What is Digg?264 Comments
- 03FightOn, on 03/23/2008, -26/+81yo.... dumbflap...WE'RE A REPUBLIC!!!!!!!!!! Our REPRESENTATIVES decide. At the end of the day if we don't like the decisions made, we vote them out, otherwise STFU! Our government was specifically designed to PREVENT immediate polls from influencing policy.
- inactive, on 03/23/2008, -26/+62First of all, Congress decides when to go to war, not the President, not the Supreme Court, not a pure democracy (people voting).
Second, I wonder if the Washington Post made similar complaints when Bill Clinton was in office and engaged the military in many conflicts throughout the world...all without Congressional approval. No, the Washington Post supported Clinton's illegal use of the military then. Partisan politics anyone?
Finally, having people vote on such things would be a bad idea. Most American voters don't know where Iraq, Iran, Afghanistan, or most any other country is on a map. Heck, some young American voters don't even know where AMERICA is on the map.
I, for one, do NOT want such uneducated, unmotivated people voting...or sitting on my jury trial...or anything else of consequence.
The Founding Fathers of the United States knew what they were doing when they chose a Constitutional Republic, not a Direct Democracy. - inactive, on 03/23/2008, -31/+66Since when is American policy dictated by poll results?
- SoulDrift404, on 03/23/2008, -1/+21It's the "representative" part of a "representative democracy" that makes Darth's "SOO?????????????" comment so intensely irritating. God I wanted to beat the crap out of that ornery bastard at that moment.
- diggduggjoe, on 03/23/2008, -0/+16Well, there is a silly part of the Constitution where congress declares war. The whole purpose is that the reps are subject to election every 2 years and should listen to the people. The very people who may be drafted, enslaved (if we lose), bankrupt (due to costs) or injured. When the congress gave Mr Bush a blank check and said "You handle it.", they broke the oath they swore to uphold the Constitution. Unfortunately, the people are too stupid or just do not care to address that they too have the responsibility to manage our country. We are all to blame when we derail our country by ignoring our most important document, The Constitution.
- inactive, on 03/23/2008, -4/+19Finally, a major article reminding everyone that there are three branches of government in the United States, and that its not the executive's job to decide yes or no on wars. War is congress's job, and congress's job is to listen to the people, and if the people say no, congress needs to say no. Its the way the American system was designed, and its a good system... its not straw poll politicking... its good governance.
- eigenweasel, on 03/23/2008, -7/+20And by "The American People" I presume you mean the clique of a handful of media owners who tell them what to think.
- Herolint, on 03/23/2008, -0/+13It wouldn't work today either given the sheer number of uneducated fools.
- gofalcons, on 03/23/2008, -2/+13Look, if the American people decided when we would go to war, then we would NEVER go to war unless it was to defend ourselves! I mean, come on people, how are military contractors gonna make billions of dollars unchecked if we can't fight aggressive wars overseas with no oversight? How are we going to keep people in fear if we're not fighting a war against an invisible enemy? You people don't think about stuff like that do you?
- inactive, on 03/23/2008, -11/+22The "American People" shouldn't be allowed to decide much of anything. They've shown time and time again that they're collectively retarded.
- pagancollective, on 03/23/2008, -4/+14So, this guy is jumping ship when it's already the ***** Titanic.
...he's a former supporter that wants to make as much room as possible between himself and that political figure. His job is based around political opinion (giving political-based lectures, writing literature on the subject, etc). Supporting bat-***** Cheney isn't in his interest anymore.
There's a reason why conservative presidential hopefuls didn't want Bush (at first) to make any public appearances or shows of support. Thankfully - finally - people are starting to realize the ineptitude and inherent idiocy of this administration. He has the lowest approval rating of any president in history, and that's coming off of the highest approval rating ever (after 9/11).
The man's ***** terrible, his administration is terrible, and their regard for both human life and the democratic system are terrible. This professor jumping ship at a politically convenient time doesn't strike me as all that inspiring. - Randrayla, on 03/23/2008, -0/+9The problem is that no one votes for who they want in congress. They only care about who the president is. Wake up people, the real power is in congress.
- Ganja420, on 03/23/2008, -2/+11The masses are asses
- Dundasbro, on 03/23/2008, -4/+13Well a direct democracy wouldn't work in America back in the day of the founding fathers anway, given the sheer logistics of communication of votes.
- curtisag, on 03/23/2008, -2/+10This is ignorant. We are a Republic precisely to avoid mob rule. That was one of the worst fears of the founders, so they setup a system where people get to vote every 4 years, but can't throw the President out of office when they are disenchanted with his decisions. They have to wait, reflect, and make a new choice next time. However, there are checks and balances on the President (rather there is suppose to be). According to the constitution, only the congress may declare a war. But that part of the constitution is ignored as anachronistic. We would all be a lot better off if we just followed the rules laid down for us by the founders. The people had their chance to end the war and vote Bush out of office.
- Kzoo, on 03/23/2008, -1/+9I think you and Ell3 missed the point of the article. The author wasn't saying the people should directly decide things (we'd never get anything done... that's one BIG committee, and there -are- a ton of stupid people out there), but that those who are in charge of the war shouldn't be completely dismissing us out of hand. I.e. give us reasons and evidence that what we're doing is the right thing. We're free to disagree, but that shows much more respect for us (well, at least it makes them look better), and shows the leadership understands that they're not dictators (or at least makes it look better -.-).
- zippy757, on 03/23/2008, -5/+13Facts are Facts:
Even AFTER Pearl H, the vast majority of American's wanted to stay out of 'Europe's war' and let them deal with Germany and Japan.
While the poster showing us signing up in droves were a little beyond reality, most American's simply didn't want to fight. I did.
Imagine if the US had not defeated Germany and Japan ..... (with all due respect to their current populations who are nothing like their pre-WWII )
We elect the president. That's why it's so very important to VOTE. - laserblazer, on 03/23/2008, -2/+10What a laughably incorrect statement. America's grasp on Iraq is tenuous at best. Too much Fox News for you.
- xXIrsotehkewlXx, on 03/23/2008, -9/+15Yes it should.
Have you met people in the United States?
A majority of people aren't exactly the type I want dictating any policy.
The representatives were voted in because they were trusted members of a community. They could speak up for what was in the best interest. What is in the best interest is not always what you want to happen. - SpinningHead, on 03/23/2008, -0/+6I dont think the constitutional right to petition the government is there for people to STFU. We have a duty to vote and those elected officials also have a duty to SERVE, not exploit.
- floorman56, on 03/23/2008, -1/+7The American People Should Decide if the Nation Goes to War? ...OK
From a poll in 2002 ...before the war ..More than six-in-ten Americans say they would back such an action.
http://people-press.org/reports/display.php3?Repor ... - inactive, on 03/23/2008, -0/+6The title "The American People Should Decide if the Nation Goes to War" alludes to your common Joe but if you people think that is the answer, you forget that it is the Congress' job to 'declare' war which is in fact, 'the people' that we elect and are urged to call or write letters to.
Remember, we are not in a 'declared' war either, just a hijacked 'conflict' that all smart congressmen have been against. - an0nymous, on 03/23/2008, -5/+11I am not defending Cheney in any way, but the interview ABC aired and the transcript released by the White House are not in agreement. There is a cut from the interviewer to Cheney in the abc video, so it's possible that it is not complete and correct. ABC should address this. It's important to be accurate particularly in matters as inflammatory as this. If the White House is lying, that's important too.
From the White House transcript:
THE VICE PRESIDENT: I don't know how long it's going to take. I do know we have to get it done. And if it takes a long time, that doesn't make it any less worthwhile. This has been a hard-fought, difficult, challenging thing for us to do, when you think about what we've done here. We've gone in and toppled one of the world's worst dictators, liberated 25 million people, helped them hold three national elections and write a constitution. They've been through some very difficult times themselves, but we kept at it, because it's the right thing to do. And when we needed to make a major decision, as the President did a year ago January, he made that decision and committed more troops. When we needed to modify our strategy to win on the ground from a security standpoint, we did it. And General Petraeus, his forces performed magnificently with a new counterinsurgency doctrine. He could have quit two years ago, and today Iraq would be chaos; al Qaeda would control large swaths of the country; it probably would be a safe haven for terrorists; certainly it would have been a much worse situation from the standpoint of the Iraqi people.
It's hard to go into a country that has never experienced democracy and expect to be able to flip a switch and have it turn overnight. But it is turning. They do have a democracy today. They have basic --
Q Two-thirds of Americans say it was not worth fighting.
THE VICE PRESIDENT: They ought to go spend time, like you and I have, Martha. You know what's been happening in Iraq. You've been there as much as anybody. There has, in fact, been fundamental change and transformation, and improvement for the better. I think even you would admit that.
Q Let me go back to the Americans. Two-thirds of Americans say it's not worth fighting, and they're looking at the value gain versus the cost in American lives, certainly, and Iraqi lives.
THE VICE PRESIDENT: So?
Q So -- you don't care what the American people think?
THE VICE PRESIDENT: No, I think you cannot be blown off course by the fluctuations in the public opinion polls. Think about what would have happened if Abraham Lincoln had paid attention to polls, if they had had polls during the Civil War. He never would have succeeded if he hadn't had a clear objective, a vision for where he wanted to go, and he was willing to withstand the slings and arrows of the political wars in order to get there. And this President has been very courageous, very consistent, very determined to continue down the course we were on and to achieve our objective. And that's victory in Iraq, that's the establishment of a democracy where there's never been a democracy, it's the establishment of a regime that respects the rights and liberties of their people, as an ally for the United States in the war against terror, and as a positive force for change in the Middle East. That's a huge accomplishment. - Kzoo, on 03/23/2008, -2/+8I give up. Everybody seems to have missed the point.
- inactive, on 03/23/2008, -7/+13I never had a problem with true conservative ideology, but I would fight to the death to save american people from the scourge of Imperial Conservativism. Its in that principal that I raised my right hand and swore to preserve and defend the constitution of the United States against all enemies foreign and DOMESTIC. As a member of the U.S Military,
- mchugh22, on 03/23/2008, -1/+6To bad congress didn't even vote on this war.The president just did it. Everyone knows how Washington really works. Representatives get elected with money from big business. They throw in earmarks to keep their district happy and then they give companies like Halliburton no-bid contracts so they keep their campaign funding .
- laserblazer, on 03/23/2008, -1/+6If that was your real opinion, seek help. If it was sarcasm, it was way too dry.
- lacronicus, on 03/23/2008, -1/+6As opposed to what? a representative democracy? In case you didn't notice, all hell is already breaking loose. Our economy is failing, our VP is openly apathetic towards the opinions of the American people, we are stuck in at least two "conflicts" with no end in sight with more likely on the way, and you're trying to tell me everything is working just fine? Please...
- SpinningHead, on 03/23/2008, -0/+5Since when is writing letters and protesting mutually exclusive to posting on DIgg?
Nobody claimed anyone didnt have the right to speak, which is why I responded to a comment I found defensive of power while contemptuous of the will of the people. - Cumella, on 03/23/2008, -3/+8I sure as hell don't want every eligible voter deciding whether we should go to war or not. Have you seen your fellow Americans? The government was set up this way for a reason. People need to shut up and understand that a direct democracy = all hell breaking loose.
- roosevans, on 03/23/2008, -11/+16American policy should not be dictated by poll results, but American policy should not disregard poll results either, in my opinion/
- MrTarot, on 03/23/2008, -2/+7The "President" was busy misleading the public, the UN, and the world with as many things as he could come up with at the time to get the public at large to want to go to war with Iraq. I would think even you would remember that we were a fairly upset nation of people that wanted to lash out at the people we felt responsible It's really NOT the people at fault for being misinformed and wanting to revisit Iraq.
The fact is, Congress let him get away with whatever he wanted and thus, so did the people that are responsible for that person being in Congress. - EtherGnat, on 03/23/2008, -0/+5You can't just blame the President--either Bush or Clinton. Congress seems perfectly happy to go along with the situation. For some reason they don't want to actually declare war anymore.
- jbenson2, on 03/23/2008, -1/+6Chilean coup d'état of 1973 - big deal IF you are from Chile - otherwise, a minor blip in history
- the3rdkey, on 03/23/2008, -0/+5"Here, the people rule." I almost ***** my pants loling when I read this.
- thehappyhobo, on 03/23/2008, -2/+7If you read the article, it didn't call for direct democracy. Rather it made the case for the people's elected representatives actually listening to their voters and then making up their minds. Cheney's answer was outrageously cavalier for an official in any democratic system to make.
- diggduggjoe, on 03/23/2008, -1/+5No! We get out of the damn bed and start fixing the mess.
- DiggLive, on 03/23/2008, -8/+12He's still around?
- inactive, on 03/23/2008, -2/+6This entire article is so idiotic. As I recall, the American people were just thrilled to go to war. They were thrilled to go around calling anyone who opposed the war fags, Nazis, terrorists, and traitors. These are the same American people who elected the congressmen that granted Bush the authority to go to war.
And now these same American people are howling about the evil Empire, headed by Emperor Bush and Darth Cheney. We need to face the facts - we made the bed, and now we have to lie in it. - Ryalnos, on 03/23/2008, -0/+4Actually, that's probably not true.
- TheSabre, on 03/23/2008, -0/+4Is that some kind of Canadian poetry?
- eryximachus, on 03/24/2008, -0/+4Actually, the majority of Americans at this point receive some form of government assistance. Today, the reality is the minority of Americans are enslaved to support the majority. Sounds a lot like Soviet Russia to me. I'm fine with the concept of democracy, but the moment you receive government assistance - your right to vote should be revoked.
History has shown us time and time again that most people are selfish to the point of self destruction. They will vote to divert the public treasury to their own pockets at the expense of future generations. Just look at the enormous national debt the Baby Boomers have bestowed upon their children. - floorman56, on 03/23/2008, -0/+4Clinton's "illegal" acts of aggression lasted for 5 years
Humm we still have troops in Bosnia... should Bush remove them? - gianpo, on 03/23/2008, -3/+7Well lying to everyone willfully isn't exactly legal. He should be impeached and thrown in prison for massive fraud and mass murder.
- pintomp3, on 03/23/2008, -3/+7why is mickey surprised? cheney has never hidden his view that the executive branch should rule unilaterally without checks and balances or oversight. cheney is about as undemocratic as they come. he was pissed that nixon should have to answer to congress. he thinks being elected president means being king for four years. he doesn't care for what the people want and he doesn't care about the constitution, he only cares about consolidation of power.
- inactive, on 03/23/2008, -0/+4Keep in mind we dont live in a pure democracy, but rather a form of democracy called a republic. We elect officials to make decisions for us. The majority does not dictate what we do, but (if the current administration isnt full of douche bags) it can and should sway it. Dick Cheney's "So" comment was not necessarily wrong... just really really dickish (no pun intended). I believe he said it that way because it makes him feel like an alpha male or something stupid like that.
Also you should all remember that we ALL were more then happy to go to war in Afghanistan after 9/11. Many people also supported going to Iraq because at the time we thought we would be fighting more terrorists. In a way we did agree to this war. Look at bushes popularity right after 9/11 if you don't believe me. - kingUssop, on 03/23/2008, -0/+4Sounds like you want a King and not just a government official...
- happyhead7, on 03/23/2008, -2/+5in 4 years, people are going to look back and watch Ron Paul youtube videos and apologize for calling him a loon.
- inactive, on 03/23/2008, -2/+5True, but we're talking about the principals and rationale behind who officially declares that America goes to war. Let's not promote the idea that illegally taking the nation to war is to be overlooked because the body count hasn't reached a certain mark.
- inactive, on 03/23/2008, -1/+4First of all, Americans ween't privy to the confidential information of Iraq's WMD program. I immediately questioned Iraq as a target for many reasons including a personal vendetta by Bush, but you have to trust that your government wouldn't outright lie to you. They did. So you can blame Congress for allowing Bush to destroy an entire country for no reason because they saw those confidential reports and voted to go ahead, but the American People cannot be blamed. Putting a referendum on whether to go to war is ridiculous since we will never see all the information.
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