What is Digg?355 Comments
- satanatnmtedu, on 10/12/2007, -9/+132The question is: Is this study of the Bible in the context of early writing? Or, is it generic, religious Bible study? If it is the former, then no problem. If it is the later, then the ACLU will likely come running.
- ScornForSega, on 10/12/2007, -15/+132I thought I was done...
(sorry for the double post)
What really gets me is that you know full and well that if the school board approved a class to teach the Qur'an, these people would have a ***** fit. It kills me how the most "religious" people are the most easily offended by anything other than what they happen to believe. It really makes me question their faith, and they should probably do the same. Most everyone's read the Bible or at least gets the general idea. Christ = savior, performs miracles, dies at the age of 33, raises after 3 days of being dead. I GET IT.
What I could really use a history lesson in at this point is why the Arabs hate the Jews and wtf is the difference between a Sunni and a Shiite. - bloodylip, on 10/12/2007, -18/+82Don't forget that since Harry Potter takes place in England, wizards are corroborated by geography.
- inactive, on 10/12/2007, -36/+97@DiggsOnlyNeoCon
You mean like the events of Noah's Flood and Exodus? Oh wait, not only are these things NOT corroborated by history, they're actually contradicted by it! And now that I think of it, they're quite a bit crazier than anything Dr. Seuss wrote.
Although some of the mundane things mentioned in the Bible have been found by archaeologists, you should not leap to the conclusion that the Bible is corroborated by history. After all, Troy was found, yet that hardly leads credibility to the tales of Poseidon and Aphrodite. - ScornForSega, on 10/12/2007, -35/+90@satan
Dude.. it's a Texas public high school. Not exactly the centerpoint of sophisticated discussion on early Judaeo-Christian texts. - Junkyarddawg, on 10/12/2007, -21/+71The bible has never been blanket-banned from school. It's perfectly allowed to use it in comparative religious classes, or as a (rather inaccurate) source in history classes, as long as it's not proselytizing using public money - but it's not allwoed to replace science teaching with bible teaching.
- SmackMyMac, on 10/12/2007, -5/+37If history teachers and literature teachers can talk about Greek Mythology and "The Gods" they should be allowed to teach an equal portion about Christianity, Hinduism, Budduhism, and Islam.
The More Our Children know about the many different religions the better they are prepared for life. Maybe then, we can start an understanding of other cultures.
Just a thought. - d4nie1, on 10/12/2007, -11/+41They are obviously disguising prosyletizing their religion in the name of teaching history. It's a pretty tranparent ploy. If they were really concerned about teaching history then they would teach a variety of religous texts.
- d4nie1, on 10/12/2007, -4/+31Except it's not a history of religion class. The class is only about the bible. All other religions are excluded.
- tw0k1ngs, on 10/12/2007, -7/+33To say morality is derived from the bible is a thought based in delusion. Morality is a universal characteristic derived from an infinite number of sources. We cannot say for fact that the bible is subject of a proper moral background than say, Aesop's Fables.
- albrad84, on 10/12/2007, -1/+23I went to a public high school and we read excerpts from the Bible in my senior english class for the same reason. This was also the same teacher who let us watch Austin Powers: Goldmember during class. She got into some trouble for the latter.
- kingvar, on 10/12/2007, -2/+24It's no big deal. I'm in an English class in a New York City public high school, and one of the books we read was the Bible.
- snarfyboy, on 10/12/2007, -5/+26No, this isn't an academic class. The people publishing the course, National Council on Bible Curriculum in Public Schools, is a dead give away. This is a thinly veiled attempt to teach that the Bible is (the) truth by calling it historically accurate.
- inactive, on 10/12/2007, -12/+31@SmackMyMac
That's utter *****. The United States was founded on Enlightenment values, not religious ones. Indeed, many of the things that we consider at the heart of America, such as freedom of religion and representative government, are explicitly contrary to Biblical values (thou shalt have no gods before me, divine right of kings). - jaycliche, on 10/12/2007, -9/+28As a agnostic, I'm all for it...as long as Asian, African, South American etc history/lit are taught as well as perspectives from Islam, Hindu, Budism, Judaism are taught.
The bible has some historical perspective but needs to be balanced with ancient historians and poets from all cultures. Much of the bible's content was "modified" over the years, especially when first put together in the Byzantine Empire. - whiledo, on 03/25/2009, -2/+19@razor150
In Texas, public schools are organized into Independent School Districts (ISDs). For example, public schools in Houston are part of the Houston Independent School District (HISD). This is a public school. - ChemEng, on 10/12/2007, -1/+18"National Council on Bible Curriculum in Public Schools" clearly an unbiased source for information...
- radicaldementia, on 10/12/2007, -5/+20I have a feeling if you ask these people about offering a similar class about the Koran, or even works that predate the Bible, they would all be opposed. I have no problem with learning about the Bible in public school, but devoting an entire class to it is clearly an attempt to religiously teach the Bible.
- ebonn101, on 10/12/2007, -0/+15save it. im sure the people on this site who are from texas take offense to your punitive remark. if you're going to be one of the bush-bashers, at least pick an appropriate article to comment on. this is totally unrelated.
- greymaxcat, on 10/12/2007, -6/+20well... it is old...
and it is written...
so historical literature would be a good way to describe it...
But have you ever read the thing? Booooring... and the plot makes no sense. - d4nie1, on 10/12/2007, -4/+18@SmackMyMac
The constitution says that the government should not support one religion over another, and that's what they are doing here. It is not right for tax payer's dollars to be spent this way. I would not have a problem with an impartial History of Religion class, but Bible studies belong in Sunday School, not public schools. - annonimality, on 10/12/2007, -9/+22@ DiggsOnlyNeoCon
"The Bible has been corroborated by history. Don't be so stupid as to compare it to Dr. Seuss." - What about the story of Samson deriving super-natural strength from the length of his hair? That sounds a lot like Dr. Seuss to me. - dilberter, on 10/12/2007, -4/+16If they were really concerned about teaching history, they would teach, well, history.
The history we know to be supported by historical documents, verifiable accounts, and hopefully unbiased towards any religion.
I don't know how people don't see this... there is NO PLACE for religion in public schools if you want to keep this country (or rather make it once again) a free nation that respects all its citizens without prejudice and discrimination.
The issue as reported in the MichNews is regarding which version of the bible they should teach whereas the real question is whether they should teach the bible AT ALL.
At best, the bible could be used as supporting material in a HISTORY class among other texts. - inquebiss, on 10/12/2007, -0/+12Secret Christian Ninjas? Awesome!
- kremvax, on 10/12/2007, -14/+26Keep in mind that the source of the article is a right wing fundamentalist blog.
That "history and literature" context, to them, is a limitation to be overcome, not a rational end for a government run school.
I *still* don't understand a group of people who believe it's in their best interests to have the government teach religion to their children. Wacky red staters... - montiff, on 10/12/2007, -7/+19Can we stop with the blanket statements about Texas or any other state...
I don't comment on a issue and immediately point out how stupid or idiotic that States citizens are.
There are religious fanatics everywhere, in every state. - inquebiss, on 10/12/2007, -2/+13There's nothing wrong with teaching religion. I had a humanities class in high school that taught us about islam, judaeism (sp?), hinduism, buddhism, and christianity. Nobody was telling us which was right or wrong, we were just learning about them.
- wozley, on 10/12/2007, -3/+14Is it just like the movie?
- thecatisdead, on 10/12/2007, -0/+10@ScornForSega
From what I can tell:
Shi'a (Shi'ite) - 10% of Muslims, and are the more radical and conservative branch. They believe that Muhammad chose his cousin and son-in-law (Ali) as his successor (as Caliph). Much power is concentrated in Shi'a religious leaders called (clerics == mullas == mujtahids). They believe that these leaders have "sacred knowledge" that ordinary Muslims cannot attain. Although an overall minority, they are a majority in Azerbaijan, Iraq and Iran.
Sunni - 90% of Muslims. They believe that Muhammad's lieutenant Abu Bakr was chosen by the community (not necessarily Muhammad himself) to succeed him (as Caliph), and that this was the right decision. Unlike the Shi'a, Sunnis have no organized religious authority. Ideally, Sunni Muslims do not need any religious intermediaries to speak to the Divine. They believe that there is no "sacred knowledge"; any good Muslim can be a leader since the Qur'an is the final authority. However, Sunnis still have scholars (ulama), mystics (shaykhs), and saints (awliya) that hold some degree of religious authority.
--
Caliph - the leader of all Muslims, also the successor of Muhammad (similar to how the Pope is the leader of all Catholics, and is the successor of Peter).
Imam - the current Caliph.
Ayatollah - an honorific applied to prestigious **Shi'ite** Islamic officials, but not a position in itself.
--
Sources:
http://www.answers.com/shiite
http://www.answers.com/sunni - razor150, on 10/12/2007, -1/+11@illegalcortex
Interesting, I guess I should have known more about Texas schools before saying anything. Thanks for the info. - inactive, on 10/12/2007, -7/+17so many of you are missing the issue here. its an elective. no one is being forced to take it. this headline was put up as such to get the atheist diggers to digg it.
and who are the ignorant backwards people here? the school for having an elective that their kids are interested in? or all the condesending diggers implying that everyone from texas is an inbred moron? - masamunecyrus, on 10/12/2007, -6/+16I really don't think that it matters at all if the Bible is in history. The problem comes in when they want to teach it in SCIENCE class.
- inactive, on 10/12/2007, -1/+11That's a complete non-sequitur. You might as well ask "if they can teach algebra, why not Scientology?"
- Artifez, on 10/12/2007, -1/+11There are references to actual people and real places but there is also a huge amount of people and events that simply could not exist or are extremely unlikely. This is equvelent to saying that the Terminator movies are historically accurate because they take place in Los Angeles.
- drmangrum, on 10/12/2007, -0/+9I remember my world history classes teaching the basic ideas of religion of each area of the world. Did they stop doing this? It's kind of hard to study a culture if you don't study their religion, kinda like reading a book and skipping every other page.
- wssharp, on 10/12/2007, -12/+21why the bible? why not a comparison of religious texts? no worldview, texas?
i guess the context is important. the article doesn't really state in which class they'll be studying the king james bible. if it's just a generic literature class, it's retarded that they'd only study the bible. - snarfyboy, on 10/12/2007, -1/+10This historical facts the Bible contains can be taught from textbooks. You don't need the Bible for that.
- dilberter, on 10/12/2007, -1/+10There's a difference between being open-minded and supporting ideals that are based on erroneous or non-existence sources.
The bible is such material. One of the most politically motivated and edited books ever.
If you want to argue with me that the earth is 6000 years old, I have a real problem with that, whether it's your belief or not, IT'S INCORRECT AND RIDICULOUS and it goes against a lot of VERIFIABLE evidence. - jamin, on 10/12/2007, -1/+10
@CopperFalcon:
"Although some of the mundane things mentioned in the Bible have been found by archaeologists, you should not leap to the conclusion that the Bible is corroborated by history. After all, Troy was found, yet that hardly leads credibility to the tales of Poseidon and Aphrodite."
And we read the tales of Poseidon and Aphrodite and literature and history classes, do we not? I read Homer in my Ancient History class. I read about Greek Mythology. I read ancient poetry in literature classes. That doesn't mean everything we read about actually occurred in space and time. There is still value in studying it. Students can read the Bible and come to their own conclusions. - dkneppra, on 10/12/2007, -1/+10The Bible is a central piece of literature in the history of our world.
Good luck trying to understand Shakespeare without a basic understanding of the contents of the Bible. - Spacejack, on 10/12/2007, -1/+9atb: I didn't realize that you were the Supreme Court. Thanks for your ruling.
- aceg1357, on 10/12/2007, -9/+17Wonder why this is news because this kind of course is in quite a few curricula.
Nothing new here so the ACLU won't be going after them.
The bible is a well written book with a lot of literary devices.
And they make sure to use it as literature/history and not religion.
The students are pretty smart, they even have questions on whether it is lawful to teach the bible in school.
@d4nie1
most public school teachers are very liberal and have a strong belief in the separation of church and state. This isn't some disguise to push religion. - DiggsOnlyNeoCon, on 10/12/2007, -1/+9http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Bible_and_history
- Gerbil_Juice, on 10/12/2007, -1/+9Britney Spears sold a lot of albums. Your point is?
- DiggsOnlyNeoCon, on 10/12/2007, -10/+18I'm so sick of the cliche "brainwashing people into religion" or "forcing it down their throats." Education is one of the most liberal institutions -- yes, even in Texas. These aren't all secret Christian ninjas looking for covert ways to force conversion.
- twooranges, on 10/12/2007, -8/+15They must include the true gospel.
http://www.amazon.com/Gospel-Flying-Spaghetti-Monster/dp/0812976568 - inactive, on 10/12/2007, -0/+7@insomniacal
After reading your blog, it's patently obvious that you don't even understand the basics of science, never mind evolution. Anyone who uses the lines "The real issue isn’t whether ID is science — it’s that evolution is not. ID has just as much right to make claims about the untestable, unobservable, unreproducible past as evolution does." is obviously a narrow-minded nitwit (regardless of schooling). Hell, it wouldn't have been any less factual than if John West had written your blog!
One can only hope you don't pollute your child's education with your own arrogance and ignorance. - snarfyboy, on 10/12/2007, -1/+8The first amendment says the government cannot establish a religion. Once a public school begins promoting a religion, it is doing exactly that, because the school is a government institution.
- Rayor, on 10/12/2007, -4/+11Is it bad that I read that as "Bible black" at first?
- rhawk301, on 10/12/2007, -2/+8I would agree that the Bible should be a part of the public school system. So should the Koran and other historical works. We can learn quite a lot from these books. We should know the history, when they were written, and what parts of them have been found during excavations. These books have huge amounts of human history within their pages. Remove the devotional stuff, but keep the maps and core content. In fact, since there are so many versions of the Bible for devotional study, maybe there should be a version published which includes content specifically for Public school education, made with sturdy paper and a rugged binding.
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