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- reddevil3, on 10/10/2007, -39/+205Let me expand a bit since I was there:
Everything was going pretty well until this ***** showed up.
So here's how it went: Kerry gave a speech for roughly 40-45 mins first, then a moderator asked him some questions followed by a Q&A session. Obviously not everyone could get to ask a question. So after 6 or so questions, the moderator says that we won't be taking any more questions. This guy gets really pissed since he was standing next in line, and starting shouting and making a ruckus. I was sitting just a few rows in front of the mic.
He started getting all angry and started saying "we have been listening to you for 2 hours, it's our time to ask questions", (it was more like an hour) to which Kerry said "if you didn't want to hear me speak, why did you come?". Then this guy started shouting again and then the police starting getting a hold of him. Then Kerry told the security to stop and told the guy to calm down and that he will take his question after he's done with the current question.
Then the guy's turn comes up and you can see in the videos how he's being such an ass...he sounds mentally ill to me. But then security grabs him and starts pulling his shirt and his female friends got really worried and started shouting at the security...the guy keeps shouting and they take him to the back of the auditorium and for some ***** reason they taser him AFTER he's been subdued and put down...one of his friends started crying. - multivariate, on 10/10/2007, -26/+182While this may not legally be an inappropriate use of force by the police, this certainly shows a tremendous failure in judgment on their part. This student wasn't some 250lb gang-banger, and once they had him on they ground they could have easily cuffed him and led him out.
I have two other observations:
1. Why were the police responsible for monitoring the length and substance of questions asked? No officer should have laid a hand on any student unless they were threatening John Kerry or creating some sort of disturbance that could not be handled by university officials.
2. If you watch the background of the video, you'll see quite a few students laughing as the man was dragged out, incapacitated, and eventually tazed. Good job fellow Florida students; way to stand up for the right thing. - CicadasHymn, on 10/10/2007, -35/+186Personally when they started tasering him and he was begging for help I wouldn't have been able to sit there and let that happened. The people just sitting in their chairs watching as the young man cried for help made me want to literally vomit. I felt sick. Even though I don't agree with what he was saying he does have the right to say it.
Coming up this week: The police chief will issue a formal "apology" and the boy will be released with a pat on the back and promises that this wont happen again.
Next week: It happens again - jeffchuck, on 10/10/2007, -27/+136"Holcomb said there would be an investigation into whether the officers used force appropriately, adding that employing a Taser gun would only be justified in a case where there was a threat of physical harm to officers."
There was clearly no threat in this case, so unless the whole department is corrupt, we should see some significant action taken against the officers. - KlipschFan, on 10/10/2007, -14/+103I was there at the forum. I ironically had the very last ticket for the show, but was first in line.
You can read my account of the incident at my blog youraverageidiot.blogspot.com. I got Kerry's joke a little off.
Suffice it to say the University Police Department is full of a bunch of piss heads that have a chip on their shoulder, because they were unable to get a real police job. This event gave all the wannabe's a big hardon, because they had something to do besides give parking tickets, tell frat boys to turn down the music, and kick out the alcohol smugglers at the football games.
There was a real time transcript for the hearing impaired. You can see the screen in the YouTube video.
Apparently the reaction to this incident has crashed the site of Accent at UF.
The student is up for first appearance today. I called a relative at the Public Defender's office to help him out.
Before the YouTube video starts Kerry did tell, "Mr. Security man, I'll be happy to answer his question." That would be apparent on the transcript. - BabaRamDass, on 10/10/2007, -42/+120That's some ***** up ***** right there.
- izzybr, on 10/10/2007, -21/+70Well, look everyone, in the cops defense the guy WASN'T asking the same old ***** questions reporters are supposed to ask. I mean, you let one guy start asking questions that make the people in power uncomfortable, then maybe the real reporters start realizing they should be asking more pertinent questions. And wouldn't that be a sad day for a free and open society...when reporters can ask whatever they want.
This guy could have totally averted the situation by making some banal comments about John Edwards hair (...and he was your running mate, HA!) instead of asking why Kerry didn't contest the election.
BTW, way to go cops. You really covered your asses by charging him with a ***** felony that will get dropped. - sgtbutterscotch, on 10/10/2007, -6/+53Im pretty sure I heard at least one person (a woman) screaming for the police to stop.
- jthomp3120, on 10/10/2007, -14/+59Even dicks have civil rights
- breakerjump, on 10/10/2007, -13/+57I work as a law enforcement officer in the southeastern U.S. I have tasered individuals and I have been tasered. This instance of use looks - on it's face anyway - to be a little unnecessary. The subject was already swarmed by several units; there are a plethora of methods and pressure points available to a trained officer to coerce a subject's hands into cuffs, and easily, at which point all that would be left is to simply stand him up and walk him out. If he refused to walk, it's easy - carry him. Tasering the subject was just over-the-top.
Now, I'll add one more thing. As someone who has been tasered on multiple occasions (both drive/dry-stun and prongs), getting hit even with the prongs is not really THAT bad. The screaming and the whaling and pouting these guys do is pathetic (the library incident comes to mind). They sound like little girls. I'd take a tasering over a baton, OC spray or even a mass-officer swarming any day of the week. - blorc, on 10/10/2007, -43/+87http://video.nbc6.net/player/?id=157250
How is it some "***** up *****?" Both the video in this link and the I linked above show that he resisted being escorted out. On top of resisting the police, he screamed repeatedly, making a disturbance. They attempted to subdue him for nearly two minutes and warned him repeatedly that he would be tasered if he continued to resist. The video on this site is excellent because you can see him begin to apply just before he's tasered, and then suddenly starts resisting again and turns over off his belly to scream and yell some more, at which point he is finally tasered.
I think it's pretty clear that it was used appropriately, and that's not even taking into account the other claims that he barged into a ticketed event to more or less hijack the microphone so he could verbally attack Kerry. When he began to resist being escorted out and moved forward towards Kerry, he lost his option to be escorted out without an arrest.
The sad thing is how many people (like yourself) will see this and automatically assume it's police brutality because a taser was used. If the guy had been carrying a gun or some other lethal device and had charged the stage, Kerry could be hurt or dead and you would have the same people who are crying "POLICE STATE" instead criticizing the police for not doing their job.
Watch the video again with a clear head and open mind. Watch the police give him time to ask the question (which they didn't have to do), then attempt to escort him out. Watch him resist multiple times, attempting to walk towards Kerry rather than staying where he is or moving away. Watch him resist multiple times on the ground, refusing to get on his belly, and when he finally does, turning over multiple times until he's tasered.
They gave ample time, ample warnings. And make sure you follow up through the whole NBC6 video, because it's clear that this guy is not thinking clearly. He believes the police are going to take him away and kill him. Come on, guys... use your heads. - IrishJoe, on 10/10/2007, -5/+46From the article: After the incident, Capt. Jeff Holcomb of the UPD said Meyer had been charged with disrupting a public event and placed in the Alachua County Jail. Holcomb said there would be an investigation into whether the officers used force appropriately, adding that employing a Taser gun would only be justified in a case where there was a threat of physical harm to officers.
At least 5 officers were holding him down. There was NO threat of physical harm to an officer at the time they tasered him, therefore they were not justified in using that level of force. Tasers are to be used in lieu of a gun as a non lethal form of force. They certainly would not shoot him while they held him down (I hope) so they can't taser him either. - PeaceChicken, on 10/10/2007, -6/+43I agree, Multivariate. What was more disturbing than watching the pieces of s--t police: the other students just SITTING there while their fellow citizen SCREAMED for help and later screamed in pain, pleading for someone to stand up for him? Or Kerry's complete inaction?! They all just sat there, and then had the nerve to laugh?! This country doesn't stand a chance.
"First they came for the Communists..." - inactive, on 10/10/2007, -18/+54*****. You would have sat there and you know it. I am so ***** tired of you ***** saying "I wish I had been there, I would have done something". You might as well be saying "I wish he had pulled that ***** with ME. I would have kicked his ass".
- gl77, on 03/31/2008, -7/+41"help help i'm being repressed!" sorry just had to throw that in there.
- JFetch, on 10/10/2007, -31/+65He shouldn't have became combative, and that's why he got tasered, but they shouldn't have tried to kick him out in the first place. They might get a lawsuit because of it.
- foreignwarren, on 10/10/2007, -10/+41The VERY first thing the officers did was put their hands on him. THEY escalated the situation. Even if he was asked to leave...they had ABSOLUTELY no right to touch him at that point. He HAD NOT BROKEN ANY LAW WHATSOEVER...they provoked a situation and should all lose their jobs for using a taser to incapacitate an already incapacitated person who was already under the weight of 6 cops. THIS IS NOT WHAT A FREE COUNTRY LOOKS LIKE.
- tedlove, on 10/10/2007, -30/+56they should've tasered Kerry while they were at it.
- FyreGoddess, on 10/10/2007, -15/+39The problem is that there's not a whole lot anyone can do in that situation. The power is in the hands of the uniformed officers and it's already been made clear that they are overreaching their bounds. The only thing that could possibly have been done to change the situation would have been a riot and that would have been a whole lot less pretty.
The smartest thing that EVERYONE did was taking pictures and recording everything. Watching that happen so that they could testify is smarter than getting involved and escalating the situation. - inactive, on 10/10/2007, -31/+53But, I thought that kind of thing only happened at Republican events because Democrats are so kind, gentle, and loving.
- smackhero, on 10/10/2007, -9/+30what does this have to do with democrats? john kerry doesn't command the local police--they were the ones who acted inappropriately. i dislike john kerry, but he didn't do anything here. if you actually watched the video, he said "that's alright, let me answer his question..." the cops just ignored him and started grabbing the guy who they saw as a disruption.
if you want to talk about which political party is more against free speech and has hurt our freedoms, the republicans have been far worse. which president started relegating freedom of expression to designated "free speech zones?" it's always been conservatives who've been more unfriendly to free speech and have violated our personal liberties to suppress dissent.
that's clearly why you jumped on this story to try and claim that democrats hate freedom of speech without even watching the video or reading the article. i guess you can't let facts get in the way of your trolling. - GabrielS, on 10/10/2007, -4/+25What makes him ballsy? You can ask the same questions at any political forum.
Can we stop pretending that asking these questions is somehow a moment of truth? - reuscel, on 10/10/2007, -12/+29The whole story is here: http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2007/9/18/10649/5334
I'm against police brutality and the overwhelming drive to fascism that the Bush administration has put in place, but this video is not the whole story. - theworldisflat, on 10/10/2007, -6/+22I don't know if using a taser was called for, but the kid made several mistakes... not stopping his ***** when asked, then lunging back towards a US Senator after being pulled aside. The showboating was planned, but I doubt the use of the shockystick was.
At any rate, failures on both sides. - BelXul, on 10/10/2007, -1/+17At the White House, if reporters ask questions the administration does not like, their press pass is revoked and they usually get fired from their job for that. You are Free to do as we tell you.
- GawtMilk, on 10/10/2007, -7/+22Comment from the original article :
I also attended the speech this afternoon. While I agree with the above commenter's outrage, I would also like to point out that Meyer was visibily resisting and, even halfway across the auditorium, certainly seemed capable of violence against an officer.
Meyer and all of the rest of the attendees certainly do have rights of free speech, but only one, Meyer, refused to leave the microphone after Kerry and others noted that time was getting scarce. Meyer's question, which Kerry allowed after one he called "final," was heavily prefaced and degenerated into what the Sun rightly calls a "diatribe." "Asked" is simply not the word for Meyer's actions.
Also, I would question the use of "middle" in the description of Meyer's location in the audience; he was on the right microphone, and officers ushered him up the right aisle while he resisted before he was brought to the ground, screaming, then Tasered.
The biggest shames are that Meyer, whose question revealed a certain familiarility with politics and whose persistence would be ideal as a political activist, chose to use a strident, confrontational manner rather than remaining calm, and that, obviously, UPD used such force. Whether or not they had to is something I cannot declare, not knowing their codes well. I know his screams will stay with me for days, but I also know this case will be a far cry from the Mostafa Tabatabainejad case from UCLA.
Also a shame is that Sen. Kerry's speech was surprisingly current, humorous, and stirring, coming from someone who was never really impressed by him in 2004, and that his talk will be overshadowed by what promises to be an ugly fallout. - scorchedearth, on 10/10/2007, -4/+19I still fail to see why they needed to taser him when there were 5 cops on top of him. If they couldn't accomplish that in such a large group, they should be fired for incompetence.
- rebrad, on 10/10/2007, -9/+24Both parties are the same and are made up of the so called "elites". To them the little folk should just be quiet and do what their told or face the consequences.
- Napoleone, on 10/10/2007, -8/+22"Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the ***FREEDOM OF SPEECH***, or of the press; or of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances."
They moved in to arrest him for exercising his First Amendment Right to freedom of speech.
You must feel very stupid right now, especially since you probably thought the first amendment was just about religion. Go educate yourself, my friend. - proliance, on 10/10/2007, -9/+22A guy gets tased for harassing John Kerry and Bush gets blamed . Only on Digg.
- getrealnow, on 10/10/2007, -6/+19It was on the front page yesterday, but the more people see it the better.
- NewGTGuy, on 10/10/2007, -2/+15Yup, if only a few more would have done the same.
- cmwotring, on 10/10/2007, -3/+15I'm pretty sure John Kerry did not ask for this man to be "quieted".
- smackhero, on 10/10/2007, -2/+13so basically people shouldn't be allowed to exercise free speech or exercise civil disobedience unless they want to be tasered. all the guy was doing was standing up for his right to express himself without being manhandled by the cops. note that the speaker didn't want him removed and the cops were just having a power trip.
- KevenM, on 10/10/2007, -39/+50Watching the video a second time, as well as a portion leading up to the video http://youtube.com/watch?v=CheY0jYXJjY I've come to the conclusion that this kid is nothing more than a GRADE A ***** DISTURBER. The whole thing was overplayed, overacted, and he was looking for trouble.
Whether or not it was good judgement on the police's part, he could have simply avoided being tasered if he'd stood still when they asked him numerous times, but probably figured that this was his only chance at his 15 minutes. - kuzotz, on 10/10/2007, -2/+13yea this generation of college students are pussies.
- darkdantae, on 10/10/2007, -10/+21That is irrelevant. What if he said I like beer, should I respond with, "I have a friend who died from alcohol. ***** you *****."
- KevenM, on 10/10/2007, -12/+23Reddevil, when are you going to learn that few people are interested in actual facts?
- oldhick, on 10/10/2007, -2/+12So tasering a mentally unstable person on the ground is OK?
- notque, on 10/10/2007, -2/+12And he also didn't do anything about it, even after he was tasered. ***** that Kerry guy.
- sheepster, on 10/10/2007, -2/+12here is some good video of it:
http://www.cnn.com/2007/US/09/18/student.tasered.ap/index.html?eref=rss_topstories#cnnSTCVideo - smackhero, on 10/10/2007, -3/+13he only started getting upset when the cops began laying their hands on him. if it were anyone else doing that, it would be considered assault. clearly kerry was interested in answering his question, so he wasn't really a disruption. he didn't break any laws, and he wasn't a threat to anyone. the cops had absolutely no right to taser him and cause him bodily harm and trauma.
- Jugalator, on 10/10/2007, -2/+11Yes, after all, he's a threat to national security.
- revolvingcur, on 10/10/2007, -3/+12Actually, the UPD is an accredited law enforcement organization that operates in tandem with the GPD (Gainesville Police Dept). These guys were full-fledged, not some namby-pamby mall cops.
- smackhero, on 10/10/2007, -7/+16"left wing america hater"--watch bill o'reilly much?
- billybibbit, on 10/10/2007, -1/+10there were protests all over campus today
- wicketr, on 10/10/2007, -4/+12HAHA. This wasn't the CIA arresting him. It was the local campus police. You think the UF police force has strict orders from the Skull and Bones to keep it on the down low???? LOL
- NewGTGuy, on 10/10/2007, -15/+23If 20 people or more would have approached the police, I believe they would have backed down. The last thing they need is a riot at a Kerry event.
The problem is we have all been brain washed into sheeple. It is an agenda which has been years in the making. - blorc, on 10/10/2007, -2/+10Post-edit-timer correction: In the last sentence of paragraph one, I meant to say "...you can see him begin to comply..." rather than "...you can see him begin to apply..."
- zombiedepot, on 10/10/2007, -3/+11Get back into your free speech zone before someone gets tasered.
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