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141 Comments
- InfamousAtheist, on 10/12/2007, -13/+62It's about time they decided to attack something that's actually evil.
- aldente, on 10/12/2007, -1/+42Remember, the President works for us, not the other way around.
- d00ley, on 10/12/2007, -5/+43I disagree that he deserves respect simply by occupying the office of the president. That attitude is more appropriate for the subject of a king. If the person holding the office is deserving of respect, he will get it. If he is not deserving of respect, he should not get respect.
- inactive, on 10/12/2007, -7/+37Wow, even Bush's strongest supporters are starting to realize he's out of control.
- TGMD, on 10/12/2007, -1/+30Hey I'm an atheist but some things just transcend religous beliefs
Torture is one of them
(murder is another)
There are very few true evils in this world that almost all humans can agree on, but when we do it's a great thing. - krinthekuz, on 09/16/2008, -3/+28dude: http://www.souptree.net/blog/images/rabbit_pancake.gif
- StingerMS, on 10/12/2007, -2/+26I'm a Christian and I have a bunch of atheist/islamic/buddhist friends, and we get along just fine. Religion is one thing, but friendship is another. It's sad when people attack Christians because of what some "Christians" do.
- mistshadow2k4, on 10/12/2007, -4/+26No, whether you believe it or not, quite a number of them never were for torture at all.
I live in the Bible Belt and many, many church-going Christians can't talk about anything but how much they disagree with what the Bush administration has done; lots of people hereabouts are not shy in denouncing Bush as nothing less than evil. When the reports about torture starting coming in, most of the Christians I know didn't agree with it one bit. I hear it every day; you can't go the grocery store or eat at a restaurant without hearing at least a small group of people discussing all this.
I often don't agree with the fundies either (and I'm not a church-goer at all), but it's pure bigotry to make a sweeping generalization like yours -- especially when it's not true. Bush supporters are found in and outside of the ranks of church-going Christians, and Bush-haters too. All too often, however, the official attitude isn't the same as the attitude of the Christian themselves; leaders tend to be religious politicians more than religious. - fuzzmeister, on 10/12/2007, -7/+28Do I actually agree with evangelicals?! Does....not....compute....
*fried* - thebaron2, on 10/12/2007, -14/+27Seriously. I'm not a fan of religion in general, but I'd much rather see this than radical Christians strapping explosives to themselves and detonating in crowded areas in protest.
Not to single anyone out or anything... *ahem*... - 7levels, on 10/12/2007, -5/+18I can't believe I actually agree with them.
- siszam, on 10/12/2007, -1/+14Not every conservative, Evangelical Christian supports Bush. I never did and no one I know did. For that matter, not every Christian is Republican either. It's stupid to make such broad generalizations.
- kingleroy, on 10/12/2007, -4/+15@ water dragon -- How can someone claim to be a 'Christian', and then ignore the 'commandment' of their alleged 'god' that says "Thou Shalt NOT KILL"?
Because most Christians/Jews/Muslims interpret that as Thou Shalt Not MURDER --- killing in war is not murder to them.
I mean, it's insane to think that the Ten Commandments called for pacifism. If you actually read the book(s) that include the so-called Ten Commandments, you'd see that "God" keeps on talking to Moses for another page afterward and he says stuff like (paraphrase:) "Don't enslave your fellow Jews who fall into financial disfavor -- that's what all those foreign countries are for!!"
Don't quote a Bible you don't know and call them hypocrites. - inactive, on 10/12/2007, -7/+18At last these stupid ***** are paying attention to something thats actually important, other than all their other important stuff like gay marriage, flag burning and other totally irrelevant crap!!
- morel42, on 10/12/2007, -3/+12I'm glad they finally realized that the True teaching of Jesus was not hatred towards gays, or the enforcing of there own beliefs on others. But to treat all of mankind as there brothers and sisters, and to spread peace and kindness to all.
If they followed this and only this, even those who don't believe in the divinity of Christ would stand with them. - thefirelane, on 10/12/2007, -1/+9Why do you hate America?
- zephc, on 10/12/2007, -1/+9regarding the previous replies in this sub-thread:
This raises an interesting side-note regarding traditional Abrahamic religions, specifically they have a tendency (when practiced in a more 'fundamentalist' way) to be at odds with democracies, and tend to instead view social constructs in terms of top-down hierarchies, as opposed to a multi-lateral, bottom-up 'web' of people.
This is something often ingrained from an early age in many aspects of life: from home (father as king of the castle), to church (where religious leaders 'lead the flock'), to the universe as a whole (God as master of all).
Anyway, I applaud this move by this group, as the support of human rights and dignity seems to be a good push away from top-down systems where the leader and the cause is important, to bottom-up systems where human life is what is most important. - dime, on 10/12/2007, -4/+11"On the morning of 9/11, Christian fundamentalist David McMenemy crashed his car into a building in Davenport, Iowa, hoping to blow it up and kill himself in the fire. Media ignored this, even after 30 yrs of extreme violence by anti-abortion fanatics, who believe they ’re fighting a holy war. I guess the only way to make headlines nowadays is to be an Arab or Muslim."
Did you just actually compare coordinated hijackers flying planes into buildings, causing billions of dollars in damage and killing thousands of innocent people.... with a guy who drove his Saturn into a Health Center that hadn't opened yet?
I feel my brain actually starting to liquefy from the idiocy of that comment. - actorboy, on 10/12/2007, -1/+7Dugg down for caps, dude. Hope I didn't agree with your point.
- warox, on 10/12/2007, -1/+6cognitiveres
Digg down x1000
Every person, regardless of their status, profession, or any other classification, is initially worthy of respect and deserves to be treated fairly as a fellow human being. People are respected according to their class or job, but everyone must earn and maintain respect through their actions. Becoming president, generally, is indicative of earning respect but in no way assures that he will keep my respect.
Since you identify as a fundie, I'll pick on priests for my example - a job deserving of respect no doubt because you assume they are selfless and serve their community. The small number of them who abuse children are not given special status because they are priests, instead they are derided as the scum they are.
While I realize we do live in a classed society with different tiers of status, no person, regardless of their status, is automatically more specially deserving of respect or admiration. Lies are lies, deceit is deceit, and torture is torture regardless of where it originates. - there, on 10/12/2007, -1/+6
Wow....Christians actually following the teachings of Christ. Will wonders never cease. Now if we can only convince them to ditch leaders like Pat Robertson who issued a very unjesus-like "fatwa" to assassinate Chavez. - warox, on 10/12/2007, -1/+6foxnutjob,
I was about to add you as a digg friend based on your comments above but I realized you're just as nutty as these Christians you hate, so instead I dugg you down. Not a Christian either, and in fact I'm pretty sure you and I have the same opinions on Christianity in general.
You make damn good points, but remove the anger from your comments and you'll find you're much more effective. l appreciate your passion and find it to be powerful, but, seriously man, by insulting people - even if you think they're crazy - you alienate even your allies. - mtalon, on 10/12/2007, -2/+7All generalizations are false.
Bush and cronies aren't representative of all Republicans, and the loud minority of ultra-conservative Bible bangers aren't representative of all Christians.
Most Christians aren't hypocritical judgemental jerks. Unfortunately, the vocal ones are the ones most people notice. The rest are too busy working at the homeless missions or helping out senior citizens or quietly doing other charitable things. You never see them because you don't need them yet, but they're there. They don't try to bully you into beliveing the way they do. Their actions show where their true heart lies.
The ones who feel the need to judge and condemn haven't really figured it out yet. No act of man can bring a person into the light. Acts of men can drive them away, though. - actorboy, on 10/12/2007, -3/+8I'm not anti-religion, but I am anti-Rush Limbaugh, and you're starting to sound a bit like him right now.
- lnf69, on 10/12/2007, -7/+11Anti-Religion is the new religion of Digg.
If you're bashing all Christians here, you're probably a fanatical AntiReligioniare. - rlh1, on 10/12/2007, -1/+5All registered Republicans ? Wow.
I had no idea. Ted Bundy too? Wow - CognitiveRes, on 10/12/2007, -16/+20As a fundie, and a conservative, I don't agree with a lot of what President Bush has done. However as he carries the office of president he deserves respect. However it makes it more difficult when he does some things that are really negative.
- dtfinch, on 10/12/2007, -2/+6Right. The voters deserve the disrespect, not Bush. After 4 years, they knew everything he stood for, and reelected him anyways. They had a choice that was clear as night and day, between good and evil, and they chose evil, because evil had an (R) next to its name on the ballot.
- thcobbs, on 10/12/2007, -2/+6@NightMare
Took scientists 6 years to study and 3 years to write a report on climate change....
Any large group that listens to its members moves slowly. - inactive, on 10/12/2007, -1/+5It"s a shame that we had to read this story from a British news source. Well, better late than never I guess. If these Christian leaders are so close to Pres. Bush as they claim, they should have gone to The White House and slapped the Pres. around when he first got the thought in his head. I want to thank the non- Christians who commented here for using a capitol "C", that is very thoughtful of you , respect is given where respect is due.
- dtfinch, on 10/12/2007, -2/+6Took long enough. Torturing detainees is what got Bush reelected wasn't it? Wasn't "moral values" the most cited factor in exit polls? They used to love him, and support everything he did. Now they're waffling. Wafflers!
- KnightMareInc, on 10/12/2007, -4/+7are you seriously comparing studying the earth's cilmate to the question of whether or not torture is bad?
- rstevens, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3Torture is to true Christianity as doing good is to the dark side. Those who endorse torture and say they are Christians are liars.
- dvpdziyn, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3I guess I shouldn't be surprised at the state of American discourse when people who were insightful enough to not trust Bush administration are now too narrow-minded to accept those who are just coming around to see the way things are.
One of Bush's greatest manipulative tactics is making you decide - "it's simple," he would say "If you want to be more secure, you vote for the person who's got a strong record." By default, you are supposed to then see him as the only choice. When you come on here and act as though only you see the truth, and that those with/without faith, or that those who are Democrats/Republicans, are just plain totally screwed up (in PG language), you are taking a pickax to the gap that separates the people of this country, or of this world. You're just making that gap bigger and bigger. You're doing exactly what Bush (not to mention many Reppublicans and Democrats) does.
There are very important and fundamental things that we will most likely always disagree on, but that doesn't mean we shouldn't be talking, or listening to each other. That's what digg is all about. - inactive, on 10/12/2007, -4/+7""As a fundie, and a conservative, I don't agree with a lot of what President Bush has done. However as he carries the office of president he deserves respect""
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Respect?!!
Respect a silver spoon fed drunk, coke snortin’ awol former male cheerleading, barely coherent, powdered-puff, border-line retarded puppet criminal fake president man propped up by unbridled corporate whore lobbyists, foreign special interests and well paid corrupt professional politicians who brainwash 40-60% of illinformed America through Nazi propaganda tactics using fake cable "news" stations to steal elections through GOP supported corporate owned paperless fake e-voting machines??!!!
NEVER!! - nitsuj, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3"Nobody expects the ... "
You know the routine. - nestafett, on 10/12/2007, -2/+5they've been against it the whole time..
http://www.sojo.net/
sojourners, the good side of christianity - Fumz, on 10/12/2007, -4/+7Given their unquestioning and unwaivering support, I'm surprised they did this... bravo.
- altjeringa, on 10/12/2007, -4/+7The ability to articulate yourself more eloquently might help you in promoting your cause. At least you won't seem retarded.
- inactive, on 10/12/2007, -3/+6You go to such sad lengths to attack a concept that you don't believe, that you don't understand and that you don't even need in your life, and its not even apparent what end your efforts serve. How does your endless stream of venom elevate your own personal belief system to be superior to another? How does your personal hatred for some concept discount the value of that concept to another human being? How do you intend your own prejudices to trump the values of people you don’t know and will never meet?
Your line of thinking is akin to "all Germans are Nazis", "all Arabs are terrorists", "Africa is a primitive continent", "Socialists hate freedom", "Capitalists hate the poor", etc.
Even as a life-long atheist, your philosophical arrogance and boundless frustration make me feel great pity for you.
It would serve you well to leave your parents basement and see the world before you begin assigning definitions to people you don't know or understand. - inactive, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2@fox:
"Do some research, for about twenty years then come back and post.
We don’t want to hear any more of your ill informed garbage until then"
I don’t need you to admit that you are my intellectual inferior. Your words have proven the fact quite successfully, now crawl back into your parent’s basement and live to troll another day. - inactive, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2@dvpdziyn:
With such an insightful, measured and eloquent post, I can only assume you navigated to the digg comments section by mistake.
Kudos to you. - StingerMS, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2@tehnico
Most of what you said I agree with. There are different branches of the Christian belief. I'm not talking Catholic/Protestant here. I'm talking Methodist/Baptist/Pentecostal/Charismatic ect.
And yes, churches (although I don't agree with it) spread division amongst THEMSELVES. My Father is a minister, and we consider our church non-denominational, which means that everyone is welcome (not to say that Baptists wouldn't accept a Methodist in their church. They would, it's just that the belief system is different).
I guess what I'm trying to get it is that it's basically impossible to unify religion. What we can (and should) be focusing on is unifying people. - johnnyrocket, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2Okay, creepy, check out the number of diggs when i came across this article:
http://i130.photobucket.com/albums/p257/johnnyrocket7108/666ff.jpg - fireball74, on 10/12/2007, -1/+3@dtfinch:
I have mixed thoughts on your comment. Yes people voted for him a second time, but at the time he didn't show his truly evil side until after he'd started the war and issuing his famous signing statements to ignore Congress and the law. It doesn't help that he has also been implicated in a lot evil deeds since then either. I believe it is a serious case of a wolf in sheep's clothing, so to speak.
Anyway, I believe he should be impeached and removed from office for lying when he swore to protect the Constitution.
On topic: For once I agree with these people. I don't know how to feel about that, and it's a bit depressing. - actorboy, on 10/12/2007, -1/+3@foxifiednutjob
Blocked for being the Fred Phelps of atheism. Your ranting intolerance, illustrated here and in your 21 other posts to this article, is as repugnant as the type of fundamentalism you rail against. Come back when you can engage in a thoughtful, concise dialogue. Until then, you only serve to prove that there are ***** on both sides of the argument.
Fortunately, I won’t have to see it. - warox, on 10/12/2007, -1/+3Fox,
I agree with you but you're crazy, bro. I can tell you're more intelligent than the average digger, and I'm surprised you can't see the fallacy in your own argument.
You say it's irrelevant that Stalin, Mao, and Hitler were atheists but you have a list of 'republicans' (I highly doubt they all are registered and politically active, fwiw) that is relevant. Associating Ted Bundy with fundamental Christian terrorism is, to put it nicely, a load of crap. The Unabomber was hardly Christian, he was a Luddite terrorist.
I repeat that I agree with a lot of what you said on this page. Evangelicals and other who gave Bush a free ride are not allowed to be given a free ride just for saying, oh, yeah we disagree with him now. Nothing has changed aside from the political climate around Bush, and they deserve to be called out for their hypocrisies. - tehnico, on 10/12/2007, -1/+3@stingerms
There's also a big difference between faith and religion. Religion is the bureaucracy between a man and his God. When you are dealing with your interfaith friends it's easy to see and accept their beliefs as their own and impart your own moral relativism. It's a different story when churches go at it and start trying to enforce their own moral absolutism. Churches can't relate to each other the way people can. Church is the great divider of our time. - Skid32, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2...yet not even a peep against what the Egyptians, Palestinians, or Taliban use on their prisoners. I'm sorry, but I can't support any organization, Christian or otherwise, that only sees such a small fraction of the real world.
- DreKor, on 10/12/2007, -1/+3Ahhh, Revelation... possibly the most disputed canonical book in the Bible.
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