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Arizona Senator Insists 9/11 Involved Controlled Demolition

westvirginiaholler.blogspot.co… — A republican state senator in Arizona is convinced that controlled demolition was used on 9/11 in the supposed "collapse" of the WTC towers. In her well written argument in the newspaper she presents a strong case and calls for a truly independent investigation of 9/11 based upon new evidence which the 911 Commission Report never addressed.

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  • LumpyRevolution, on 05/13/2008, -92/+116More and more are stepping forth every day. I believe the truth is going to be told very soon even if blood has to spill.
    • dshPls, on 05/13/2008, -66/+67Buried this article and your comment. No one with any credibility has ever supported 9/11 truth, it's only people who have no experience in physics, engineering, or chemistry. This article just proves that point once again.
      • card51short, on 05/13/2008, -26/+59yep...richard gage and his 300 architects and engineers have zero credibility.
        dshPls, however, has tons! ;)
        • theright, on 05/13/2008, -9/+6How many of those are qualified structural engineers, card? Four?

          Argument from authority much?
        • card51short, on 05/14/2008, -0/+4once again you want me to do the research for you...fine...

          *45+ years in civil and structural engineering design and construction with project work in bridges, buildings, foundations, earth retaining structures, roads, highways, and various commercial, industrial and public works facilities.

          *Mr. Simmons studied at Brigham Young University, graduating with degrees in Russian and Civil & Environmental Engineering with an emphasis in structures.

          *Since graduating college in 1982, I have worked in the structural engineering field. In 2000, I started my own consulting business as a structural engineer. I have experience with wood, concrete, and steel design as well as some forensic experience investigating collapses of structures. I also have experience as a paid on call fire/rescue worker.

          *I began my career in the 1980's as a Structurally Certified Welder and held various welding positions in a shop fabrication environment. I received my B.S. in Civil Engineering from the University of Wisconsin - Milwaukee in 1993 with an emphasis in Structural Engineering. I have several years experience in Municipal Engineering and site design and 10+ Years experience in the structural design of residential, commercial, industrial, and institutional structures of steel, concrete, masonry and timber.

          *Licensed Engineer in Training in Texas, E.I.T. #37893 University of Texas at Arlington, will take P.E. exam in 2009, also American Welding Society Certified Welding Inspector, structural steel AWS D1.1.

          *Full Master Degree study of Civil and Structural Engineering.

          *Consulting structural engineer specializing in building and other structures design and retrofit.
          California SE 1985
          California PE 1982
          MSCE 1980, UC Berkeley
          BSCE 1978, University of Texas, Austin

          *Actively engaged in the analysis and design of superstructure and foundation systems of low-rise buildings. Provide structural engineering services for new building construction as well as additions and renovations to existing buildings.

          *Hold a Ph.D from Univ. Of Miami and has over 20 years of experience as a structural & forensic engineer.


          OK I'm stopping now...that is literally half of ONE out of the 10 pages.

          You're a complete joke...give it up man.
          • card51short, on 05/14/2008, -0/+2umm nothing to say? owned...go home
      • Herkimer56, on 05/13/2008, -45/+19"richard gage and his 300 architects and engineers have zero credibility."
        That's exactly correct. Congratulations on finally puzzling that out. It sure took you long enough.
        • card51short, on 05/13/2008, -11/+27yep. they're with al qaeda...I understand, herky ;)
      • dOOBiEx213, on 05/13/2008, -13/+6It's a bad idea to post your picture on the internet... now we all know you're an uuuuuuugly *****, and we can point it out.
      • ctrlv, on 05/13/2008, -7/+14I love how "TRUTH" is now a dirty word. There's no conspiracy about this: we don't know what really happened. We can only believe one version or another. In other words, go on faith. Why is seeking the 'truth' about something a bad thing, and simply relying on faith a good thing?
      • rpgmaker, on 05/13/2008, -2/+17"No one with any credibility has ever supported 9/11 truth, it's only people who have no experience in physics, engineering, or chemistry."
        Then you haven't watched any documentary criticizing the 9/11 terrorism attacks or you are just stupid. How can you buy the official story when it says that a plane "vaporized" when it crashed? The US government could've done better than that.

        If the 9/11 wasn't an inside job then your government has failed at giving you a good and reasonable explanation, not ***** that you rather believe (this is specially true with newyorkers) instead of questioning your government and what you believe is the truth.
        • theright, on 05/13/2008, -12/+9Who on earth claimed any planes "vaporized" on 9/11?
          • sealbeater, on 05/14/2008, -1/+7The people who wonder where the wreckage of the plane that hit the Pentagon went.
          • jcm267, on 05/14/2008, -7/+3Where do you think the wreckage of the plane that hit the Pentagon went? They weren't going to leave it there indefinitely.
          • kemp34, on 05/14/2008, -0/+2Where did the wreckage go JCM? Do you have any insight on to where that was taken and reassembled? They do that for nearly every plane crash, you're aware of that right JCM?
      • IKORKYI, on 05/14/2008, -0/+1flying planes into buildings and then demoing them just in case they didn't fall and cover up the evidence is the best thing the government could come up with to justify the wars in the middle east?

        so is the government stupid, or ingenious? cause if you blame bush for something like that , i don't think you can call him dumb
    • SkippyDoorknob, on 05/13/2008, -21/+15Being a senator doesn't mean you're some sort of super genius. Nobel prize winners have been taken in by scam artists before.
      • Cryptocracy, on 08/17/2008, -6/+15yeah look at Hillary, Obama and McCain... and speaking of manbearpig, he is a fraud, not a sucker.
    • Shakermaker, on 05/13/2008, -16/+22LOL - "even if blood has to spill"??

      WTF does that even mean? You gonna grab a gun and overthrow the US gov't? Let's see you put down GTA 4 long enough to do that.
      • PolarBearCa, on 05/13/2008, -13/+4It means get on your tin-foil hat, because it`s going to be a bumpy ride down this comment list...
    • fr3ddie, on 05/13/2008, -18/+7how the hell is this guy NOT buried?
      • funkymoose, on 05/13/2008, -9/+3Thought the same thing. He was at +17 diggs. I just refreshed though after leaving for 5 mins and now he's at -1.
      • staffa, on 05/13/2008, -11/+7Before this posting hit the front page only the 'league of truthers' had seen and commented on it.

        It was puzzling me for awhile too, hell it's probably 3 people with 20 accounts.


    • CC440, on 05/13/2008, -4/+3What will the truth tell us? That the Bush Government is corrupt and evil? We knew that and yet we still wouldn't impeach somebody in their last few months. That Iraq and Afghanistan are joke wars? We knew that but we still couldn't leave unless you like destroying the Middle East. That our freedoms were taken for no reason? They still were taken for a ***** reason and we know that, but the laws are on the books and it would still take years or decades to repeal them.

      Yes, it would be nice to know, but nothing would change because of it, too much time has passed for us to do anything about it.
    • heathuff23, on 05/13/2008, -9/+1I do agree lumpy! On that fateful day, among the passengers on the flight that hit the first tower was the Loch Ness Monster, Bigfoot, Elvis, Hitler and the cast from Alice in Wonderland (except for tweedledum, he was on the second flight because putting him and 'dee on the same flight would have looked waaaaaay too suspicious).
    • sheasie, on 05/13/2008, -1/+13Huh? The truth doesn't matter 'cuz too much time has past ?? Look, I guess I understand your point, but I strongly disagree. How many wars, invasions, laws, etc. have been (and will be) passed because "9/11 changed everything". The simple fact is that knowing the truth about 9/11 (even 7 years later) will change everything.
      PS. 7 years is not THAT long ;)
      • kemp34, on 05/14/2008, -0/+2Yeah, people act like 7 years is the scope of a lifetime. 7 years ain't ***** people, think about all the BS that is coming out from the middle of the century, just now. We still are in the dark on many things.
    • Meggido, on 05/14/2008, -1/+2The truth is rarely that convoluted. You will find out that terribly complicated plots like the one described are not practical to pull. There might be some shady areas on what exactly happened during 9/11, but suggesting that some government conspiracy coordinated people in the states to rig the towers for demolition at the same time they had other people not fail to hit the towers with planes full of people is ridiculously far fetched. If a government wanted to provoke reactions like these they do have much more controllable tools at their disposal.
      • card51short, on 05/14/2008, -0/+1i agree it is far fetched. So is 19 hijackers with boxcutters who were on wanted terror lists doing it while by lead by a guy in a cave halfway around the world.
  • davidmesaaz, on 05/13/2008, -58/+45Hey just so you all know this same State Senator tried to pass a law saying that Arizona had the right to succeed from the United States. She says a lot of things none of which are taken seriously.
    • card51short, on 05/13/2008, -11/+26pure evil...must be with al qaeda
    • suzywang3000, on 05/13/2008, -13/+32succeed?
      • Trevcal123, on 05/13/2008, -3/+6I noticed that too!
      • CC440, on 05/13/2008, -0/+4Well considering the rest of the US is failing pretty hard it's nice to know that Arizona can succeed if it sets its mind to it. Reach for the stars Arizona!
    • faskill, on 05/13/2008, -7/+23that Arizona had the right to attain success or reach a desired goal?
    • Chassit, on 05/13/2008, -10/+36Try "secede".
    • Pg5of16, on 05/13/2008, -3/+6So, uh, did she actually propose seceding from the union or not. Cause I thinks thats a tad more important than if he spelled secede right.
    • Picaroon, on 05/13/2008, -9/+4Being truthers, they bury what you say and pick at a simple typo. One could draw parallels between that and the way they pick at stupid things like the largely irrelevant melting point of steel (since it's not melting, but weakening of that is important) instead of looking at the facts.
  • cloudsifter, on 05/13/2008, -51/+70What? No Herkimer56 yet... oh wait, too soon, it's only been a few minutes... LOL

    You can "bury" but you can't stop the truth from spreading... digg.com doesn't have the power to suppress a story on a large enough scale. :P
    • Herkimer56, on 05/13/2008, -45/+52You're an idiot. You people in the Cult of 9/11 do nothing with your lives except spread lies and propaganda about events that you clearly have no knowledge of. If you don't like the fact that there are people on Digg who are unwilling to allow you to post whatever garbage you want without challenge. If you don't like being asked to explain your lies or provide actual evidence to support your idiotic theories then go to the prison planet forums where liars and morons are welcome.
      • Observant1, on 05/13/2008, -24/+40and youre an offensive idiot THWASHBUCKLERR from the CULT of government worship speading the lies and propaganda of the 'official story'. if you dont like the fact that there are people on Digg who are sick of you constantly calling them morons then go get a job working with the mentally retarded so you can be right when you say it, TO THEM.
        long story short, GFY.
        • JMScheib, on 05/14/2008, -5/+6I was waiting for you to say "NEO-CON!!!1"

          Get over it dude. Not even 1/2 of these people that think the conspiracy is BS are conservative. I'm certainly not. There are so many details that people don't understand, particularly with the FAA. As a pilot, reading some of these comments make me shake my head.
      • card51short, on 05/13/2008, -15/+25no YOU spread lies! *sticks out tongue*
      • Look4Truth, on 05/13/2008, -11/+26Poor Jerky's all worked up, must be struggling with his new Godzilla theory for building 7.
        • TheHomeOffice, on 08/08/2008, -10/+4Look4troof, are you 12? You must be because you never answer ***** when people post questions about trooferland and your theories.
          You are a worthless asshat and the fact that you do not answer anything we post to you and your troof weirdos just shows to everyone that you don't know jack ***** except how to stalk herkimer. Get off of Herkimers nuts for just one moment and add to the debate or just keep being a troll.
        • Herkimer56, on 05/14/2008, -10/+3If he was 12 he would be able to form a more cogent reply.
        • Look4Truth, on 05/14/2008, -3/+7Hehe, reading your silly comments and you're questioning MY age? Go back to sleep lemmings, everything's fine.
      • ChildofDestiny, on 05/13/2008, -9/+16Herkysquirky, it's called "democracy". Ever heard of that word before? If you don't like it, then go back to your troll cave and keep dreaming.
        • PolishLogic, on 05/13/2008, -11/+5It's called democracy?

          That's funny *****, right there.
        • Herkimer56, on 05/14/2008, -10/+5So you're going to scream Democracy when it comes to posting the trash that you people post but it's okay to silence and ridicule anyone who can prove that your postings are trash? Is that what you're trying to say? I think you better take a few minutes to drop by dictionary.com and look up the word "hypocrite".
      • PlagueOfMorons, on 05/14/2008, -6/+12Herkie's bank statement accidently came to me and by mistake I opened and read it:
        Deposit: $5000 from AIPAC for "services rendered"; deposit: $2500 from a Mr Rove, K.; deposit: $1.98 from WalMart for refund check for returned half-empty bottle of personal lube. I think this is conclusive evidence of collusion!
        • TheHomeOffice, on 08/08/2008, -9/+4what a ***** you are. your usernames says it all though,,,, you troofers are a plague of morons alright.
        • Herkimer56, on 05/14/2008, -8/+3I think that this is conclusive evidence that you're scared of me because you know I'm telling the truth and you don't want your lies exposed.
      • Rabbit63, on 05/14/2008, -2/+6Thwashbuckler!
    • chocobomog, on 05/13/2008, -9/+24Actually, "bury" does stop the truth from spreading. I see less and less of these stories every month and more "anti-truthers" attack you each time you rise up (including Bill Mayer and South Park). So either they are getting better at burying your stories or you are getting lazy and submitting less. Either way, your "truth" is reaching less people...
    • JMScheib, on 05/13/2008, -4/+10You are a giant tool.
  • Catspaw, on 05/13/2008, -67/+102More people need to come out. 9/11 was a staged event by criminal elements in the US government -it has been used to wage a war against the US people. Now there is Patriot Act 1 and 2, and all the signs that martial law is on the cards. As Alexander Solzhenitsyn stated: "A state of War only serves as an excuse for domestic Tyranny." Hitler used the same trick and look where that headed. Anyone thinking about going public, don't hesitate, as the hour is late.
    • Herkimer56, on 05/13/2008, -36/+32I suppose you can provide some credible, verifiable proof to support your claims. No? Hardly surprising.
      • Observant1, on 05/13/2008, -17/+29buried as herkspeak.
        • dshPls, on 05/13/2008, -25/+19Haha no that's just logical thought. Instead of following the crowd he's asking for verifiable evidence. It's amazingly to me that such a simple concept eludes you, yet you consider yourself superior to all the engineers/scientists/architects who disagree with your view of 9/11.
        • card51short, on 05/13/2008, -9/+24So...he's asking people on Digg for evidence? Shouldn't he be out researching himself if he's so into finding the truth?
          Go tell Richard Gage he is wrong and point out why...he'll own you...tape the convo and put it on Digg, please.
          Or call Alex Jones...nah...just keep searching Digg for your evidence ;)
    • spwpi10, on 05/13/2008, -22/+18I think it's funny when you morons type like someone will write down your words and quote them someday as epic poetry.

      "The hour is late" hahaha
      • card51short, on 05/13/2008, -11/+19no YOU'RE a moron!!!! So there!
    • JMScheib, on 05/13/2008, -9/+6Godwin.
    • schneidafunk, on 05/13/2008, -8/+10Keep in mind, radical muslims, who've sworn to destroy America, tried blowing up the world trade center in 1993 (during Clinton's administration)
    • Meggido, on 05/14/2008, -0/+3Your comments seems to be smart and informed. However, have in mind that Hitler did not need to blow pieces of Germany to raise to power. What I am trying to say is that a government willful to commit to war to favor private interest does have way simpler tools at its disposal to achieve that goal. No group of people in their right mind would attempt such an act, as it is not possible to measure the reaction of such terrible events. You just can't control the execution and outcome of things on that level. And I really doubt people in the current government would be interested in causing such scenario, at all.
      • card51short, on 05/14/2008, -0/+1Meggido, with all due respect, I believe you are misinformed.
        You say :
        "Your comments seems to be smart and informed. However, have in mind that Hitler did not need to blow pieces of Germany to raise to power."

        Hitler burned down his own Government building (The Reichstag) to enact the Enabling Act, which is very similar to our Patriot Act. He blamed the attacks on the Jews and Gypsies.

        "What I am trying to say is that a government willful to commit to war to favor private interest does have way simpler tools at its disposal to achieve that goal."

        What I am trying to say is that a government that is willing to go to war for private interests isn't working for the people and doesn't care about the people's welfare. Sacrificing 3,000 people would be like a general making the decision to expose a rank of troops to have another waiting rank of troops attack the attackers flanks.

        "No group of people in their right mind would attempt such an act, as it is not possible to measure the reaction of such terrible events."

        Yet you instantly believe that some guys halfway around the world would do it "because they hate our freedoms", right? They weren't even religious nuts...they attended strip clubs and snorted coke and wore gold and silk.
        Governments have a history of false flag attacks. Even the United States.

        "You just can't control the execution and outcome of things on that level. And I really doubt people in the current government would be interested in causing such scenario, at all."

        Well you can "Doubt" it all you want. I advise you to study up on the following events :

        * Gulf of Tonkin
        * Northwoods Document
        * Operation Gladio
        * Operation AJAX
        * Slavery
        * Segregation
        * The Native American slaughter
        * Tuskeegee Experiments

        And many others...
        Thanks for being level headed and rational in your comments.
  • AlwaysAwake, on 05/13/2008, -22/+49Only fear is the enemy of facts and truth. Honesty and open-mindedness may seem like courage, but it is just realizing that when all is lost, there is nothing left but facts and truth to save ourselves and others.
    • JigoroKano, on 05/13/2008, -10/+8There is another fear; it is stupidity.
      • buckrogers1965, on 05/14/2008, -1/+2Looks like you have that covered, thanks.
  • thecoolestguy, on 05/13/2008, -49/+39911 could have something to do with what Sibel Edmonds uncovered:

    http://tinyurl.com/2s2key

    For sale: West’s deadly nuclear secrets
    Insight: Chris Gourlay, Jonathan Calvert, Joe Lauria

    A WHISTLEBLOWER has made a series of extraordinary claims about how corrupt government officials allowed Pakistan and other states to steal nuclear weapons secrets.

    Sibel Edmonds, a 37-year-old former Turkish language translator for the FBI, listened into hundreds of sensitive intercepted conversations while based at the agency’s Washington field office.

    She approached The Sunday Times last month after reading about an Al-Qaeda terrorist who had revealed his role in training some of the 9/11 hijackers while he was in Turkey.

    Edmonds described how foreign intelligence agents had enlisted the support of US officials to acquire a network of moles in sensitive military and nuclear institutions.

    Among the hours of covert tape recordings, she says she heard evidence that one well-known senior official in the US State Department was being paid by Turkish agents in Washington who were selling the information on to black market buyers, including Pakistan.

    The name of the official – who has held a series of top government posts – is known to The Sunday Times. He strongly denies the claims.

    However, Edmonds said: “He was aiding foreign operatives against US interests by passing them highly classified information, not only from the State Department but also from the Pentagon, in exchange for money, position and political objectives.”

    She claims that the FBI was also gathering evidence against senior Pentagon officials – including household names – who were aiding foreign agents.

    “If you made public all the information that the FBI have on this case, you will see very high-level people going through criminal trials,” she said.

    Her story shows just how much the West was infiltrated by foreign states seeking nuclear secrets. It illustrates how western government officials turned a blind eye to, or were even helping, countries such as Pakistan acquire bomb technology.

    The wider nuclear network has been monitored for many years by a joint Anglo-American intelligence effort. But rather than shut it down, investigations by law enforcement bodies such as the FBI and Britain’s Revenue & Customs have been aborted to preserve diplomatic relations.

    Edmonds, a fluent speaker of Turkish and Farsi, was recruited by the FBI in the aftermath of the September 11 attacks. Her previous claims about incompetence inside the FBI have been well documented in America.

    She has given evidence to closed sessions of Congress and the 9/11 commission, but many of the key points of her testimony have remained secret. She has now decided to divulge some of that information after becoming disillusioned with the US authorities’ failure to act.

    One of Edmonds’s main roles in the FBI was to translate thousands of hours of conversations by Turkish diplomatic and political targets that had been covertly recorded by the agency.

    A backlog of tapes had built up, dating back to 1997, which were needed for an FBI investigation into links between the Turks and Pakistani, Israeli and US targets. Before she left the FBI in 2002 she heard evidence that pointed to money laundering, drug imports and attempts to acquire nuclear and conventional weapons technology.

    “What I found was damning,” she said. “While the FBI was investigating, several arms of the government were shielding what was going on.”

    The Turks and Israelis had planted “moles” in military and academic institutions which handled nuclear technology. Edmonds says there were several transactions of nuclear material every month, with the Pakistanis being among the eventual buyers. “The network appeared to be obtaining information from every nuclear agency in the United States,” she said.

    They were helped, she says, by the high-ranking State Department official who provided some of their moles – mainly PhD students – with security clearance to work in sensitive nuclear research facilities. These included the Los Alamos nuclear laboratory in New Mexico, which is responsible for the security of the US nuclear deterrent.

    In one conversation Edmonds heard the official arranging to pick up a $15,000 cash bribe. The package was to be dropped off at an agreed location by someone in the Turkish diplomatic community who was working for the network.

    The Turks, she says, often acted as a conduit for the Inter-Services Intelligence (ISI), Pakistan’s spy agency, because they were less likely to attract suspicion. Venues such as the American Turkish Council in Washington were used to drop off the cash, which was picked up by the official.

    Edmonds said: “I heard at least three transactions like this over a period of 2½ years. There are almost certainly more.”

    The Pakistani operation was led by General Mahmoud Ahmad, then the ISI chief.

    Intercepted communications showed Ahmad and his colleagues stationed in Washington were in constant contact with attachés in the Turkish embassy.

    Intelligence analysts say that members of the ISI were close to Al-Qaeda before and after 9/11. Indeed, Ahmad was accused of sanctioning a $100,000 wire payment to Mohammed Atta, one of the 9/11 hijackers, immediately before the attacks.

    The results of the espionage were almost certainly passed to Abdul Qadeer Khan, the Pakistani nuclear scientist.

    Khan was close to Ahmad and the ISI. While running Pakistan’s nuclear programme, he became a millionaire by selling atomic secrets to Libya, Iran and North Korea. He also used a network of companies in America and Britain to obtain components for a nuclear programme.

    Khan caused an alert among western intelligence agencies when his aides met Osama Bin Laden. “We were aware of contact between A Q Khan’s people and Al-Qaeda,” a former CIA officer said last week. “There was absolute panic when we initially discovered this, but it kind of panned out in the end.”

    It is likely that the nuclear secrets stolen from the United States would have been sold to a number of rogue states by Khan.

    Edmonds was later to see the scope of the Pakistani connections when it was revealed that one of her fellow translators at the FBI was the daughter of a Pakistani embassy official who worked for Ahmad. The translator was given top secret clearance despite protests from FBI investigators.

    Edmonds says packages containing nuclear secrets were delivered by Turkish operatives, using their cover as members of the diplomatic and military community, to contacts at the Pakistani embassy in Washington.

    Following 9/11, a number of the foreign operatives were taken in for questioning by the FBI on suspicion that they knew about or somehow aided the attacks.

    Edmonds said the State Department official once again proved useful. “A primary target would call the official and point to names on the list and say, ‘We need to get them out of the US because we can’t afford for them to spill the beans’,” she said. “The official said that he would ‘take care of it’.”

    The four suspects on the list were released from interrogation and extradited.

    Edmonds also claims that a number of senior officials in the Pentagon had helped Israeli and Turkish agents.

    “The people provided lists of potential moles from Pentagon-related institutions who had access to databases concerning this information,” she said.

    “The handlers, who were part of the diplomatic community, would then try to recruit those people to become moles for the network. The lists contained all their ‘hooking points’, which could be financial or sexual pressure points, their exact job in the Pentagon and what stuff they had access to.”

    One of the Pentagon figures under investigation was Lawrence Franklin, a former Pentagon analyst, who was jailed in 2006 for passing US defence information to lobbyists and sharing classified information with an Israeli diplomat.

    “He was one of the top people providing information and packages during 2000 and 2001,” she said.

    Once acquired, the nuclear secrets could have gone anywhere. The FBI monitored Turkish diplomats who were selling copies of the information to the highest bidder.

    Edmonds said: “Certain greedy Turkish operators would make copies of the material and look around for buyers. They had agents who would find potential buyers.”

    In summer 2000, Edmonds says the FBI monitored one of the agents as he met two Saudi Arabian businessmen in Detroit to sell nuclear information that had been stolen from an air force base in Alabama. She overheard the agent saying: “We have a package and we’re going to sell it for $250,000.”

    Edmonds’s employment with the FBI lasted for just six months. In March 2002 she was dismissed after accusing a colleague of covering up illicit activity involving Turkish nationals.

    She has always claimed that she was victimised for being outspoken and was vindicated by an Office of the Inspector General review of her case three years later. It found that one of the contributory reasons for her sacking was that she had made valid complaints.

    The US attorney-general has imposed a state secrets privilege order on her, which prevents her revealing more details of the FBI’s methods and current investigations.

    Her allegations were heard in a closed session of Congress, but no action has been taken and she continues to campaign for a public hearing.

    She was able to discuss the case with The Sunday Times because, by the end of January 2002, the justice department had shut down the programme.

    The senior official in the State Department no longer works there. Last week he denied all of Edmonds’s allegations: “If you are calling me to say somebody said that I took money, that’s outrageous . . . I do not have anything to say about such stupid ridiculous things as this.”

    In researching this article, The Sunday Times has talked to two FBI officers (one serving, one former) and two former CIA sources who worked on nuclear proliferation. While none was aware of specific allegations against officials she names, they did provide overlapping corroboration of Edmonds’s story.

    One of the CIA sources confirmed that the Turks had acquired nuclear secrets from the United States and shared the information with Pakistan and Israel. “We have no indication that Turkey has its own nuclear ambitions. But the Turks are traders. To my knowledge they became big players in the late 1990s,” the source said.
    • lifeinchains, on 05/13/2008, -11/+20Do you expect me to read that? My attention span is far too short for that many words.
      • ats314, on 05/13/2008, -5/+8this is the longest comment i've ever seen... just sayin.
    • oldhick, on 05/13/2008, -7/+13Why provide the link, then paste the text in the comment?
      • BESTenemy, on 05/13/2008, -2/+4When you post both, they cancel eachother out.
    • Simonft, on 05/13/2008, -5/+9Why did you shorten the url, then paste the entire article? Seems counter productive to me.
    • EXTER, on 05/13/2008, -4/+1tl; dr
    • spawnfree, on 05/14/2008, -2/+2Well i read it and it just points out how easy it is for a huge compartmentalized organization to conspire effectively by simply not telling the subordinates what the real motives are.
      the subordinates get fed *****. Nobody has anything useful to contribute or leak because the people who would blab don't get told the truth.
    • GhostyBoy, on 05/14/2008, -1/+1Show a little respect for your info by putting in the reply section. You just guaranteed it's burial.
    • jcm267, on 05/14/2008, -3/+2http://killerfun.com/82095_ABC_News_Gets_Owned_by_ ...
  • Jimmyb207, on 05/13/2008, -38/+38One by one they are coming in the name of Truth. Karen Johnson is a brave and righteous women. Braver than literally EVERYBODY in U.S. Government? And, it appears from this editorial she wrote recently that she is becoming wide awake! Keep spreading the word of Truth.....I believe it's getting ready to unload a major asskicking on the "Official Lie"!
    Check out this editorial by Karen Johnson.
    http://www.azcentral.com/arizonarepublic/opinions/ ...
    • Herkimer56, on 05/13/2008, -27/+20She's a loon.
      • Observant1, on 05/13/2008, -11/+19^^ he's a THWASHBUCKLERR: http://digg.com/comedy/Herkimer56_the_biggest_THWA ...
      • Jimmyb207, on 05/13/2008, -8/+14Herkel....how's that ride on the ol' downward spiral going?
        • staffa, on 05/13/2008, -3/+4Gawd I hate discourse that equates agreement with being 'wide awake' 'righteous' 'brave'



          I will grant you she is brave though.



          However, regardless of the disgusting use of spin language, I am still very skeptical of this point of view, to the point of calling you a loon as well.



          For all the claims made in the linked article, there were no actual outside sources listed.

          The sheer scale of the conspiracy would be astonishing, 10's of thousands of people would have to know about it and not be talking about .

          Why, why would they use explosives. There mere act of having 2 airplanes hit the towers, which I saw on TV, would have been enough to enact all the crap that came after without risking the blatantly obvious trail of evidence that would come from having used controlled demolition. It would be insanely risky and wholly unnecessary to the aims you claim they have.



          I am no fan of the patriot act but you guys are bat ***** crazy.
          • Jimmyb207, on 05/14/2008, -1/+2And allow me to call you bat ***** STUPID.
            "There mere act of having 2 airplanes hit the towers, which I saw on TV, would have been enough to enact all the crap that came after"
            You say that not because you for fact but because thats what the TV told you, go back to sleep.
            The Towers were engineered to take the force of a Boeing 707 crashing into it.
            http://911research.wtc7.net/wtc/analysis/design.ht ...
          • staffa, on 05/14/2008, -0/+1How is that relevant, two jumbo jets hitting the towers, even if the towers did not collapse, would still have killed about a thousand people. It will still be a terrorist act large enough to have allowed bush to push through the patriot act.

            There would have been no need to use demolition, it would have escalated the scope of the conspiracy from 10 people to 10,000 people. It would have injected a massive number of points of failure of which any one of them would have blown the roof off the entire thing and it would have gained them nothing they didn't already have.

            And not that it matters, but the towers fell because of the burning jet fuel not because of the force of the impact. I like how you defeat your opponents argument by defeating an argument they never made. The problem is you can only see what agrees with your point of view, you are blind to the blatantly obvious.

          • Jimmyb207, on 05/15/2008, -0/+1That's interesting. Calling me blind to what is blatantly obvious is exactly how I feel about your position.
            You absolutely can not omit the Larry Silverstein factor:
            Mr. Silverstein, who made a down-payment of $124 million on the $3.2 billion WTC complex, promptly insured it for $7 Billion. Not only that, he covered the complex against “terrorist attacks”. The WTC complex was owned by the government before Silverstein "acquired" ownership.

            Following the attacks, Silverstein filed TWO insurance claims for the maximum amount of the policy ($7B), based on the two -- in Silverstein's view -- separate attacks. The insurance company, Swiss Re, paid Mr. Silverstein $4.6 Billion ...you do the math.
            There's no way that jet fuel made those towers collapse.
        • staffa, on 05/16/2008, -0/+1How is it that everytime it is pointed out how you are wrong, you go on a tangent, bringing up another unrelated point?

          So what, Mr. Silverstein bought the WTC and like any reasonable invenstor on such an expensive properity, he insured it. And considering the WTC has been the target of repeated previous terrorist attacks, he insured it against terrorist attacks. What a freaking shock.

          And when a terrorist attack happened, omg, he got payed.

          That he filed 2 claims just means he is a greedy little ***** that is trying to maximize his return, whatever.

          And what does a down payment have to do with it. Are you trying to twist the truth, I am not stupid.

          You pay 10,000 down payment on your new house, you insure it against fire for 500,000(being its value) it then burns down and you get payed 500,000.

          What, do you think you get the entire 500,000? Don't you think some of that(all of that) is going to pay off the bank loan and other creditors?

          Gawd you are stupid.


  • Herkimer56, on 05/13/2008, -62/+46Buried as insanely inaccurate because she's basing her conclusions on nothing other than the lies and disinformation of the Cult of 9/11.
    • Observant1, on 05/13/2008, -18/+38Buried as insanely inaccurate because he's basing his conclusions on nothing other than the lies and disinformation of the Cult of the official government story.
      aint life a bitch?
    • BrapAllgood, on 05/13/2008, -12/+15Cults are hidden. This is completely out in the open. Fail.
    • Herkimer56, on 05/13/2008, -19/+14Cults are hidden? The Branch Davidians? The Scientologists? You consider those hidden? You're even stupider than anyone ever thought you were, Brappie.
      • card51short, on 05/13/2008, -8/+11no YOU'RE in a cult!!!


        (God seriously...can the deniers go ONE post without calling names...I'm getting tired of doing this!)
        • kemp34, on 05/13/2008, -6/+9Herky wants to desperately believe he is "normal". He is in the cult of "false normalcy" and tries to disparage anyone outside of his defined right-thinking herd.
      • leonhyral, on 05/13/2008, -2/+2Haven't you heard? Scientology is a religion!
    • StMac, on 05/13/2008, -6/+7I can't believe this story made it to the front page. The crazies are out in full force today
      • Rabbit63, on 05/14/2008, -2/+3Nope, its just that the numbers of morons who believe the official lies has dwindled so much,.
        • LeRobot, on 05/27/2008, -0/+1Dwindled to what? 98% of the population? Can you guys even get a city councilor elected? No.
  • BohicaTwentyTwo, on 05/13/2008, -47/+37She presents nothing that hasn't been seen and discredited before. Its the same old, "explosions in the basement", "support beams exhibit cut edges" crap over and over again.
    • Rabbit63, on 05/14/2008, -2/+3None of these issues have ever been successfully dealt with by the official story which is why they are all still relevant Moron.
      • BohicaTwentyTwo, on 05/14/2008, -1/+3The photos of the "cut edges" on the support beams were taken days, possibly weeks, later after the workers started CUTTING away the support beams to be taken away.

        Even IF there were explosions in the basement, clearly the collapse initiated on the higher floors and therefore does NOT support the controlled demolition theory.

        There, I just sucessfully dealt with both issues.
  • domataos, on 05/13/2008, -32/+24I wont debate whether or not 9/11 was a controlled demolition, because I don't have a degree in structural engineering, but I think it's a bit off that all these people are coming out now. Why didn't these people come out 7 years ago, when this happened? It seems odd they wait for a few months before an open election to finally come out and preach outrage, whether they're right or wrong about the validity of the argument.
    • card51short, on 05/13/2008, -8/+23must be some sort of conspiracy...obviously, we should of had all the facts on the day of 9/11 and we should have came out EXACTLY on the day of 9/11 or we are all liars.

      Conspiracy nut
      • dshPls, on 05/13/2008, -25/+11It's pretty simple actually. The 9/11 truthers are led like sheep, and manipulated whenever some D-list actor/actress/politician needs support.
        • lazerus9, on 05/13/2008, -7/+17Zionist Shill! Is your Tin Foil Yarmulke too tight?
      • card51short, on 05/13/2008, -6/+19so basically you're saying we're involved in a giant conspiracy with D-list actors and politicians?
        Tin foil hat nutcase.
        • dshPls, on 05/13/2008, -17/+8Haven't you seen all the praise for Rosie, Charlie Sheen? Look at the comment above "Karen Johnson is a brave and righteous women."

          Please pay attention to your own cult so I don't have to. If you just applied all your scrutiny to Alex Jones and Prison Planet you'd realize what's really going on.
        • card51short, on 05/13/2008, -6/+15*hands dshPls a tin foil hat*
          This will keep you safe from the upcoming JIHAD
    • Herkimer56, on 05/13/2008, -23/+15You don't need a degree in structural engineering to know that no evidence of explosives has ever been found in any of the WTC debris.
      • card51short, on 05/13/2008, -10/+26you don't need any degree to know there was no search through the debris FOR explosives.
        And if there was, whoever did the search was a conspiracy nut, right?
        • dshPls, on 05/13/2008, -17/+13I didn't check under my bed for a purple elephant, it must be there because I wish it was!
        • card51short, on 05/13/2008, -9/+13"I didn't check under my bed for a purple elephant, it must be there because I wish it was!"

          You should verify if there is one or not if you think there is one.

          so...there was no investigation, right? Herkimer is saying there was.
        • Look4Truth, on 05/13/2008, -9/+14"you don't need any degree to know there was no search through the debris FOR explosives."

          Maybe when they get done reassembling the airplanes...oh wait...
      • LucidOne, on 05/13/2008, -10/+25You don't have to have a degree in forensic science to know that the government destroyed the crime scene of the worst mass murder in modern US history. They couldn't cart away the evidence fast enough! They even used the pulverized bodies of the victims to fill NY City potholes! Disgusting!
        • PolishLogic, on 05/13/2008, -13/+5I call that reducing your carbon footprint.
        • Herkimer56, on 05/13/2008, -17/+12Except that the government didn't destroy the crime scene and the debris was preserved and examined for more than a year before it was disposed of. Any more lies you'd like to tell?
        • LucidOne, on 05/13/2008, -9/+22You are the liar here Herki and everyone knows it! The crime scene was destroyed as quickly as possible and NO real investigation has ever been completed. It's a fact.
          • Hortnon, on 05/13/2008, -14/+10Prove
            It
          • sealbeater, on 05/14/2008, -7/+12He's right, do a google search for 9/11 China steel beams and you'll see how fast the evidence was carted off to India and China. No investigation done at all.
          • JohnReb, on 05/14/2008, -9/+7Funny, I rode past that heap of debris twice a day for about a year as it was being taken apart and sorted out. Anyone who says it was quickly sent away is either simply parroting what they were told, or flat out lying.
          • Look4Truth, on 05/14/2008, -6/+10"Anyone who says it was quickly sent away is either simply parroting what they were told, or flat out lying."

            Lol, and where exactly is it all being looked at? Hmm? Reports please? Links?

            Didn't think so.
          • Herkimer56, on 05/14/2008, -9/+7I wonder if any of these idiots are aware that many pieces of the debris still exist and are in labs all over the world? All of the debris was held at Fresh Kills until it had been studied, sorted, cataloged and tested. There were literally thousands of crime scene experts from every local, state and Federal law enforcement agency looking at every piece of debris for anything anomalous and they found absolutely nothing that would lead a reasonable person to believe that there were explosives present in any of the buildings. Despite this, these basement dwelling boneheads would have us believe that they know more about what was found in the debris then the people who actually did the searching and the laboratory work. Their arrogance is surpassed only by their ignorance.
          • JohnReb, on 05/14/2008, -8/+5http://www.nyc.gov/html/dcp/html/fkl/fkl6.shtml
            "After the FBI, NYPD, and Office of Emergency Management determined the process of retrieval had been exhaustive and complete the screened and sifted WTC materials remaining at Fresh Kills were placed in a 48-acre area (the materials area) immediately adjacent to the recovery site on the West Mound (Section 1/9) at Fresh Kills. A layer of clean soil at least 1 foot deep was placed in this area prior to placement of the screened materials; afterward it was covered with additional clean soil to protect the site and control erosion. The area is clearly marked to prevent disturbance."
        • card51short, on 05/13/2008, -9/+13Herkimer why would the Government investigate the rubble for explosives when only a lunatic would think explosives were in the WTC?
          • PolishLogic, on 05/13/2008, -12/+7"only a lunatic would think explosives were in the WTC"

            Couldn't have said it better myself.
          • card51short, on 05/14/2008, -1/+1so then why would they do a search through the rubble for explosives, Polish?
      • YourMothersMilk, on 05/13/2008, -11/+26You don't need a degree in structural engineering to see that Tower 7 was destroyed by a controlled demolition.
        • PolishLogic, on 05/13/2008, -17/+15No, you don't. However, without any background in structural engineering or controlled demolitions, you're merely offering up an opinion on how the events occurred.

          While I don't have that background, I've witnessed 3 controlled demolitions and none of those 3 looked anything like what happened to the WTC buildings. Not even close. Now, until I witness how a controlled demolition of a building completely stocked with office equipment, restaurant equipment, retail equipment, and people looks, I have nothing to compare it to. Meaning, until evidence surfaces that shows beyond a doubt that it was a controlled demolition, I can't get behind that theory.

          As for the conspiracy concerning the government being the ones that planned and carried out 9/11, I only have to say this. Why involve 1000's of people, fake plane records, fake passengers, fake phone calls, fake everything, when they just could have driven 8 trucks (4 in each building) loaded to the brim with explosives (say twice as powerful as the OKC explosion, per truck) and brought them down in a heartbeat. This way you involve maybe 20-25 people, rather than numerous agencies, the military, civilians, etc.

          There are so many more convenient ways, involving MUCH less risk of error, to accomplish that mission. That's why I don't buy the 9/11 conspiracies.
          • kemp34, on 05/14/2008, -2/+3But you do buy that there was a conspiracy. You just believe it was a conspiracy carried out solely by a couple dozen Islamic extremists. You believe in a certain type of conspiracy.
          • Herkimer56, on 05/14/2008, -1/+2I believe in facts, logic and critical thinking. Since you're clearly unfamiliar with those terms I would suggest dictionary.com for more information.
        • Herkimer56, on 05/13/2008, -17/+15Apparently you're having a bit of difficulty with reading comprehension, Mother. There has never been any trace of any explosive of any kind found anywhere in the debris of any of the buildings in the WTC. In short, you cannot have a controlled demolition without explosives.
          • buckrogers1965, on 05/14/2008, -7/+7Why did they find fragments of bones of the people from the WTC on all the rooftops of the surrounding buildings? A simple collapse would never have the energy to pulverize living bone and spray it out for 1000 meters in every direction. Only high explosives could do that.
          • Herkimer56, on 05/14/2008, -7/+8Ever heard of kinetic energy? Google it.
          • inobla, on 05/14/2008, -7/+7"A simple collapse would never have the energy to pulverize living bone and spray it out for 1000 meters in every direction."

            Are you joking?! *****, you guys are an **endless** barrel of laughs.

            Did you see the images of the buildings as they collapsed? You know, the ones with pulverized DUST and DEBRIS jetting out sideways for hundreds of feet? No, that wasn't explosives you were seeing. That was air being forced out from inside each floor - pushing out all the pulverized debris with it. If concrete can get crushed to dust as each floor progressively buckled downward, with the weight and crushed up material from previously collapsed floors in the mix ... exactly what do you expect a human body is going to look like after being subjected to the same environment? (OH LOOK AT THIS GUY, LETS GIVE HIM CPR AND SEE IF HE MAKES IT!!) .. not

            I suggest you follow Herkimer's advice and look the formula E=.5mv^2 over a bit. Look at some good estimates of the weight (mass) and velocity (fast, but no, it wasn't freefall). Plug the numbers into the formula. Now compare that to the strength of living human bone.

            Another hint... there was **WAY** more energy at the concentrated node of collapse than what would be required from the explosives you think were necessary to cause the collapse itself. Any bodies in or through that node would be mince meat - bones and all.

            Please stop parroting false claims about physics like that one.
        • card51short, on 05/13/2008, -13/+17WAIT A SECOND!!! HE'S RIGHT!! IF THE GOVERNMENT WERE TO DO IT, THEY WOULD USE 4 TRUCKS FOR EACH BUILDING!
          CASE CLOSED...AL QAEDA DID IT.

          We all know the government would only use trucks. Whew!

          Just quit now while you're behind...go back to the top XBOX games of 2006 thread.
          • PolishLogic, on 05/13/2008, -11/+9The point just passed right over your head.

            What's an easier scenario to carry out:

            1: One that involves multiple government agencies and their personnel, the military, civilians, local law enforcement and fire personnel acting in unison and then keeping them all silent.

            2: One that involves 20-30 operatives rigging 8 tractor-trailers to the brim with explosives and planting a few of them at the base of each buildings.

            I'm assuming you're going to say the first one is much simpler and leaves much less room for error. Considering some of your other insightful comments about this topic.
          • kemp34, on 05/14/2008, -2/+4I have not heard one person make the claim you list in scenario number one. The thing could have been carried out by 50 select individuals. Additionally, what of the theory that certain portions of intelligence knew, but did not try to stop it? What of the theory that there was nominal support by various global agencies? Your claim is that there was a minimal conspiracy of a couple dozen Islamic extremists and they pulled off the greatest collection of attacks against all odds, with ultra-minimal response from our defense forces. I do not know what exactly led to 9/11, but you sure seem to think you know everything.
          • Herkimer56, on 05/14/2008, -2/+3"I have not heard one person make the claim you list in scenario number one."
            Alex Jones has made just that claim. Are you really going to claim that 50 people could have snuck in to the towers and planted the several tons of explosives that would have been necessary to bring the towers down? You're delusional.
          • card51short, on 05/14/2008, -3/+1Polish...so are you saying the government didn't have a hand on it because they didn't chose the easiest option available?
            Good logic ;) You should join a debate club!

            "Alex Jones has made just that claim. Are you really going to claim that 50 people could have snuck in to the towers and planted the several tons of explosives that would have been necessary to bring the towers down? You're delusional."

            If the 50 people did so in a span of a long period of time...do you think it's impossible?
          • card51short, on 05/14/2008, -1/+1also why didn't al Qaeda just use truck bombs? Wouldn't that be way easier than risking the hijacking, not being shot down AND hitting your targets? It would require tons of less training for flying and hijacking, too.
            PLUS, half of them were on the no-fly list. Why would they take these huge risks?
    • Bilabrin, on 05/13/2008, -10/+18Here's what an architecht had to say about it...
      http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-818269776 ...

      here's what a structural engineer had to say:
      http://www.opednews.com/maxwrite/link.php?id=31639
      • Herkimer56, on 05/13/2008, -19/+17Richard Gage is a complete fraud. He's still pushing controlled demolition even though he's perfectly aware that there were no explosives in the building. I've read Billy Rice-William's little letter to the editor and he's just as clueless as Gage. In his article he couldn't even talk about the way the towers were constructed without getting the facts completely wrong.
        • Bilabrin, on 05/13/2008, -10/+23That's a somewhat blithe dismissal of a 2 hour presentation of evidence. At least provide a link or two.

          The funny thing is, that since nobody really wants to believe that 9/11was anything other than 2 planes taking down the twin towers, some of us will not be convinced no matter the amount or quality of the evidence. Ask yourself, do you have an open mind enough that any evidence could ever convince you that 9/11 was staged? What would it be?

          Here's a website debunking another website which claims to debunk Richard Gage.
          http://www.opednews.com/maxwrite/diarypage.php?did ...
          • PolishLogic, on 05/13/2008, -13/+12I love the "open mind" argument. Especially considering that those who throw that out there have just as much of a closed mind as they accuse others of having.

            Also, you do realize that if one spends enough time on Google they could find sites that debunk sites that debunk sites that debunk sites. Then they could even find a site that debunks those. That's what makes the whole 9/11 conspiracy so entertaining.
          • Bilabrin, on 05/14/2008, -4/+6Hey I have an open mind. I'd love for someone to come along and debunk the truthers completely but they have mountains and mountians of evidence.

            What really bothers me about 9/11 is that the argument is basically that a chunk of floors dropped two or 3 stories and that converted enough potential energy to kinetic energy to demolish every other floor of that building? I could see a few stories collapsing but then the upper part should have toppled over and fell off to the side when the enegry of the falling upper part was dampened in the form of a few crushed floors.
          • LadyKofNYC, on 05/14/2008, -4/+2Exactly, Bilabrin. There is simply no way those towers could have collapsed all the way to the ground while simultaneously causing thousands of tons of concrete and glass to pulverize into fine breathable dust without an enormous amount to ADDED energy.
          • Hortnon, on 05/14/2008, -3/+6The assumption, being, of course, that only the concrete turned to dust, and that all of it did.

            This is where you're wrong.
          • ssn697, on 05/14/2008, -1/+4"but they have mountains and mountians of evidence. "

            So, where is it? I have evidence from MIT, Michigan State, Purdue, Univ. of Sydney, the USCE, etc. that clearly debunks the controlled demolition theory. If you are open minded, why doesn't any of that evidence count?
          • Bilabrin, on 05/15/2008, -0/+1Tell you what, I'll google those sources in regards to 9/11 and see what I come up with. That open minded enough for you? Some links would be appreciated.
        • card51short, on 05/13/2008, -12/+13no Herkimer, YOU get the facts wrong!!! No backsies!

          Care to provide any data or evidence or you just making accusations with nothing to back them up?
        • KloroFormd, on 05/13/2008, -9/+14What's your opinion on Building 7?
          • Herkimer56, on 05/14/2008, -10/+8What do you care? You're going to say I'm wrong anyway. Go find someone else to play your little games with.
          • LadyKofNYC, on 05/14/2008, -2/+3Herkle insists that Building 7 didn't collapse straight down. He thinks the North wall of building 7 fell backwards and then leaped up and fell forwards.
          • card51short, on 05/14/2008, -1/+2hahahahahahah hilarious...then again, Herkimer is a structural engineer. Remember, only they can have an opinion ;)
          • KloroFormd, on 05/14/2008, -1/+2I was simply asking to hear his opinion on it, and get attacked. An opinion can never be wrong IMO, it's just an opinion.

            I just want to see where you stand, Herkimer.
    • lead2thehead, on 05/13/2008, -9/+10Yes, I'm sure it had nothing to do with the two jumbo jets that crashed into it. No... somebody snuck into the world trade center with hundreds of pounds of explosives, prepped the building for demolition in downtown Manhattan without anyone noticing, and it was all a big ploy to go to war with the peace-loving saints in Al Qaida. You people are insane.
      • buckrogers1965, on 05/14/2008, -5/+9The buildings were designed to take two airplane hits each from planes the same size with full fuel loads. That was part of the design process.
        • JohnReb, on 05/14/2008, -7/+10No it wasn't, it was calculated, after the design was done, that they could withstand one hit by a 707 that wasn't almost out of duel and flying at approach speed to land at nearby Newark Airport.
          • JohnReb, on 05/14/2008, -6/+5That should read "was almost out of fuel" not "wasn't almost out of duel"
            I shouldn't type when I'm tired.
          • inobla, on 05/14/2008, -6/+4Good thing you pointed out the correction... Otherwise some troofer would have used that typo to invalidate you're entire argument. Standard troof logic.
          • card51short, on 05/14/2008, -2/+2JohnReb, I have Leslie Robertson (Designer of WTC towers) on tape saying they could withstand MULTIPLE 707 crashes.
            Are you telling me by "multiple" he only meant 2? OK, we'll say 2. Are you saying that one 757 causes more damage than 2 707s hitting?
          • JohnReb, on 05/15/2008, -1/+1Show me the tape.
            The information I have uncovered all says a hit by a 707 looking for or missing Newark Airport on final approach.
    • BESTenemy, on 05/13/2008, -10/+10I don't believe our government would be smart enough to pull off a white flag operation such as 9/11, yet at the same time fail to do simple things such as planting fake WMD's in Iraq when they went looking for them...

      Also, if there was a controlled demolition, what was the point of flying the planes into buildings? Wouldn't it be sufficient to just have the buildings collapse and link the events to the last time Bin Laden tried blowing up the towers?
      • buckrogers1965, on 05/14/2008, -5/+10If the buildings had both just collapsed with no warning it wouldn't have been as dramatic and shocking. The shock doctrine requires that the public be overwhelmed with hours and hours of horror that culminates to a peak. Only then will we be willing to just accept things like 2000 page patriot acts that they had ready to go and that was passed without even being read.
        • Herkimer56, on 05/14/2008, -8/+5Yeah, because if two large bombs had gone off in the basement unannounced, brought both buildings down immediately and killed maybe 50,000 or 60,000 people it wouldn't have been nearly as dramatic as what happened. Are you really as stupid as your postings indicate?
        • card51short, on 05/14/2008, -1/+2Herkimer, no one would have seen it...there would of been no video.
  • suzywang3000, on 05/13/2008, -14/+33what what what??!! controlled demolition by the US gov't??
    • LucidOne, on 05/13/2008, -8/+21You got it Suzy! Don't stop there, investigate! Find out for yourself what is really going on, it's nothing like what you've been told!
      • Herkimer56, on 05/13/2008, -17/+10Certainly not if she's been told by the likes of you.
        • LucidOne, on 05/13/2008, -7/+12It must be really frustrating for you Herki, dedicating your life to suppressing the truth only to get disrespected and dug DOWN. I can tell because you get more and more desperate as time passes. You've got nothing left but insults and lies. Poor thing.
          • PlagueOfMorons, on 05/14/2008, -1/+4Well, Herkimer does a hole card. He's being considered for a news position on FOX.
            I believe he'll be the assistant who reads the news stories to the anchormen over their earphones, because they don't know how to read anything, much less cue cards. On the other hand, with Herk reading them their lines their speech will go something like "You're all a bunch of POOPYHEADS!! Yidddit fffftthhhhh ganag ganag!!"
    • mysql101, on 05/13/2008, -8/+3The US Govt is so inept that it's laughable that anyone would try to convince us that they were able to pull off killing thousands on US soil without someone from the inside spilling the beans. We can't even strip prisoners and make fun of them without it getting out.
      • spawnfree, on 05/14/2008, -1/+4how can anyone spill the beans when only a small handful of trusted individuals actually know the truth.
        and they are not telling. there is nothing we can do if they don't own up.

        in other news; yesterday i weakened the top of a tree in my garden and it fell down through the trunk of the tree and reduced it all to a pile of sawdust and splinters. Im guessing everyone does it this way.
        • LeRobot, on 05/27/2008, -0/+0The fact that comparing a tree to the WTC gets +3 diggs shows what a bunch of groupthink cultists the troofers are. What a complete joke.
  • Dumbledorito, on 05/13/2008, -16/+46What's worse is that it was a no-bid contract.
    • PolishLogic, on 05/13/2008, -11/+6Yes, god forbid they accept bids on the cleanup and leave blocks worth of garbage sitting in the middle of Lower Manhattan for months until they finalized the bids and ensuing contracts. Nobody would mind that at all.

      /facepalm
      • card51short, on 05/13/2008, -4/+11ummm huh? bids take months?
        People are going to worry about garbage when there is 230470934809 tons of wreckage clogging up the area?
        • PolishLogic, on 05/13/2008, -7/+4Yes, bid processes can take months to go through. Bureaucracies are a bitch.

          Psst, the wreckage is want I was referring to when I said garbage.
        • card51short, on 05/14/2008, -0/+1Polish...you realize the rubble was there for years being cleaned up, bid or no bid, right?
    • Observant1, on 05/14/2008, -0/+3pretty darn convenient coincidence how the controlled demolition company happened to be in town shortly before the event isnt it.
  • sockpuppets, on 05/13/2008, -48/+35Oh look the truthers are on digg spreading ***** again.

    Buried.
  • inajeep, on 05/13/2008, -39/+26Looks like they found a group of like minded conspiracy theorist to dig the article and then digg up the comments. Sorry still not believing.
    • card51short, on 05/13/2008, -9/+17sounds like a conspiracy theory you got going there...
      tin foil nut
      • inajeep, on 05/14/2008, -2/+1Name calling doesn't make you right, it just makes you look more foolish.
  • bhod, on 05/13/2008, -39/+17you moonbats just need to give it up already. anyway, if there was any wrongdoing on the part of the republican controlled government then you should vote for obama because as president he would investigate and put those responsible in jail. i'm not saying that there were controlled demolitions involved, but if there was, then obama would take care of it. he only looks out for the interest of the american people and not the corporations. believe.
    obama 08!
    • ats314, on 05/13/2008, -5/+12If there was any wrongdoing?
      Seriously?
      • Herkimer56, on 05/13/2008, -13/+8You can prove that there was? You have evidence that will stand up in court? Nope. You have ignorance, bias and a willingness to believe the ***** of the Cult of 9/11 despite the fact that they can't prove a single thing they say.
    • card51short, on 05/13/2008, -6/+9"you moonbats just need to give it up already. anyway, if there was any wrongdoing on the part of the republican controlled government then you should vote for obama because as president he would investigate and put those responsible in jail. "

      So you're calling Obama a moonbat? Why do you hate America so much?
  • macweirdo42, on 05/13/2008, -24/+74If the government really wanted to pull off a great conspiracy, you know what they'd do? They'd find a group that wants to kill Americans - there's lots of them around. They'd monitor their activities, they'd figure out their plot... And they'd quietly ignore it. They'd give the guys a free pass to do whatever the hell they wanted. If there was a government conspiracy, oh, believe me, it'd be so freakin' easy... And no one at all would know, because there'd be no evidence. I mean, do any of you truthers understand how easy it'd be for the government to allow terrorists to slip a briefcase bomb into the United States? You get intel, and you quietly slip it under the rug. And where would be the evidence? The best you could do would be to speculate that the government knew ahead of time, and that's tenuous at best. Oh, believe me truthers, if the government truly wanted to ***** us over, it'd be so much easier than you paint it, and so much less complex, too.
    • Yetisquatch, on 05/13/2008, -5/+23There are still quite a few things that dont make sense about that day but what you just described is the conclusion I came to as well.
      • gbv23, on 05/13/2008, -2/+8Agreed --and that is still (obviously) different from the "official" story ----sadly, the more outlandish claims have the side-effect of discrediting anyone who dares question the official story.
        • barkus, on 05/13/2008, -5/+5Agree as well. I'd even go so far as to suggest the conspiracy that the government clandestinely propagates the most extreme versions of the 9/11 conspiracies to make all dissenters of the official story appear as a lunatic fringe.
          • theright, on 05/14/2008, -3/+6I'd even go as far as to suggest the conspiracy that the government clandestinely propagates conspiracies that the government clandestinely propagates the most extreme versions of the 9/11 conspiracies to make all dissenters of the official story appear as a lunatic fringe, to make all "dissenters" of the official story appear as a lunatic fringe.

            Conspiracy or not, it's working...
      • theright, on 05/14/2008, -4/+6Hi there, Yetisquatch.

        Any questions, or "things that don't make sense" with regards to the attacks. Just ask, and I'll be happy to fill you in. Questions are great, pre-conceived opinions are not.
    • asskicker32, on 05/13/2008, -9/+9This sounds plausible... What i dont understand is the idiots saying "It had to be nuclear bombs inside" because they obviously have no idea how steel is made, nuclear bombs work, explosions work or pretty much anything...
      • Cryptocracy, on 08/17/2008, -6/+7what idiots said that? must of been disinfo....
      • Herkimer56, on 05/14/2008, -7/+8There is a distinct movement within the Cult of 9/11 that still insist that small nukes were detonated inside both towers. Their claims are no more outlandish than the orbital laser people, the "no-planes" people or the controlled demolition people. All of those theories can and have been easily disproved.
      • buckrogers1965, on 05/14/2008, -1/+3I remember that theory, and disregarded it, because every electronic device present would have at least clicked and altered the video if a nuke, even a small one went off. You should have seen every camera that was on flash and click at the same time, if they didn't burn out altogether.
    • schneidafunk, on 05/13/2008, -7/+14Agreed. Anyone who's worked for the government knows how completely inept they are. When I was a kid, I believed in conspiracies and that a highly intelligent small elite group of people controlled the world. Then when I worked for the air force (I was on a secure base on the east coast during the 9/11 attacks) I realized how completely unorganized and bloated the government really is. *****, I'm assuming most people here have not worked for the government, but as a small example look at the DMV or the post office. That being said, I don't believe the U.S. government purposely caused 9/11 to happen, but I do think they are covering up details about the true nature of the event.
      • nycmac247, on 05/13/2008, -4/+10"compartmentalization"
        • schneidafunk, on 05/13/2008, -6/+6Explain how this relates to 9/11. It's obvious you've never worked for the government. If so, which department (or compartment as you would call it) do you work in?

          Have people forgotten that the radical muslims who've sworn to destroy America tried blowing up the world trade center in 1993?
        • Cryptocracy, on 08/17/2008, -4/+8wrong, schneider...the FBI did it.
          http://www.whatreallyhappened.com/RANCHO/POLITICS/ ...
          • theright, on 05/14/2008, -5/+6I'm a nice guy, so I'll give you the opportunity to retract that statement if you don't want to be embarrassed.

            In deciding if you want to take me up on that offer, just consider one of us two knows what they're talking about with regards to this matter...
          • GovernmentSp00k, on 05/14/2008, -0/+2You take that statement so personally! like your mother got called out or something. You have vested interest in the FBI being held accountable. Why could that be. Were you involved in the '93 attacks? Let me guess: one of you two is an FBI employee defending their livelihood and the other is not. Or was it really radical freedom hating islamic patsies who did those too, all by themselves? Our massive multi billion dollar state of the art military industrial complex and all of the taxpayer funded alphabest soup agencies put together FBI NSA CENTCOM DOD ACC ANG DLA DSS FINCEN CID DA Pentagon FEMA CIA Army Navy Airforce Marines are no match whatsoever for low life primitive degenerate radicals and their "suprise" attacks on America! And to think, NOBODY was tracking these people. They sure do like those WTC towers for some reason. Probably because they're symbols of American freedom & democracy and all that.
        • card51short, on 05/14/2008, -0/+4you mean you were a...PILOT...and they didn't fill you in on everything they were doing?

          Well, now I trust the government...even though they are "totally incompetent".
          • GovernmentSp00k, on 05/14/2008, -0/+3That certainly is the illusion to be propped up by the powers that be. We're so incompetent we can't even balance the budget properly! That's our middle name, incompetence! Silly us, we're so incompetent the left hand doesn't know what the right hand is doing! Smoke & mirrors dichotomy. Much like the phony left / right paradigm they feverishly promote and prefer you believe exists. Divide and conquer at it's finest. Brilliant plan really, when you think about it.

            'Incompetance' is far less likely when carried out by a small group within the much larger organization. Ask Sibel Edmonds.

            "In politics nothing happens 'by chance.' If something happens, then you can bet that it was planned that way."
            -FDR
    • nycmac247, on 05/13/2008, -5/+8not easy to fly a plane that big the way that they were supposedly flown.
      really - not easy.
    • barkus, on 05/13/2008, -6/+9It's possible that the US government knew and it's very likely that elements in the Israeli government knew.

      http://www.huffingtonpost.com/philip-giraldi/whats ...
      • Herkimer56, on 05/14/2008, -8/+6Oh, yes, there's always a minimum of one "Blame Israel!" nutjob on every truther or Ron Paul thread but they don't usually link to dead pages.
      • barkus, on 05/14/2008, -3/+8Fixed
        http://www.huffingtonpost.com/philip-giraldi/whats ...

        Here's some more evidence. It is as close to a smoking gun as you'll get. One of the five Mossad agents who was caught filming as celebrating the attacks slipped up by stating that they were "there to document the event" on an Israeli talk show. This is not possible unless they had prior knowledge of the attacks.
        http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w0hmhLycNyQ&feature ...
        • theright, on 05/14/2008, -5/+3Just a few minor errors with the second half of your post:

          1. The men were not Mossad agents. The FBI found no evidence of ties to Mossad. The men themselves deny being members of Mossad. There is no evidence to suggest they were Mossad agents. None

          2. They were not caught filming or "celebrating" the attacks. Two separate eyewitnesses at separate locations called the police, one noting that (from a distance) they didn't appear saddened by what they were seeing. One of the witnesses had previously had arguments with the company the men worked for, and had a long-standing grudge against the company. Claims that they were smiling, taking pictures of themselves in front of the burning towers, etc. are all overdramatized and unsubstantiated

          3. The man did not stay they were "there to document the event". He stated their "purpose was to document the event". That does not imply foreknowledge. Use of the word "purpose" is perhaps misleading, and most probably a translation issue considering English may well not be his first language. The man clearly meant to state nothing more than that all they were doing was documenting the event, as thousands of other people in New York and New Jersey did that day
    • blueridgewv, on 05/14/2008, -2/+3Do you realize how easy it would be for a terrorist, or even a teenager, to cause major havoc in the U.S. today? Yet we are told that "Islamo fascists want to kill us every day", and nothing has happened for 7 years, not even a firecracker in a mall! (Americans have more to fear from each other, driving the roads, crime, or even lightening!) Anyone here could do better than this.
      The only conclusion is that the propaganda about "terrorists determined to kill us" cannot be true, and is at minimum overblown, a total "conspiracy theory" that is lacking evidence. Do you really think Homeland Security or airport screening can prevent anything from happening, or that suicide bombers are afraid of Bush or U.S. government? Just who is perpetrating a conspiracy theory? Explain this if you can with a rational argument.
      Meanwhile it is not Islamo Fascism being erected, but Federal Fascism, which republicans who claim to believe in "limited government and individual liberty" should recognize more than anyone.
  • redcolumbine, on 05/13/2008, -25/+13Please digg this effort to prevent a recurrence: http://digg.com/2008_us_elections/No_False_Flag_Oc ...
    • Herkimer56, on 05/13/2008, -12/+12Spam your trash elsewhere.
      • ChildofDestiny, on 05/13/2008, -10/+12Says the digg troll with 12000+ comments...
        • LadyKofNYC, on 05/14/2008, -6/+613000+
          • jcm267, on 05/14/2008, -5/+5Says the "woman" who blindly diggs dozens of Ron Paul submissions in spans as short as 10 minutes.
        • PlagueOfMorons, on 05/14/2008, -4/+6Well, actually, it's one comment repeated 12000 times: "You're all marons! Yes, marons! Ninny ninny pthbbbt ptang ptang goowowie om nom nom nom. And that's the OFFICIAL truth you're too stupid to understand!"

          Someday the nurse is going to walk over and ask "What are you doing at the keyboard, Mr. Herkimer?" and then it's all going to be over for him.
        • jcm267, on 05/14/2008, -5/+7What does the number of Herkimer's comments have to do with anything?
          • buckrogers1965, on 05/14/2008, -2/+5Well, with that many comments on one site, it's almost like it's his job to post here or something.
          • jcm267, on 05/14/2008, -4/+3There are lots of people who have made tons of comments here. I, for instance, have tons of comments here. No one has to pay Herkimer or I to come here and point out to the world that you people are idiots. We find it entertaining.

            The only reason why it's so rare for Ronbots to get to have as many comments as us is because those who comment a lot usually wind up getting their panties in a bunch over something that an "enemy of freedom" says and then say something that is over the line. Ronbots and Truthers tend to be not too bright and a little on the crazy side.
  • swrostmore, on 05/13/2008, -17/+27Why doesn't the article NAME the senator that they make the allegations about? It just says "Arizona Senator (R)"... bury me if I'm missing something.
    • theviceroy, on 05/13/2008, -10/+7possibly an attempt to make people think the article is about John McCain?
    • 10001110101, on 05/13/2008, -1/+23Gotta read to the end:
      Sen. Karen S. Johnson, R-Mesa, represents District 18.
      Freedom Communications / Arizona
    • blueridgewv, on 05/14/2008, -0/+2Are you blind? Her name is listed at both the top and bottom of her "commentary", just below the newspaper's name.
  • yohnstoppable, on 05/13/2008, -28/+47When the hell did Dale Gribble get elected to the Arizona senate? And when did digg get overrun by dumbass truthers?
    • BrapAllgood, on 05/13/2008, -15/+15Just before you got buried, I think.
    • Jexie, on 05/13/2008, -14/+18digg was overrun by truthers right around the same time people who do not believe the official government story on 9/11 became a majority.
      • Hortnon, on 05/13/2008, -12/+12A majority, huh? lol
        • Jexie, on 05/13/2008, -9/+11I'm not saying the 'official' truther stance is correct, just that most people recognize you'd have to be ***** retarded to believe a plane crashed into the pentagon or that wtc7 naturally fell. Its not hard to believe there is a lot of BS coming from the gov't about what happened.
          • Hortnon, on 05/13/2008, -8/+12Really? Most? I call *****. Prove it.

            The Jones-commissioned Zogby poll showed only 5% believed in the truther version, so you're gonna have to work hard for this one.
          • Jexie, on 05/14/2008, -2/+2I can't prove it, and the Zogby poll is irrelevant to what I said since I have already stated I am not supporting any official truther version. Its just plain as day that a jumbo jet does not crash into a building, completely disintegrate not leaving one speck of itself and leave the window panes intact 6 inches from the hole it made in the building. You can call *****, I'm calling complete retardation.
      • theright, on 05/13/2008, -7/+7A majority? Try 4%.

        That's right. 4%.
        • ats314, on 05/14/2008, -1/+5not being a smart ass, but source please?
          • Hortnon, on 05/14/2008, -7/+4http://www.911truth.org/images/ZogbyPoll2007.pdf

            Page 5:
            There are three main schools of thought regarding the 9/11 attacks. The first theory is the official story, and maintains that 19 Arab fundamentalists executed a surprise attack which caught US intelligence and military forces off guard. The second theory known as Let It Happen argues that certain elements in the US government knew the attacks were coming but consciously let them proceed for various political, military and economic motives; and the third theory Made It Happen contends that certain US government elements actively planned or assisted some aspects of the attacks. Based upon your knowledge of 9/11 events and their aftermath, which theory are you more likely to agree with?

            Official Story: 63.6%
            Let it Happen: 26.4%
            Made it Happen: 4.6%
            Not Sure: 5.5%

            Margin of Error of +/- 3.1

            Keep in mind, this poll was paid for in large part by 911truth.org
          • Hortnon, on 05/14/2008, -7/+3BURIED?!

            I'm quoting from a truther website! If you guys don't like your own websites, you're in for some problems...
    • Herkimer56, on 05/13/2008, -13/+16That's never happened, dumb-ass, and it never will. The vast majority of the American people are too intelligent to believe the garbage put out by the likes of you.
    • card51short, on 05/13/2008, -10/+7no YOU'RE a truther dumbass!!!
    • JMScheib, on 05/13/2008, -4/+6Comment of the week.
  • Look4Truth, on 05/13/2008, -44/+47Loose Change Final Cut
    http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-371925900 ...

    The Smoking Gun of 9-11 (WTC7)
    http://youtube.com/watch?v=P-uWyjwHY7g

    Patriots Question 9/11
    http://www.patriotsquestion911.com/

    TerrorStorm
    http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=7860484536 ...

    7/7 Ripple Effect
    http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=8756795263 ...

    America: Freedom to Fascism
    http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-165688030 ...

    9/11 Flight 93 Rare Footage
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JZekosYOmXc

    Endgame
    http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=1070329053 ...

    Larry Silverstein, WTC 7, and the 9/11 Demolition
    http://www.whatreallyhappened.com/cutter.html

    Interview with Stacey Loizeaux
    http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/kaboom/loizeaux.html

    Money as Debt
    http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-905047436 ...

    BBC Reported Building 7 Collapse 20 Minutes Before It Fell
    http://youtube.com/watch?v=C7SwOT29gbc

    Comparison Vid - The Planned WTC Demolition
    http://youtube.com/watch?v=Qa7PN-8T2VY
  • Easty, on 05/13/2008, -19/+52Wait, so they flew planes into the towers, but also it was a bomb. Also government did it. Yeah.
    • emalen, on 05/13/2008, -26/+14Actually, yes.
    • SkippyDoorknob, on 05/13/2008, -6/+14So the US government is so incompetent that it can't figure out how to deal with the whole Iraq issue, national debt, and an approaching recession but at the same time is super genius enough to be able to pull off a conspiracy that would require hundreds of people to be involved (and remain totally silent) and years of precise planning and preparation?
      • Troy64, on 05/13/2008, -5/+10They couldn't even plant WMDs in Iraq. Any government that could pull off 9/11 would have no problem planting WMDs.
      • spawnfree, on 05/14/2008, -3/+2if i had billions of potential profit resting on my actions i would get my ***** together and start hiring the right people.
        then hire more people to convince the people paying for everything that i was just incompetent.
        Oh dear the war is dragging on, why don't these suckers demand i offer my services at cost during wartime to prove my patriotism? Oh ***** we are winning, get Cheney to pull troops out for some ***** reason.
        Then i could retire and buy an island or two with my loot or piss it away on my idiot children.. that would be good for me so ***** all of you guys. Being a sociopath is cool, who doesn't want to be one these days?
  • 911cartoon, on 05/13/2008, -16/+15good stuff
  • PolishLogic, on 05/13/2008, -33/+33Conspiracy theories are cash cows.
    • Herkimer56, on 05/13/2008, -18/+12Just ask Alex Jones.
      • Akufen, on 05/13/2008, -4/+9Or those who go around trying to spread disinfo and protect the official version so obsessively that their motivation could only be a paycheck.
        • LadyKofNYC, on 05/14/2008, -4/+6Herkle's been hard at work ALL day. Half the comments on this thread are his, and they can all be boiled down to ...."shut up you stoooopid"
          • Herkimer56, on 05/14/2008, -5/+3Only you. "Lady"K, but that's only because you're so stoooopid.
        • Herkimer56, on 05/14/2008, -6/+3I just don't like liars like you, Akufen.
    • card51short, on 05/13/2008, -9/+10hahahahahahah yeah the cash is just rolling in.
      OMG THE GOVERNMENT DID IT...QUICK, SEND MONEY TO WHOEVER TOLD ME!!!!
      • theright, on 05/14/2008, -5/+6Well, that mentality has proved rather profitable for Alex Jones, David Ray Griffin, William Rodriguez, Louder than Common Sense, WeAreDERANGED...

        It's almost kind of funny to watch 9/11 deniers deplore the corporate media while failing to see the conflicts of interest that undermine the very leaders of their "movement"...
        • Akufen, on 05/14/2008, -3/+8You're absolutely right, because everyone who gets a paycheck is corrupt. Yup, absolutely. Valid reasoning. Honestly.
          • theright, on 05/14/2008, -2/+4Who said anything about corruption? I cited blatant conflicts of interest, but I made no accusations of corruption. I'd appreciate it if you don't put words into my mouth.

            It is, however, interesting to see you come so close, but still fail to connect the dots...
          • Akufen, on 05/14/2008, -0/+1You cited nothing. You pasted a list of people/groups, added those 3rd grade JREF wordgames and assumed you had a point. You don't. They don't like corporate media, that's the only valid point you had. So please tell me how not liking corporate media is a "blatant conflict of interest" with anything.

            And for your information, there's no such thing as leaders of the 9/11 movement.
      • card51short, on 05/14/2008, -0/+2"Well, that mentality has proved rather profitable for Alex Jones, David Ray Griffin, William Rodriguez, Louder than Common Sense, WeAreDERANGED..."

        Proof? Please post their salaries before 9/11 and then their salaries after 9/11.

        Thanks!!
  • ToastedZergling, on 05/13/2008, -18/+32corrupt gov'ts are the real cash cows
  • oldhick, on 05/13/2008, -14/+23I may have missed something, as I often do... But as I read the article, I saw nothing new in it. Is the story more credible because a Senator says so?