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93 Comments
- kurick, on 10/12/2007, -7/+69This is an important story that shows if parts of the government and legal system are left unchecked, our rights will be violated by others that are in power. Imagine being jailed without due process. No chance to defend yourself.
- inactive, on 10/12/2007, -5/+54Maybe it's just a trial run to see how we will react.
- eug2k, on 10/12/2007, -3/+30thats what im afraid of
- tooslickvan, on 10/12/2007, -1/+27If she's in jail against her fourth and fifth amendment rights then it's a serious violation of all of our rights and we should all be concerned. But it appears that there may be more to the story than what is in the article. First, the article itself is very biased and I suspect that some of the facts may be misrepresented. I don't have any proof that the article is inaccurate but I haven't found any other source that confirms the facts either. Second, Elsebeth Baumgartner is not just some person "expressing her opinion at a city council meeting" but is a former lawyer that was disbarred for professional misconduct (http://www.sconet.state.oh.us/Communications_Office/summaries/2003/0924/022237.asp) and may have filed many frivolous lawsuits (http://www.clevescene.com/Issues/2006-05-03/news/feature.html) against public officals. There quite a bit of controversy of what she has done and how she was treated. I haven't heard about this case until now but it is not simple case.
- shakaru, on 10/12/2007, -0/+13I decided to give some of the numbers on the bottom of the page a call and found something out. Most dont work, and of the ones that did work, I was sadly informed that this story is compleatly false. Charges HAVE been filled, there was no rant made by the judge and the reason why she was in jail for so long was not because of any reasons listed in the article, but because she refused to pay the bond on the grounds that she felt her rights were beign violated.
Im going to have to say that my own opponion is this, the article is greatly missleading, the woman is a nut job, and everyone should go back to their lives. - exmil, on 10/12/2007, -8/+21This is outrageous, a citizen held without charges. She is not a terrorist, it appears, but the victim of her local government and judiciary, who are all in this epic misdeed together. I wouldn't even expect this to happen in Kalifornistan, mush less Ohio. Where is the freaking ACLU when stuff like THIS happens?! Everyone email this link to your local news affiliate, if enough attention is brought to bear on this travesty, maybe the right thing will be done to free her and bring down the people who GROSSLY abused their powers on her!
ex_mil - brady47, on 10/12/2007, -0/+13http://www.clevescene.com/Issues/2006-05-03/news/feature_full.html
- mww2, on 10/12/2007, -1/+14Dear MiddleGirth, the ACLU has to know about something before they can respond to it.
- inactive, on 10/12/2007, -0/+13Wow, interesting.. Let's look some stuff up..
http://www.google.com/search?q=%22June+Maxam%22&hl=en&lr=&start=10&sa=N
Per the whois on the website. She's a fruity nutcase..
And I'm not going to look up or encourage anybody to look up her information but it's out there
Also look here http://victimsoflaw.net/InnocentsInPrison.htm - bradleybuda, on 10/12/2007, -0/+10It's a shame that this is being trumped up as a civil rights violation when there are so many real problems in the world. This woman is nuts - she has been a tremendous nuisance to the Ohio legal system, has clogged the courts with frivolous lawsuits, and was only placed in solitary confinement after six months of rebellion in jail, where she overflowed toilets with paper cups and illegally disrupted the criminal cases of her fellow prisoners. She spent years filing lawsuits filled making defamatory claims against every single person who has ever disagreed with her until she was barred from ever filing a lawsuit in Ohio.
Really, the system has bent over backwards for this woman and she continues to abuse it. This article was linked above, but it deserves mentioning again:
http://www.clevescene.com/Issues/2006-05-03/news/feature_full.html - kurick, on 10/12/2007, -1/+10You are right, there is more to this story than meets the eye. And I did the same exact thing you did when a friend told me about this, I searched for other sources to confirm the story, and I only found 1 other source on news.google.com.
But that is still no excuse for her rights to be violated. I just think on that fact alone there needs to be more media attention on this story, and citizens need to be informed about it in hope that the whole truth comes to light.
Also the 2 links you provide do not apear to be valid links to stories. - masgaster, on 10/12/2007, -2/+10Give me a break. This is a lawyer has a history of frivolous conduct, and as a vexatious litigator under Ohio law she merely has to file a motion for leave to appeal with the court before she can file her notice of appeal. She didn't and the court properly dismissed the appeal. And what's this about her giving legal advice with her license revoked? I don't blame the judge for getting angry at lawyers that tarnish the profession through blatant disregard of professional responsibility. She might have a DP claim, but if she would take the time to cross some t's and dot some i's, maybe she would be arguing her point by now.
- brady47, on 10/12/2007, -2/+9Dailykos has already been through this one today and figured it was pretty much single sourced ***** from the North Country Gazette
http://www.dailykos.com/story/2006/9/13/163745/658 - jer2eydevil88, on 10/12/2007, -0/+7I live in Cincinnati and the cops here in Clifton Heights are awesome human beings that I trust and feel secure when they are around. This kind of news shouldn't be taken to mean that all of Ohio is backwards just because there are a few bad apples.
I also know from my speeding tickets on 71 that there are some cops in Ohio who seem to enjoy being on a power trip. - kyriakos, on 10/12/2007, -2/+9the land of the free..
- YumYumKittyLoaf, on 10/12/2007, -3/+9*****, I live in waterville, 20-30 minutes from Oak Harbor. That is NOT good... I feel unsafe now, since a city nearby called Bowling green has strict cops. Bleh... ohio sucks
- mbrinkm, on 10/12/2007, -1/+7Wow, this story has perfectly illustrated the tendency of the hive mind. Do you all actually believe everything you read? Did you even try to authenticate the story from more than one source?
Brady47, WyllyWylly, Killagoat and others have shown with a QUICK google search that this story is a load of crap. Here's another link to add to the pile.
http://www.portclintonnewsherald.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20060328/NEWS01/603280303
From the article publisehd on March 28, 2006:
Baumgartner, 50, pleaded innocent Monday to 10 counts of intimidation, two felonies and eight misdemeanors, two felony counts of retaliation, one misdemeanor count of falsification and one felony count of possession of criminal tools, Kasaris said. - inactive, on 10/12/2007, -0/+5Not commenting on the subject of the article itself, but just wanted to say I'm little inclined to take legal analysis seriously from a publication that writes, "Fair Use is not applicable" in bold letters below each article.
Copyright law sets out certain principles by which portions of a copyrighted work may be excerpted or used for transformative works *without* permission of the copyright holder, and for the NCG to claim that such law does not apply to their own articles is simply ridiculous. If someone wishes to quote a line or two from the article and comment or criticise such, after it has already been published, then that person by all means has the right to do so. And in certain cases, an entire work may be reproduced legally, such as in certain educational uses.
While the situations covered by Fair Use are limited, they do exist, and if the publishers and editors of the North Country Gazette fail to recognize even something so basic and fundamental to copyright in the United States, I have to wonder whether they're qualified to report on any issues of law or its abuses. - PantherX, on 10/12/2007, -2/+7My guess is a certain judge is going to be disbarred... and probably investigated and throw in prison with a bunch of ***** he sent to jail. Hope he brings lube and knows how to make a shiv.
- jeffiek, on 10/12/2007, -1/+6Former lawyers disbarred for professional misconduct have just as much right as anyone else to express their opinion. Ad hominem attacks add nothing to the topic.
- ebrandsberg, on 10/12/2007, -1/+6Having been through the legal process before, here is what isn't stated--you can have your bond dropped for just about any reason. As such, what I think happened was this:
1. She was charged way back when for the other crimes (so yes, she HAS been charged with something)
2. She was released on bond
3. She was arrested again on the contempt charge
4. She was believed to have performed the UPL (true or not, it is enough in our system)
5. Her bond was revoked.
To be honest, it could have been revoked on the contempt charge again, or simply for having been arrested again. Once you are in the system, your rights pretty much disappear. I'm surprised that the article didn't tell us that they didn't read her Miranda rights too--believe it or not, in most situations they don't have to.
On the lack of communication, the jail officials may have deemed her to be a risk, and are limiting communication. This too isn't a right for prisoners. If her lawyer wants to talk to her, then her lawyer will have to physically visit the jail. Then and ONLY then does she have a right to speak to him as far as I know. - mww2, on 10/12/2007, -2/+7Addendum: If it wasn't a fake/exaggerated/complicated story, which it is.
- HappyScrappy, on 10/12/2007, -1/+5After over 2 minutes of intense research I am going to render my judgement:
Stone cold crazy.
I've met up with stone cold crazy face to face before, and these descriptions fall more in line with the persecution complex of a manic-depressive (bipolar if you wish to use PC terms) and sane people trying to deal with her crazy actions than with accurate, unbiased descriptions of a scenario likely to have played out in this country.
I could be wrong though. - zweben, on 10/12/2007, -0/+4kurick: Take the ) off the end of the links and they will work correctly. It's a flaw in digg's auto link detection.
- wistar, on 10/12/2007, -0/+4Think you could have de-gremlined that before posting?
- WyllyWylly, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3Oh look, she's already been wiki'd: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elsebeth_Baumgartner
Even *that* article has its neutrality questioned. Forget this silly bitch, why isn't everyone still worried about what is happening to Jose Padilla? THAT sage scares the ***** out of me.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jos%C3%A9_Padilla_(alleged_terrorist)
http://www.rotten.com/library/bio/crime/terrorists/jose-padilla/ - Petrarch1603, on 10/12/2007, -1/+4if this is true i think the federal government needs to investigate
- earthtoandy, on 10/12/2007, -4/+7Viva La Reveloution!
- humanaut, on 10/12/2007, -5/+8More islamofascist propaganda... when will you people learn to willfully ignore these kinds of stories?! You're playing right into the game plan of the enemy!
- inactive, on 10/12/2007, -1/+4YumYumKittyLoaf---
I used to live in Wauseon. The only reason Ohio cops suck is that they steal so much money from motorists. That's the entire job of the police there is to generate revenue.
BG sucks because of BGSU. It's a big drinking town.
But there's always Tony Packo's. Yeah. - hecatomb, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3I live in Defiance (not far away from YumYumKittyLoaf at least) and this is crap... I know our judicial system here isn't really the most honest, but I could see something like this happening here.
This town is small enough that the people with the money get away with EVERYTHING, and it's irritating as hell... (and that may be the case in many small towns.)
Please let the power of Digg make this story more prominent so it gets alot more attention throughout the US (or the world for that matter)...
Now even if she's crazy and some of the allegations are true, the fact of the matter is she's being held in this way; at least give her a trial. - serpentor, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2I *REALLY* wish I read that clevescene.com article before digging this. The woman is a complete and utter psychopath! Get this off of digg right now!
- aCultureHussar, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2Well with further investigation she seems on the brink of insanity, providing that the other source is credible. Having said that, since we don't seem to mind letting out other crazy women out of prison for lets say killing their children her rights surely need to be protected, more importantly @ this point there needs to be a 3rd party impartial investigation into the whole thing including her allegations against the town officials.
We're being so F-ed by our government in so many ways that i for one am losing trust in our so called leaders every day. - Kourgin, on 10/12/2007, -4/+6one small step closer to world war III.
*high five's Colbert. - mrlost117, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2good investigative work killagoat, now Ill work to restore a positive thumbs up to your previous post. you earned it.
- HHarrelson, on 10/12/2007, -3/+5On the face of it: this is a case of the law run amok.
" Former attorney Elsebeth Baumgartner of Oak Harbor, Ohio, has been sitting in Erie County Jail for 19 days since Aug. 21 after retired visiting court judge Richard Knepper, who had already disqualified himself from her case, jailed her.
Knepper ruled that she had engaged in the unauthorized practice of law, revoking her bond in a case in which she's been charged with stealing the corporate vehicle owned by her internet news publication, Erie Voices which she financed.
Except for one thing---she hadn't been criminally charged with UPL.
Her bond was revoked by Knepper without any hearing, without any accusatory instrument."
On the basis of these statments, I believe that Ms. Baumgartner is, in fact, a political prisoner of the State of Ohio, United States of America. As such, her cause should be taken up without pause. - inactive, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2I don't know about anyone else, but the author's writing style makes my head hurt.
- brady47, on 10/12/2007, -3/+5yes, it seems, June Maxam, the author of this article, has been up to the same shenanigans all over NY state
- dkm201, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2Oh wait, dailykos says she's out on bail...
- wurzelgummage, on 10/12/2007, -2/+4This whole story smells really bad. Marked as "possibly inaccurate"
- MobbyG, on 10/12/2007, -1/+3{insert coo coo clock sound here}
- jerz2dc, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2This women is insane! I hope some of you guys take the time to read the other articles.
http://www.clevescene.com/Issues/2006-05-03/news/feature_full.html - kylesellers, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2Yeah, how about a link instead next time?
- kylesellers, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2Yeah it sucks--that Padilla hasn't been thrown in jail to rot. I mean seriously, showing up with ten grand in cash, a list of al queda contact infromation, and several anonymous cell phones and we can't get through the trial?
- protogenxl, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2well regardless if this story is accurate, Erie County is about to get slapped with a huge civil suit.
- Ascus, on 10/12/2007, -1/+3Digg, Very seldom can is it that in one case everything wrong with the Courts and the Elected Government be shown at the same time.
1) She should be able to be able to file suit on any government she believes is violating the law, without unrelated repercussions.
2) She should have to present proof more than, "I smell a conspiracy". The burden of proof guilt should should now be on her, not the ones she accused. Sense she has no legal cost (she is her own lawyer) the people she accused are under undue financial burden, form which they have little recourse.
3) There is little that can be done to stop these people from using the courts as a legal battering ram. She is not the only one doing this, she just doesn't have some large group backing her like some of the other political causes.
Digg also, for an exercise to find out there is much more to the story that first appears. She does appear to be fruit, but in turn none of the charges she has leveled has made it to trial, and likely some of them are true, but very possible the exist only in her mind. Without any of them being reviewed but prosecuted, there is no way to know for sure.
And for the record, she is in jail for a very documented reason, just one she refuses to accept. - kurick, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2Well I wish I found this article before I posted this on Digg, and I want to thank everyone for posting it. http://www.clevescene.com/Issues/2006-05-03/news/feature_full.html
It definitely shows that there is ALOT to this story and that she very well might be crazy. But on her most recent incarceration, I would still like to know if she was held for that long without formally being charged with a crime, because that would still be inexcusable.
Although I must concede that if there was ever a case of special circumstances in rearguards to taking aggressive action against someone, this is it. - ayeroxor, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2High five is Colbert?
- labmouse42, on 10/12/2007, -1/+310 years ago I was involved in a bar brawl. Some guy called my girlfriend a slut so I beat the snot out of him. This gave me a first hand view on the US process.
1) Person is arrested for a crime. The arresting officer places the initial crime for what they will be charged for. In my experience this charge is usually rather high. I was involved in a bar fight once and was charged with Aggravated Assault for punching a guy.
2) After you have been arrested you are held for an armament. You can pay bail at this point, but the bail amount would based on what the arrest was for, and can quite easily be extremely high. In my case the bail was set to $100,000. If you pay for the bail, the armament will be scheduled further out from when you were arrested, if you do not pay the bail then you are supposed to be brought to an armament within 7 days.
3) During your armament you are charged with a crime and you can plead. In my case the judge looked at the arrest, laughed, then charged me with battery, I pleaded guilty and paid the $500 fine. (Having a lawyer also helps greatly in the US)
In the case of this lady, she was either lost in the system to intentionally left in jail. Either way, she has a very solid case at small claims court, and can get a fair chunk of cash from the state for this mistreatment. In Georgia the small claims amount limit is $15,000 and I would encourage her to utilize whatever limit there is for this. - VolatileWhimsy, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2I bet there is more that they are conveniently not telling...
But being the intelligent person, I'll withhold opnion till I see the facts one way or another instead of blindly believing some yellow journalist........... -
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