is that "under god" wasn't even in that original Pledge and in god we trust was added to money when?
The other "funny" (hypocritical?) stat is that students don't think school administrators should censor student newspapers (64%), but it seems that some of those are fine with the government doing it to the "real press."
And I agree, the title is somewhat misleading. - Capta1nA, on 10/12/2007, -2/+11Should I disown myself from my generation? who the ***** are these people
- seandfeeney, on 10/12/2007, -1/+9On another note US Education system is on the decline...
- Bhima, on 10/12/2007, -0/+7Whatever... I remember them asking college girls if they were for or against women's suffrage and all were against.
- tont0r, on 10/12/2007, -1/+8That also means that 2/3's of them think otherwise. yay.
- goofporter, on 10/12/2007, -0/+7Gotcha..Self defense is for rednecks. Resisting tyranny is for extremists.
You may do as you please but if my car breaks down, I have tools to fix it in my trunk.
If my life, liberty or property is threatened I also carry tools to solve that problem.
My guess is that you depend on police to defend your life, AAA to deal with your roadside emergencies and plumbers to fix your clogged toilet.
Your faith that others will fix your problems in a timely manner is charming but unrealistic.
Dick - MrTea, on 10/12/2007, -0/+6..............................................._,,,,-------,,,__
........................................,,;:#ggg@@g;,..........‘`=-,
.................................,,;$#^`````*#@@@g;,.............’=-,
...............................,/$`................``#@@@#g,...............‘,
........................._,;f`.......................,$@@@@#g,..............“,
....................,/*&gp..+,_..................%*#@@@@g;,............’,
................,./_`”>’.....`#$$#x;,............,%@@@@@#g;,..........`
..............,/ (............`....`”*=,``.......*&*%@@@@@g;,..........
...........,/...,^=*#q,_,/`.......`~..`-.......g$@@@@@@@#g,........|
........../,;p8jq;,_..........;.........................`%@@@@@@@#g;....|
........,/.f,,,,_..`*8r-,.....;......................,&@@@@@@@@@#./
......./.,$ `,...`.-...&..../........................`%@@@@@@@@$#/
.....,/,$--__........`..../............................#$@@@##@@@@/
...,/...`’t-,__,;>`..../.........................................;`=””=.`;@#*
.,/....`”~--~`’’....-`...................................,--”,~#-,.._*”`
(..........................................................,....`””......,;`
.`,_.....................................................&`*-,,_-”`
.......`-,_.............................................../`.../
...............................................................| - rationalist, on 10/12/2007, -1/+7"unless you've at least had some experience with the way other governments work, you should shut the hell up when criticizing your own"
A rousing defense of the First Amendment. - MyHappyClam, on 10/12/2007, -1/+7I see more of the minority making demands and the majority suffering. Things should be fair but not tilted so far to one side as to give them all the power. But there will always be those who have and those who don't and sue.
- Crosshare, on 10/12/2007, -0/+5Sadly this isn't the only evidence you see of this in school anymore. I remember in my senior year I was taking an extra U.S. history class and we were put into groups and our assignment was to rank our top 5 most important events in U.S. history. 2 out of the 5 groups in class had the same event. Can you guess which one that is?
1. Columbine (this was before Sept. 11th mind you)
Not the signing of the Declaration of Independence, events from the American Revolution, or even Pearl Harbor, but Columbine. A lot of American students don't care about history, and are very short sighted, they only care about events that affect them directly. I should also note this was a Colorado classroom, so they felt a little closer to the event, but still. - Jagdhund, on 10/12/2007, -1/+6I never said it should be banned. I said that people who try to abuse their freedoms, should not do so. Abuse leads to disregard and disrespect for that freedom, and the abusers are as responsible for the attacks on freedom of speech as the ones who attack.
I am not advocating banning, despite what context you assign my words. I advocate personal responsibility for one's words and actions, instead of having to rely on waving the first amendment around to justify psuedo-slander. - drakethegreat, on 10/12/2007, -0/+5High schools from the same high schools that are considered some of the worst in the world. It doesn't surprise me because these high school students are simply the dumbest kids ever to come out of this country so why should we expect them to say/do anything intelligent?
Digg me down for this bleak outlook but the correlation to me seems rather obvious. Education quality goes down, respect for our constitution goes down. - TubaTechno, on 10/12/2007, -2/+7If someone gives that quote one more time....
that has to be the most overly used quote EVER on digg. - 15charmaxwtf, on 10/12/2007, -0/+5Or, it has always been since the introduction of public schools.
- meltingrobot, on 10/12/2007, -0/+5@OUberLord
FYI, driving a car isn't a freedom. That is a privilege. You aren't granted a license upon birth. You have to pass a test to earn it. It can be taken away for the said things you just mentioned as well as DUI and other violations. Bad analogy! - Riluske, on 10/12/2007, -1/+6Leading questions? Hello?
We have no idea how this survey was taken. For all we know, this could be what the teachers have been drilling in there heads for that passes couple of years. The problem is not the kids, it's the people who teach them. - netwonder, on 10/12/2007, -0/+5They should be lined up and bitch slapped. Than they should get a taste of what its like in other countries of the world that lack our freedoms.
- bs0l, on 10/12/2007, -1/+6South Park says that 1/3 of the whole U.S. population is retarded. That's 100 million people. 100,000 isn't surprising.
- Jagdhund, on 10/12/2007, -2/+6Somehow, I believe that the only way a third of the students would believe such a foolish thing is because many people _are_ shouting about the first amendment at every little opportunity.
It loses its sacredness when every small issue is blown way out of proportion and the 'victim' is suing for someone infringing on their right to freedom of speech. Never-mind that the speech is inflammatory, offensive, or inciting hatred in public, they will try to make an issue out of it. It is not that the amendment goes too far, it is that there are people out there who want to test it at its limits constantly. - whiledo, on 03/25/2009, -0/+4I was going to say something about it being good that 2/3rds supported the first amendment, but then I read the article.
"The new survey finds that 45% of students, up from 35%, believe the First Amendment goes too far in the rights it guarantees. Yet questions about specific freedoms show that support for some speech and press freedoms is essentially unchanged or up slightly"
Then they go on to break it down by "press", musicians, newspapers and then high school newspapers. The general newspaper category is the one bringing it down.
"54% (up from 51%) say newspapers should be allowed to publish freely without government approval."
I think this has more to do with the fact that students are incredibly disconnected from newspapers and as such haven't put as much thought into it. Notice when they ask if student newspapers should be free from oversight by the authorities, the numbers go up to 64%.
I'm not sure what all this really means, though. There are good reasons high school students (for the most part) can't vote yet. I wouldn't mind the voting age being bumped up to 20, even. Very few people in high school have the experience necessary to even contemplate issues of free speech. They're too busy with the myriad of other things in high school that they'll realize were meaningless when they graduate.
Who knows what I would have said at that age. I'm not worried, as I know these kids have a lot of growing up left to do. - THEMACGOD, on 10/12/2007, -0/+4Be glad to be offended... revel in it. It means that the freedom of speech is still working.
- chinaman1472, on 10/12/2007, -0/+4From the article:
"Students tend to know less about the First Amendment than adults do, and they are more likely to take its rights for granted, says Dautrich, who has surveyed adults extensively for the First Amendment Center in Nashville. But when it comes to some issues more important to kids and teens, such as song lyrics and student press freedom, students are more likely to support the rights, he says."
Well, that pretty much sums it up. Educate the kids more, the results might be a little different. - littlebylittle, on 10/12/2007, -7/+11From article which is about teens: "Students tend to know less about the First Amendment than adults do, and they are more likely to take its rights for granted, says Dautrich, who has surveyed adults extensively for the First Amendment Center in Nashville. But when it comes to some issues more important to kids and teens, such as song lyrics and student press freedom, students are more likely to support the rights, he says."
Submitter's Title is misleading. NOT "Marked As Inaccurate" because I hate it when butt-hats do that. - Cappez, on 10/12/2007, -4/+8the bottom fifty percent have always been below average, bottom third significantly so...what's new?
- inactive, on 10/12/2007, -0/+4Here a link to the actual survey & results:
Students: http://firstamendment.jideas.org/students/students.php
Teachers: http://firstamendment.jideas.org/faculty/faculty.php
Principals: http://firstamendment.jideas.org/principals/principals.php
Draco - Gerz1219, on 10/12/2007, -0/+4You know, debating key issues like free speech is important to maintaining a functioning democracy. In a debate, a student learns that there are two sides to every issue. They then learn that just because the side they disagree with has an argument, it isn't necessarily a good one, and that they shouldn't always switch sides at the first sign of resistance. It's important for high school students developing their political identity to consider, for a moment, that the First Amendment should not exist. Only by exploring the implications of that idea, which is a gradual process learned through experience, do the vast majority of responsible adults come to the conclusion that the First Amendment must exist.
I would consider it unhealthy for our democracy if two-thirds of students wanted the First Amendment abolished or neutered, but I would also consider it unhealthy if 100% of them blindly agreed with it. That would mean we had become complacent as a society, and that we weren't raising adults capable of critical thinking. - inactive, on 10/12/2007, -0/+4I would like to see the actual poll questions.
Not just the results, - inactive, on 10/12/2007, -2/+6@littlebylittle
seems calling everything that someone doesn't believe propaganda is the new cool thing to do on digg.
how quickly opinions change. - rationalist, on 10/12/2007, -0/+4So, if 45% of students believed that raping, killing and then dismembering young children was cool, you would say, "bravo for critical thinking"?
Critical thinking does not mean being so open minded your brains fall out. What makes civilization work is a thin veneer of consensus about basic principles and standards. If a majority of Americans cease to support the basic principles that make our society what it is, we will no longer be that society. They only effective bulwark against authoritarianism is strong and widespread appreciation for freedom. Even supporters of the conservative interpretation of the 2nd Amendment (I'm not one of them) must recognize that having guns won't help if people won't fight because they don't care.
Don't get me wrong, I strongly support teaching critical thinking and challenging conventional wisdom and engaging young people in thought experiments. But, I fear that you are rather out of touch with real education in today's public schools. Civics has been eliminated as its own subject, and only the most generic, least offensive parts of it have been absorbed into the history curriculum - which, in turn, has been largely neutered and starved for time and resources in the curriculum.
Students responding to this survey today have not experienced the kind of critical thinking education you seem to think they have.
I do think another reason for this apathy is that we as a society deny young people many of their First Amendment rights, and schools in particular (often illegally) constraint and disrespect student's Constitutional freedoms. This, in turn, reduces their support for principles they see adults enjoying yet denied them. - shmuu102, on 10/12/2007, -0/+4
we are talking words and ideas.... far from physical damage and injury...
if you cant handle somone with differnt views and ideas, then thats your problem not theirs - arkmtech, on 10/12/2007, -0/+4"Sell not virtue to purchase wealth, nor Liberty to purchase power." - Ben Franklin wrote the proverb into Poor Richard's Almanac in 1738.
In any case, it is a tragic irony for people to say that our First Amendment, which guarantees us the right to state our opinions & express ourselves without fear of persecution by those who disagree with us, goes too far... -
Show 51 - 100 of 233 discussions
© Digg Inc. 2009
— Content created and posted by Digg users is