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221 Comments
- CaptCarrot, on 10/23/2009, -7/+166Libraries should carry books about everything.
- BullBearMS, on 10/23/2009, -8/+75As usual, The Onion said it best:
<quote>
Difficult as it may be to believe, just three years ago, this 44-year-old churchgoing family man was a construction worker, nightclub regular, and self-described "party slut" in Los Angeles' seamy homosexual underground. But now, thanks to the friends he has made through the Orange County-based Reclamation Ministries, all that has changed. Today, Lindeman is living a new life, one of devotion to his wife and children, piety before the Lord, and intense self-hatred and shame in the face of his entirely unchanged sexual orientation.
"Before I was converted to the light of the Lord, I was constantly indulging my sinful, natural sexual desires," Lindeman said. "But now, with the help of Jesus, all those group gropes in the backs of abandoned trucks near the warehouse district are just so many shadowy memories, fueling so many secret masturbation sessions, followed by paralyzing attacks of guilt and fear, and frantic prayers begging forgiveness."
<end quote>
Read the rest here: http://www.theonion.com/content/node/28799 - Crimeodial, on 10/23/2009, -4/+65Well, it's B.S, but they should carry the books. Freedom of speech and all.
- lydecker, on 10/23/2009, -5/+65Sure. If someone is uncomfortable with who they are and feels the only option is to try and change it, I still wish the best for them. And I hope they don't get hurt when they fail.
But by "You Don't Have To Be Gay" they really mean "You Don't Have To Follow Your Sexual Orientation, You Can Totally Marry Someone You're Not Attracted To And Life Isn't That Bad. Except The Sex." - inactive, on 10/23/2009, -1/+56You Don't Have to Be Gay by Sen. Larry Craig
- rocknog, on 10/23/2009, -9/+48You and other amateur medical experts are a ***** danger to society. I mean, you make these great proclamations like "Homosexuality is a mental disorder," or "Vaccines cause autism," and you know what, people buy into that ***** and there are real consequences. And yet, you're totally immune to the suffering you cause because you wrap yourself up in this deranged fantasy world where facts don't matter.
- SQLDigger, on 10/23/2009, -5/+38That's a bit of a tall order, as there are books on a lot more subjects than most libraries can deal with, especially small town libraries. The most I would say is that there should be no active prohibition of acquiring a book if members of the community (whose taxes pay for the library) request it.
- Diefree, on 10/23/2009, -14/+46Those "cures" for being gay are brainwashing and cause severe mental harm. You're a bigot David, it's that simple.
- Elranzer, on 10/23/2009, -6/+37Because homosexuality is not a mental disorder.
- Salif, on 10/23/2009, -1/+31Libraries should be an open, uncensored source for all knowledge and thought, even when it comes from bigots and racists. In the end, I believe this open exchange of information will be for the best, most educated people (in time this should be the majority) will realize that these are books written by homophobic fanatics with insane agendas. "Gay Reversal" is a complete fabrication brought upon by extreme social pressures and abuse.
- Diefree, on 10/23/2009, -12/+41Reported for homphobic bigotry. Being gay is not a mental disorder, being a ***** idiot like you on the other hand.
- rocknog, on 10/23/2009, -7/+36The use of profanity has absolutely nothing to do with the legitimacy of my argument. Your argument that it does, however, only further demonstrates how utterly ***** moronic you are when you can't grasp the barest principles of logic.
- lydecker, on 10/23/2009, -1/+30Because nobody has shown to be successful at changing their sexual orientation, only covering it. All conversion therapies are shown to operate on this method.
- chrismwood, on 10/23/2009, -14/+39Back in the closet you *****!
/DavidNiven - zephc, on 10/23/2009, -3/+26I'm sure its already there, in the fiction section.
- krazikamikaze, on 10/23/2009, -0/+22Of course they should. Right next to the mountains of evidence showing people are born gay and can't be "fixed", plus all the books about homosexuals who try to pretend they're straight--marry a woman, have kids--only to realize later in life they're horribly depressed and start soliciting gay sex in airport bathrooms or frequenting male prostitutes.
- tmyprod, on 10/23/2009, -2/+24Libraries should be able (if not encouraged) to carry any and all books, even books about why Libraries shouldn't be allowed carry certain books.
- inactive, on 10/23/2009, -3/+24Grabbing onto profanity rather than addressing the argument shows the lack of a brain in DavidNiven's head.
- consonance, on 10/23/2009, -2/+22The fundie propaganda.
- jmyhc4, on 10/23/2009, -1/+20Just because the people in charge of an institution are intelligent and secular doesn't mean they are extremists. And, dear troll, Fox "News" is neither news, nor is it opinion. Opinions are formed when a person looks at a fact and determines for themselves what the true nature of a situation is. This is most obviously lacking from any "report" made by those broadcasters. The stuff spewing out of the sorry excuse for a media outlet are outright lies and slander.
Of course "President Asshat" has a problem with people tell bold faced lies about him. If I were to act like a Faux News host talking about Obama I would tell people that you sodomize horses while wearing purple frilly night gowns. Then when you got upset, I would tell you that that is my opinion of what you do. - CaptCarrot, on 10/23/2009, -6/+25A good portion of books are donated to libraries, not purchased. So if someone donates copies of this book, the library should have no problem having it on the shelves.
- Solkre, on 10/23/2009, -4/+23I don't see why a library shouldn't carry any book, as long as it's content is legal (IE no CP pop-up picture books).
- rocknog, on 10/23/2009, -21/+39Censorship is wrong, I agree, but you're a ***** lunatic. Once again, you have absolutely NO IDEA what the ***** are you babbling on about. Just shut the ***** up already. Where you get all these ideas, I have no ***** clue, but I've never known anyone as ***** stupid as you. The fact that you can form coherent sentences is in itself nothing short of a miracle. You go out there, you spew nothing but lies, you repeatedly demonstrate no understanding of the subject matters you comment on, I'd be surprised if you've ever had anything in the way of formal education, you routinely make statements that are both factually and logically not only wrong, but nonsensical - if I knew you personally, I'd have you committed because your ramblings sound utterly deranged.
- SQLDigger, on 10/23/2009, -2/+20That's pretty much what I meant ;). Libraries shouldn't be censoring anything that doesn't violate reasonable laws (like blocking access to pornography to kids). Once the government starts treating its citizens like children, we have a serious problem.
- inactive, on 10/23/2009, -7/+25Perhaps if "gay conversion" wasn't one of the easiest ways to make a gay person commit suicide... Of course, that's what DN wants. Just like he's fine with women dying in back-alley abortions because they can't access real medical attention, he's fine with gay teenagers killing themselves because they've been fed lies about who they are.
- lydecker, on 10/23/2009, -8/+25Should heterosexuals not be exposed to ALL aspects of their sexuality, including the possibility of a change in their sexual inclinations? Should we try these same tactics used here on heterosexuals?
The militant heterosexual activists already have heterosexuality taught to kindergarteners because those kids need to be exposed to the truth should have NO problem with learning that if somebody touches you, you should tell an adult. Or that some families (like the ones they see everyday) are led by two people of the same gender.
Why should we only "indoctrinate" people into heterosexuality? We're not, we're just for education- equal education. - inactive, on 10/23/2009, -5/+20"Gay conversion" is a pseudoscience and one of the quickest and easiest ways to make a gay teenager commit suicide.
- CaptCarrot, on 10/23/2009, -4/+19Granted, space requirements do limit a specific building from carrying as many books as would be required to cover *all* topics. But just so long as nobody -- even the tax-paying community members -- can stop a *single* tax-paying community member from getting a book through the library. (And inter-library loans go a long way toward overcoming the space problems of a single institution.)
- Rikushix, on 10/24/2009, -2/+14As much as I disagree with the material in these books the fact that they are by definition books makes them suitable for libraries. If someone wants to voluntarily read it, they should have the freedom to. At least if it's donated or otherwise privately provided. I'm not sure I would want my tax money going towards my public library purchasing something like this.
- CaptCarrot, on 10/23/2009, -5/+17Dugg down upon re-reading your post for putting the word books in sarcasm quotes. They're books, period.
- 4degrees, on 10/23/2009, -6/+18it's a book, library should have it.
- ayeroxor, on 10/24/2009, -0/+12What the hell is wrong with you, Carrot? Imagine waking up in a world where everyone was gay and liked the ***** and they thought you were sick for liking pussy.
Could they somehow turn you to find hairy chests and asses attractive? To want to suck a *****?
Could they? - maml, on 10/24/2009, -1/+12Libraries have a responsibility to be clearinghouses of information, but they don't infringe on freedom of speech by NOT carrying your book. You don't have a right to the library's shelf space.
I've been an initial screener for donations to a couple University libraries. We generally recycled (sent to the books sale our just put in the green bin) religious pamphlets, diet books, and outdated computer manuals (don't give your library "The complete idiots guide to DOS", they don't want it.). They were out of the scope of our collection. I High School Library is there in support of the school curriculum. It's purpose is the educate, not mislead. Gay conversion is pseudo-science, and doesn't belong there. Unless a teacher is doing a course on *****, which would be a great elective for seniors. - Joker99352, on 10/23/2009, -0/+11Isn't that where you keep torrented music?
- Diefree, on 10/24/2009, -0/+11Siszam you're a hypocrite and idiot and I'll prove it. Do you wear clothes made of more than one type of fabric? Eat shellfish? Ever worked on the Sabbath? Ever were in the same bed as a woman on her period?
Now just run along little bigot. - rocknog, on 10/24/2009, -1/+12Abk0110, by your definition, stamp collecting is a mental disorder - it's a rare behavior that greatly deviates from the norm of human behavior, and it requires special accommodations in order for a stamp collector to live out his ideal life, collecting stamps.
- SQLDigger, on 10/23/2009, -3/+14Actually, I'd call it redundant.
- askantik, on 10/23/2009, -2/+12STOP WASTIN MY TAX MUNEE ON THEM THERE GOD DAMN BOOKS. FUK THAT! ABAWLISH LIBERRIES! SOCIALISM!
:] - disappointed, on 10/24/2009, -1/+11There's no hard line between "normal" and "crazy" but the general rule is that a particular behaviour might be considered a symptom of a psychological disorder if it is harmful to the individual. Homosexual behaviour would not be considered harmful in any modern, liberal society. So it would just be classified as a personality type. As far as I know - I'm no shrink or anything.
- cmost, on 10/23/2009, -3/+13I can't seem to understand why anyone would think that someone else's sex life is any of their business! What consenting adults do in their own homes isn't for the government or anyone else to judge. Homosexuality has existed since the dawn of man and can even be observed in a multitude of animal and insect species. Get over it!!! If church goers and others of their ilk really want to preserve the sanctity of marriage, maybe they should be lobbying to outlaw divorce!
- emkaysmith, on 10/24/2009, -0/+10Speaking as a recently retired public library professional in a very large city system with 35+ years of experience: Censorship is never, ever right. Period. I mean, a library can't buy *everything* -- they couldn't afford it. And where would you put it? But not buying a book because you don't approve of its content is extremely unprofessional.
However, having survived several politically & religiously motivated censorship campaigns over the years, I have to say I've never come across a professional librarian who wasn't outraged by the idea. It's virtually always the hobbyhorse of certain nutjobs on the city council, which has to answer to the voters, who are also the taxpayers. - catalysis, on 10/23/2009, -1/+11They see me trollin..
- robwhite1979, on 10/23/2009, -1/+10I don't get it... How can people seriously think that being gay is something that can be "unlearned". I know I never had to make the choice to be straight at any point in my life, so why would a gay dude have to choose to be gay? It's just something people are born being IMHO and the guys who write these books about going from being a gay guy to a straight guy are just total closet cases who need some kinda therapy so they can just accept themselves for who they are... It's creepy as hell...
- ljkelley, on 10/23/2009, -1/+10I see no reason why a library shouldn't carry the book. On the other hand I see no reason why they should be forced to carry it either.
- A11YND, on 10/24/2009, -0/+9Libraries are in my opinion the precursor to the internet, they should be an unfiltered bastion of knowledge and entertainment. While I don't believe at all that being gay is something you can reform I will still support the books being included in the library. Just because you don't agree with something doesn't mean that the counter arguments don't deserve the same credence as yours, once you limit one thing you can limit it all and that is in my opinion the very definition of Un-American.
- askantik, on 10/23/2009, -2/+11lol?
What you really meant is that neo-cons don't read books. Other than maybe Ann Coulter or Glenn Beck. And despite being overwhelming Evangelical, no, they do not read the Bible... or if they do, they don't act like it. - Elranzer, on 10/23/2009, -13/+22Wishful thinking on DavidNiven's part.
- bubgz, on 10/24/2009, -2/+11Freedom of speech is not the same thing as forcing an institution to requisition funds for hate speech. Libraries should not be forced to purchase neo nazi literature either.
- sugarazor, on 10/24/2009, -1/+10I'd consider Mein Kampf to fall under a historical context.
I can see both sides of the argument here, but I think it's definitely a good debate to have. "Gay conversion" is a myth concocted by religious nuts, so I don't see why these books should be anywhere but the fiction section, but at the same time, I don't want to be in the business of outright banning any book. - Chompy, on 10/24/2009, -0/+9Agreed. As long as "You Don't have to be Gay" is right next to "Being Gay is Awesome" and "Gaytown: Population, You", then I don't have a problem with libraries carrying it.
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