What is Digg?189 Comments
- upsidedork, on 10/12/2007, -16/+73Yes, everyone does have the right to marry. But a lot of us don't have the right to marry the person we love.
- sockpuppets, on 10/12/2007, -3/+42Sometimes it seems like a contest to see who can be the biggest douchebag in politics.
- BassCadet, on 10/12/2007, -11/+36If we want to help low-wager workers take home more money, why don't we exempt them from income taxes?
Instead, by hiking the minimum wage for EVERYBODY, we're giving away money to people who might not even need that money as badly.
Example: 16 year old boy working at McDonalds, he is driving a car his upper-middle-class gave to him, he has no expenses of his own. There is no reason he needs to make more than minimum wage. If he doesn't like minimum wage, there are smarter ways to make more money as a 16 year old (I mowed lawns, cleaned houses, sacked groceries at that age...I never made less than $6-7 an hour, and that was like 15 years ago)
But for the 35 year old woman who is working 2 jobs, one of them minimum wage, just to make ends meet....give HER tax breaks and let her take home more money! - jhaven, on 10/12/2007, -12/+32@adam84a: "unless I'm missing something, everyone does have the right to marry..."
What America do you live in? - Bytor, on 10/12/2007, -2/+22He is still an asshat because:
A: He was previously whining about having to work a 5 day week saying it destroys families. He thinks he should only have to work 3 days Tue-Wed-Thur and be grossly over paid for it.
B: He is assertion that getting married and working 40hours week is the way out of poverty. Many working poor already work much longer than 40hours/week at minimum wage jobs. Marrying someone won't make it better. - sych0, on 10/12/2007, -4/+23Thats it. I'm not buying his RAM anymore
- inactive, on 10/12/2007, -1/+18Working harder has nothing to do with it. I live in the deep south and I am here to tell you that no people in the world work harder than broke ass southern whites and blacks. The problem is not with the workers. The problem is widespread MASSIVE poverty and absence of jobs that is the symptom of a broken economic system. Just think LA and Katrina to get a picture of what southern georgia is like. Saying all poor americans are to blame for their poverty is about as stupid a stament as any brainwashed existentialist asshat could make.
- 8bit_Hero, on 10/12/2007, -3/+16Let them eat Cake!
- 3DPeruna, on 10/12/2007, -1/+14Let's see...
1) When I was in graduate school, I had a full time job (something the school advised against) and a full time graduate school load. My first year, I did freelance work and we were dirt poor. I had a wife and kid to support. I put in 40 hours a week work, when I could get it, and I put in 60-80 hours a week school. We always ate our evening meal as a family. I would wake at 7:00 AM, go to school/work return for the evening meal for a couple of ours, then back to school/work until 2-3:00 AM. I did this for THREE YEARS. This is the price I paid to get out of "poverty."
2) I now own my own business. I still work more than 40 hours a week, but my time is flexible (I can do stuff with the family during the day, work in the evening/night when the kids go to sleep). This is the price I pay to stay out of poverty and am working to get out of the middle class.
I know it was said by a Canadian, but I'm convinced that anybody in the US/Canada who wants to get out of poverty, regardless of sex or race, can get out. It's a question of personal perseverance and desire (Of course, there is that 5% of any given population that cannot take care of themselves--the "chronic" poor because of mental/physical/emotional disability. These are the people that truly deserve help). (http://www.townhall.com/columnists/WalterEWilliams/2006/01/04/the_poverty_hype) - Bytor, on 10/12/2007, -2/+14WTF? You went to university and will get upset if they pay someone more than slave wages. So what if they upped minimum to $7, that is barely survival money. That is not a handout. Obviously they can't/didn't teach intelligence/common sense, you either have it or you don't.
Did you ever work for minimum? I did (as a student). I worked for $7 and it is not much better, I worked for $10 and that is treading water. I lived on my own in my own place at those wages. I bet you went from living at home straight to university and are now bitching about something you have no clue about.
I started at $20/hour after University and would be damn happy if they set minimum $8 or more. It is no skin off my back if someone can actually eek out a living working 40 hours a week. Minimum wage currently is slave wages you can't live on it unless you work two jobs. You know the tables could turn and you might find your career outsourced someday and find yourself pulling minimum even with a University education. - spengy, on 10/12/2007, -7/+18I don't know why antifederalist is being dugg down. His message is "work hard, it will pay off." That's a good message.
- upsidedork, on 10/12/2007, -3/+14@ Shalabi: Who will pay for them to learn a trade? Where will they get money for food and rent while they're going to school? When you're stuck in the middle of it, getting out of poverty can appear to be impossible.
- upsidedork, on 10/12/2007, -1/+11I don't think "I read a book about it" is going to look good on a resumé.
- Lokix, on 10/12/2007, -5/+14Make that 125, atleast. I don't want idiots running this country, unfortunately they already are.
- mabhatter, on 10/12/2007, -3/+12actually a teenager pays higher taxes on their pay because they are claimed buy their parents as dependants.. all the money they make is taxable... that's a LOT of bucks ... remember college students, like a lot of diggers, still count as "dependants" until their 25 for all those folks putting themselves thru school.
- gonzoradio, on 10/12/2007, -1/+10@Broomett -
Where do you live? Mexico? All the factory jobs where I live went south of the border years ago.
And 2 people working full time for 10 an hour, 40 hrs a week, no vacations, no sicktime, will rake in a luxurious 40K a year combined - after taxes, maybe 35, assuming you qualify for EITC. If you don't, then it's closer to 30K a year for a family of at least two, maybe 3 or 4 or more. Yeah, baby, that's living. Just don't get a medical bill or a flat tire.
What are you, 15? Learn some math. - deadbaby, on 10/12/2007, -4/+12What if you have kids? Should you have to work 60-80 hour weeks and let your kids raise themselves just to put food on the table? Then their kids grow up to be drug dealers or something and you'll say "it's all the parents fault. they should have done a better job raising their kids"
- mikesbaker, on 10/12/2007, -32/+40here is what he said because I don't think you read it:
"if people end poverty, many of them would marry and work 40 hours a week, they would be out of poverty"
I wish I got to work only 40 hours a week. If you are poor and work less than 40 hours a week than tough *****. You deserve to be poor. - sicc, on 10/12/2007, -4/+11Um, maybe I'm missing something, but if you're poor should you not be working harder and longer? Certainly you shouldn't be working less, right? Yea it's hypocrtical, but I don't think he's in poverty either...
- drjekelmrhyde, on 10/12/2007, -2/+9lets see working 40 hours a week on 5.25 =10,920$ before taxes now lets add the wife say she make 6 bucks a hour 12,480$
total 23,400$ a year WOW a 10 dollar hooker gets twice that in a year - chriskzoo, on 10/12/2007, -5/+11Let's just wait for this to play out: Dems raise minimum wage, unemployment rises, somehow they blame Bush.
- Bytor, on 10/12/2007, -1/+7So you work a full time 40hr job + 60 to 80 hrs on school. + spend a couple hours every night with the family around meal time 7*2 hours = 14.
40+80+14 = 134 hours.
Leaving you 4.8 hours a day to sleep/eat breakfast/eat lunch/shower/shave/*****/do laundry etc...
I guess you are just superman. The rest of haven't figured out that spin the world backward for more time trick. - boyasunder, on 10/12/2007, -0/+6Yeah, but that's just the thing. Lots of people who've taken a _basic_ economics class will tell you it's dumb to raise the minimum wage.
Most _actual economists_, who've taken whole bunches of economics classes!, know that predicting gloom from a modest increase is *****. Even an anti-increase economist only predicted a 4% decrease in the job rate: http://www.prospect.org/deanbaker/2007/01/opponent_of_minimum_wage_says.html#015071 - mikesbaker, on 10/12/2007, -10/+16so he is an ass hat for saying that poor people need to get their asses into work. he was talking 40 hours not 70.
- MaxPayne3476, on 10/12/2007, -2/+7BassCadet, how do you determine what 16-year old is actually making the money and needs it and who doesn't?
Sure you may just use his social class, but what about someone such as myself? I'm considered upper-middle class and do have a job (granted I'm a lifeguard so money is not a big deal). However, I also have a car. Now what the government would see is that I have a car and I'm not making payments to a car loan. Oh, well I guess my parents bought it for me. Wrong. I actually have taken the money out of my Social Security funds (from my dad passing away) and pay $200 a month to pay the money back. No one loaned the money to me, so unfortunately, under your system the government would exclude me and put me under minimum wage.
Also, why should that kid make any less money then his poor friend if they work the same job, same hours, and same responsibilities. That kid shouldn't get shafted just cause his family isn't poor. This isn't a welfare state. Want assisstance? Go to the Netherlands. - upsidedork, on 10/12/2007, -1/+6You were very lucky in that you knew what to do to pull yourself up. I think there are a lot of folks who would like to do the same, but have lived in such institutionalized poverty that they just don't know what steps to take. They might not ever have known anyone who accomplished what you did -- they might not even believe that it's possible.
- mrgreen4242, on 10/12/2007, -0/+5"yes an english class would help a lot"
Says the guy with no punctuation or capitalization in his "sentence". - Buelldozer, on 10/12/2007, -2/+7I wouldn't worry about it. In a few years the minimum wage hike will have pushed the salaries of everyone else UP to compensate and you'll effectively be making the same amount as you are now. Without factoring in inflation, etc.
- dannighe, on 10/12/2007, -1/+6Do you really think putting:
"I like to go to the library and read, but have no formal secondary schooling." on a resume will get you hired? - Rezzy, on 10/12/2007, -2/+6If he were working for minimum wage, you could sure as hell bet he'd be working a five day work week
- sicc, on 10/12/2007, -5/+9Now who's fault is that? The hooker or the person making minimum wage?
- dannighe, on 10/12/2007, -3/+7Seeing as minimum wage is based off of a computation done in the 1960's, and hasn't been raised much since, that argument is simply stupid! Not everyone can do well in college. There are different types of intelligence, and not all of them will make you $20/hr.
- drizek, on 10/12/2007, -0/+4So rich people shouldnt have to work for a living? Why not?
- AnteChronos, on 10/12/2007, -0/+4Max is right, though -- uneloquent as he may be. If someone is below the poverty line and is barely able to provide for themselves, it's downright irresponsible for them to bring another life into the world. They'll be inadequately prepared to both care for the child *and* earn enough money to pay the bills.
- zdiggler, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3I came from a 3rd world country and most of the family there ONLY the Husband work!!
America is claimed to be 1st word and both almost 90% of family here both husband and wife must work to live in their own home. Unless you're in so called UPPERClass.
If your wife work, you're below middle class. - gonzoradio, on 10/12/2007, -3/+6Ah, but oddly enough, after multiple studies conducted from Berkeley to NY, there's absolutely ZERO evidence that raising the minimum wage leads to job loss.
Whoops! Damn! Foiled again!! - tankexmortis, on 10/12/2007, -2/+5"I was instilled with the idea that if you work hard, do the right thing, and form working relationships with others, that you will be successful."
While that would be nice, the world is just not that simple.
People do not choose to be poor. It's not a lifestyle choice. If you are poor, you are not happy about it. You are not content. And it is not an easy thing to get out of. My mother worked for 30+ years to get out of poverty. Many work their whole lives and still don't make it out. It's not simply a matter of working harder or longer. There are far too many factors in someone's income (especially someone who's already disadvantaged - for instance, by poverty). You can't live a decent life on welfare and food stamps and it disgusts me that some people act like the impoverished are living the high life because they don't have a high-paying job (as if pay had anything to do with stress level). And it's not as simple as "getting an education". Not when you're stuck in a crappy public school and don't have the money for college.
Life is not simple. Please don't let your indoctrination blind you to that. - JavertHolmes, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3I don't think there's an easy answer to this problem that can be solved via a two sentence headline or a 5 second sound bite. Even the PROBLEM can't be defined easily. Just look at all the facets...
1) Trying to solve funding for people who can not work. The physically/mentally ill. Come up with a system to properly fund 99.9% of these people to give them a balanced diet, shelter, clothing, and whatever treatments they need. The trick would be defining who is physically/mentally ill enough and, after that, how to stop fraud cases from leeching.
2) Trying to deal with the pregnancy issues for people living below the poverty line who can not support another mouth to feed. How do you deal with this as a society? Mandatory temporary sterilization? Millions spent in condoms, etc? Free abortions? Mandatory abortions? You get into some very tricky issues here. What about the moms who want kids because they're lonely and get treated like ***** by the men in their lives? They won't volunteer for an abortion. What about all the kids that pulled themselves and their families out of poverty after they grew up?
3) Learning how to deal with people who can work, don't want to work, but instead leech off of others. This is the kind of person who talks about how working is for chumps and yet spends his/her life leeching off of those who do work either through the government, panhandling, or crime. What do you do with these people? How do you pull them out of poverty if they just plain don't want to do anything?
I've raised about a dozen questions from three categories of poverty that sure as hell can't be answered by "work a 40 hour week and get married." I think it's about time we started talking about poverty constructively, though, with no punches pulled. - WalkerBurgin, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3I have nothing against the government helping people temporarily to get back on their feet when they're in need, or helping people with serious disabilities... In fact I think that a government should do this for its citizens. What I do have a problem, however, is a system that allows people to live off the government indefinitely while making no effort to help themselves. This in no way encourages people to become self sufficient and is unfair to the vast majority of Americans who truly do work for their living.
- upsidedork, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3Again: how are they going to learn that it's not impossible, when they've never seen any evidence to the contrary?
I agree, they don't need to be babied. Just given the tools and knowledge that we were lucky enough to have provided to us. - gonzoradio, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3Unless of course you live in a place where 5 people want every job you have. Then you can pick and choose, paying the least the market will bear. That's business - but on the other hand, that's what creates the working poor.
- Sil369, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3Interesting points killinger777.
- killinger777, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3About 2% of Americans make minimum wage. Most are middle-class teenagers.
http://www.bls.gov/cps/minwage2005.htm
Guess how businesses make up for the higher wages? They either cut jobs, or raise prices. So, the teenagers make a little more money, and the poverty level families who already make over the minimum wage get to pay more for goods. - avidlinuxuser, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3I don't like your logic. What if the mother and father wanted one child and could afford it, but the woman ended up having a multiple-birth pregnancy? Suddenly, they become a leech do to unpredictable circumstances. Some people on digg need to stop just using economics 101. There is a lot more to economics as individual and as a group. There are unpredictable circumstances that occur. What if you're barely getting by and some drunk slams into your car one day? You're in the hospital for several months. You don't have any insurance, and you are stuck with thousands of dollars owed to the hospital after you're released. You will be working a good long time to pay that off. On a group scale, you are working at Unnamed fortune 500 company. As far as you know, everything is good. Some time later, it turns out you're company's accounting was funky.The company is soon to be bankrupt. Your entire retirement fund is gone. Lets say you are unfortunate to be close to retirement. Now, you will be working several more years, and you may not be able to find a decent job. Take some statistics and probability with these economics classes so that you can learn that success is highly dependent on chance.
- Ndiggnation, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3Two words + 2. ***** him.
- brentolamas, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3Why is this confusing?
I want to work less so I can be with my family.
I want you to work more so I can work less so I can be with my family.
Who gets hurt? - alexonix, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3but I'm le tired...
- AnteChronos, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3@mabhatter
"remember college students, like a lot of diggers, still count as "dependants" until their 25 for all those folks putting themselves thru school."
The only thing significant about the age of 25 is that you can no longer be claimed, even if you still live with your parents. But you can claim yourself at a much younger age if you are self sufficient. Basically, you only count as a dependent if your parents provide for more than half of your living expenses. If you're paying your way through college and living somewhere other than your parents' house, then they can't claim you as a dependent, even if you're younger than 25. - S1L3NTC, on 10/12/2007, -2/+5@Broomett
First of all, Digg has conveniently placed a "Check Spelling" button right below where you wantonly display your nauseating stupidity.
Other than being an easily led asshat, what do you do that makes you of such great value to anyone?
I don't understand what gives you the right to declare who is of value and who is not.
I am a 29 IT professional and father. I never had the luxury of completing college because I had the priority of NEEDING TO FEED MY WIFE AND KID. Last time I checked, student loans and Pell grants weren't something that you could support a family on. Some people get caught in a loop of needing to work in order to survive; living from paycheck to paycheck.
I was able to improve my situation by gaining certifications and work experience; things you obviously lack.
We all can't stay with mommy and daddy forever like you. Do yourself a favor and go back to popping pimples instead for filling the boards full of your baseless opinions.
Asshat! -
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