What is Digg?124 Comments
- inactive, on 10/12/2007, -10/+76Conservatism is dead until Liberals put on their greed hat at which point Conservatives will campaign against their greed and win for a few years until the Conservatives put on their greed hat at which point Liberals will campaign against their greed and win for a few years, blah blah blah. Rinse, repeat.
- sbassin, on 10/12/2007, -13/+43What?! Republicans trying to avoid the issues and stick to talking points? This is a first. Next think you know they'll be accusing dissenters of wanting the terrorists to win.
- inactive, on 10/12/2007, -14/+40baron -- so you're saying that if we leave Vietnam, the dominoes will fall elsewhere and then communism will take over the world.
Fighting for fantasies and complicated theories is a bunch of *****. The reality is: terrorism has skyrocketed since imposing this supposed "fix." Try something different! - shawnfassett, on 10/12/2007, -24/+47Conservatism is dead.
- lagitane, on 10/12/2007, -9/+31This is the first I've heard that we are in Iraq to defeat radical Islam!?! That's a pretty big task!!! So the GOP strategy is to turn the debate into a True Christian (tm) Crusade... One problem - I probably wouldn't have started with one of the most SECULAR GODDAMMED COUNTRIES IN THE MIDDLE EAST, JACKASSES. What, the Taliban wasn't "radical" enough for you? Damn these ignorant monkeys piss me off.
- quakerorts, on 10/12/2007, -8/+30GOP admits that they can't defend the surge or the presidents strategy, so they decide to use (are you ready).... FEAR!
- inactive, on 10/12/2007, -9/+28Everybody knows the entire world can be fit into two distinct groups. The Republican Party, and the evil freedom hating terrorist supporting liberals that hate America. That's what I keep hearing anyway.
- mwsherman, on 10/12/2007, -5/+23As a full out leftist commie pinko loser who hates war and likes abortion, I have to say that the democrats are being incredibly stupid. We, being the USA, started that war and now we have a horrible disaster on our hands. And unfortunately, it's our responsibility to clean our mess up, weather we want to or not.
Democrats, we get the idea. Everyone sane is against the war, and everyone knows that you can continue to cry "shame on you" by waving junk like this in the face of the Republicans. However, it's not going to solve any problems, you vote-mongering whores. Now, perhaps some more concrete plans are needed before we send more troops there, and yes, the whole thing sucks. But please, grow up. When I was 2 years old I was taught to clean up any messes I make, and now it's time to clean up this mess.
Rather than using Iraq as merely a political tool, democrats should take the opportunities presented by the change of power and actually do something. With the change in leadership we have an opportunity to get the rest of the world, NATO, and the UN involved. All that needs to happen is a few Democratic leaders need to go on TV, admit that the US government made a mistake, and ask for the support of the world to stop a bad situation before it gets much, much worse. Chances are we'll get it, and at the very least it will improve our international standing. And it still makes the Republicans look like idiots, which is the whole point of the resolution in the first place. You spineless donkeys. - thebaron2, on 10/12/2007, -7/+19What I'm saying, BigDave, is that terrorism existed, and was rampant, long before 9/11 and the road to Iraq.
I don't like that we're there. I DESPISE the fact that we ended up there because of ***** intelligence and poor decision making on the part of this administration. But to believe that everything is going to be peachy and peaceful if we just up and leave is the definition of naiveté. Your world view is obviously so twisted by your politics that you didn't actually THINK about the comment I made - you just assumed right off the bat that I must be some right-wing shill promoting the war, which is NOT the case. - dclowd9901, on 10/12/2007, -4/+16I'm glad our political leaders see debates as games that they may win or lose, rather than relevant and important questions that aren't served by meaningless rhetoric and unilateralism.
- stonewaljacksn, on 10/12/2007, -3/+14This isnt even about conservatism. This just looks like two stupid parties taking polar opposite sides so as to not be confused with one another. I love our incredibly divisive and hate inspiring political system.
- rstevens, on 10/12/2007, -4/+13The government of the United States was established for good, honest politicians with varied opinions and beliefs. Safeguards were put into place to protect the people against dishonest and corrupt leaders.
Had the founding fathers seen our day where corruption is the norm they would have established a system of government first to protect the people against dishonest leaders and then to provide safeguards, freedom and influence for the honest.
I hope the American people elect good leaders to revisit the entire framework. The country needs another Constitutional Convention of 1787. - pitlord, on 10/12/2007, -3/+9I can't believe thebaron got buried for providing a link to the full text of the letter. Diggers should be ashamed of themselves for burying the truth like that!
Digg up thebaron2 if you stand for truth! - thewump, on 10/12/2007, -5/+11To all the retards who voted for Bush in 2004.. "***** you. We told you so"
- Ark7, on 10/12/2007, -1/+6Yeah, that chickenhawk argument, that hasn't gotten old.
If we're going to use that "logic," you're not allowed to criticize the government anymore until you start an armed revolution against it.
Yeah, sounds pretty ***** retarded when it gets turned back around on you, doesn't it? - SecondGuesser, on 10/12/2007, -2/+7Democrats convinced me that "staying the course" was a bad idea. They now control congress. It's time to unveil their better plan. Humiliating Republicans with non-binding resolutions and silly debate doesn't stop the bloodshed. Grow the ***** up. I'm inches away from regretting my vote for Democrats.
- CraigB12, on 10/12/2007, -8/+13@bigdave and baron
Communism basically took care of itself, even though invading Vietnam and Korea didn't do a damn thing. Baron is right about the fact that we'll have to fight elsewhere if we leave Iraq, but at least then we'll have the support of other countries. On the other hand, by invading Iraq we gave them a country to fight for to make their own, and if we leave they're just going to make it their base of ops. - inactive, on 10/12/2007, -5/+9Every week it's some new fake information. Every week you guys repeat it. Even if they had left Iraq, and there's no evidence that they have, it's not going to make any more of a difference than the various elections where you were told that we were turning the corner, or the constitution where you were told that we were turning the corner, or the capture of Saddam where you were told we were turning the corner, or when Bush declared that major combat operations were completed where you were told that we weren't just turning the corner but that it was over, or when Saddam was executed when you were told that we were turning the corner, or when we went into Fallujah when you were told that we were turning the corner, or when...
- youareretarded, on 10/12/2007, -1/+5Great! So lets defeat radical islam by using force and inadvertently killing innocent people while trying to do it. Wouldn't that just add more fuel to their cause?
It looks to me like a sequel to the whole democracy vs communism thing.
How about, instead, we protect ourselves by improving security for our boarders and ports? I don't quite understand why that's not the most important thing we should be doing right now. - odinfire, on 10/12/2007, -3/+7Uhh... whats out of context. They print the entire letter. If you care to look, its posted right on a government website.
http://majorityleader.house.gov/docUploads/ShadeggHoekstraDearColleague.pdf - UglieJosh, on 10/12/2007, -6/+10Jeez, next thing you know, they will be using these talking points to block a bill to raise minimum wage and not even letting it reach the floor.
Nah, that could never happen. - totorototoro, on 10/12/2007, -3/+7"If Democrats force us to debate the surge or the current situation in Iraq, we lose.""
If they don't debate the current situation in Iraq, we all lose. - odinfire, on 10/12/2007, -3/+7How is linking to a direct file off a government website a circle of no answers.
http://majorityleader.house.gov/docUploads/ShadeggHoekstraDearColleague.pdf
You cant bury this as liberal spin. It's in black and white on a government website.
Click the f'n link. - ThinkFr33ly, on 10/12/2007, -9/+13@sodamoeba - "Terrorism hasn't skyrocketed, the Liberal news coverage of terrorism has skyrocketed."
Actually, terrorism rates HAVE gone up, and a lot. (Tripled, in fact.) The Bush Administration attempted to lie about it by not including a lot of data, but the truth eventually got out.
See: http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2005/04/26/AR2005042601623.html
Nice try though. - inactive, on 10/12/2007, -5/+8Soda:
>Terrorism hasn't skyrocketed
Here, let me summarize the recently declassified NIE for you (that the Bush administration tried to suppress):
* The total number of international terrorist incidents, both significant and non-significant, declined until 2002.
* 2004 marked the single, largest increase in terrorist activity ever recorded since the CIA started keeping records dating back to 1968.
* The four fold increase in significant terrorist incidents (attacks in which people were killed and wounded) was a direct consequence of the war in Iraq. All you have to do is look at the attacks recorded and the people killed and wounded in those attacks. Iraq and India were the big targets in 2004.
* According to information provided at the U.S. State Department in 2005, there were approximately 198 significant terrorist attacks in Iraq in 2004. This was nine times more than the 22 significant terrorist attacks in Iraq identified in the State Department's 2003 report. Indeed, the number of significant terrorist attacks in Iraq in 2004 exceeded the 175 significant terrorist attacks that occurred throughout the entire world in 2003. - diggsIt, on 10/12/2007, -4/+7Do any of these Congressmen think for themselves, or do they only know how to regurgitate the party 'talking points'. No wonder Washington is void of good ideas. It's just a never ending episode of 'Spy vs. Spy'.
- GabrielS, on 10/12/2007, -1/+4@odinfire
Well, my comments are getting downvoted so you can help out by upvoting them as I'm simply engaging in conversation about a legitimate question.
The letter was sent to specific individuals. It was sent to Hoyer. The implication is that the communication was confidential just as all letters sent to fellow members of Congress are confidential unless the parites agree to share them. - DGaw, on 10/12/2007, -4/+7"baron -- so you're saying that if we leave Vietnam, the dominoes will fall elsewhere and then communism will take over the world."
Actually, bigdavediode, I think baron is actually saying that if we leave Vietnam, those responsible for the withdrawal will be responsible for the slaughter of millions in Cambodia, the executions, re-education camps, and effective enslavement inflicted upon the Vietnamese, and for laying the seeds of 9/11 by helping convince Osama bin Laden that the US weak, and burdened by large numbers of short-sighted dupes who can be intimidated into fleeing from a fight--which, unfortunately, it apparently is. And as it turns out, all of that is exactly what happened after Vietnam.
It's regrettable that even the US withdrawal from Vietnam wasn't ill considered enough that people won't rush to make the same mistake 30 years later. - inactive, on 10/12/2007, -5/+8There isn't always a way to fix everything you mess up. Say whatever you want about Saddam, but he was the only thing holding that country, and the area in general, together. We killed him, he's dead, we can't say "whoops sorry, that didn't work out so well, come back to life now please". Our village idiot shot a hole in the dike, has been continuing to shoot more holes, and we're at the point now where sending more people to plug the holes with their thumbs isn't really very practical or helpful.
- Deranged, on 10/12/2007, -2/+5pardon my skepticism, but how does a government letter "leak"... I know our president is a dumb *****, but they don't let him have the important stuff.
- inactive, on 10/12/2007, -7/+10The thing I hate the most about these Neocons is there is no debate, you are 'not allowed to talk about it.
Yeah, isn't that what a child molester tells his victims too? - floorman56, on 10/12/2007, -2/+5You are right...whenever the gangs in L.A. start acting up we always reduce the number of police because we know fewer police means less crime.
- HAKdragon, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3Abortions for some, little American flags for others!
- tkstock, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3By the way, that quote was from the actual letter.
- NeverbyLuck, on 10/12/2007, -4/+7I am probably completely opposite of you on the political spectrum, but I agree with what you have to say. If Democrats would stop using this as a political football and see it for the serious situation it is, the whole country and world would be better off for it.
I don't think this whole thing was a mistake, but it has certainly turned into a cluster. However, it had almost unanimous bipartisan support so it is the responsibility of everyone who voted for the measure. I think a little bipartisan cooperation and compromise would do the whole world some good right now. - inactive, on 10/12/2007, -7/+10"Conservatism is dead."
Sweet! Can we start drilling oil in Alaska and the Gulf now? - tkstock, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3"Thanks to the liberal mainstream media, Americans fully understand the consequences of continuing our efforts in Iraq - both in American lives and dollars. The American people do not understand the consequences of abandoning that effort or the extreme views, goals, and intentions of the radical Islamist movement that is fueling the war in Iraq and the attacks on westerners and unbelievers throughout the world."
In other words, they want to get the debate away from what Americans hear everyday on the news, and have a debate about the truths that Americans don't get to hear in the media. Sounds like a good idea to me! Maybe the entire letter should be read. - floorman56, on 10/12/2007, -1/+3Krymore
I would recheck that
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/3660179/ - Ark7, on 10/12/2007, -1/+3Thank you, counter-terrorism expert davediode. Tell me, what happened in Afghanistan in the early 1990's after Americans pulled all funding and operatives out of the country because, well *****, it didn't concern us anymore! I'm sure nothing bad happened, like, you know, a totalitarian religious theocracy intent on world domination that harbored terrorists with the same goal coming to power. And I'm sure nothing like that would happen now, either. Wahhabist Muslims will suddenly stop believing in the religion that is central to their entire life if we go away.
- odinfire, on 10/12/2007, -3/+5@gabriels
You have a point, but I cant imagine any member of Congress would be willing to host such a file on their site if they didn't have some sort of credible source. In addition, who said it was confidential? - Ark7, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2Right. Because if you aren't a Christian in America, they cut your head off. Whoops, sorry, my mistake. That's every nation under Sharia law in the world. But watch out for those Christians! They might try to EVANGELIZE to you! *shudder*
Of course, that little comment of yours only served to further drive home the point that you have no clue what the ***** you're talking about in this field of study. Go back to playing international geopolitical guru and terrorism expert on Daily Kos or Democratic Underground; you know, somewhere where no one else has any actual experience in the field and might believe that your head isn't completely up your ass. - BassMastr, on 10/12/2007, -2/+4Do you have a point?
- Maarek, on 10/12/2007, -5/+7They wear their bias openly and proudly, unlike Fox News who claims to be "Fair and Balanced".
Honesty up front FTW. - Ark7, on 10/12/2007, -3/+5God damn neo-con/JOOOS! All up in 9/11 and that *****!
- GabrielS, on 10/12/2007, -4/+6@odinfire
Ok, I see. The link to Laden is just the Text version of the PDF on Hoyer's site.
However, that still doesn't answer the question as to how Hoyer acquired a confidential communication from the Republicans. - geekee, on 10/12/2007, -3/+5It's not a debate. The Democrats refuse to admit they have no plan either. They simply want to withdraw troops, and hope for the best, even if the result is an escalation of war the engulfs the entire Middle East.
- Ark7, on 10/12/2007, -7/+9You're ***** retarded. Every news outlet has reported at this point that al-Sadr and his leadership have all run from Iraq and fled to Iran. If you weren't so ***** stupid that you actually get your news from anything other than what you see on The Daily Show or the Colbert Report, you'd know that.
- GabrielS, on 10/12/2007, -1/+3@odinfire
As we learned with Manual Miranda, we cannot rule out foul play in the asking questions about the acquisition of this letter by Rep. Hoyer's office.
Asking questions about the acquisition of the letter is entirely legitimate. Rep. Hoyer has it posted to his own Majority Leader site, so he's confident that it is accurate. But by posting it he opens this line of questioning. - inactive, on 10/12/2007, -4/+5I missed the part where I said a single word in your entire post. Care to point one out to me?
- inactive, on 10/12/2007, -7/+8Talk to Dick Cheney and the Project for the New American Century if you want to know about the end justifying the means...
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