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75 Comments
- TheKriket, on 11/10/2009, -2/+68Why the hell is Dr. Phil even commenting on this? He's not even a REAL doctor.
- Lucas123, on 11/10/2009, -5/+52Having been in the military for two tours of duty, it's difficult to explain to people who haven't the level of trust and responsibility that an officer who's reached the rank of major is afforded. He was a field-grade officer and would have had gone through many pressure-filled leadership roles evaluations by superiors to get there. I don't know why this guy decided to go on a shooting rampage -- psychosis, terrorism, etc... --- but I do not believe he simply "snapped under pressure".
- skipvt, on 11/10/2009, -11/+49dr. phil, what a douche.
- IrishJoe, on 11/10/2009, -13/+45Ms. Rabinowitz and the Wall Street Journal should check a dictionary on what constitutes terrorism. It's an attack or threat of attack on civilians to instill fear (terror) for political purposes. Maj. Hasan's attack on his fellow soldiers was terrible, but is not terrorism. It's fratricide or blue on blue violence and those killed might be listed as dying from "friendly fire" in military records. No one is justifying what Hasan did; we all are rightly disgusted and horrified by his actions. But terrorism has a special meaning. Our military knows this and are not throwing the term around loosely and irresponsibly as Joe Lieberman and the Rupert Murdoch owned WSJ are.
- bluto36, on 11/10/2009, -4/+28exactly we are supposed to believe a Major in the army was the VICTIM of harassment?
by who? a group of NCO's would tease a major and call him camel jockey? or are we supposed to believe the colonels and Generals on the base were putting their careers on the line so they could tease him?
shut up Dr. douche Phil - Insightful, on 11/10/2009, -0/+19FUD. If people fear joining the military or if soldiers were willing leave for this, do you really want them to be your soldier?
Talk to some real soldiers instead of making up ***** about our military is afraid of Mr. 101 Keyboard Brigade. - Insightful, on 11/10/2009, -4/+22Slightly off topic but we having been kicking out able gay and lesbian soldiers for decades who wanted nothing more to serve our country yet religious fanatics have been able to thrive within our military. Why?
- yocouchdigga, on 11/11/2009, -2/+18Could someone kick Dr. Phil in the dick and get it on camera, please? The guy is an absolutely enormous douche.
- Idiggapony, on 11/10/2009, -7/+23You really don't have even the slightest idea what went on in this case, do you?
- Idiggapony, on 11/10/2009, -6/+21Agreed. It's not terrorism. The meaning of the word "terrorism" is being gradually eroded by people who use it to mean "anything that I really don't like," like the author of this article, and, recently, Joe Lieberman. Although your mention of Rupert Murdoch is a non-sequitur that isn't relevant here.
- ReisenInaba, on 11/10/2009, -1/+15He stayed in a Holiday Day Inn Express last night?
- GunWraith, on 11/10/2009, -8/+20This was not terrorism. This was mass homicide. There is a significant difference between the two, and we need to make sure that that distinction remains firm.
- BohicaTwentyTwo, on 11/10/2009, -3/+14How many documented cases are there of psychiatrists being driven homicidally insane by their patients?
I mean besides this one:
<A class=user href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Harley_Quinn" rel=nofollow>http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Harley_Quinn</A> ... - Dr3w, on 11/11/2009, -3/+14For anyone who didn't read the article and wanted to get some Dr. Phil bashing in, the title and description of this submission makes it sound like Dr. Phil had done the "terrorist motive" talking, but he was actually cautioning not to jump to the terrorist conclusion. It was WSJ conservative writer Dorothy Rabinowitz who wants us to neglect everything but the shooter's Islamic background as the cause of his rampage.
And I'm not saying his Islamic background is something to ignore either, some of his behaviors were pretty alarming. It's just that I've found looking at everything usually provides a better picture than putting up the blinders and squinting at just part of the picture. - twiztidsinz, on 11/10/2009, -5/+14Except for the fact that Murdoch owns WSJ and Faux News
- Dr3w, on 11/11/2009, -1/+9How is an editorial the truth? Those were her opinions.
- Lucas123, on 11/10/2009, -5/+13He kind of shouted "Allahu Akbar" (Allah is great) while he was murdering people and he'd just been shopping earlier that day in the local 7-Eleven in a full-length Muslim dress. That kind of clued people into this incident being related to his religious beliefs.
- DarkShroud, on 11/11/2009, -2/+10How about the fact that he tired to contact Al-Qaeda members.
- duggtodeath, on 11/11/2009, -6/+14Nice hawkish piece from the WSJ. However, the NY Post beat you to the Muslim-bashing, however.
- GunWraith, on 11/11/2009, -2/+9Terrorism: the use of violence and threats to intimidate or coerce, esp. for political purposes.
There was no apparent political motive to this. This is a man who did not want to be deployed (seemingly due to his religious beliefs), snapped, and went on a killing spree. This is no more terrorism than the Columbine shootings.
And yes, often times there is religious "screaming" prior to acts of mass homicide. "Jesus forgive me", "Lord have mercy on my soul", etc... - BohicaTwentyTwo, on 11/10/2009, -1/+8Yes, I know. Edit fail.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Harley_Quinn - bugsy187, on 11/11/2009, -3/+9Is it more important to find out what exactly happened or use this event as a "you're with us or against us" speech?
- DarkShroud, on 11/11/2009, -3/+9High stress? The men who have actually been in combat have not gone on shooting sprees.
- SpeedSteamBoat, on 11/11/2009, -0/+5No matter which side of this particular debate you take, I think we can all agree on this point.
- lebeagle, on 11/11/2009, -6/+11One witness has publicly stated he was silent whilst shooting others have either recanted statements or offered no comment. Millions walk round in Muslim garb all day and don't murder anyone.
Perhaps we should just wait until there has been a full inquiry and trial before we condemn this guy as a terrorist, mentally ill or both. - geodebug, on 11/11/2009, -0/+5Ms Rabonowitz is just as bad as Dr. Phil, making calls from the sidelines. I say we sit tight and see what the investigation yields. The guy is alive, maybe he'll actually tell us what his motives were.
What's the benefit of jumping to a conclusion? None. It wont bring back the dead and it won't make him any more or less guilty. Even if it comes out that it was a coordinated attack with an external party (Al-Qaeda) does that change anything? We are already at war with them.
My gut feeling is this guy just went bonkers and isn't part of a larger movement, but my feeling is worth about zip, just like the WSJ and Dr. Phil. - blackinthmiddle, on 11/10/2009, -2/+6"No American is served by our country's decision to ignore any kind of extremism for fear of offending people."
There, fixed it for you. - EatingPie, on 11/11/2009, -4/+8The point of the article is more like... "The media, what douches."
Heck, the next day ABC ran an article about how the terrorist was called "Camel Jockey," which somehow was supposed to justify his murder of these people. Pathetic.
-Pie - SpeedSteamBoat, on 11/11/2009, -1/+5Murdoch properties have a fascist slant that often preys on xenophobia and bigotry.
The fact that the WSJ is such a properties is absolutely relevant. - ryanonfire, on 11/11/2009, -0/+4Yeah he may have a PhD but he never published any academic papers from it which is pretty piss poor.
- Lucas123, on 11/11/2009, -3/+6Other people don't need to condemn him, he condemned himself by his actions. Whether he did this as an act of a religious extremist or just because he was nuts, makes little difference.
- geoboy, on 11/11/2009, -0/+3Personally, I'm waiting for Jack Thompson to chime in.
- 68024, on 11/11/2009, -5/+8Oh my god! An arab wearing arab dress! He must be a terrorist.
- SpeedSteamBoat, on 11/11/2009, -1/+4How is pointing out that ethnic discrimination and badging might have played a part in leading this man to murder in any way suggest that those motives justify he actions in the least?
- duggtodeath, on 11/11/2009, -0/+2My bad, however.
- smcnow, on 11/11/2009, -0/+2From the actual opinion piece it is Rabinowitz, no Dr. Phil, who comes off as a douche. Rabinowitz is crystal clear on Hassan's motives having never said word one to the man. Just because he shouts "Allahu Akbar" does not make him a religious extremist or even religious for that matter. Rabinowitz rules out even George Stephanopolous' alternative that he just snapped. That he had been bending toward that breaking point for a long time does not even warrant consideration. Perhaps one day I will have the all knowing wisdom of Dorothy Rabinowitz, but until that day, I think I will consider evidence and treat speculation as just that.
- Sucka27, on 11/11/2009, -1/+3Douggmc, so are you saying it should be classified as an act of war? The former in your definition is not met, the latter might be, so this could be argued.
The grey area is that you can't classify something as an act of war if there's no specific country involved (at least not traditionally), in this case it's a religion. The easiest out is to say it is terrorism because it's a familiar term used to describe Muslim on western world violence.
Personally, I don't give a ***** what they call it and it isn't really important. There might have been a host of factors going into the decision, maybe he was scared to be called to duty AND didn't want to fight fellow Muslims. Maybe he also grew mentally instable while fighting this internal battle and took a way out that might, in his eyes, see him recognized as a hero by the people he valued more, in the process making a statement to "God" proving just that.
The point is, it isn't black and white. When someone does something ***** up like there are most likely a ton of factors contributing to the final motive. Placing too much importance on the terminology used is just over-analyzing. - geodebug, on 11/11/2009, -1/+3Agree.
Dramatic violence tends to motivate people to irrationality (Iraq war ring a bell?), which is just what the Army is rightfully is worried about. You have 3000 Muslim soldiers kicking ass for the US and one goes bonkers so does it make sense to paint them all with the same brush? Besides, this ***** isn't the first soldier to murder his comrades, just (unfortunately) the most successful.
Being divisive is just what the enemy wants. Don't feed their wishes with ***** until the true story comes out. - themadrammer, on 11/10/2009, -24/+26Amazing that the Suicide & Stress rate in the military is at highest levels, yet when a man goes on a homicidal killing streak, it must be his religion!
- ItWasOnlyAJoke, on 11/11/2009, -1/+3First of all: don't get me wrong, you may be correct...but
What exactly are the suicide bombings in Iraq? Are these classified as terroristic? I don't know why this guy was screaming "Allahu Akbar," and I don't know exactly what his motives were for trying to contact Al Qaeda, but it seems to me that the motives for this are something a little more than an average shooting.
(Yes, I know, attack me for using Wikipedia)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Terrorism
_________
Terrorism is the systematic use of terror especially as a means of coercion. At present, there is no internationally agreed definition of terrorism. Common definitions of terrorism refer only to those violent acts which are intended to create fear (terror), are perpetrated for an ideological goal (as opposed to a lone attack), and deliberately target or disregard the safety of non-combatants.
_________
Terrorism? It's hard to say; the definition is very fuzzy...I'm not sure anyone can exactly put it into one category, but there are certainly some big question marks here, and I suppose it all comes down to the unknown. Only the shooter knew what his motives were; if he was doing it as a martyr attempt to further a terroristic cause (which appears to be possible), then you would think it should be lumped into a terroristic act. - SpeedSteamBoat, on 11/11/2009, -2/+4@Lucas123: You completely just contradicted yourself by insisting that it was religiously motivated then saying it didn't matter if it was or not.
If it doesn't matter either way, why argue?
That said, if I wore a cross necklace at a 7-Eleven then later someone claimed to have seen me praying while I committed a heinous act of mass murder would you be as comfortable concluding I was religiously motivated to kill? - Dregganaut, on 11/11/2009, -1/+3The dude was a sanctimonious hypocrite who put on a show of Islamic piousness but also went to strip clubs and drank beer. I heard reports that he was bullied for his religion, but I get the feeling that he was actually bullied because he was an ***** who everyone hated. His eyes scream "momma's boy" to me.
- bigterguy, on 11/11/2009, -0/+2Even without Hasan's future comments, we need to learn how to 'connect the dots' from available data and predict who might 'go off'. So there is a very good reason to evaluate this case closely and be sure we don't miss the next one. Remember that before 9/11 there were a variety of warnings that were missed because we refused to connect the dots. The next one could be even more serious - a bio, chem or nuclear weapon in a major city.
- Scaryclouds, on 11/11/2009, -2/+4@Lucas
Apparently it makes a difference to you. Your words and actions seem to suggest a wishfulness for this to be religiously motivated. - geodebug, on 11/11/2009, -0/+1I agree that it is important to find out why he did it: "sit tight and see what the investigation yields". I'm more commenting on the general public who are jumping to conclusions based on their biases and guesswork. We don't need a lynch mob editorial from the WSJ and we don't need armchair QB from Mr. Phil.
- Idiggapony, on 11/12/2009, -0/+1Of course he's "part of a larger movement." There's no possible way that anyone could deny that. Islamic extremism has hundreds of millions of adherents internationally, supported by tens of billions of dollars in oil money that have gone to install radical clerics in mosques, madrassas, community organizations, clerical credentialing organizations and the like all over the world.
Hasan is "part of a larger movement" even if he never contacted anyone else about his plans and had no help in what he did. - HEINRICI, on 11/11/2009, -0/+1OK Joe,
I sure do feel better now that you went to the dictionary. I am in the Army, fought guys like this, and you don't have a clue. Every single military person that does not drink Kool Aid knows this to be terrorism. That the definition did not originally include "unarmed people" does not change the fact that it was a terror attack. The very fact that this guy is Islamic and paraded around in a Jihad costume (between lap dance sessions) among the other dozen indicators he showed tells the story, I wish Hasan was a Cambridge cop, then people like you would get right to the point. I checked your thousands of other postings. You hate military people and Republicans, of which most military people are. Go suck Rachel Maddows' c0ck. They are attached to balls you don't have.. - GauteHauk, on 11/11/2009, -1/+2However, however.
- CanUTube, on 11/11/2009, -0/+1But, those combat simulator games TEACH people to kill!
- Lucas123, on 11/11/2009, -0/+1Amazing the number of diggers jumping to this guy's defense. It's a modern day phenom. We're all concerned we may offend Muslims. The fact is, and you may want to absorb this and reflect on it, religious extremists have little to do with mainstream Muslims. Extremists, if that's what this major was, don't deserve your sympathy and understanding. If hijacking four planes and flying three of them into buildings and crashing a fourth into a field didn't turn America against Muslims, this nut case isn't going to either.
And, if indeed this had been a Christian who'd gone "postal" I have no doubt there would be no such defense from folks like yourself worried it might tarnish the reputation of other Christians in America.. -
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