What is Digg?371 Comments
- swOhio, on 10/12/2007, -40/+116I live in Ohio where they just raised the minimum wage statewide to $6.85. I am very upset and for a number of good reasons.
If you are a good worker you can make more than 5.15 an hour at ANY job. If you can't get a raise then you are probably lucky just to have your job. Heck, I work with people who make much more than minimum wage that are lazy and have poor performance.
Now with minimum wage being hiked up a lot of businesses operating costs have gone up. The value of the dollar is watered down when prices increase to counteract the higher labor cost. Not a big deal for the inept people who can't maintain a respectable work ethic as they get a raise. The people who it does affect are those making 8-11 dollars an hour. They still make the same rate, but that $9.00 doesn't buy as much as it use to. All for what? For some ***** employees who can barely hold a crappy job?
The only thing raising the minimum wage does is increase market prices, aka Inflation. I wish the voters in my state understood basic principles of economics. - smitting, on 10/12/2007, -37/+110$219,000/yr for an entire franchise across a state is pocket change man.
- playerslight, on 10/12/2007, -14/+66I've never quite understood the mentality behind the minimum wage, as wages are subjected to differences in geography, economic activity, etc.
Someone living in some tiny hamlet in Michigan where (admittedly crappy) housing can still be found for a few thousand dollars might be able to make a go of it at $5.15 an hour, whereas $7.25 isn't nearly enough for anyone to get ahead in New York. This whole blanket minimum wage idea seems a little silly, as it just depresses economic activity in low-income-earning locations. The government should at least index it based on the economic activity of a specific region, i.e. $11/hr in NYC and $6 in rural Michigan, or something like that. - inactive, on 10/12/2007, -67/+117Minimum wage increases can easily put small business owners out of business. It won't hurt the large corporations, they'll just eventually pass the costs to us, the consumers.
The Republicans did the right thing. ***** Kennedy. He's never worked a day in his miserable life. - killinger777, on 10/12/2007, -16/+65Eyestosky, that's really not how it works. 2% of American hourly wage earners make minimum wage. So while an increase may help them, all the other poverty level families who were already making 10 or more an hour are hurt. They will pay more for goods, as businesses will raise prices to compensate for the higher wage.
http://www.bls.gov/cps/minwage2005.htm
http://www.mises.org/fullstory.aspx?Id=1603 - j37hr0, on 10/12/2007, -13/+57It seems that many of you think that raising the minimum wage just gives unskilled workers more money and everybody has to pay more for goods and services. While this does happen a big supporter of minimum wage increases are Unions. Many Union contracts specify that the Union workers get paid minimum wage plus X number of dollars, or even better 4*Minimum wage. Going from 20.60 an hour to 29 an hour is a very substantial raise. And that is where the increase in goods comes in, all union products will now cost more. If you thought the Democrats and Labor Unions aren't behind this and it's for the 10% of workers making minimum wage, you are truly blind.
- killinger777, on 10/12/2007, -37/+77"Trust me, don't feel bad for the restaurant that rapes consumers on the cost of their burger."
I don't feel bad for the restaurant, I feel bad for the customers who will end up paying for that extra 219K. - CraigJ, on 10/12/2007, -12/+49@smitting - No not really. A Restaruant, even a chain restaruant is at best operating at 18% if they have a bar, and I'm being genourous - there are exceptionally well run organizations might hit 21% or 22%. so your $9.00 burger might yeild $2.00 in profit before taxes. Restaruants are low margin. high volume operations, and the single biggest expense is labor. Increasing labor costs by 30%-40% is a huge increase. - A regional increase of $200,000+ is significant. Many restaruant chains are publicly held - Google their financial statements.
It is amazing how many diggers just through out rendom ***** as if it were fact. - jeffiek, on 10/12/2007, -13/+49The "blanket minimum wage idea" as you describe it, is only one of the many ways to show the lunacy of minimum wage laws. Yes, indexing it to local areas would diminish that problem. But then you create an even bigger one. You have the federal government micro managing the country!! How small an area should be covered? By each state? But then shouldn't it be a state law? Even then, states like NY cover a wide range of economies, varying from NYC to country life. Should the areas be broken down by county?
See the problem with your solution? It's no better, it just creates a nightmare of a bureaucracy. - FTLJohnson, on 10/12/2007, -58/+93@Mike
Rapes? REALLY? Dude, you are comparing voluntary buying something you WANT... to rape? Seriously? Do all socialists think like this? - rockforever, on 10/12/2007, -17/+51Its a drop in the bucket for places like Red Robin. It really hurts stores that are just a little bigger than mom and pop. Stores and resturants that have like 2 or 3 locations.
- robfarrell, on 11/27/2008, -40/+72Kennedy works everyday.
The bottle that is. - FTLJohnson, on 10/12/2007, -16/+41@smitting
Good point... it would be coming out of your pocket... and my poclet... and all the pcokets of people who eat at places that pay minimum wage... Ya know whose pockets it wouldn't come out of... High paid excutives who eat at many of the over 90% of business that DON'T pay minimum wage. - drjones78, on 10/12/2007, -7/+32@j37hr0
Exactly, right, dugg up. Minimum wage increases are about shoring up Union workers votes, not helping the unskilled minimum wage laborer.
Union works get exponential raises with minumum wage increases, because of how their salaries are calculated based on minimum wage. Its the dems pandering to their base (no I'm not a republican either, but see this for what it is people) - zephc, on 10/12/2007, -7/+31@omatsei:
If going to Red Robins is gonna break the bank for you, I might suggest buying food at a grocery store and making your own food: its healthier and vastly cheaper. - bmorrow, on 10/12/2007, -15/+36If it is $30 an hour then the math should be ((30*12)*365)*20 unless Red Robin is only open for 1 hour a day (I'm assuming about 12 hours a day). So that brings it to $2,628,000 which is a little harder for a restaurant chain.
- Necoras, on 10/12/2007, -3/+22This is a federal minimum wage... the states can't go below it. However, states are free to set a higher minimum wage. California for example has a minimum that is either $8 or $10 an hour. (I live in TX so I don't know exacts)
- nixonrichard, on 10/12/2007, -8/+26"Here's how you end this argument: have you ever tried living on 5.15/hr? There we go."
It's tough to live on $5.15/hr in major cities . . . which is why the only people that have jobs that pay that low are high school kids living in their parent's house or lazy people who don't want to get a better job. I live in Seattle. A friend of mine gets paid minimum wage (because he's fine with it), which I think is around $7 here now. He qualifies for low-income housing and pays $350/month in rent in downtown Seattle. He does just fine. The *****'s got a 60" TV with high-def cable. Granted, $7 is more than $5.15, but it is DEFINITELY possible to live on a small budget anywhere. Many people live a lifestyle that would be impossible to maintain on $5/hr, but that doesn't mean you can't do it. Granted, you can't drink gourmet coffee and you can't get a gym membership that you never use and you can't eat ONLY chicken breasts, but you can do it. - sicc, on 10/12/2007, -9/+27Good. Let the free market decide what to pay. IMO, there should be NO minimum wage at all, just like there should be no maximum wage. If you don't like getting minimum wage, get off your ass and learn a skill. I grew up poor, have nothing but a high school education, I'm doing great. Miss me with the sob stories.
- omatsei, on 10/12/2007, -14/+32@eyestosky: If/when the Congress increases the minimum wage, I won't be getting a raise. I already make more than the proposed amount... So I'm left to pay the extra money when I go to Red Robin to eat (they don't actually have Red Robin's around here, but if they did, I'd eat there). That means that I end up with less money to spend on other things, like maybe paying some employees of a small business I'm thinking about starting.
- Laytonx, on 10/12/2007, -27/+43Wages are suppose to keep up with inflation, the US minimum wage hasn’t been keeping up. It’s a myth to think a raise in the minimum wage will hurt the economy. Pay people a fair wage and they will spend it. good for all.
- JoCliMe, on 10/12/2007, -15/+31It would also hurt the workers, in order to minimize the costs these businesses have to take on, they'd have to cut the hours of those that are working for them. Good intentions gone bad, that's pretty much raising of minimum wage in a nutshell.
- sikosmurf, on 10/12/2007, -20/+35What happens if the minimum wage is raised? People who are already working minimum wage jobs will get a pay raise. What about the people who were making above the new minimum wage? Typically, they receive no raise. This closes the gap between everyone else's pay, and the pay of some punk kids working at McDonalds. If minimum wage is not enough, demand a pay raise or go somewhere else.
This is one of the few issues on which I'll agree with the Republicans. - inactive, on 10/12/2007, -18/+33Amazing. The US Senate acutally proved they have a brain on their shoulders. Bravo!
- UglieJosh, on 10/12/2007, -22/+35Any small business owner that can't find a way to pay his employees a livable wage doesn't deserve to own his business.
I support small business as much as I can, but I can't feel bad for them on this issue. It is the right of any person that works to make a wage that they can support themselves on and a business that can't afford to pay them one, shouldn't go into business.
Even small business owners usually live the upper-middle class lifestyle and have no right to complain that they might have to pay their lower class employees enough to freaking eat.
Watch the episode of 30 days where Morgan has to live on minimum wage for a month. - inactive, on 01/02/2009, -3/+14http://www.dol.gov/esa/minwage/america.htm
Seeing that over half the states ignore the federal minimum wage anyways (and have their own higher rate), it's questionable how much an effect a hike would have. - whipnet, on 10/12/2007, -7/+17Good, we have to clean up the illegal workforce first before we can expect small business to pay higher wages. Raise it, and the desire or need to hire illegal work rises.
* - ohearn, on 10/12/2007, -3/+12Then either get the education or the experience and go get a better job!
- inactive, on 10/12/2007, -6/+15yeah, god forbid the government issues a tax break to the small business that will be cleaned out by this ***** minimum wage bill.
MINIMUM WAGE IS NOT A CAREER or is it? I have not made minimum wage since high school - shadgenki, on 10/12/2007, -2/+11@PleaseJustDie : Obviously you don't know what you're talking about. If there is a high unemployment rate, then that means that the demand for jobs heavily outweighs the number of available jobs. You're assuming that there's better jobs for people to get in that area, when clearly that's not the case, otherwise there wouldn't be a HIGH UNEMPLOYMENT RATE, you jackass!! They have no choice but to take whatever is available, which doesn't even earn enough to pay for food and shelter each month.
- omatsei, on 10/12/2007, -13/+22@UglieJosh: "It is the right of any person that works to make a wage that they can support themselves on and a business that can't afford to pay them one, shouldn't go into business."
Say what? Where is that right written? Holy *****, we can just pull new human rights out of our asses? In that case, might I modify the existing right a bit? My proposal would say "It is the right of any person that works to make enough of a wage as they see fit, irrespective of the person paying them, or their ability to do the job for which they were hired, and a business that can't afford to pay them however much the employee wishes shouldn't go into business."
You sir, obviously do not have the interest (or the required mental capacity) to start or run a small business. - r00ts, on 10/12/2007, -24/+33"Minimum wage increases can easily put small business owners out of business. It won't hurt the large corporations, they'll just eventually pass the costs to us, the consumers.
The Republicans did the right thing. ***** Kennedy. He's never worked a day in his miserable life."
Yes, it puts small businesses who exploit their workers by paying them an unsustainable and wholly unjust wage out of business. But the majority of businesses who pay fair, reasonable wages will see very change (at least primarily). - killinger777, on 10/12/2007, -12/+21"It is the right of any person that works to make a wage that they can support themselves on and a business that can't afford to pay them one, shouldn't go into business."
It is the right of any person that works to make a wage that they can support themselves on TO GET A NEW JOB! - exoendo, on 10/12/2007, -11/+19"the businesses that can't pay more than slave wages don't deserve to be in business."
Says who? You? There you go, arguing subjective morality. For eons, it's been the consumer that has decided whether or not a business should be worthy to stay in business, not your subjective moral beliefs.
As for the rest, you just show yourself to be bigoted. - JackDanger, on 10/12/2007, -5/+13Nobody seems to have brought this up, so:
There's a precedent for a massive minimum wage hike. For much of the country's history we had no minimum wage. That generated the mass poverty that can be seen from the very beginning right on through the Industrial Revolution. It's sickening to look at the level of disenfranchisement of most people. They worked full time (we're talking 12-hour days 7 days a week as the national norm up until the late 1800's) and had nearly enough to survive.
Enter WWII. When the soldiers were gone there was a massive need for labor. Women found themselves making $80/week at factories - an amount that was totally unheard of until then. What happened wasn't that goods all became more expensive. Rather, a middle class appeared that was willing to spend their money on goods produced by this same middle class - and corporations got a huge cut of it.
The economic boom of the late 40's and 50's is due to the increase in wages given to workers at the bottom. To bring it into modern terms: many economists calculate that Walmart could increase their sales by increasing their wages. Because the employees would pump their money right back into the store.
And if that argument doesn't grab you, consider this: high-level salaries have skyrocketed for decades at somewhere between 3% and 8% increase per year. How much of that economic boom has helped the folks at the bottom? Very little. The minimum wage is damn near unchanged.
If we remove the minimum wage we're all back to squalor. If we hike it WAY THE HELL UP we'd be doing just fine. - evildorko, on 10/12/2007, -4/+12giving walmart tax cuts would result in them lowering the prices? come on. trickle down economics failed in the 80s and continue to fail today. we continue to give out huge taxcuts for the large corporations and the result is a growing divide between the middle class and the mega-wealthy. not to mention the poor continuing to get poorer.
does a loaf of bread cost the same it did 10 years ago? no. then why are the poor in this country making the same amount of money they did 10 years ago? theres only a set amount of money in the world. if the rich are getting richer, the poor are getting poorer. plain and simple, thats how it works. while our elected officials continue to defend the rich-specifically the corporations- they are betraying the very people that elected them.
the only way to restore order in our decaying society is to abolish the lobbying system, get our lawmakers out of the backpockets of big business corporations and make them accountable to the individual taxpayers that elected them and not the robber barons who paid for their tv commercials. - parker1105, on 10/12/2007, -4/+12Great point, but it will be lost on the economic geniuses who read Digg all day.
- playerslight, on 10/12/2007, -6/+14Thank you for completing my rhetorical statement.
It's odd that, even though we both have the same conclusions about minimum wage laws, we choose to present them so very differently. - inactive, on 10/12/2007, -3/+10There is absolutely no constitutional authority for the government to dictate what businesses should pay their employees. But since when has the Constitution mattered to politicians?
- cfrazier, on 10/12/2007, -1/+8A friend of mine is a union leader in Illinois. If this goes through then the union will go for a wage increase because their current wages are set at an amount aboce the minum wage. Basically they will argue that the company gave teh least skilled and trained a raise but not the most skilled and trained.
- ThinkBox, on 10/12/2007, -13/+20@ mozzep
The minimum wage is just that - MINIMUM - It shouldn't be a living wage. In fact, it CANT be a living wage. If every job were required to pay a living wage that would be socialism.
Small businesses get hurt the worst and have to raise prices to stay afloat. So, if we do raise the min wage, where does that extra money go and where does it come from. If all prices raise, it does nothing but harm. - jamauss, on 10/12/2007, -0/+6Hey - you might be smarter than the average college student if you're already noticing the "college education scam" in regards to cost.
- jeffiek, on 10/12/2007, -0/+6"You people should be thinking about the people that are trying to live on minimum wage."
We are. Look at Florida's minimum wage increase:
http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=6619460
"Long's colleague, Mike Jacobs, found another solution while working at Bahama Breeze, a Caribbean-style chain restaurant. His corporate bosses told him to cut complex menu items to reduce labor costs. So he got rid of desserts like the Chocolate Tres Leches."
The poor guy that made Chocolate Tres Leches is out of work. - mikeneilson, on 10/12/2007, -2/+8I didn't realize that Bush got a vote on the senate floor.*
*sarcasm - WasabiBomb, on 10/12/2007, -3/+9"This comes down to do you want the government in control of wages or the people?"
Hey, I've got an idea- if minimum wages only serve to drive up the cost of living, then let's get rid of it! Hell, let's let businesses decided how much (or little) they want to pay! Imagine how good the economy will be when the poor are making a buck an hour...
But why stop there? Let's get rid of all government controls! After all, businesses should be able to decide how they want to run themselves, right? We could get rid of child labor laws for starters, right? Hell, think how much money they'll be able to save when they don't have to let anyone take breaks, or when they don't have to worry about employee safety...
If businesses hadn't historically taken advantage of workers, there wouldn't have been any need to implement government controls. - iceperson, on 10/12/2007, -13/+19"Trust me, don't feel bad for the restaurant that rapes consumers on the cost of their burger."
You sure do have it all figured out. You must have more money than you can count with all that business acumen.
For all you people that don't get the point, if it's so damned easy why don't you start your own business and stop complaining about being so damned broke? I'll tell you why, because you're more likely to go broke in the first year starting a business... - parker1105, on 10/12/2007, -10/+16Who else would you expect to take the sensible path?
- zirconx, on 10/12/2007, -13/+18Good for the repubs. A $2.10 hike (40%!!) would reak havoc with small and medium business. I don't think the democrats really wanted to pass this, they just knew the republicans would block it - then they could label them as hating poor people (see @siszam comment above)...
- NoUse, on 10/12/2007, -1/+6The story here is how adamant the Republicans were that the Filibuster was anti-democratic 3 years ago. Anyone remember Justice Sunday?
Now?
Lets use it to stop a minimum wage increase.
*Thumbs Up* - K1llerSe7en, on 10/12/2007, -4/+9Being a college student, $7.50/hr would be great. I know that college students already got a gift in the loans going down from 6% interest to 3%, but I don't think it's enough. With the cost of living rising exponentially, and the cost of attending college rising yearly, I can't help but wonder if my education is all just a scam to put me and keep me in debt.
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