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211 Comments
- BillE3, on 03/12/2009, -5/+84Ban guns in America to solve the drug cartel problem in Mexico?
And I thought I had already heard all of the silly B.S. arguments for banning guns. This takes the cake.
Why do you think that all of South America is armed with AK-47s' of every version? Don't they know that Russia makes AK-47s' and sells them all over the world. Mexico can get guns cheaper and easier than going to America. Mexican gangs can then make money bringing the illegal guns into the America and sell them here in the black market. A marketplace the anti-gunners ignore and act like it does not exist. - graphictruth, on 03/12/2009, -4/+49Missing the point entirely from not just one, but TWO points of view. Taking guns out of the equation - not possible. Taking the reason for USING guns - entirely possible. But to do that, why, we'd have to look at what drives the problem. Drug policy. Prohibition.
If it was not Mexicans, it certainly would be someone else. So talking about Mexicans being the problem amounts to arguing over who should control the drug trade. Who would you prefer? The Angels? Skinheads? The Russian Mob? Chinese Tongs? The CIA? This doesn't seem like a profitable idea for those of us ducking bullets.
PROHIBITION is the problem. It's inarguable. It literally doesn't matter what you think about what people should do - Society has to cope with what people actually WILL do. Legislating morality merely creates very profitable black markets that make it very much worth shooting each other to maintain.
This isn't even worth arguing over. The only discussion that is rationally acceptable is how to achieve a transition to an actually sane policy. DEA agents would be much better employed in real law-enforcement and genuine national security activities. - black27696, on 03/13/2009, -2/+39Actually, the wall they built did serve the purpose they built it for. Also, the Berlin wall worked perfectly well. If you erase what they were treating people like in East Germany the wall itself served it's purpose.
- black27696, on 03/13/2009, -2/+33I'm still at a loss about gun control. Why are people so amazingly stupid that they think gun control will stop criminals from having weapons? Whether you like them or not, or think they're dangerous or not, making laws against owning guns only stops people that follow the laws. Most of the arguments for heavier gun control are along the lines of carelessness causing accidents with weapons or people shooting their own family members by mistake. The level of accidents vs. intentional murders however is extremely skewed in favor of the intentional ones. People being careless or killing family members with their SUVs hasn't stopped us from making them, and car accidents are far more dangerous in that respect.
- alfalfa31, on 03/12/2009, -3/+33It's tripe like this that makes anyone with no brain believe that the Mexican drug runners are at fault. If it weren't profitable, it wouldn't be a problem. How do you take the profit out of it? Eliminate the restrictions placed on it.
I'm with metrodigg on this one. *****. We spend billions of dollars a year fighting drug trafficking, and scarcely 1000 people die annually in this country of drug overdoses? How many more people die in the "war" itself?
Lunacy - dstntmbrk, on 03/13/2009, -2/+27"Building walls never solved any problems"
They solved the problem of my roof falling on me. - stompk291, on 03/12/2009, -3/+27yeah, if I was a mexican drug lord, I'd be thinking, "if only I could get some scary looking semi-automatic black rifles"
/s - jugger74, on 03/13/2009, -2/+25The title is correct though this is a gun control issue. Mexico has an absolute gun ban for it's citizens allowing these drug gangs to run roughshod over the entire population. When a population is disarmed criminals are allowed to flourish and governments become tyrannical. For another example of this just look at the cities of Philadelphia and Washington DC they have gun bans and still have some of the highest gun crime rates in America.
- GaiusArchanus, on 03/13/2009, -5/+28This misses the point. Eric Holder's reason for wanting to reinstitute the assault weapons ban in the US was:
"Some recent Mexican army and police confrontations with drug cartels have resembled small-unit combat, with cartels employing automatic weapons and grenades,"
AUTOMATIC weapons are ALREADY illegal in the US. They have been illegal since 1986. Grenades have been illegal since 1934! In response to the Mexicans getting weapons that are already outlawed, he wants to ban all semi-autos because he thinks YOU are too stupid to know the difference. - black27696, on 03/13/2009, -6/+27The fact that you think farmers make healthy profits proves you have no idea what you're talking about and devalues your entire statement.
- Karmashock, on 03/13/2009, -1/+22Walls actually have a long track record of success... though you do need to man and maintain them. What walls really accomplish is slowing people down. They make it more inconvenient to go from point A to point B. The best place to build them are places where the patrols can't get out to often. Hopefully the wall will slow them down enough that you can catch them.
- illDecree, on 03/13/2009, -5/+24
Why, bit by bit, are we allowing the second amendment to get eroded? - DanBarak, on 03/12/2009, -0/+18Trouble is brewing down south. Not good news at all.
- Blisshead, on 03/13/2009, -0/+18Current gun laws already prohibit selling illegal guns illegally. The gun 'control' that is being advocated by Holder and the other clowns in that car have nothing to do with this. As Pelosi said in a rare moment of clarity, let's try actually enforcing the law first. I agree with her there, do that before we infringe further on the non drug lord American citizens who have never shot upon the ATF or beheaded a drug mule south of the border.
- cornfeed, on 03/13/2009, -0/+17Hi,
Actually, owning full-auto firearms is NOT illegal in the US. It's VERY highly regulated and VERY expensive. But if you can pass the background check and can afford the couple hundred dollar stamp fee, you too can own a class3 weapon. But they aren't common because the are only so many licensed receivers in existence, and no more can be licensed. And the cost to buy one is in the many $1000's of dollars.
The vast majority of the weapons the Mexican drug cartels are getting, the AK47/74's and RPG's and such are coming from other sources. Because they don't exist in those kinds of numbers here in this country. And the ones that do exist, are very tightly controlled. - Bloodwine, on 03/13/2009, -0/+17Doesn't Mexico have a ban on firearms? a lot of good it's doing down there.
If they ban weapons in the U.S., they'll just flow in from somewhere else. Not to mention you suddenly have a new black market in the U.S. - HAL90000, on 03/13/2009, -2/+18This conflict is fueled by the drug war. Banning drugs hasn't helped one little bit, and in fact helps keep it going. Banning guns won't help either, and banning people from entering places won't do ***** either. A giant wall isn't going to block your problems! Stop building walls, and start tearing them down!
Lesson learned: stop trying to ban *****, because it not only doesn't work, but makes the "problem" worse. - Fhwqhgads, on 03/13/2009, -2/+18Gun control is a farce. Guns will always exist, except these laws and regulations simply disarm the good guys and give the bad guys the power. It's really an agenda to disarm the citizenry so the tyrannical government can take over without resistance. That's what I see. I don't know about everyone else. They are too busy watching brainless shows on TV to give a *****.
The obvious no-brainer solution is legalizing the drugs and putting the criminals out of business. When you outlaw any item or substance, you create a black market. There will always be a market for that item or substance. The black market becomes extremely profitable since there are no price controls and competition is eliminated by force. Whoever controls the distribution, holds the power. Right now, the power is in the hands of armed, violent criminals. Prohibition doesn't work. Period. When the ***** will our leaders wake the ***** up and stop this *****? No drugs. No funds for violent gangs. Eventually they will die. Of course, everyone has heard this ***** before, but it still won't sink in to some of them, especially those in power.
Elect me someday. I'll do what needs to be done. - pilgrim3970, on 03/13/2009, -0/+16There is no such thing as a"gun problem" the problem lies in the indvidual who does violence not with the means he uses to do it.
- Phearce, on 03/13/2009, -0/+15It's all about supply and demand: if a group (drug cartel) demands a product (weapons) the market WILL supply it. Silly laws aren't going to change that.
Same goes for demand (drug users) and supply (drug cartels). Or demand (cheap labor) and supply (Mexican laborers).
Solve the underlying problems that are creating demand in the first place. - rda1441, on 03/13/2009, -1/+16The only type of gun control that should be required is the control you need to practice on the range, and the control you need to shoot an intruder or attacker.
- Karmashock, on 03/13/2009, -3/+18This is an idiotic political argument. We need to ban handguns because the mexican drug trade has overwhelmed the mexican government? It's just stupid. The only people by default that would be moved by this argument are idiots.
Furthermore, between the constitution, general american sentiment, and obama's dwindling political capital this is a fools gambit. Sure, obama still has a lot of support but it's not unlimited anymore.
I just hope the mexican situation doesn't get out of control. We can't have mexican cartels beheading people on this side of the line. If they don't stop then we're going to have to move the national guard down there and perhaps ACTUALLY build that wall. - avalenci, on 03/13/2009, -2/+14"the truth is that Mexico itself has only made half hearted efforts to control the drug trade until recently" .. The author is an Ass%#!*+ . How can he say that when so many law enforcement agents in Mexico have died. It's completely irresponsible.
- kortiz, on 03/13/2009, -3/+15finaly some rationality ^
- inactive, on 03/13/2009, -8/+20stop beating around the ***** bush! legalize drugs already!
- Barackalypse, on 03/13/2009, -1/+13Is anyone really ignorant enough to think a weapons ban here will stop Mexican drug cartels from obtaining weapons? Do our laws that make drugs illegal prevent people here from obtaining them? These people deal in illegal goods for a living and excel at bringing things to places where they aren't allowed. Even if we succeeded in stopping all guns entering Mexico from the US, it doesn't matter, since the cartels routinely pay off the Mexican Police and Military, and those guys have their own guns. Alternatively, they can just buy them in such wonderfully lawless places as Africa, Afghanistan, and Columbia.
- inactive, on 03/13/2009, -3/+15the real problem is prohibition of marijuana. its creates the black market for these gangsters to make money from. 60% of mexican drug cartel money comes from marijuana.
end prohibition and they cartels will not have as much money and therefore be less of a problem... - Karmashock, on 03/13/2009, -3/+15Just because some people profited by the illegal immigration doesn't mean it was wrong under those conditions. It's always been wrong.
I don't think we should go after people though. Go after the businesses that hire them and the problem will go away. Fine someone 10,000 dollars per infraction and they'll stop. If you're having a hard time finding people, then put a bounty on it. If someone gives you a tip give them a cut of the fine when it's paid.
Illegal boarder crossing for anything but smuggling will stop. Then what's left can be dealt with strictly as an anti smuggling operation and we don't have to feel sorry for them. - Barackalypse, on 03/13/2009, -0/+11Couldn't Mexico solve the problem by just legalizing drug trafficking and selling licenses?
- vaago, on 03/13/2009, -0/+10Abolish the anti-drug laws like they did for booze and remove the teeth of the cartels. As long as there are exorbitant profits to be made in trafficking there will be gangs with guns. If heroin were a dollar a fix, cocaine ten cents a snort, and herb fifty dollars an ounce, where would be the funds to buy all of these AK-47's?
- proxybot767, on 03/13/2009, -0/+10The AK-47 in the rest of the world sells for $75, the full auto kind. Right now the Mexican Drug Cartels have "money trees". Gun runners will even give away the AK-47 as a loss leader in other parts of the world, so why not to the cartels in Mexico. It cost over $400 to get a semi-auto AK-47 in the US. Where do you think the cartels will buy their guns?
- Barackalypse, on 03/13/2009, -4/+14How about we draw a line in the sand, build a wall along that line, put surveillance and guards on the wall, and shoot anybody that tries to come over it, under it, around it, or through it?
- KimmyGibbler, on 03/13/2009, -1/+11I'm from Philly, and everyone who wants one can get a gun, you just have to go to another city to get it (a 15 minute drive). The problem is that the guns used in crimes are mostly purchased on the black market, so the gun "ban" really has no effect. In fact, 70% of the guns used in murders can be traced back to one gunshop, Colossimo's, which is the distributor for the Philly Police Department, which seems to indicate that the Philadelphia Police play an active role in the black market. This city is ***** up, but it's a nice place to live if you can afford to live in the nicer areas. All the murders are pretty much concentrated in the ghettos
- Licurgo, on 03/13/2009, -4/+13the israelis are very good at, no terrorist attacks since when?
- Blisshead, on 03/13/2009, -0/+9Exactly. If the people in power actually wanted to solve the issue and not use the war on drugs and gun control for votes, they probably would.
- jpop, on 03/13/2009, -0/+8They used to have suicide bombers fairly often till they got the wall up.
- rpgmakr, on 03/13/2009, -0/+8That's exactly why I think that gun bans don't work. It just hurt honest citizens since they're the ones that will not going to buy one illegally.
- ChristopherShwn, on 03/13/2009, -0/+8What history book did you use?
- Virtuallad, on 03/12/2009, -24/+31Building walls never solved any problems... ask Chinese.
- WindReaver, on 03/13/2009, -0/+7You are forgetting that the gun control crowd operate on emotion and not on logic or reason.
- wrestlingnrj, on 03/13/2009, -1/+8Because they look so scary and they're evil
/sarcasm
Mostly it's simply people's ignorance and fear of firearms.
*goes to clean AR-15 and 1911 - Karmashock, on 03/13/2009, -1/+8the boarder and guns are unrelated unless you're talking about arming the boarder patrol.
- Fhwqhgads, on 03/13/2009, -2/+9and nevermind the number killed by prescription drugs, which are all approved to be perfectly safe. 100,000 and counting, according to the AMA.
War on Drugs? LOL! - Jlaugh, on 03/13/2009, -0/+7It's just an excuse to crack down on guns in the US. Gangs which run cocaine can get and afford whatever sort of arms they want. Those cartels are as organized as the government of Mexico.
- theskillwithin, on 03/13/2009, -0/+7IF THEY BAN U.S. CITIZEN GUNS
HOW DO WE DEFEND OURSELFs FROM THE MEXICAN CARTELS (kidnaping us as in the article description.) - Smaulz, on 03/13/2009, -0/+7[citation needed]
- jameskong15, on 03/13/2009, -0/+6Maybe, just maybe, it's because they are commenting on Holder using that argument to push his pathetic agenda?
- frishackbanned, on 03/13/2009, -0/+6Good fences make good neighbours
-Robert Frost - cybrguy, on 03/13/2009, -1/+7Corruption is not a direct symptom, but it is an indirect symptom. Excess money from black markets increase corruption, and we have historical precedence to show it.
We can take this one step at a time. Legalize the cash cow, marijuana. Everyone knows that it is the big money maker, the least dangerous, the most prolific, and probably the most medically beneficial drug on the prohibited list. Ironically, there are dozens if not hundreds of drugs which are legal, but more dangerous than marijuana. - shiftclick, on 03/13/2009, -1/+7So, if Holder, Obama, Pelosi and Reid get our guns and stop OUR gun makers from selling them (legally), what's to stop the Mexican cartels from buying AK-47's directly from Chavez or any other despot? Nothing, Nada. This is lose/lose.
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