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Battle over PATRIOT Act appeal brews as critical testimony is gagged

arstechnica.com — The government has appealed a ruling that was issued last month by a federal court judge striking down the controversial National Security Letter provision of the PATRIOT Act. Gag orders are preventing a proper and full investigation, however.

Who dugg this? Made popular Nov 7, 2007

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  • SheilaNoya, on 11/08/2007, -0/+44Let's not forget that Bush also took away the security clearances from 92 Senators immediately after 9/11. He didn't want to be forced to share intelligence information or let them know how his administration was selectively cherry picking info from the CIA. Only 8 people were allowed to see the actual intelligence data (1 Democrat and 7 Republicans) and they were all sworn to secrecy and not allowed to discuss what they knew.

    http://thinkprogress.org/2005/07/26/bush-pulls-sec ...
  • catsandboots, on 11/08/2007, -2/+45Who needs critical testimony when National Security is at risk? Don't you know that we're at war! Oh and let me throw in terror, 9/11, WMDs, and Democracy in Iraq to help complete the talking points.
  • Groovemaster, on 11/08/2007, -0/+22Let's also not forget that Bush and Cheney officially refused to testify under oath to the 9/11 Commission.

    I wonder why... (except I don't really).
  • Groovemaster, on 11/08/2007, -0/+19Thanks for commenting, Mr. Guiliani.
  • seenthefuture, on 11/08/2007, -0/+19It's all BS. I'll never understand how the "majority of Americans" do not put this logic together. Who benefits from all this?
    If any of you really feel that some radicals in the middle east could overcome a country like America, you're just an idiot in my opinion.

    Think about how most of us will take on a lifetime of debt (mortgage(s), car(s), student debt, personal loan(s), medical expenses...) with "The American Dream". We entertain ourselves bickering over this crap for a few more hours until the next white house announcement. It did not start or end with this admin, nor will it end, this sort of manipulation is down to a science for some.
  • spyd3rweb, on 11/08/2007, -0/+18Lets not forget Cheney and Bush were OPPOSED to ANY investigation of 9/11, until many months after when they were forced to. Then the investigation they did do was underfunded and set up to fail, they stacked the deck with a bunch of bush cronies, such as Kissinger, in charge of the commission. (Kissinger was later booted off due to conflict of interest allegations)

    Somehow it seems no investigation was necessary because Bush magically knew who did it without needing any proof.
  • theNazz, on 11/08/2007, -0/+17Nothing like a little Anthrax in the government mail system to panic legislators into signing away our Constitution...
  • inactive, on 11/08/2007, -0/+14IMHO: The "Patriot Act" should be renamed the "Act of Heinous Treason against the people of the nation".
    It's a bit wordy but more accurately conveys the underlying thrust of the legislation.
  • spyd3rweb, on 11/07/2007, -0/+10How long did it take Germans to accept Hitler burned the Reichstag?
  • inactive, on 11/08/2007, -0/+9This is the entire argument I was going to make summed up by the guy in hte article
    "If Congress were able not only to enact the substance of legislation, but also to prescribe the precise corresponding rule telling the courts what level of scrutiny to apply in properly gauging the constitutionality of the statute's application in practice," wrote Marerro in his ruling, "the barriers against government abuse that the principles of separation and balance of powers were designed to erect could be severely compromised, and may eventually collapse, with consequential diminution of the judiciary's function, and hence potential dire effects to individual freedoms."
  • mmazing, on 11/08/2007, -0/+8Mainstream media is just as guilty for all this *****. If America was properly informed, this wouldn't have gotten so out of hand.
    On the same token, this brings up an interesting point, some media sources, like NPR, actually welcome debate about touchy subjects. Is America, as a people, unwilling to hear the truth? The point is - there ARE media sources that are fair and balanced, but they aren't watched/listened to by most of America. Why?
  • crypt, on 11/08/2007, -0/+7I always wondered.. what is so patriotic about this PATRIOT-Act?
  • inactive, on 11/08/2007, -0/+6Hey our country is being stolen by rich thugs! CIA steps in......Shhh you can't say that, it is against national security.....well now, what is wrong with this picture.....
  • keeling0ver, on 11/12/2007, -3/+9In my mind I equate what is happening to this country with global warming. The great period of socialization and expanded government that stretches from the New Deal to the period following WWII is akin to the industrial revolution. Our civil liberties are like the ozone layer protecting us from the oppression of the Sun (big government). The increasing national debt is like the increasing global temperature. The patriot act is like the hole in the ozone layer burning all of the penguins (innocent citizens) with UV radiation (warrantless wiretaps) below. Ron Paul is like Al Gore, trying to get people to wake up to the fact that the world is going to ***** around them. And Bush/Cheney play themselves in both situations... the people in charge who are letting it happen or actively participating in the destruction, although they are not solely to blame. Either way, something needs to be done and we (the penguins) are the only people with the power to do something about it.
  • kesam, on 11/08/2007, -2/+7And it worked too. No matter how much they lie about EVERYTHING, even the most avid Bush haters still accept their story without any proof. There is some serious cognitive dissonance going on.
  • mmazing, on 11/08/2007, -0/+5If you disagree with the government, the terrorists have won. *Cough* That was me pretending to be a giant uninformed douchebag. Sorry.
    Might I also add that being patriotic means backing up your government no matter what. *****, there I go again.
  • SavannahBlade, on 11/07/2007, -0/+5What WMD, you cretin?
  • Shadic, on 11/08/2007, -1/+5Guiliani wouldn't even mention terror, WMDs, and certainly not Democracy in any way.
    I'm pretty sure he just repeats 9/11 over and over again.
  • 89992, on 11/08/2007, -0/+4"Those who would give up essential liberty to purchase a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety."
    Benjamin Franklin, Historical Review of Pennsylvania, 1759
  • therealkdog, on 11/09/2007, -1/+5Im in ur country stompin ur rights.
  • shawnolds, on 11/08/2007, -0/+4There is nothing patriotic about the PATRIOT-Act. It's a cleverly named piece of legislation that has one purpose. To attack your constitutional rights. The "War on Terror" is actually the "War on Civil Liberties & Dissenter's". It's all just one big power grab. Most of the things that Nixon resigned over are now legal for the government to perform under the PATRIOT-Act. The PATRIOT-Act has nothing to do with defending America. Unless you mean defending this Administration from American's?
  • knomevol, on 11/12/2007, -0/+3savant minds sometimes work in such metaphorical ways. perhaps s/he'll recommend a workable solution soon.
  • Screamager, on 11/07/2007, -0/+3The land of the free... yeah, what a joke. What surprises me is that a massive exile is not beginning. I know I would want to get out of there fast. Trade your house over to a Mexican for theirs and get out while the borders are still open.
  • qpn6ph9q, on 11/12/2007, -0/+3Whoa, I've seen some mixed metaphors and wacky analogies before but this one just asploded my brain.
  • chsbrgr, on 11/08/2007, -0/+3Talking to yourself isn't covered under the gag laws...
  • knomevol, on 11/07/2007, -0/+3the TV is gospel, even when jimmy swaggart isn't on.

    throw out the TV.
  • jmpeagle, on 11/07/2007, -1/+3are you conversing with yourself?
  • Bhima, on 11/07/2007, -0/+2The American dream has long since died... Hunter S. Thompson did the eulogy at the funeral, it was really nice... sniff...
  • WayneCA, on 11/08/2007, -0/+2This is so blatantly wrong. Our government is reducing accountability as much as possible and when a judge tells them to eat it, they appeal? I like my democratic institutions you fascist bastards in the White House. Can we have the elections already???
  • brianary, on 11/08/2007, -0/+2No, I don't think so.
  • inactive, on 11/08/2007, -0/+2Pass All Treasonous Rules In Our Term....
  • mmazing, on 11/07/2007, -0/+2You seem to have missed my very apparent sarcasm.
  • qpn6ph9q, on 11/07/2007, -0/+2The WMD that asploded his brain some time back
  • spyd3rweb, on 11/08/2007, -0/+2interesting...
  • Eldavidos, on 11/08/2007, -0/+2Patriots do what they're told by the government like good little boys - oh wait, George Washington.....
  • F1R3DUP, on 11/07/2007, -0/+2Uh, impeach?
  • lnf69, on 11/08/2007, -0/+2No, schmuck!
  • brianary, on 11/08/2007, -1/+2What the hell is wrong with you?
  • weebit, on 11/07/2007, -0/+1Yes and I wonder which one of them in the government sent out the little bit of Anthrax to scare the legislators into signing away our Constitution...?
  • knomevol, on 11/07/2007, -0/+1http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1yNgH5vX_Bs
  • lnf69, on 11/07/2007, -0/+1I'm having most hardening and difficult attempt in understanding what exactly you are of the trying to say here?
  • mattsw84, on 11/08/2007, -0/+1I capitalized PATRIOT bitches, all will bow down.
  • shawnolds, on 11/07/2007, -0/+1It's simple. He was one of two people that could stop the patriot act. The other was Patrick Leahy who's office also received anthrax.
  • rcook18, on 11/08/2007, -1/+2Read the article and skip the indignant response.
  • shawnolds, on 11/07/2007, -0/+1No, we are so much unsafe today as American's from other countries as well as our own Administration.
  • jlhoben, on 11/07/2007, -0/+1Ahh, gagging - the new American way.
  • secretivecoward, on 11/07/2007, -0/+1Democrats are cowards.
  • inactive, on 11/08/2007, -0/+1Being a true patriot means to fight oppression of your government, and support the people.
  • rcook18, on 11/07/2007, -0/+1The effect of the Patriot Act is "The operation was a success but the patient died".
  • inactive, on 11/08/2007, -0/+1^ Same IP I bet.....
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