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229 Comments
- PSWTyrant, on 12/12/2007, -5/+88Everyone who says it's not torture should try it at least twice just be sure they understand it fully. Everyone involved in this has broken the law and tarnished our country's credibility. Impeach now!
- hawkeye17, on 12/12/2007, -7/+76This man is a disgrace to all the veterans of past wars who fought and died to protect the ideals of this country. Ideals that do NOT include the use of torture. WTF is happening to America? Every time we stoop to the terrorists level and use torture, the terrorists win.
- phnx0221, on 12/12/2007, -6/+74The legal adviser at Guantanamo Bay is "not equipped to answer that question"?
Taken straight out of the play book I see. I wonder, if instead of a hypothetical, if it were truly the case, if he would still be "unequipped to answer that question'? Or, do you think he, and the Bush administration, would immediate lambast the Iranian government for using torture against a prisoner of war? That they would cry foul, quoting the very Geneva Conventions they themselves have called "quaint and obsolete"?
How difficult is it to say whether or not a technique that is used is torturous or not? I mean really, the lives and mental well being of people are at stake, and because of politics, you can not say what is or isn't?
I wonder what it must be like to look someone who has suffered by the hands of torture, square in the eye, and tell them that it wasn't so, or that you don't know whether or not it was so, so you went ahead and decided to do it anyway?
Oh right, he doesn't have to deal with that. He's the lawyer in the office, who doesn't have to look these people in the eye, hear their screams, and see another human being go through a terror that he will never have to face. - moulin1, on 12/12/2007, -3/+44Many American servicemen and civilians alike, have suffered the pain, indignity and crippling effects of torture at the hands of foreign governments and organizations. Nazi Germany, Imperial Japan, North Korea, North Viet Nam, and any number of middle eastern political groups. Now the US stands accused of torture. But there is one major difference between these nations and groups and the US. None of them ever justified or endorsed torture. None attempted to rationalize torture with their ideology. None ever attempted to codify torture into law. Not even Saddam Hussein. It was always a dirty secret to be hidden and denied. The US has broken new ground by bringing torture into its mainstream ideology.
- IrishJoe, on 12/12/2007, -7/+42It used to be that my country, the United States of America, prided itself on being the most honorable nation on earth never lowering itself to level of our most desperate enemies. Now if we do whatever Iran, a theocracy run by religious nuts, does it's fine. I guess ever since my once proud nation got taken over by religious nuts, they've been modeling themselves on other dictatorial theocracies. I hope one day, we, the American people, will take our country back from the theocrats.
- unfilterthought, on 12/12/2007, -2/+31Why don't we subject him to some waterboarding?
Then he will be properly equipped to answer the question.
Nothing like first-hand experience.
Any person who dares say its not torture should be only able to say that after being waterboarded. - yakimushi, on 12/12/2007, -4/+30"I’m not equipped to answer that question." So... he was born without a soul? A conscience? A brain?
What does someone need to be equippped with to understand that waterboarding is torture? - aliashandle, on 12/12/2007, -3/+22Iranians also arrest and execute homosexuals. Why are we even looking to Iran for affirmation. We're the ***** United States of America. I thought we looked to no one. I thought we were the beacon of freedom that shines upon this earth and guides the rest of the world on how to behave as a sovereign nation. Or is that only for convenience.
- tehseanzor, on 12/12/2007, -0/+19when he says he's "not equipped to answer that question" what he's really saying is "I don't have a very good lie or excuse right now. I know it's torture but I can't say it is because that would make us (Gitmo) bad."
One way or another they look bad but they look worse when they try to lie. Soon they will have to lie that they lied and it will go on an on until they confess or die - VeryBoredNow, on 12/12/2007, -2/+20I think we're missing the basic concept of a CIVILIZED democracy with laws here. What I am trying to say has been said by Ghandi in a popular quote "an eye for an eye will make the whole world blind", if we keep sinking to the level of the people we're trying to protect ourselves from then we are no better than them. On the other hand it creates a vicious cycle out of which there is no return unless everything boils over.
- lnxfi, on 12/12/2007, -1/+18I tried to use that argument once when I was 5 when I did something wrong. My mom smacked the crap out of me for it.
Someone needs to teach government a lesson. I vote for my mom to do it. - pintomp3, on 12/12/2007, -1/+15did you have it done to you by someone who assumed you were a terrorist?
- Talphin, on 12/12/2007, -1/+15WOW This planet is *****
- rosullivan, on 12/12/2007, -2/+14Hartmann can take his "hypotheticals" and shove 'em up his ass. ***** him and his "hypotheticals". Waterboarding IS torture, like it or not. Let's do it to him and see how he likes it... would THAT be fair?
- stealthmoe, on 12/12/2007, -2/+14Ron Paul: Torture is Terror
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XQCtn2jVwkQ - moulin1, on 12/12/2007, -11/+22I agree absolutely. You should be waterboarded.
- source1984, on 12/12/2007, -2/+13CLEARLY, waterboarding when you know its waterboarding training is VERY DIFFERENT from waterboarding when you don't know its waterboarding (as a prisoner). Do some thinking.
- phnx0221, on 12/12/2007, -1/+11Being subjected to a torturous technique in a controlled environment is drastically different than being subjected to that same technique in an uncontrolled environment. When journalists, military personnel in training, or any curious person undergoes this in controlled conditions, they know that the person in control of them is not going to kill them. They know that it will be over soon. They know that the person in control over their life will simulate drowning only long enough for you to understand what it is like.
When a person is in confinement, held captive by people who do not understand or speak their language, don't know their culture, don't know anything about them, other than the fact that they assume that person is a terrorist, it is surely, a drastically different experience. The person being held, doesn't know that their captors aren't going to kill them, they don't know that there is an end to it, they don't know anything other than they are being held, and being tortured. Many times, these people don't even know WHY they are being held in the first place.
That is certainly a different scenario, which is why they do it in the first place. It's a psychological and physical terror that is put upon a person in captivity, in order to garner information out of a suspect who will tell you anything to make it stop. - Herostratus, on 12/12/2007, -5/+15NO man, just for ***** and giggles. Youll be famous on You Tube.
- valkyries, on 12/12/2007, -0/+10pliers should stay more then 10 feet from my finger nails
- EarlOfLade, on 12/12/2007, -0/+9Any official who feel they are not able to decide should be waterboarded so they have a firm basis to form an opinion on.
- Frei, on 12/12/2007, -2/+11Considering the US has prosecuted people in the past for using this torture technique, I think it's safe to say that no one will call it what it is for the real possibility of there being severe consequences for those who performed and/or approved the torture.
And what's with the 5th grade excuse here? I can just see someone saying to this guy, "If Iran jumped off a bridge would you?" - Swift2, on 12/12/2007, -1/+10They're given a sample of what an enemy might do, just like they're exposed to tear gas and all the rest, so they can train getting their gas masks on quickly when they're tearing up and having trouble breathing. That is completely different. The program that Navy SEALS went through, developed for training only, was called SERE, and the head instructor in the program was appalled to see those techniques being adopted as our torturer's manual.
- kooft, on 12/12/2007, -4/+13EditorResponse, most of us believe that torture is a tactic that morally questionable regimes use. We don't think it's okay if Iraq or Iran tortures, but we expect them to because they don't subscribe to American standards and values. When America tortures we speak out about it because we're Americans and are proud of the fact that we're the morally correct voice of reason in the world. We don't want to be viewed as a 1st-world Iran.
And somehow that patriotism makes me socialist, communist, Marxist and anti-American? - pintomp3, on 12/12/2007, -0/+8the fact that we even call it waterboarding means that the war-mongers have won. waterboard is the device, the act is controlled drowning. by calling it waterboarding, they win the game of semantics and get to frame the argument. this is the case with the "war on terror" and "war on drugs" to "collateral damage" and "axis of evil".
- THE4IRON, on 12/12/2007, -1/+9In other news, a redneck lawyer says inbreeding isn't a bad idea either...
- radink360, on 12/12/2007, -4/+12Iran does it? So now we like Iran and we do what they do? D.C. is full of asshats!
- VeryBoredNow, on 12/12/2007, -1/+8yea , cause we want to be just like the nazis! right?! ... rightttt
- blake_mooney, on 12/12/2007, -1/+8Yes, it sure is. We now torture prisoners and say it's not torture. How ***** immature is that ***** sucker to say "Iran does it!". He sounds like a ***** 6 year old.
- NCSUspoon, on 12/12/2007, -0/+7The worst way to think about torture is to measure yourself up to what other people are doing. By that logic, concentration camps are not torture - the North Koreans do it, Thumb screws are not torture - they use it in Afganistan and former Iraq. The objective with anti-torture laws is to be better than those who use it, by not stooping down to their level. Can't understand why that is so hard to grasp for some people.
- BR3DDY, on 12/12/2007, -0/+7This is too frustrating. I'm just thinking out loud but...
It seems that in order to remedy the " I cannot recall", "I don't recollect", "I cannot remember", "I am not equip" etc. flood of answers that have hindered these federal investigation recently, we need some sort of rule that says "Using any of these statements is not a means to omit a question you are obligated to answer to the best of your knowledge and should be able to" with serious actions.
People need to be held accountable and something needs to be done when they willingly cover their asses. - source1984, on 12/12/2007, -0/+6why u think they want you dead? just for kicks?
- kooft, on 12/12/2007, -0/+6I've been here voicing my opinion on Digg. Just because I don't believe in 'bomb first, verify the intelligence later' doesn't mean I hate America. I just can't get behind a morally hypocritical foreign policy.
- netdance, on 12/12/2007, -0/+6it's also over in less than 15 seconds.
Several SERE instructors have publicly said it's toture if used in a real prison setting. - pintomp3, on 12/12/2007, -1/+7our new stance on terrorism has become "if you can't beat'em, join'em" we cannot claim to uphold a higher moral standard while at the same time doing things that the "enemy" does.
- inactive, on 12/12/2007, -1/+7And the Spanish Inquisition did it, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Waterboarding#Spanish ...
- faskippy, on 12/12/2007, -1/+7But, but, we don't torture. Our President says so.
- arghargh, on 12/12/2007, -0/+5Who know who else was a nazi? HITLER..
- brianary, on 12/12/2007, -0/+5@dcorey07:
TORTURE ISN'T RELIABLE. - brianary, on 12/12/2007, -1/+6You don't even know what socialism or Marxism or communism is, you halfwit.
- inactive, on 12/12/2007, -3/+8There's nothing wrong with smokin pot mom! C'mon! Everyones doin it!!
- amigabill, on 12/12/2007, -0/+5Then Brigadier General Thomas W. Hartmann shouldn't mind if someone does it to him. I think it'd be interesting if anyone in positions to make decisions on using various methods of interrogation should be required to go through it a few times him or herself before that decision authority is granted to them. This should include those carryoing out the interrogations and using those methods, even if they aren't in a position to decide anything, they should at least truely know what they're doing to another human being. Perhaps that whole chain of authority choosing to do something down to the guy doing it should have to experience the same method themselves each and every time it is used. You choose to waterboard someone, you have to be waterboarded yourself. That could help discourage using extreme methods without careful consideration. Especially for things that these guys tell us are not torture, it can't be that bad so why not?
- kooft, on 12/12/2007, -0/+5"I think it'd be interesting if anyone in positions to make decisions on using various methods of interrogation should be required to go through it a few times him or herself before that decision authority is granted to them."
Daniel Levin, former Assistant Attorney General, decided to undergo waterboarding to gain an appreciation for the technique while he was analyzing torture. Here's a quote from the ABC article it:
"After the experience, Levin told White House officials that even though he knew he wouldn't die, he found the experience terrifying and thought that it clearly simulated drowning.
Levin, who refused to comment for this story, concluded waterboarding could be illegal torture unless performed in a highly limited way and with close supervision. And, sources told ABC News, he believed the Bush Administration had failed to offer clear guidelines for its use. "
http://www.abcnews.go.com/WN/DOJ/story?id=3814076& ... - wil2200, on 12/12/2007, -2/+7the US continues to slide down into a the well of barbarism
- phnx0221, on 12/12/2007, -0/+5How many hundreds of thousands of people have been killed in Iraq as a direct result from our war and occupation? How much value can you place upon the infrastructure of an entire country that has been destroyed? How many millions of people are now displaced as refugees? While I'm not condoning the loss of innocent life here in America, I can certainly tell you that those numbers are far greater than 3,000.
- netdance, on 12/12/2007, -0/+5Actually, the Nazis called it engaged interrogation - just like we do.
- valkyries, on 12/12/2007, -3/+8id take that over a big knife and you being video taped
- inactive, on 12/12/2007, -0/+5I say that if they give any more than ONE of that slew of answers in a single session, they need to have full psychiatric evaluations and brain scans...especially checking for instances of Alzheimer's Disease. If they're mentally and physically fit and they evade questions, they should be fired and then prosecuted for felony perjury. If they're mentally or physically deficient, they should be removed from office and sent to a nice convalescent home so they can babble in peace. Period.
- n8glenn, on 12/12/2007, -1/+5It is truly disgusting to me to see so many people on this thread advocating torture and all sorts of brutality. You people are damned. You are lost souls. How are you any different than nazis? How in the world can you call yourselves christian, or american, when you advocate savagery? Sure, the "terrorists" would torture you if they had the chance, so now you want to be like them? Sure, some people out there are your enemies, but jesus said to love your enemy as you do yourself. Get it straight, america is supposed to be better than that, christians are not supposed to act like terrorists! And perhaps most importantly, torture does not work! It gives you absolutely nothing valuable and puts our soldiers at risk in so many ways. It is only used by tyrannical regimes to intimidate the populace, and it could be used on you eventually if you continue to support it.
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