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198 Comments
- gronne, on 10/12/2007, -25/+144I don't. If it wasn't for people like him spreading all the FUD about homosexuality he wouldn't have to live a secret life!
- whereisian, on 10/12/2007, -17/+91I totally feel bad for this guy. It doesn't sound like he promoted hate. It sounds more like he was raised in a such a rigid community where he couldn't express himself for fear of reprisal.
I won't pass judgment on this man. I only hope his soul can heal. Perhaps Evangelicals can begin to rethink their stance so that they stop persecuting others and their own - as other sects have done. - chulaka, on 10/12/2007, -20/+87My first reaction was, "love it"... ***** like him does enumerable damage to other human beings. But, in the end, I feel sorry for him.
- iching, on 10/12/2007, -7/+41I think it was the hypocrisy and not his homosexuality which caused him to resign.
Jesus never really spoke out against homosexuality (lived with 12 men) but did speak out against hypocrisy in most of his works
Matthew 23
"Woe to you Scribes and Pharisees, You Hypocrites".............
"When he tells a lie, he speaks in character, because he is a liar and the father of lies." (Jn 8:40-44)
But really in comes down to this thought by Shakespeare
"To thine own self be true, and it must follow, as the night the day, thou canst not then be false to any man. "
William Shakespeare - CanceledCzech, on 10/12/2007, -20/+51Yeah, true. But even though, I only have three letters for anything like this: L, O, and L. Honestly, the irony is crazy. I think people need to realize that Homosexuality is not a choice, it's something you're born with.
- sxtxixtxcxh, on 10/12/2007, -4/+33Barnes described struggling with what he believes is the biblical teaching that homosexuality is an abomination. Over the years, he grew to accept that "this is my thorn in the flesh."
that's no thorn. - gonzoradio, on 10/12/2007, -4/+31As a gay person, I just feel sorry for Barnes and his family. Unlike Ted Haggard, Barnes didn't get politically involved in anti-gay measures, or preach hate against homosexuals. And his open apology - as well as his frank discussion of what his childhood was like - puts him light-years ahead of "Queen of Denial" Haggard. I don't agree with his theology or his politics. But I don't know how you can be anything but sorry to see a life ruined because of fear. Here's hoping he can learn to accept himself and help other closeted Christians do the same.
- Silencer7, on 10/12/2007, -6/+32If sexual orientation were in any way truly malleable, and if this guy really had any special connection with some divine creator being, he would have been 'cured' long ago, as would Haggard have been.
Conclusion: Gay's not a choice, there is no interventionist god, give up the fairy tales and find a different way to put meaning into your life. - RobotKing, on 10/12/2007, -2/+26I want to see the Megazord fight this so called Megachurch to the death.
- dodoporridge, on 10/12/2007, -11/+35"Another way to look at it is that if certain elements of a relationship between a father and son are not the way they're supposed to be before a boy hits puberty, his need for affection and desire for validation from his father gets mixed up with his developing sexuality, and becomes something so deep that it's almost impossible to sort out."
That's a load of crap. Gay (and straight) people come from all kinds of families; they don't all have dysfunctional relationships with their fathers. You're a *****. - Lynxpro, on 10/12/2007, -13/+35@gr8one
Sounds like you are referring to the Freudian view which would make it a psychological component and not a biological one. Call me crazy - no pun intended - but I don't think that's the accepted view today.
Now all we need are some evangelicals to come out of the scientific closet and profess a belief in evolution... :) - Neiby, on 10/12/2007, -5/+27Christian ministry must be a popular field for males trying to disguise their homosexuality. I personally know of two other cases of this in Colorado that are further in the past.
- Neiby, on 10/12/2007, -3/+24You're 100% correct, but unfortunately you have no hope of convincing the faithful of that.
- Neiby, on 10/12/2007, -6/+25This stuff isn't "few and far between". It's rampant. I'm not referring to homosexuality, per se, but sexual 'sin" is quite common. It just usually doesn't make front page news.
- ThePottsDome, on 10/12/2007, -3/+21Lacks Cow Bell
- inactive, on 10/12/2007, -3/+20Guys in this situation really don't count as hypocrites. Sure, they preach that homosexuality is bad and wrong, but that's why the guy resigned his post too. To be a hypocrite, you have to think it's bad when others do it, but think it's OK when you do.
Christians are pretty willing to accept that we all have vices, and kind of ***** up from time to time. And they're generally willing to forgive you if you genuinely feel bad about it, which this guy clearly does. (Not that I think he has anything to feel bad about, but he seems to think he does).
/Also I'm pretty sure having roommates doesn't exactly make you gay. I was going to make a comment about frat houses, but realized they're probably not the best example. - zephc, on 10/12/2007, -1/+18I remember having a crush on a girl when I was in 1st grade. At that age, I had no idea what it really meant, other than I couldn't stop looking at her :-P (P.S., Yes, I'm a guy)
- wssharp, on 10/12/2007, -6/+23i think that he said that he was "struggling with homosexuality" speaks volumes. homosexuality shouldn't be something that people struggle with, it should be just another difference that people embrace about each other. i could go into a big rant about social constructs and how no one ever "struggles with heterosexuality," but meh.
and of course it doesn't help that the perceived community solution to this will be "thoughts and prayers," instead of open-mindedness. bummer. - gonzoradio, on 10/12/2007, -2/+18@Eleo
Crazy as it sounds, a lot of us DO know very early on. Not in sexual terms - you're right, you're not thinking that way at 5. But many gays and lesbians say they knew in first grade they didn't fit in. They couldn't understand it or explain it, but they knew there was something important about their relation to their own gender that didn't fit other people's expectations. - DyDx, on 10/12/2007, -6/+22@Lynxpro and gr8one: In fact, Freud's childhood sexuality theories are completely false. Freud was so full of ***** it's not even funny.
He did, however, popularize psychology and concoct psychoanalysis. Sure, psychoanalysis as it is known today isn't the same as Freud's, nor is it anymore effective than other therapies, but it was such a massively popular movement and technique that it has great affected Western Culture, and for that he is still talked about. - missflibbles, on 10/12/2007, -3/+19I'm gonna go out on a limb and say that I don't think anyone considers Christians Hippocrates.
Hippocrates was a philosopher, numbnuts. - slipknotrobb, on 10/12/2007, -5/+20What, did you think Ted Haggard was the only christian hypocrite out there?
- Trublmakr, on 10/12/2007, -5/+19I'm long out of academics, but I think it would be useful to study the apparent relationship of between those with the need to disguise their own behavior/guilt and religion. It's almost as though the shroud of religious self-rightousness is a tool.,. intentionally used by these folks in a very manipulative way. After all,.. a church leader would never abuse a young boy,.. and BTW, God definately needs more of your money this month.
- r81984, on 10/12/2007, -6/+20All through history religion was used as a tool to control people and to allow and coverup immoral activity.
This kind of ***** propably has been going on for 1000 years and only in the past 50 years are we now stopping it. - inactive, on 10/12/2007, -1/+14@ irieKEN
It is news because it is the response to "No Gays In The Military" & "No Gay Marriage" & "God Hates Fags." It is news because it exposes a flaw in a religion that punishes homosexuals every day. The deliverers, explainers and enforcers of the word of god are incapable of following the word of god. Imagine how many young gay men sat in front of this man and wondered what was wrong with them. Why they couldn't be noble and pious like this preacher. - brianbennett, on 10/12/2007, -0/+12It's quite obvious to me, preachers of all denominations need to get laid more, especially the catholic ones.
- Eleo, on 10/12/2007, -3/+15I'm gay and I didn't really have any idea of it until I was 13 or so. At the age of five I had no clue.
- BuckCynnie, on 10/12/2007, -0/+12What I find interesting about this and other steppings-down of homosexuals as leader of Christian churches is that for years the parishioners looked up to them as good leaders. I would think that these people would see first hand that sexual orientation doesn't effect the quality of that person.
- ICSU, on 10/12/2007, -8/+20hope so
- gonzoradio, on 10/12/2007, -4/+15@zbych -
Thanks for the vitriol, babe. The gay-haters out there really needed another good reason.
All Christians are EVIL! - Just like all of us gays are EVIL? If you see a problem with the second assertion, you'd better think twice about the first.
Hate doesn't fix hate. So from one formerly religious queer to another, please do us all a favor and either grow up or shut up. - Ninjab3ar, on 10/12/2007, -5/+16again?
- irieKEN, on 10/12/2007, -1/+11Probably has more to do with the amount of repression in conservative culture. They don't figure themselves out in a healthy way.
- tiffers, on 10/12/2007, -2/+12I know one of the New Lifers (Haggard's Church). He was whining that he's afraid Haggard's scandal would break the church apart. If the "Church" was based on true faith, instead of FUD, then it shouldn't be torn apart by one scandal. Something about that reaction (that it is tearing a religion apart) screams cult! Especially because both men founded their "Churches" in their basements. Bottomline: If evangelicals would stop preaching about topics that *in theory* shouldn't affect them, then they would stop being victims of their own vindictive preaching.
- groovytrance, on 10/12/2007, -0/+10"Church elder Russ Pilcher said the reaction at services Sunday was largely concern for the couple. "I thought, 'Where did I fall short in making myself so unapproachable that he couldn't come to me?"' Pilcher said. "
I wish more people had the same outlook as Pilcher, "What kind of 'friend' am I that this person had to hide from me?"
I was glad to see a reaction from a Christian that was actually Christian-like, for once. - Kalluas, on 10/12/2007, -5/+15This may be the most elegant no digg I have ever read.
- irieKEN, on 10/12/2007, -3/+12Just because he knew he was attracted to men since he was 5 doesn't mean that he was SEXUALLY attracted to them. 4 year olds fall in love all the time, and there's nothing sexual going through their heads.
At least this guy had the balls not to blame his sexual orientation on a drinking problem:P - ckinney23, on 10/12/2007, -9/+18If there was more tolerance from Christian conservative groups, he wouldn't need to feel ashamed. He shouldn't feel ashamed. This is an example of religion twisted into something horribly detrimental to humanity, something of which history has all to many examples.
- ZenMojo, on 10/12/2007, -1/+10The problem is, these are people who are raised to hate themselves and others. How are they supposed to break out of the cycle?
- dashiel, on 10/12/2007, -7/+16jesus as i recall didn't mention sex at all in the gospels. there are three or four instances where he talks about divorce/adultery and it being wrong. it was that prick paul who got all uppity about sex and started forbidding all sorts of things -- homosexuality, pre-marital sex... the guy was off his rocker and basically said no one should engage in sex ever, but if they had to do it they should get married.
- Rorrim, on 10/12/2007, -1/+9Personally, I think that everyone is born with an inherent type/state of sexuality, and also an inherent degree of malleability: how people are affected by how they observe and interpret the world in early psychological development.
Can it really be that _all_ gays are born that way or _all_ gays were influenced that way? Couldn't it be some and some? That's just my thoughts on this. It's not like any one person can know for sure. - mczolton, on 10/12/2007, -5/+13Good.
- Bytor, on 10/12/2007, -1/+9I feel sorry for the guy, but on one hand he is not very bright. He gets involved with the church because he is gay and thinks that may help. Talk about your crazy irony. The church is the main source promoting hatred of homosexuals today. Without their influence on this we might have a gay tolerant society by this point.
Gay people are certainly over represented in the church, which is kind of hilarious when you think about it. Often for misguided reasons like this guys.
I wonder what the next 10 years will bring, Will the USA keep moving in the direction of Saudi Arabia, or will it move in the direction of Sweden like the rest of the civilized world? - missflibbles, on 10/12/2007, -1/+9The Christian community helps these people as long as they don't do anything about their sexuality. If they stay in the closet, or they at least don't visibly date other men, the community is fine with it.
- drizek, on 10/12/2007, -5/+13Maybe he was brought up catholic?
- IMA_Sellout, on 10/12/2007, -3/+10In the words of my favorite gay singer, Freddy Mercury:
Another one bite the dust!
Ultimate pastor-man that should probably just come out and get it over with: Pat Roberson! - pkulak, on 10/12/2007, -2/+9"He said he cannot accept that a person is 'born that way,' so he looks to childhood influences."
Sheesh, now THAT's faith. Even when he IS "born that way", he doesn't believe it's possible. He seems like a good enough guy (not political, well liked, etc), but come on, this is just getting ridiculous. - whereisian, on 10/12/2007, -1/+8@marklj
I'm no biblical scholar, but it seems your comment is based in your denominational interpretation of the Bible. For instance, the United Church of Christ holds a different view.
http://www.suntimes.com/lifestyles/religion/156211,CST-NWS-rel01.article
(in Texas no less)
That's a funny thing to say if you don't want to get into a debate. - missflibbles, on 10/12/2007, -2/+9Atheist as I may be, your logic has a flaw there. Let's just say for the sake of argument this guy was preaching all the good stuff about Christianity, like helping the poor, loving your neighbor, and treating people nicely. If he goes against Leviticus, he's not allowed to preach these things?
Come on. Try harder next time. - inactive, on 10/12/2007, -4/+10Let me rephrase my comment: This is causing non-Christians to believe Christians are Hippocrates. It isn't helping Christianity at all. Its making it hard for Christianity to spread in America. The leaders of Christianity represent what a lot of people believe Christianity is.
- jarsfan2k8, on 08/13/2008, -0/+6Actually it is a mega church. When considering that a majority of the churches in America are @ most several hundred.
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