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Guantanamo Judge Defies Obama

latimes.com — Army Col. James L. Pohl rejects the president's request to stop proceedings at the military tribunal. He says the proposal is 'not reasonable.'

Who dugg this? Made popular Feb 1, 2009

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  • maximilen, on 01/31/2009, -20/+526President's "request"... As soon as that request turns into an order (from the commander-in-chief), he won't have a whole hell of a lot of choice.
  • bsmang, on 02/01/2009, -18/+246Sounds like a judge who thought Bush was just peachy.
  • jstohler, on 02/01/2009, -15/+204Talking out of turn... that's a paddling. Looking out the window... that's a paddling. Disobeying the President of the United States? You best believe that's a paddling.
  • mhuggins, on 02/01/2009, -10/+163"Guantanamo Judge Defies Obama"

    Actually it's not defiance at all since it was a request, not an order. If he doesn't do it once Obama makes it an order, then we can call it defiance.
  • seanieb, on 02/01/2009, -18/+113People need to stop watch 24 and go read a book or a news paper.
  • HookmasterCH47, on 01/31/2009, -6/+95Right, because we have to be just as bad as the extremists that we're fighting to win. I'm just curious what our nation's soul is worth.
  • inkswamp, on 02/01/2009, -14/+99Except it's Obama we're talking about, not Bush. Obama will probably contact the judge to find out why he chose to refuse and hear the guy out--you know, like a real leader who listens to people instead of pretending to listen and then pushing forward with an agenda anyway. The only way you'll see an executive order is if Obama disagrees strongly enough with whatever rationale this judge offers him.
  • MacEnvy, on 02/01/2009, -3/+87Wrong.

    "Section 2. The President shall be commander in chief of the Army and Navy of the United States, and of the militia of the several states, when called into the actual service of the United States"

    They are currently in service of the United States, stationed at Guantanamo, and President Obama is their CiC.
  • mrcoderga, on 02/01/2009, -29/+111PROSECUTE TORTURE
  • obliviousfool, on 02/01/2009, -12/+84Running a prison where you keep people well out of the reach of due process isn't very reasonable either!
  • Dipsomaniac, on 02/01/2009, -5/+68btschul, you're not advocating terrorists. You're advocating torturing people who are *suspected* of terrorism, meaning that you're basically a sociopath.

    Torture doesn't work. Stop masturbating at the thought of it. Shut up, too.
  • gamersedge, on 02/01/2009, -4/+63I can imagine the argument:

    Obama: You're out of order!
    Pohl: THE WHOLE SYSTEM IS OUT OF ORDER.
  • tHr333, on 02/01/2009, -12/+69SOMEBODY gonna get hurt REEEEEEEEEALLLL bad.
  • inkswamp, on 02/01/2009, -3/+57I love how people are popping out of the woodwork to point these kinds of things out now that Bush is gone. Suddenly, we're back to playing by the rules.
  • emkaysmith, on 02/01/2009, -8/+52Actually, dxjester, I'm a combat veteran (VN), my father and grandfather were both career army officers, I grew up largely overseas on military installations during the '50s, and one of my sons just separated as a MSgt after 15 years in the army. The last part of my own enlistment, I clerked in the JAG office at Fort Sam, because I could type. And my graduate work is mostly in military history.

    Also, now that I'm retired after 35 years in civil service, I edit a learned journal, and I've been freelance editing and indexing books for commercial publishers for a couple of decades.

    You apparently don't understand or recognize the concept of colloquial grammatical construction -- nor, it's obvious, do you understand the proper use of punctuation.

  • inkswamp, on 02/01/2009, -1/+43No, but I've seen "Seven Days in Mary." Probably a much different film though.
  • inactive, on 02/01/2009, -12/+51"neutered feminized?" You're a chauvinistic warmongering jarhead pig!
  • NSResponder, on 02/01/2009, -4/+39To be precise, disobeying orders is mutiny, not treason. Treason has a very specific definition in our constitution.

    -jcr
  • DJWilsonX, on 02/01/2009, -6/+40this is exactly like when Picard requested that Worf donate his organs to help save the Romulan. When Worf refused, Picard made it an order.
  • fluffyturtle, on 02/01/2009, -0/+32First of all Captain Picard requested that Worf donate blood.

    Second of all Worf refused and the Captain didn't order him to do anything.
  • madmanz123, on 02/01/2009, -9/+40Not really, I don't see a lot of people here who love to see us bypass fair trails and a public process.
  • emkaysmith, on 02/01/2009, -3/+34"Sorry but, President Obama is not commander in Chief unless at war declared by congress. "

    Oh? In that case, the last "Commander in Chief" we had was FDR.
  • BasharTeg, on 02/01/2009, -2/+32Hey dumbasses, you realize the military, including its judiciary, aren't part of the judicial branch right?

    And to have a republican talk ***** about obeying the LAW after we just suffered through 8 years of the laws of this nation being destroyed by your party's president, it just takes hypocricy to a whole new level.
  • JoeVet, on 02/01/2009, -1/+29As an army soldier, what you advocate puts me and my men in danger. When you approve the use of torture you are also approving the torture of American soldiers by the enemy. When you remove morality from our actions, we are no longer any different from the terrorists. You have in fact become a terrorist and an enemy to the United States.
  • inactive, on 02/01/2009, -5/+32So you really believe that through torture you always get the truth?
    It's proven that more than 80% of the time the victim can't even rationalize enough to give a consistent answer, and when they can't, they will lie just to get out of the situation.

    Explain to me why extreme pain/fear = truth extraction? Maybe I'm missing something in your logic...
  • TonyLocNE, on 02/01/2009, -1/+28Evidently this was the Colonel's rebuttal to Obama's request:

    "I run my unit how I run my unit. You want to investigate me, roll the dice and take your chances. I eat breakfast 300 yards from 4000 Cubans who are trained to kill me, so don't think for one second that you can come down here, flash a badge, and make me nervous."
  • Nintendesert, on 02/01/2009, -2/+28The President is that little Col's boss. And nowhere does it state that is only the case in a declared war.
  • inactive, on 02/01/2009, -2/+26I do hope you're not an American, griffeycom. If you are, then you are unbelievably ignorant.
  • FKnight, on 02/01/2009, -3/+26No it doesn't. The article says that it was a request right now, but if Obama made it an order, the discretion disappears.
  • paidhima, on 02/01/2009, -0/+22...somebody. I'm not gonna say who. But I think you might know him very well!

  • oboshoe, on 02/01/2009, -10/+30Notwithstanding Obama's order to stop the trials.

    WTF is wrong with having a trial for these prisoners?

    Isn't that the chief complaint? That they are not receiving a trial and are just being held and tortured?

    Now we have a judge who is insisting on having a trial and people are freaking out.


  • Dumbledorito, on 02/01/2009, -7/+27If someone is defying illegal orders, that's an honorable act.

    If someone is doing something illegal, and announces he won't stop, then he's not an honorable person.
  • duggdowncatisad, on 02/01/2009, -8/+27Damn activist judges. They're supposed to do what the president tells them to do. At least that's what my Republican friends were telling me a couple years ago.
  • ardembiniwoot, on 02/01/2009, -7/+25for those who make jokes about this go watch Taxi to the Dark Side
  • asgardshill, on 02/01/2009, -0/+18But does it have a happy ending?
  • slugpellet63, on 02/01/2009, -4/+21Ever seen "Seven Days in May"!!?
  • UltraDavid, on 02/01/2009, -17/+34He has to be fired immediately, of course.
  • emkaysmith, on 02/01/2009, -5/+22In which case, he should either shut up and do what he's told, or retire. And making such a statement in public shows a high level of stupid.
  • Nboy514, on 02/01/2009, -0/+17Has a better ending
  • AmandaQ, on 02/01/2009, -0/+17snnnnnap.
  • Claverhouse, on 02/01/2009, -3/+19It is equally bad to torture evil people as it is to torture decent people. Innocence has nothing to do with anything.

    Advocating torture for any reason is the sophistry of weaklings.
  • colincornaby, on 02/01/2009, -4/+20It's a MILITARY trial, therefore it's not being executed by the judicial branch, but the executive branch, meaning it falls directly under the control of the President.
  • inactive, on 02/01/2009, -5/+21What war? You know that the war was over in 2003 right, and that this is just a policing of another country, right?
  • SarcasticGenius, on 02/01/2009, -2/+18You obviously hadn't read the article nor served in the military. You are 100% incorrect.
  • Target91, on 02/01/2009, -2/+18Obama wants them to have a civilian trial. Not a military trial.
  • gwolf, on 02/01/2009, -5/+20I would say the Colonel stands a good chance of becomeing a 2nd LT. by the end of the week. The concept of a "suggestion" has an entirely different meaning in the military.
    Means "Now!".
  • burketo, on 02/01/2009, -1/+16ZING!
  • spyd3rweb, on 02/01/2009, -6/+21Putting signatures in every single one of your comments is treasonous.
  • Coven, on 02/01/2009, -4/+19btschul, it is bad because innocent people are being tortured as well.
  • Anachronus, on 02/01/2009, -17/+31Your right. If this was Bush as president all the diggers would be singing the man's praises.
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