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- 89greener, on 10/12/2007, -2/+29Nine months? I have a close friend who spent no more than 7 months home. He recently (last week) was up-rooted from his GA home for his 3rd round of duty in Iraq. The only thing he left behind was his wife, two children, and his never-ending nightmares which result in him waking up bleeding from the mouth because he chewed his tongue and inner-lip during his sleep.
I'm sure those few extra months will counter-act years of death and destruction. - bagold51, on 10/12/2007, -3/+20Sounds like a transgression to me....besides, he's part of Bushco. What else can we expect from them next? Sending the troops back after only 1 month home? Kick them all out now.
- truspector, on 10/12/2007, -2/+14They signed up to "protect America". The didn't sign up to "police Iraq".
- venir, on 10/12/2007, -1/+13@matthewmok
Sounds like you're an ***** to me. - maffick, on 10/12/2007, -1/+11You *should* know what you're getting into, but recruiters lie all the time.
- ShawnC, on 10/12/2007, -3/+12Sorry 5 years Army, deployed for 4 of it. When you raise your hand and say "I swear to obey the orders of the Commander in Chief of the United States", you know what you're getting into.
If not, go buy a new house and don't pay for it and see if you can get out of that contractual agreement. Same thing. And there is a reason your contract doesn't have any specifics. - payload74, on 10/12/2007, -0/+8For those of us serving in the military you learn really quick not to believe anything unless you've got it in writing. The 12 month "pledge" is - as the article states - a goal not a "guarantee."
- cl0r0x70, on 10/12/2007, -2/+10None of the Army recruiters camped out in our high schools will tell you the following things:
1) The Army can lie to you, and, once you're enlisted, there's no recourse for you.
2) While most young men want to defend their country, you are more likely to be forced to fight in causes in which you do not occupy the moral high ground. These circumstances might include fighting against the populace in a foreign land as they defend their own soil. You may even be called on to fight peaceful protesters.
3) You can be used in chemical experiments without your knowledge, also with no recourse. Investigation into unusual symptoms or side effects you develop later in life will be futile.
4) You will be surrounded by some of the finest young men in the country. Unfortunately, you will all be colored by the actions of some of the worst racists, bigots, and hate mongers in the country, some of whom you will be forced to fight alongside, protect, and obey.
5) Details of your life, death, and beliefs may be lied about to promote enlisting more young men like yourself.
6) You have given up your rights of habeas corpus and due process under law. You are now subject to military justice.
7) You may become forever tied to the bureaucratic nightmares of the Veteran's Administration and their health care system.
8) You are always one presidential vote away from having the follow the orders of an idiot war monger, regardless if you joined under a more sensible, peaceful administration.
And that's just off the top of my head. My sons and daughters will be free to make up their own minds when they come of age, but they will certainly hear and respond to each of these points before I'm done talking to them. - jcrash, on 10/12/2007, -1/+9While I detest the war and our leaders in Washington, it would seem like this battalion didn't do 15 months over there, so the new rule wouldn't apply to them...right?
- EntropyMan, on 10/12/2007, -1/+9I wish someone would do the math. Bush announced a 20k troop "surge" a few months ago (20% increase). Now we hear that 35,000 more are being called up (20% increase), plus the 12-15 month extensions (20 increase), plus now the 12-9 month leave (20% increase for some).
Just how many troops are part of thus surge anyway? - Comanch09, on 10/12/2007, -1/+8And yet the American Citizens just watch or bitch on the computer, yet really don't do anything about it.................
You do know there is such thing as impeachment, right? You don't have to wait until the next election. And you don't have an excuse either, the majority of you hate him anyways. He has also lied blatenly to you as well. I'm shocked he is actually still in power. Although, most Americans are complacent to do anything, so I guess it's not really that shocking. - schmons, on 10/12/2007, -2/+9My brother was notified 3 days ago that he is going back to Iraq for another 1 and a half year tour. This will be his second tour of duty in Iraq and it is very upsetting to his wife as she just had a little baby girl 3 months ago. He left for Iraq this morning. ***** Bush.
- dirtyhipster, on 10/12/2007, -2/+9100% of our troops? >_>
- painted82, on 10/12/2007, -0/+6Well, I think it's time for a draft.... wait no, Americans wont stand for that! :P
- darkstar949, on 10/12/2007, -0/+6I'm sorry, but this is outside of the scope of the Oath of Enlistment - this falls into realm of basic courtesy. It's on thing to say that you will be deployed for 15 months with 12 months back stateside; however, it entirely another to say that and then not follow through on it. Part of the reasons that the armed forces are having a hard time with recruitment and retention is due to the fact that while it is one thing to not know when you are going to be getting back home it's entirely another to be told one thing and then have another occur.
- goarmy06, on 10/12/2007, -1/+7matthewwok
STFU you prick. You have no idea what the effects being over there can have on a soldier, you arrogant *****. - zeroeffect, on 10/12/2007, -0/+4@retsep
I love discrediting this "pork" arguement
Funny, Bush has rarely ever mentioned that pork was his reason for vetoing the bill. In fact, he loves signing bills that are filled with pork. Whatever happened to that Alaskan bridge to nowhere? Didn't the last budget have the most pork barrel spending ever (back when the Republicans controlled the House and Senate). He would be one hell of a hypocrite if his third veto ever came because of pork. A real flip-flopper if you will.
Nice try, but no Twinkie for you!
But for comparison sake, let's look at the supposed Pork on the War Spending Bill:
http://thinkprogress.org/2007/04/14/bush-pork/
Now let's see how Pork Barrel Spending has increased under Bush:
http://www.bloomberg.co.uk/apps/news?pid=20601070&sid=ahjtP7v6G1y8&refer=politics
"Congress allocated a record $71.77 billion in 2006 to 15,832 special projects, more than double the $29.11 billion spent on 4,155 pork-barrel projects in 1994," - eleventybillion, on 10/12/2007, -0/+4Is it too much to ask that if you come home and get your wife pregnant that you could then stick around at least until the little one is born? Is Iraq worth that much to us? Why are we letting our moral minority dictate our actions over there?
I'm guessing the Bush girls won't be enlisting anytime soon. Still. And well, we know Cheney's daughter can't enlist.
Are we ever going to see a leader with some kind of personal stake in the success of his "plans" other than financial stake? - inactive, on 10/12/2007, -0/+4Bush would never do that. Draft leads to angry college students who will actually get tired and do something about war and Military Industrial Complex.
- Comanch09, on 10/12/2007, -1/+5Sorry, that is a lame ass excuse. Trust me, if you Americans actually got off your ass for one second to write your congressmen to impeach the Pres and his cronies, they would. Remember, they want to be re-elected (congressmen). If everyone did that, they would have to. But, again, complacent as usual.
- bardamuclichy, on 10/12/2007, -1/+4Wow. You're an *****. Considering i was a 'troop' and did two tours as a Cav scout... but because I hate this ***** I hate the troops? I've had two friends commit suicide, 4 KIA, and five get completely fubar'd. You ever try to explain to somebody that they don't have a face anymore? This isn't counting people in other troops(companies), this was just from my troop and platoon. Most of us are out now, but my best buddy is still over there on his third friggin tour. He's tired of it and wants out now... but he's got three more years... he'll probably go a friggin 4th time.
People there hate our guts. They throw rocks and scream at us when we drive down the road.
***** this so called 'war'. It's a god damned occupation. There's no such thing as 'winning'. - satanatnmtedu, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3You suggest that the American people have something to do with impeachment. I have no more power to impeach than you do. I can write my Congressman, but I personally cannot do much more.
Tell me what YOU have done to kick Bush out of office. Nothing? I thought so. - TeamBleak, on 10/12/2007, -2/+5@Kaiser
Some of us have friends and family in the military and hate to see them get jerked around by ***** like this. Understandably, you have neither, since your douche. - Liam76, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2They are promising 12 months home after 15 months deployment, this unit wasn't deployed for 15 months.
Where did they break their "promise" - diddye, on 10/12/2007, -1/+3Isn't this surge news like months old? Why is there a daily link from progress.org? We all can go on that website if we want. Lets post some new and fresh material.
- razordead, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2RTFA: "will deploy for not more than 15 months, and will return home to home station, for not less than 12 months."
It's not a definite 15 months. - darkstar949, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2The American public cannot do anything to initiate an impeachment other than contacting their congressional representative - there is no way to do a general recall election like California did.
- inactive, on 10/12/2007, -2/+4Idiot, aren't you? Real stories as in from Fox News?
This story is submitted under 'Political Opinion' for a reason. And if you follow the link, it gives you the proof that respects both the title and description of this digg submission. - geekee, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2Don't you need to serve the 15 month's in Iraq first to get the year off? Wasn't that the whole point of the policy? They were only there 13 months. It takes time for new policies to be implemented.
- redfan, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2And its official: the Pentagon does not support the troops.
- armywife, on 10/12/2007, -1/+3My husband got back in early November and he will be leaving again this time for 15 months, no I dont think its fair but what are we going to do about it if he goes AWOL he gets to go to jail and if he goes back over God only knows what will happen. I am thankful that Bush only has a year left and I hope before then he gets his ass impeached.
- thurows, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1And this news shocks you because?
- pongjinn, on 10/12/2007, -2/+3Pork like adequate health care for veterans instead of the atrocity that is Walter Reed? Yeah those democrats sure hate our troops.
/sarcasm - kidvicious1973, on 10/12/2007, -2/+3I do not agree completely with what is going on, but U.S. Military service is Voluntary.
- lifeisapickle, on 10/11/2007, -0/+1you sir, are a ***** with your little (sarcasm)...(/sarcasm) haha what a freakin nerd
- horatius, on 10/11/2007, -0/+1Support the troops. Stick a ribbon on the ass of your car!!!!
- Theodorant, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1And if we impeach bush, who comes to power? Cheney, who is probably a worse choice for the job. Then we have to impeach him. It'd be a smarter political move imo for the democrats to do nothing and leave Bush in power in order improve their chances for winning the election. Or else it just creates a messy situation . . . impeaching two people.
- satanatnmtedu, on 10/12/2007, -2/+3This is exactly what I was thinking.
- schmons, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1*3 weeks
sorry, I was writing a paper and days slipped through instead of weeks. thanks for catching that but non the less, it sucks - EntropyMan, on 10/12/2007, -2/+3@dirtyhipster, a series of increases isn't supposed to add up to 100%. Each increase is relative to the last.
Here's an easy way to look at it, with some simplifying assumptions:
Go from 100k to 120k = 20% increase.
Go from 120k to 155k = additional 29% increase on top of that (not 20%, I was typing too fast)
Keep soldiers 15 months instead of 12 = 20% more soldiers on hand
Shorten leave from 12 to 9 months = 20-25% more soldiers on hand.
What I don't know is at what rate they're coming home for good, which affects the numbers substantially.
And Bush sold the surge based on deploying only ~20k more troops. Most people said that was a drop in the bucket, but he promised it was enough. Clearly, it is not, and they're surging more than they expected.
Gates said, in speaking about the impending Presidential veto of the compromise troop funding bill, that he was 'forward spending' the money and he'd run out by July if he didn't get a year's worth. That should tell you how much they're really putting into this surge.
They know it's their last shot, but they're not giving us all the facts. - pongjinn, on 10/12/2007, -1/+2Yes, we are trying to keep them safe and respect their service(not abuse it by throwing them into a meatgrinder).
We are trying to give them better health care(not throw them in a dirty, cockroach infested, hellhole of a hospital and say "it's not that bad"
We are trying to give them the resources to succeed in Afghanistan, where the REAL War on Terror is being fought.
Bush vetoed all this. Ask yourself who REALLY supports the troops. - inactive, on 10/12/2007, -1/+2There were two marines recruiters over at my school. They were encouraging students to join Marines so they can kill Iraqis because you can't kill them here in U.S. No lies. I had interest in joining military but after seeing that event, watching videos of soldiers acting dumb in Iraq... I agree with Kerry.
- edrift101, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1Actually, serious talk of a draft would get the troops home MUCH sooner.
- EntropyMan, on 10/12/2007, -1/+1@goarmy, I don't know why you commented way down here. But anyway, I mentioned very clearly in my comment that I don't know how many are coming home, and that this missing number makes all the difference in the total force size.
But given the 3 month extensions and the 3 month reduction in leave, I don't actually get the sense that another 35,000 are coming home just yet. You'd think that the Pentagon would mention that more clearly if it were the case, as it's good news, at least for those soldiers and their families.
Maybe you can share a link to an article or DoD statement to back up what you're telling us? It may be true. I just haven't seen it. - goarmy06, on 10/12/2007, -1/+1schmons
They gave him THREE DAYS NOTICE? That just doesn't happen. You have pre-deploment training, counseling, etc etc. Somehow I doubt the validity of your statement.... - geekee, on 10/12/2007, -1/+1Usually there are multiple stories per day from thinkprogress.org.
- goarmy06, on 10/12/2007, -2/+2Wow. Just wow. The absolute ignorance i've been reading here is astounding to me, it really is. Nothing irks me more when people take the opportunity to slam people without looking at the facts. It is absurd to me that many of you are doing just that.
@EntropyMan
You are good at math, but not so much at looking at simple facts. The 35,000 troops that were called up are not going there in addition to the surge...they are REPLACING soldiers. This is how the Army works. It's a shame that you didn't take the time to actually look into the issue before taking a seemingly good opportunity to slam on the Bush admin (of which I am not a fan by any means).
@Others...rotations just don't happen overnight. This is a Co. in the 1st Armored. They will rotate in, do their time, rotate out and have their 12 months at home. Many of you weren't fans of the extensions in the first place, now you are just jumping at any opportunity to slam the war. I usually try to not evoke emotion in arguements, but to see the way many of you are approaching this thing is sickening. - ichbinladen, on 10/12/2007, -1/+1Go ***** yourself Kaiser, you pussy.
- satanatnmtedu, on 10/12/2007, -4/+4@ EntropyMan
Yes, I wish you would do the math. A 20% increase means longer deployments and a few more troops. Assuming that the first change was all there was and bitching because you thought wrong is not the same as saying that it would just be 20k more troops as part of the surge (which I don't recall being stated, though I could be wrong). - dinAlt, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0Yes, a draft would eventually lead to withdrawal from Iraq, but it would not happen overnight. Some of us, who have been against this war from the beginning, would be drafted and forced to participate in an illegal war of aggression or face time in a federal prison for refusing to do our 'duty.' Are you personally willing to be sent over there to die, with the intent of inciting further anti-war sentiment at home? Perhaps you back this approach because you are unlikely to be drafted and you do not have any ethical qualms about using others in this manner, but I find this approach to ending the war morally reprehensible.
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