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- inactive, on 10/12/2007, -6/+51Because of the lack of a paper trail, the only remedy at this point is a new election. Anything less and the will of the voters will have been violated.
The majority of those 18,000 voters were solidly backing Democrats. Now we're sending someone to Congress based on a 369-vote "victory" that didn't happen.
"The group of nearly 18,000 voters that registered no choice in Sarasota's disputed congressional election solidly backed Democratic candidates in all five of Florida's statewide races, an Orlando Sentinel analysis of ballot data shows." - shawnfassett, on 10/12/2007, -5/+40Its sad that the 'only remedy at this point is a new election'.
I do not want to agree, but I do.
The other thing that needs to happen is #1 federal guidelines that set a national standard for fair elections #2 private companies do not own our election counting machines. - ninesquaredis81, on 10/12/2007, -14/+47Three reasons I buried your comment:
1. You react only to the parties involved and not the evidence.
2. You reference the "only" stolen election. We shouldn't be OK with *any* stolen election.
3. You imply that the poster wouldn't want to investigate evidence of an election stolen the in favor of Dems. Quite possibly, the poster puts the importance of an accurate democracy ahead of partisan politics. - hehe, on 10/12/2007, -2/+33Electronic voting machines, especially without a paper trail, should be made illegal. Period. This is just proof that they're not in this country's best interets and can be easily hacked.
- bbrosemer, on 10/12/2007, -4/+24This is pathetic why do people need to be party aligned it sickens me. Vote for the best canidate each year our country gets more and more split. We become more and more extreme. We are lacking common goals and a instead more focused upon just arguing with one another rather then getting anything accomplished.
- arunforce, on 10/12/2007, -5/+21Give me back Gore.
- pawchikapawpaw, on 10/12/2007, -2/+163. The vice-president of Diebold and the president of ES&S are brothers.
http://www.americanfreepress.net/html/private_company.html
http://www.onlinejournal.com/evoting/042804Landes/042804landes.html
oooooooh, conspiracy! - inactive, on 10/12/2007, -3/+15I've seen the ballot. The Congressional race was right there, clear as day. No way 18,000 voters just skipped over it.
- inactive, on 10/12/2007, -8/+19sonofdy, yer a moron.
The GOP would absolutely protest any election they thought was fixed. Except doing that would illustrate the elections they tampered with. - shortkid422, on 10/12/2007, -4/+14FTA:
"Christine Jennings is once again allowing her own personal ambitions and the radical political agendas of liberal third-party groups to hijack the democratic process," GOP state Chairwoman Carole Jean Jordan
I'm speechless... - oddmanout, on 10/12/2007, -0/+9"2/ Alright, where are they going after an election where the GOP LOST.
3/ I know they wouldn't. Because they haven't. "
so you're saying it could have ONLY happened if BOTH sides did it. and it could not have possibly happened if you can only find the GOP guilty of it?
to be quite honest, if you think the GOP thought that they were a victim of some sort of error like this, they'd just sit back and be quiet? I find it hard to believe they would, i'm pretty sure they'd speak up the same way - shawnfassett, on 10/12/2007, -6/+14The GOP does contest elections...think back to Washington governor's election in 2004.
They were going to contest George Allen/Jim Webb, but realized that they were going to get slapped down by the media and the heads at the RNC pulled that idea. - devindotcom, on 10/12/2007, -2/+10Are you taking into account the unprecedented 18,000 skipped votes in areas which would have skewed heavily Democratic? Because THAT is the issue here.
- spisska, on 10/12/2007, -2/+10The machines uses in Sarasota County, Florida were made by Election Systems and Software (ES&S), not Diebold.
ES&S is the country's largest vendor of election equipment -- their machines are used by roughly 50 percent of the voting population in roughly 50 percent of precincts around the country. - deserted, on 10/12/2007, -0/+6Osiriscky3:
dis·fran·chise
1. To deprive of a privilege, an immunity, or a right of citizenship, especially the right to vote; disenfranchise.
These people weren't "criminals and noncitizens". They were valid citizens who did not have a vote counted by the machine.
"The Sentinel reviewed records of 17,846 touch-screen ballots that included no vote..." - knomevol, on 10/12/2007, -0/+5yes, very strange the kind of people that show outrage when democracy has failed.
- jaydj, on 10/12/2007, -0/+5I would digg this story, but I no longer have faith in electronic voting systems
- oddmanout, on 10/12/2007, -0/+5right now they're counted disenfranchised, but the whole point of this is that the people say that its way too high, and highly irregular that there would be that many. An anomaly of this size should absolutely be investigated.... especially if the winner of the race can be decided. whether its democrat or republican favored, its abnormal almost to the point where you can just look at the data outright and say "thats not right," this is why it needs to be investigated.
- aristotle1990, on 10/12/2007, -1/+5I generally learn more towards the right, but this really sucks. It doesn't matter what party you belong to; disenfranchisement is bad for the country as a whole. It appears that this is a very real error, one which could very well have caused the Democratic candidate to win.
- CandidateZero, on 10/12/2007, -9/+13Florida again?! That's why we have Bush! They really need to stop being so incompetent/corrupt.
- scotty321, on 10/12/2007, -0/+4I have been saying this for the last 2 years in my video posted here:
How To Steal An Election
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HvwnJqLLgK8
And that's about as close to the truth as you can get! - oddmanout, on 10/12/2007, -1/+5i'd agree with you if we were talking about some tiny local city council or something, but who would go to the polls and skip major candidates like congress?
- dunnduggit, on 10/12/2007, -0/+4
I attended a public meeting in Sarasota regarding the voting problems. Many people reported that they had pressed the button for Jennings, but when the review screen came up it told them that they had not voted in the congressional race. Some people had to try several times to get their vote counted.
The undervotes in other counties and Sarasota's absentee ballots were around 2-3% for that race. There was a 16% undervote on election day and 21% in early voting in Sarasota county. I dunno something seems a little fishy to me. Especially when Jennings was only winning in Sarasota county. . - lwoj, on 10/12/2007, -2/+6Oh my ***** god. The electoral process has been and is being hijacked. All you idiots can do is point fingers. All you can say is "The Dems won already, who cares" and "It is funny, when Democrats lose it's due to lies and faulty election machines... when Democrats win then it's the people making change" (digjedi). I think I'm going to explode. Yeah we've all heard it before but this really reminds me of Orwell. It's like you've all been programmed or something! One side of me wants to say "You brainwashed idiots", the other side of me wants to say "you poor brainwashed souls". I'll try to be nice. It's obvious that there is some kind of thought manipulation (cue idiotic "tinfoil hat" comment...) going on. All the evidence in the world won't convince you Republican lapdogs that anything fishy is happening, your blindness is unbelievable. And no, I'm not a Democrat sympathizer, I'm not even American and I don't affiliate with either party. I don't think it unlikely that both sides have benefitted at some point from the US's twisted democratic process, but I'm addressing the truly Republican trait of steadfast refusal to even TRY to comprehend what is going on. And that's not to ignore the true Republicans who do recognize and speak up about the issue, all respect to those on both sides who are trying to do something about this.
At this point it's not only the twisted politicians who are dragging American democracy down, public perception is being hurt just as much by the brainwashed naysayers who poopoo all these allegations of vote manipulation right out of the gates. These are the same people who have been programmed to fear liberals as if liberalism is some kind of extremist agenda or something. What to do with these victims of propaganda? People need to start thinking for themselves, to truly rationally analyze what both sides are saying. eg. "If the Dems take the Senate, they'll just raise your taxes!!!" Booooo. We don't want that. Democrats are evil. Yes, but whose fault is it that taxes must be raised? Open your ***** eyes, people! - dunnduggit, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3 This race was the most heated in the area. People were not just forgetting about it. Even people who campaigned for Jennings had problems getting their votes counted.
- oddmanout, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3right, with the torture, stolen elections, and democratic dictatorship arising... we're looking more and more like the "enemy" every day.
- knomevol, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3he can't do jack but put gasoline fumes into the air that you breathe. long healthy life? doubtful. the power to go back was within you the whole time. take it home to where the soul is. bring it down to where you can feel it like a coat on a cold day, keepin' you warm.
love your neighbor. allow him to vote and for that vote to be counted.
be outraged when it doesn't. demand that it does.
when we do this we live up to the potential of the democracy mr franklin had in mind as he cried with joy as he signed the constitution of the united states of america. - Osiriscky3, on 10/12/2007, -2/+5they weren't just flat out skipped. They are disenfranchised votes... think before you post.
- merky1, on 10/12/2007, -1/+3War Crimes... I think you misspelled unconstitutional acts. Detaining American citizens as prisoners of war is against the constitution, which outside of the US is worthless.
As for detaining foreign nationals, there is nothing in the Geneva conventions that determines length of detainment, only that a trial must be carried out, and it must be equivalent to what a member of our Armed Forces would go through. And if you think that one of our enlisted troops gets a "fair" trial, your sadly mistaken. Break the UCMJ, and you get the equivalent of a military tribunal. - spoonard, on 10/12/2007, -3/+5How is anyone surprised by this? Especially when it happens in Florida?
- iNoles, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2I'm not surprised of this. The Voting machine is should be not used again. Come on, Bring back the paper that do bubble in.
- oddmanout, on 10/12/2007, -1/+3there was an accusation and a request for an investigation. doesn't that mean they are looking for proof? otherwise, if there was no accusation first, how would the investigators know what they're supposed to be looking for?
- knomevol, on 10/12/2007, -2/+4if one single citizen of the united states of america has been denied their right to vote, every single american has been denied their right to democracy.
- Nikl, on 10/12/2007, -1/+3@RevMark:
"There is no PROOF that the 18,000 voted Democrat. Only what the Liberal media says in "polls"."
It's not about polls, it's about other votes of those 18.000 that were disenfranchised from voting in this particular race. It's not an assumption that those uncounted votes leaned Democratic, it's a _fact_. - inactive, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1we should just use google from now on
http://viral-marketing-army.blogspot.com/2006/11/google-ranking-predicts-presidential.html - zerodamage, on 10/12/2007, -1/+2Only when Democrats lose. There is always an excuse for when they lose. We heard all kinds of horror stories before the election this year, but since the democrats won, not one complaint or bogus story. Funny.
- Tarnum, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1"Prove it, you hippie". That is called plausible deniabiltiy.
- scabbers, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1It doesn't help the US argument for "democracy" in the middle east, does it?
- knomevol, on 10/12/2007, -1/+2i feel you. it is difficult to live in a community so tolerant of black box democracy. hopefully people wake up and realize there's a man behind the curtain and he can't send you back to kansas after all.
- spkthed, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1Just a few years ago everyone was clamoring for electronic voting machines because paper trails couldn't be trusted, I'm not sure I understand, how on earth are we supposed to vote? Florida was the reason electronic voting machines were requested, because Democrats felt that Bush should have lost... now electronic machines cost Democrats an election?
- mcgoo, on 08/20/2008, -0/+1See HuffPo's Exclusive: Florida GOP Congressman Vern Buchanan Facing Seven Legal Complaints, Accusations of Wrongdoing from Employees!
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/08/19/exclusive ... - mcgoo, on 08/20/2008, -0/+1See HuffPo's Exclusive: Florida GOP Congressman Vern Buchanan Facing Seven Legal Complaints, Accusations of Wrongdoing from Employees (VIDEO)
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/08/19/exclusive ... - lwoj, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1@Revmark
Then your friends are idiots. What is less patriotic to your democracy than to lie on a poll which benefits the people directly by providing them with accurate information regarding their own society? I suppose, by the fact that you place the word 'polls' in quotation marks, that this is your way of showing that you don't believe in the accuracy of polls. And I suppose that you base that reasoning on your (sarcasm ON) incredibly accurate poll of twelve friends, which proved that 100% of the time, 100% of people lie on polls (sarcasm OFF). Well if that is the case then ***** humanity, we only have ourselves to blame for the poor way we conduct our society.
Might I suggest your friends are *****. You didn't actually admit that you yourself lie on polls, so I'll give you the benefit of the doubt and assume you are nowhere close to that dim-witted. A poll is a very accurate tool of estimation. The very word 'poll' implies a level of accuracy which makes it a viable measuring tool. If there is a large discrepency in the numbers produced in a country's polls in relation to the reality, then there is quite simply something very wrong with the way that country is carrying out its polls. It could be accidental oversight, negligence, sheer stupidity, or manipulation (in ascending level of EVIL) which contribute to the inaccuracy of the data. Or, the most *pathetic* option of all, is that people are so stupid that they lie on polls out of sheer spite, which does nothing but make their own society a slightly worse place to live. If that's the case, hand me a bucket, I'm going to throw up. - elebrio, on 10/12/2007, -2/+3Ridiculously inaccurate title/synopsis.
- pearcewg, on 09/28/2008, -0/+1Most Republicans are generally against courts getting involved in elections (meaning: voters). This isn't really about 2000 or Sarasota 2006, but goes back decades, and is about concerns with the courts getting more power and responsibility than was ever intended.
They have a history of losing in problem races (the dead voting Chicago & Baltimore, union machines manipulating the vote), but they stick to the guns of keeping elections out of the courts.
Sadly, I expect this will change, mainly because they are being forced into the courts by the opposition, and will have to adapt into that direction. - Osjpr, on 10/12/2007, -1/+2http://www.onlinejournal.com/evoting/111704DeHart/111704dehart.html
- portwojc, on 10/12/2007, -2/+2No you're suppose to concede then a year or so later act like you never did.
- CyGmuS, on 10/12/2007, -1/+1... Florida... Gotta love it
- defduane, on 10/12/2007, -1/+1Sorry, 12.9% undervotes. I accidentally took votes from the whole district.
http://www.cnn.com/ELECTION/2006//pages/results/states/FL/H/13/county.000.html - theregulator, on 10/12/2007, -1/+1However, the sad truth is that if the opposite had happened, if the free marketeers had been shorted somehow, then I doubt you would raise the issue. In other words, I doubt that the "outed" voter is your real concern, only a means to an end for your agenda.
To be more credible, talk about the causes of this tragedy, not about remocrat or depublican party affiliations. -
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