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321 Comments
- mollydog12, on 10/24/2009, -41/+156here we go. what extraordinary powers will be invoked in the name of this emergency ?
- iletumi, on 10/24/2009, -15/+84"In the United States, on average 5% to 20% of the population gets seasonal influenza; more than 200,000 people are hospitalized from seasonal flu-related complications, and; about 36,000 people die from seasonal flu-related causes."
Let me know when H1N1 is even close to being as destructive. - bossm4n, on 10/24/2009, -6/+70This is just a drill for the great Zombie Apocalypse.
- dkapuchino, on 10/24/2009, -23/+72I'm not to big on the conspiracy theories, but I'd like to share a personal anecdote.
During the outbreak of Swine Flu in Mexico, I was in Mexico City. One day everything's normal - the next day the schools are closed, the streets are filled with people with surgical masks (Got some great pictures), and I had to use my hotel's concierge in order to locate a surgical mask - since all the pharmacies were out.
2 Days later, I took a flight back home, with a week's vacation in Manhattan. Leaving the Airport in Mexico city, we had to fill out health forms. Signs everywhere instructed us how to protect ourselves.
At that time - Swine flu was something scary. It was unknown. It was new. Much to my surprise - not a single official in JFK even bothered to ask me if I felt okay.
A small but simple protective measure - "Are you feeling well?"
From there, I continued on to a packed subway. From the subway - to my NY Hostel (Where I bunked with 10 other people in the same room). I was healthy, but some of the people coming out of Mexico weren't. Sure enough - a few days later, Swine Flu hit NY as well. In a school in queens - an entire class was infected. Then a baby died.
One would expect that alone would hike up preventative measures. A week later, I flew home to my home country. Again - not a single "are you feeling well" in JFK. Back home, they were a little bit more prepared. They actually suggested anyone that was in Mexico in the past 7 days kindly approach an Airport doctor to get a checkup. It was 9 days since I left Mexico, but being that I just came back from both swine flu epicenters, I hopped over to the doctors. They refused to test me. "9 days since Mexico? forget it... NY? that's not on our list".
Half a year later, Governments are putting us under "States of national emergency". In china, you actually have to fill in an H1N1 form before you board any intercity bus. Every passenger gets his temperature physically read at the airports.
And don't forget the budgets - they just have to have more money!
If I were the type of person to believe that governments actually thrive from states of emergency, I'd think all of this was done on purpose. I can understand those that find these stories supportive to their ideas. They could have restricted some of my liberties by suggesting I tell them if I feel okay or not. Instead, they waited. Now, they can restrict my liberties much more. It's an emergency! - inactive, on 10/24/2009, -20/+67I think we need a colored chart of some kind that tells us the severity of a national emergency.
100 children die = national emergency?
Car accidents kill ~1000 Americans per week... ~126 American war veterans commit suicide each week, but we don't declare those national emergencies, do we?
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboa ... - humptyz, on 10/24/2009, -20/+64This swine flu scare is getting a bit ridiculous. Someone at my last job got the swine flu, her and two of her daughters, they were only out for 3 days. Watched a 60 Minutes report this Sunday where they profiled a teenager that had it and was in the hospital. That's sad, true, but the football team he played on, the opposing team, and all the cheerleaders got it as well; all of them were fine after a week. Swine flu is killing people but it is not some horrible disease, not like malaria or something. Scare mongering at its finest.
- tzvika613, on 10/24/2009, -10/+49Regarding your last paragraph - “Government is not in the business of producing results. Government is in the business of producing government: passing laws, changing rules, setting up bureaucracies. This is why government is always more interested in problems than solutions. A good problem lets congressmen get news coverage for introducing high-minded and noble-sounding legislation, provides the EPA with justification for an expanded budget, and gives Al Gore a campaign speech.” (P.J. O’Rourke, All the Trouble in the World)
- dkapuchino, on 10/24/2009, -32/+70I think the left had a term for this...
"Fear-mongering" - reed311, on 10/24/2009, -19/+55Holy *****, I literally just had the government knock on my door and confiscate my guns! Beware people. I hear that Obama is sending out a survey team on Monday to identify all conservatives and then he will quietly usher them off to the FEMA camps that he has secretly been building near the Mexican border. These are crazy times I tell you.
Dugg for the comments. The Internet has been the greatest resource in the history of mankind for a small group of delusional people to get together and make themselves even more delusional. - cajungal, on 10/24/2009, -17/+50You read my mind!
- inactive, on 10/24/2009, -17/+49YESSSSSSSSSSSSSSS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Martial Law! Kill off the weak! Instill National Service!!!!!!!
Oh yeah!
(being sarcastic, of course). - bettverboten, on 10/24/2009, -53/+82Here we gooooooooooooooooooooooooooo....
We have to have Obamacare/control..now...right now..
this is a crisis and we have to pass this now..right now!
That is how these things seem to work best for this administration. - le0pardess, on 10/24/2009, -23/+50Yesterday it was a concern, and today H1N1 is a hellbent National Emergency with 100 supposed deaths? Wtf? Overnight we are all facing swine flu doom? The plague! The plague! Quick! Get your masks, hand sanitizers and quarantine yourselves! There's gonna be mass panic because of a vaccine shortage! Martial law to be declared! Surrender your freedom!! Hide yourselves from society!!! (and don't forget the proper etiquette of sneezing on the inside of your elbow...)
http://www.fas.org/sgp/crs/natsec/98-505.pdf - BillE3, on 10/24/2009, -13/+36That is unless they are ones crying wolf. Then it is a national emergency.
- Billistic, on 10/24/2009, -9/+32Oh by the way, I was watching the news and they were announcing:
"SHORTAGE ON SWINE FLU VACCINES"
I said to my friend, hey they're trying to play this like a game console launch, they tell people there's a shortage and that makes people line up for it which makes news crews report on it even more and makes more people want it.
Now I turn CNN on and what do I see? People lining up to GET THEIR DAMN FLU VACCINE. - quirkopatra, on 10/24/2009, -3/+24Ok, I hope my comment will be different and add something meaningful to the discussion.
I have been sick for over two weeks now with something I cannot shake off. A couple of days ago I started feeling better and I think I'm over the hump. That's the thing. If you get it, you down the liquids, you take the OTC medicines, and you eat despite no appetite...oh, and a vitamin every day.
When I got it, I basically knew it was going to be a matter of common sense treatment...and yeah, you can't go out and spread it. You just have to hunker down and ride it out unless you get chest pain or difficulty breathing or a high uncontrollable fever.
The panic is part of the problem. I worked in an er for five years. Anytime the news covered an outbreak of whatever, whooping cough to mumps...people began to flock into the ER thinking they had whatever it was.
So far, this flu doesn't seem to, in terms of fatalities, merit the panic that is being generated.
Still people will flock to er's with the flu. If it begins to get overwhelming, it is not a BAD IDEA to allow hospitals to set up flu-treatment areas separate from the regular ER...as is discussed in this article. The treatment can be speedier and there won't be as many flu-ridden people around other er patients who are already compromised.
In short, what is described in the article is a good idea, IMO.
And it is the responsibility of healthy people who get sick, frankly, to suck it up until they get better and not go around spreading it to everyone else.
You are lucky if you have a boss that'll trust your judgement. Others might be required to get Dr.s excuses....
It might be a good idea if employers relax the rules a bit right now. - BillE3, on 10/24/2009, -7/+28It possibly could be partially due to intentional actions. I think another huge factor involved in your scenario is how government does not know what the right hand nor the left hand are doing. Government also finds it impossible to coordinate both hands to find its own collective butt.
- bettverboten, on 10/24/2009, -14/+35I guess I was writing my comment
(didn't see yours) when you were posting yours
they basically say the same thing...funny how great minds think alike. - BillE3, on 10/24/2009, -4/+23That is always the best question. Follow the money it will lead to lots of unasked questions.
- dkapuchino, on 10/24/2009, -9/+27Everybody run, the flu is going to kill us all! Oh noes!
- dkapuchino, on 10/24/2009, -12/+30Hence, the absurdity of suddenly calling this an Emergency.
People get the ***** flu. Some people die. OMG! Please take away my liberties so you can protect me from the evil viruses! - Qumahlin, on 10/24/2009, -13/+30How many children typically die from the normal flu...I don't understand how doctors and scientists are letting this BS happen, everything is within normal levels, this is no worse than any other seasonal flu...
- dkapuchino, on 10/24/2009, -6/+23Most of the people dying from swine flu are also "compromised" patients.
The first patient to die in the US was a baby.
Most people that died in my country from swine flu were high risk patients.
You're just reciting a myth that they've stuck onto swine flu during the first outbreaks - creating much more alarm and panic than actually necessary. - dkapuchino, on 10/24/2009, -5/+21Obviously.
The CDC's budget is over $9B. All I could ask myself then was - where is all that money going? - FitteMas, on 10/24/2009, -13/+28Alex Joneses ratings will rise now. thats for sure.
- dkapuchino, on 10/24/2009, -14/+29Any sound mind thinks so right now.
For half a year they've been helpless on swine flu, allowing it to pretty much spread freely. Creating panic, all the while doing nothing about it. Now its some kind of an emergency. - rocknog, on 10/24/2009, -10/+25Thus proving that the left and the right are two sides of the same coin, and both sides can go ***** themselves.
- jd75, on 10/24/2009, -9/+22100 child deaths from swine flu is high. In 2007, there were about 70 child deaths from the flu. In 2006, there were about 50.
http://www.cdc.gov/flu/weekly/weeklyarchives2007-2 ...
Sure, 1000 deaths overall (children and adults) is a drop in the bucket compared to deaths at the hands of ***** drivers, but a doubled rate is concerning.
But then so is the fact that they might now set up extra emergency rooms to handle the flu! Oh my freedoms! Oh what a world what a world! - bossm4n, on 10/24/2009, -4/+17Remain calm, all is well. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zDAmPIq29ro
- dkapuchino, on 10/24/2009, -4/+17But still not a cause for national emergency.
- x713, on 10/24/2009, -10/+23Are you guys seriously getting all conspiracy theorist about this? They call national emergencies almost all the time for different things and it usually is only about getting around restrictions in government bureaucracy to have more money, supplies, equipment, personnel, etc. available to easily manage pending problems. Yes this flu is not doing much damage now as others, but pretty much the only reason for this was that they were not expecting this flu and are unprepared to help the old and young. People will die because nobody was prepared but most will live on fine just like any other flu even though this one is a stronger strain.
- CoreyFC, on 10/24/2009, -8/+21*yawn*...
- Billistic, on 10/24/2009, -7/+19Ok I just researched that the government ***** up the first swine flu vaccine.
All done. - gozroth, on 10/24/2009, -5/+16It's not hard with the patriot act and all.
- dukeeeey, on 10/24/2009, -4/+15fear mongering leads to amazing profits :D
- dizilbdog, on 10/24/2009, -9/+20Glenn Beck's head just exploded.
- mheyk, on 10/24/2009, -9/+19Sooooo when are the top CEOs getting their pay cut by 90%....or was I supposed to fall for this distraction?
- Thuktun, on 10/24/2009, -5/+14Never attribute to malice what can adequately be explained by incompetence.
- Mujokan, on 10/25/2009, -0/+9Why not just google it, it's not a secret.
"Instead, by declaring a national emergency, the White House will allow hospitals and governments on the local level to more rapidly prepare triage sites and procedures to handle any future surge in sick patients. A hospital in danger of being overrun by H1N1 patients would be allowed to segregate them in a separate site for treatment, which might slow the spread of the disease." -- Time magazine - factotum218, on 10/24/2009, -7/+16I already went though the H1N1 fiasco. Or as my Dr. said "congrats, your another notch on the bed-post".
In a nutshell I had fever, aches, all kinds of things shooting out of both ends...you know, the flu!
Get over it. You'll live. - Azathothh, on 10/24/2009, -5/+13hide!
- Jordan117, on 10/25/2009, -4/+12You're totally right, mollydog, this is a tyrannical power grab:
"Health and Human Services Secretary Kathleen Sebelius now has authority to bypass federal rules when opening alternative care sites, such as offsite hospital centers at schools or community centers if hospitals seek permission."
zomg, offsite emergency rooms = FEMA camps! ALERT THE MILITIA. - dkapuchino, on 10/24/2009, -9/+17The stupid people aren't here right now. They're lining up to get their swine flu shots, because someone convinced them this strain of flu is any different than the flu they've been dealing with their entire lives.
- Necromancyr, on 10/25/2009, -3/+11This was only done so that an EUA (Emergency Use Authorization) could be utilized to make new drugs available in case of mass outbreak due to inability to vaccinate (due to limited supplies or the stupidity of people).
Basically, in times of an emergency like this (which this is - anything that has double the lethality rate of the normal seasonal influenza virus this short of a period of time into the season has some seriously bad potential) the FDA can approve a drug for use (in this case, an antiviral drug) in certain cases. This would most likely be in cases where a person infected with H1N1 takes a turn for the worse and is going to die and Tamiflu isn't working. The drug that I know was temporarily approved is a similar drug, that works a different way than Tamiflu providing a secondary possibility to save people that are non-responsive.
This is one case where you need to, you know, get educated on something before making completely off base comments. Ask people who know about influenza, virology, etc. - quirkopatra, on 10/24/2009, -3/+11You know what would actually be a national emergency?
IF YOU REALLY COULD GET IT FROM EATING BACON! - Mujokan, on 10/25/2009, -1/+9No they aren't. "Emergency" isn't defined as "what mollydogg12 thinks is scary". It's basically a bureaucratic term that means they have to act quickly.
You can say they don't have to act quickly, but that is just your opinion as a random internet poster, not an obvious fact. - NoLibertarians, on 10/25/2009, -1/+9No, I mean put in place and fast track anything needed to squelch a pandemic. Successful people act, losers react!
- Billistic, on 10/24/2009, -5/+12Well it's because the government has shown time and again they can't do anything properly.
I mean even with regards to 9/11, the war in Iraq and Katrina, you trust the same guys who ***** up those deals to actually inject you with something. By they way they also ***** up the original swine flu vaccine.
Your comment reminds me of this:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CMqYlnAiIUU - freakFlag, on 10/25/2009, -2/+9My wife, 16 month old son and myself have already had it and we survived. Nobody has died around here from it. The people who are worse off are those who are not proactive in getting themselves better, take a day off, get some medicine, have some soup and relax.
- eir574, on 10/25/2009, -1/+8"the flu comes every year. people get sick. some die. this year won't be any different,"
Wow, you're able to tell that no more people will get sick and die than in previous years? That's surprising, as infection rates (and therefore the number of deaths) seem higher than for previous seasons. We could wait until the flu season is over and decide that maybe we should have done something about it, or we can look at early trends and say that we need to act quickly to prevent a worst case scenario.
You probably think people were crybabies in 1918 for being a wee bit upset that people were dying from the flue, right? -
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