What is Digg?726 Comments
- inactive, on 11/20/2008, -30/+344You don't have to be gay to love this ass-kicking commentary. Well done.
- cmp1966, on 11/20/2008, -32/+331I am not gay. I am religious. And I have something to say, both in my own defense and to the religious community that I am often thought to share offensive viewpoints with simply because I am a heterosexual, Christian American.
I am suppose to be one of them; I was raised to be one of them. And, I have thought much about this issue. I am ashamed! I was taught to respect people who are different than I for whatever reason. I was taught that no one ever had the right to impose a religious belief upon another. That a church was meant to guide and teach you, but it could not, under any circumstances, coerce or impose its beliefs upon anyone. Not even my own religion has that right! I was raised to believe that the separation of church and state must never be bridged.
I was taught that the purpose of government was to establish ways for people to live together in peace. To make it possible for a wide variety of people with many different religions, customs, and beliefs to live and work together with respect for each other so that an economy could be established. That the state could never, ever, impose a religious belief unless the security and safety of that society and economy would clearly benefit.
We have here a group of people who have become an established segment of our community. A group of people who have the support of business as well as established religious organizations which support their rights, including the right to marry. Religious institutions which say they support gay marriage and wish to perform such ceremonies. Are we suppose to impose our religious beliefs upon them? If so, I don't want to hear any snivelling when another religion's beliefs are imposed upon yours. The separation of church and state must not be circumvented! Not even by vote, but most certainly not by a vote which is based upon religious beliefs which have no clear benefit to the state! Indeed, the state is harmed by this as all it does is cause misery and harm to a large minority segment of its own citizenry. This is the perversion!
Or, am I just suppose to ignore those people, those companies, those religious institutions? As if they don't count? I will not be a part of this!
My Sunday School teachers taught me about separation of church and state. And they taught me that as a citizen, it was my Christian duty to find ways to work with people who are different than I, independent of my religious beliefs (except that I, myself, must live by them) in a manner which is courteous, respectful, and promoted peace. As a citizen of the United States, I was to conduct myself in a way that best promoted the welfare of my state and federal government with respect toward all the citizens in it. We were to live our Christian beliefs ourselves, but we weren't suppose to shove those beliefs down another's throat, nor to coerce anyone into living them, nor to impose those beliefs on anyone! Shame on you!
They also taught me that God made me, just the way I am. They told me that God loves me just the way I am. They told me that this was true of every single person in this world, even those who were different than I, even those who didn't believe in God at all. They told me that God is compassionate, merciful, and that all love comes from God. That He wanted us to do our best to be like Him. To try and do what He would want. To forgive others the way we want Him to forgive us. To not judge others. To love one another.
I don't see my churches acting the way they told me to. I don't know if homosexuality is a sin. I know what the Bible says. I'm missing something, clearly. But I have friends who are gay. They are good people and I will not condemn them. That's between them and God. I believe in a merciful God and I will trust Him to know what He's doing because He made them, too, just the way they are and I figure that's how He loves them.
I don't know why my religion is becoming one of intolerance and hate. Or being represented so. I don't know why gay people are having to bear this. I just know: I don't want to be a part of it. And I don't want people to think that just because I am a heterosexual Christian American, that I support what is being done to our gay community in any way at all. And I beg everyone, please reconsider what you are doing.
To the gay community: I am very ashamed. I am sorry from the bottom of my heart. - zenbud, on 11/20/2008, -5/+144The fundamentalists are ruining the 'Christian' reputation. You are a shining example of what Christian really means - you rock.
- johnnr2, on 11/20/2008, -29/+158BRAVO!!!
- paintgrl, on 11/20/2008, -5/+113Well we need more people like you. Don't be afraid to speak out.
- angeladtao, on 11/20/2008, -28/+126I learned in a 12 step program that we see in other people those character defects that we don't like about ourselves. I have always thought that this saying applies so well to those people who criticize other people's behavior so mercilessly. We have seen many examples of this lately, too. I think that God created us all just the way we are, and He doesn't make mistakes. Although I am straight, I have never been able to understand this type of discrimination. One of my friends told me she could tell one of her twin sons was different - and she suspected he was going to be gay - at 5 months old. Five months old!! Nobody chooses their sexuality at 5 months old! This was obviously something that was present at birth. I'm glad to see that the GLBT community is finally going to stand up and speak up for themselves. There is so much ignorance out there that perhaps a little education might be a useful part of the movement, too. I'll keep your movement in my prayers. (God listens to liberal's prayers, too, btw.)
- thepoliticalcat, on 11/20/2008, -24/+118Excellent, I say.
- jodimcmullen, on 11/20/2008, -5/+95Well said.
- flamingchorizo, on 11/20/2008, -5/+89Too bad 75% of the "Christians" in my community weren't more like you when they went to Vote yes on Prop 8. I stood on street corners holding up NO on 8 signs to make my community aware of the rights they were about to take away from a group of people and it was sad to see the amount of so called Christians drive by and spit at us, throw eggs at us, telling us to go back in the closet, calling us some very unchristian things. Its good to know there are real Christians still out there. Thank you
- kismetropolis, on 11/20/2008, -5/+85That was beautifully spoken. Thank you for saying it.
- dilpil1, on 11/20/2008, -19/+88The religious right demands everything from everyone, while gay families demand nothing from anyone.
- inactive, on 11/20/2008, -16/+83I have always tried to ignore the religious right, to no success. It would seem that they insist on being in your face at all times. They cannot accept the fact that what they think is only their opinion. Instead they insist they have "The word of God" to back up their rationale.
Unfortunately they are all wrong. God did not write anything! The Bible was written by MEN, and it has been interpreted, and reinterpreted so many times, that the original words have probably been totally screwed up over the millenia.
I remember smashing a sign over a "Christian" protesters head once. I guess that would be considered a violent act by them. However the sign in question said " You are all going to Hell, You have no rights! Die of AIDS!". This was at a Gay Pride celebration in Seattle. The year was 1985. I had just lost three friends to AIDS. It did not even enter my mind, that I was doing something wrong. I would do it again! When they provoke us, are we simply supposed to go back into the closet? Or suddenly say, "I am changed, I have found the light". *****! - kezia1, on 11/20/2008, -14/+78I had an argument at work with 2 people who were against Gay Marriage. After 10 minutes of me constantly providing facts and empathy, and them constantly throwing up red herrings (as religious people tend to do), i conceded. I cant save those people. They have to save themselves.
What i cant get through my mind is this: How can anyone possibly deny anyone their civil rights? - oldhick, on 11/20/2008, -5/+57I have a similar story. One of my dearest friends, who is a die hard conservative macho kind of guy that works in the trucking industry, has a brother who is gay. While he loves his brother with all his heart and accepts him I know that he's struggled due to his industry and friends and the jokes they make.
But I remember him telling me that he knew when his brother was about 3 years old that he was going to be gay.
Anyway, we're all just people trying to get by in this world and it would be a lot easier if people would worry more about themselves and their lives then everyone around them! - uncleosbert, on 11/20/2008, -20/+64i will always remember reading these blogs. it's powerful to see this movement come together and i'm glad to see it.
- Infidelcastr0, on 11/20/2008, -26/+70Religion. The terrifying thought that somebody, somewhere might actually be happy.
Organized Religion has been making the world a crappy place to live since the beginning of history.
You think you have the right to tell another person whats normal or acceptable? To force your value system on others?
Well my "Values" say, that you quacks are ***** dangerous, and anyone dumb enough to get on their knees and worship an invisible man in the sky has a severe mental disability.
I believe that, in a just world organized religion would be banned. Anyone who believes in any sort of god should not be allowed to teach, vote, marry, care for children, hold public office, join the military, speak publicly or do or say anything that risked spreading or enforcing your stupid, dangerous views like the virus that they are.
What's that? I'm being ignorant and bigoted? My idea of justice and reason is antithetical to freedom? It's wrong for me to call for others to be oppressed like that? I should just leave others alone, let them believe what they want, and worry about myself?
***** that, I have principals and values and stuff, and I cannot sit by and let your perverse zealotry infect my children. - MrColdheart, on 11/20/2008, -20/+62Sorry but this issue gets me really ***** angry.
America will ultimately allow everyone to get married legally, It's just a matter of time; And anyone who would deny the civil rights of another American is a Rat Bastard. - oldhick, on 11/20/2008, -4/+45Excellent comment. I couldn't agree with you more. Thanks for taking the time to put your thoughts down. I think you did an excellent job of communicating some ideas that are hard for many people to understand.
- cmp1966, on 11/20/2008, -1/+42 All I know is, I want to feel safe and secure in my home and as I go about my own business within my community. I want to be free to choose my own beliefs and religious convictions. I want to be free to choose what books I read, what clothes I wear, and what I teach my children. I want to be free to choose whom I'll spend my life with. I want a place to live, enough money to pay my bills, have a little fun, and help my friends with. I want the best possible medical care for myself and my family. I want a good education for my children. I want to choose who I am and what it means to be me. That's all I really need.
And I think most people want pretty much the same things. I don't think I'm that much different than anyone else.
One thing I'm sure of is that to get it, you have to give it. - inactive, on 11/21/2008, -15/+56Yes, your poor little 1-billion-member-strong religion is sooo persecuted. I really feel for you.
You guys have been ***** up the world for over 2000 years. Don't you think it's time to rest on your laurels and give the smart people a shot for once? - grando205, on 11/21/2008, -11/+51Intolerant??? Intolerant???? Are you ***** kidding me?????
The "religious" right has the corner on the market when it comes to intolerance.
She exercised her free speech when she voted yes on 8.. It's our turn to exercise our free speech.
Also, I'm sick of people saying that that old woman was a victim of violence. PUUUUUHHHHLLLLEEEAAASEE. She had a Styrofoam cross
knocked out her hand. While I disagree with whoever did that, that can HARDLY be called violence! - inactive, on 11/21/2008, -4/+41Isn't this whole thing an issue of tyranny of the majority?
- openj, on 11/20/2008, -18/+54Civil rights, human rights, religious rights...it's all the same. None of those things matter, only God matters. What you need to know is that there is a book that is a lot older than you, and that you should read and follow every single line of this book immediately.
No being gay. No working on the Sabbath. No haircuts. Women can't speak. Stone your rebellious children. Take slaves. Sell your daughters into servitude. No shellfish. Don't get kicked in the nuts. No making money. No birth control.
You get the point. No go out and be a real Christian! - wphj, on 11/21/2008, -10/+45http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Matthew_Shepard
- oldhick, on 11/20/2008, -3/+37That is so sad. Digg is full of these "Christians" as well. I understand how believing Jesus leads to hate and intolerance, but it is certainly happening.
Apologies. - algaeturd, on 11/21/2008, -3/+35Very well stated. It's a shame that mainstream 'christianity' has very little to say about love and acceptance and a whole lot to say about hate and disrespect. Not with simply gay issues, but with all kinds of issues concerning us as Americans.
I was raised a Christian. But I can say with 100% sincerity if the religious right we saw during the 2008 election cycle is what Heaven is full of, I'll rightfully take my place in Hell. I wouldn't want to be anywhere that those people full of hatred and bile and hypocrisy are rewarded. - ricperry1, on 11/20/2008, -12/+43Why can't a monogamous homosexual couple have the same benefits as a monogamous heterosexual couple? Shatter pre/mis-conceptions and bias. Don't pre-judge the whole community. Not all gay people are in non-committed relationships.
I'm burying you not out of a desire for convenience, but because I disagree with your characterization of the gay community and for your holier than thou attitude toward gay people. - jasoninoakland, on 11/20/2008, -14/+43I'm sick of the self-serving hypocrisy of the Christianists.
Jesus came out against divorce many times in the Bible. He equated it with adultery. He stated adultery is a sin that will land you in hell forever.
Jesus never said anything about homosexuality, much less same-sex marriage.
And these self-righteous pricks use Jesus as their justification for putting gay & lesbians in the second-class citizen bucket. And not a single one will try to ban divorce...because they might need to get one someday.
ENOUGH! - inactive, on 11/20/2008, -4/+32Kudos to all of you for your comments. I would digg all of you in this thread a thousand times if I could.
- enantiodromia, on 11/21/2008, -6/+33i demand you learn more about the history of Marriage, and see that it was not a religious union or even about love, but was used to unite local land owners to prevent them from fighting over borders.
- ploop, on 11/21/2008, -2/+28Yes.
- inactive, on 11/21/2008, -2/+28Yes.
- xtremepado, on 11/21/2008, -1/+26yes
- Cuchanu, on 11/21/2008, -12/+37The problems is that I don't think the leaders of the religious right do a lot of reading. Cough *PALIN*.
- ashfish, on 11/21/2008, -11/+34Alright, so I watched the videos you linked. The first one I thought was hilarious. So, you're mad at the glbt members of this community (to which they seem to be the majority) are telling unwanted peoples to vacate their community. No one was accosted, no one was hurt. A few people got in the police's face but I expect that. There is always at least one no matter what group is protesting. To the second video, one you were walking into an obviously heated protest. While I do think it wasn't in the best taste to knock down that woman's cross, again, no one was actually hurt. Except maybe her feelings for the disrespect. But when you look at how the right has been vocal about Prop. 8...Well, not a lot of respect was given on that front. As this article states, this kind of thing has been a long time coming, you keep abusing a specific sect of people and they will fight back.
- rokklobster, on 11/21/2008, -5/+27Well done indeed. I'm surprised Fred Phelps/the Westboro Baptist Church --http://www.godhatesfags.com -- wasn't mentioned. The ridiculous lies they spew about "the fag lifestyle of soul-damning, nation-destroying filth" make me sick to my stomach.
- singingsox, on 11/21/2008, -9/+31Yes because, all gay people act that way.
And furthermore, all Christians act like saints!
No. - authorone, on 11/21/2008, -9/+30If you don't believe in gay marriage, then don't have one. Gays and lesbians don't care whether you accept us or not. But you have no right to tell us that we don't have a right to have families and children or the ability to work and live in peace and not by YOUR prejudiced notions of who we are. And about EHarmony, if they felt they were in the right, then they shouldn't have settled. End of story.
- inactive, on 11/20/2008, -14/+35I get the feeling that groups like "The Family Research Council" care a lot more about 2 men going at it than they do about the current fiscal disaster. I like to think that's part of why the Republican party lost so badly this time, but I hold out little hope that Obama will cut spending to the level I'd like, or anything even close...
- Lazydriver, on 11/21/2008, -3/+24As an Atheist, it's not the Christian in you that makes you a good person as we all know from those Fundy *****.
It's the common ***** sense and respect towards others you disagree with. - inactive, on 11/21/2008, -3/+23Jesus just called, he wants his religion back.
And he says to quit stalking him. - inactive, on 11/21/2008, -5/+25Sheeps, robots and 12 years olds don't have the mental capacity or emotional maturity to give consent.
And, apparently, neither do you. - jasoninoakland, on 11/20/2008, -6/+24I don't know of a single gay person who's demanding that churches perform same-sex marriage. Stop drinking the kool-aid; this is about *civil marriage only*.
- usrlocalbin, on 11/21/2008, -2/+20Damn I wish I could digg you up more than once.
Very well said and much respect! - inactive, on 11/21/2008, -3/+21A few points.
1) Christianity is not a monotheistic religion, no matter how much you want to pretend it is. You've got Jesus, Yahweh, Casper the Holy Ghost, Lucifer (+ minions), nine choirs of Angels, and over 10,000 saints -- all of whom have enough superpowers to qualify as a god in any religion. "Monotheism" is just a marketing term used to separate yourselves from the heathens.
2) Not even all Christians condemn homosexuality, so how can you say all major religions do?
3) "Lot went outside to meet them and shut the door behind him and said, "No, my friends. Don't do this wicked thing. Look, I have two daughters who have never slept with a man. Let me bring them out to you, and you can do what you like with them."
Sounds pretty clear to me. Of course, your god is a big fan of rape and sexual slavery. Just ask the Midianites.
4) I don't respect your god or his prophets. Deal with it.
5) If we're going to go by what your god's prophets approved or disapproved of, you've got a lot of 'splainin to do. You may wish to review Leviticus and Deuteronomy.
6) It's call "religious insanity". Please seek help. - Infidelcastr0, on 11/20/2008, -6/+23So what exactly is your point? That you do not hate anyone, but want to see certain people deprived of their liberty, out of respect for tradition? Out of reverence for an institution, you want to prevent certain people from joining it? That sounds a great deal like bigotry to me, carefully stated though it may have been.
You sound like the sort of person who actually thinks occasionally so let me ask you this. Why should it be any business of the state? Why not just have a type of civil union available to any two people who want one and leave the question of ceremony and terminology to the parties directly involved? I'm not a religious person but if I were I do not think I would want laws being made regarding my sacraments - MrColdheart, on 11/20/2008, -3/+20You do realize not one person was talking about religious ceremonies right?
- wishninja, on 11/21/2008, -4/+21Still crying about a few little protests?
Where I live homophobia is openly practiced and demonstrated. I hear bigotry on my radio people saying homosexuals are abusing their children. There where a bunch of people a few months back protesting outside my local school because some gay boy got the ***** beat out of him and the school wanted to have a talk with the kids and teach tolerance.
***** up that you are crying about a few little protests. At least people are not beating the ***** out of your kids for being a bible thumper. - zip000, on 11/21/2008, -3/+19Modern society violates a great deal of what the bible says. We do it everyday, and I'm sure most Christians and maybe even most Christian fundamentalists violate something in the bible everyday. Choosing to pull out the gay issue and obsess about it is a choice. You could just as easily pull out the not eating pork issue and obsess about that. Or the circumcision issue and obsess about that. Or the graven image issue and obsess about that.
But for some reason, the Christian right obsesses about the gay issue to the detriment of all of the other issues like compassion and forgiveness and poverty. - ObamaYouth, on 11/21/2008, -1/+17I'm straight and I'm against straight marriage.
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