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- InfernoX, on 10/28/2009, -4/+72Makes perfect sense. Just compare first gen PS2 games to the latest gen games. It's amazing what you can do when you're on a closed platform and can focus entirely on optimizing for specific hardware.
- Xaevier, on 10/28/2009, -3/+69The Japanese expect to triple the TPS (Tentacles per second) per schoolgirl for their PS3 games in two years time, for now all we can do is wait.
- soundsofreason, on 10/28/2009, -7/+63Can't wait to see how much further the system gets pushed in 2010. This is just my opinion, but I'm already enjoying my ps3 way more than I did the ps2... and believe me, I loved my ps2. Picked it up when it first came out and I was still in high school. Can't count how many great games I played on it...
Picked up my 80GB over a year ago (MGS4 bundle) 'cause I knew that was gonna be the last model with backwards compatability... funny thing is, I only used it for FFX for like two weeks and haven't since... and I don't see myself using the BC again for a looooooooooong time.
I find myself going back to these games over and over... like Warhawk, LBP, Killzone 2 (online of course... campaign was kinda weak), Infamous, MGS4, Uncharted 1+2, Valkyria Chronicles, Demon's Souls, etc... not to mention all the kick ass games coming soon... and the kick ass PSN titles.
No matter how much time I put these games down for, when I come back to them they are just as much fun if not more. Not trying to promote Sony here, just sayin' I think that they sometimes get a bad rap, but if ppl gave the ps3 a chance they could find it to be one of the best systems they've ever had... imo - sloach, on 10/28/2009, -3/+53See quote in article:
"We're using all of the PS3 right now," Stevenson says. "But you can always be more efficient in the way you use it." - AvidPreatorian, on 10/28/2009, -3/+52Uncharted 3, 2011.
- Solkre, on 10/29/2009, -2/+37I was unaware we had a TPS scale, I'm horrified and aroused.
- SuicideMouse, on 10/29/2009, -7/+40Multi-platform games look nearly the same on the 360/PS3 but in all honesty some of the exclusives on the PS3 blow anything I've seen on the 360 out of the water. I have both and I'm not trying to be a fanboy, I love my (3rd) 360 and my PS3, I just think my PS3 is better.
- master69better, on 10/29/2009, -2/+35Open question - the best graphics on the PS3 have almost always been on exclusives (MSG4, Uncharted/2), can we expect to find more exclusives in the future as the PS3 breaks away from the 360 in performance? The trend so far from what I see is that multi-platform games hit the least common denominator and you really need to squint at side-by-side hi-res screenshots to discern differences between the 360 and PS3.
- SpeedSteamBoat, on 10/29/2009, -8/+39Meh, whatever.
Seems like a meaningless statement that sounds good for PR purposes.
How do you determine when a system is "maxed"? Graphically, it is already considerably less powerful than even mid-level PC graphics hardware, and the GeForce 7 based chipset inside the PS3 already lacks a lot of the latest graphics features.
Sure, games at the end of a systems life cycle tend to look the best of those developed for that particular platform, but it's all relative. God of War II looked AWESOME for a PS2 game, but obviously didn't belong on a PS3 or 360.
I guess finding a game that makes sense for the Cell's weird architecture is a bit of chore, but otherwise...
It's cool that you typically will continue to find more creative ways to be more effective with the same hardware, but that sort of thing isn't really news.
That said I'll probably be buying a PS3 within the next year. - raydeen, on 10/29/2009, -2/+32You didn't get the TPS report? I'm going to have to speak to Peter about this. Yeeeeeaaaaaahhhhhhh......
- Ajajadude, on 10/29/2009, -4/+27So, what you're saying is you'd know more than the people who design these games, right?
- master69better, on 10/29/2009, -8/+30Pre-release Uncharted 2 : "We maxed out the PS3"
Post-release Uncharted 2/ Pre-hype for Uncharted 3: " Still some juice left in that old turkey"
Pre-release Uncharted 3 : "We maxed out the PS3"
Post-release Uncharted 3/ Pre-hype for Uncharted 4: " Still some juice left in that old turkey"
................................
Pre-release Uncharted n : "We maxed out the PS3"
Post-release Uncharted n: "We're excited about the PS4" - allisonaxe, on 10/29/2009, -4/+24"PS3 Won't be Maxed for at least Another Two Years"
translation: "its really hard to develop for and it is taking us that long to get the most out of the system." - StealthGod, on 10/29/2009, -19/+38This is *****!
I make games and I work with the PS3, Xbox 360 and PC. Why would anyone applaud Sony for making a console that is so difficult to work for that it takes five or six years to figure out how to make games well?
Optimizing your games is a never ending process, that's going to happen on any platform. The problem with the PS3 is that it's extremely difficult to tap into all the available power because of the architecture. Why not just design a console that actually caters to video games, rather than a powerhouse processor that could potentially be used in many devices that isn't particularly aimed at games? That's what Microsoft did, and as a result the 360 is very easy to develop for. - camaroz06, on 10/29/2009, -4/+22I dunno about that I think the PS3 already has it's hands full when trying to push 1080P games.
- LXicon, on 10/29/2009, -2/+19if you RTFA you'll see that James Stevenson says : "We're using all of the PS3 right now, but you can always be more efficient in the way you use it."
there's a difference between "using 100% of the hardware" and "using 100% of the hardware in the most optimized way". - kingmanic, on 10/29/2009, -7/+23Not exactly the same but generally within the same computing generation but are far from the same. The 360 being easier to exploit while the Ps3 is more flexible. John Carmack sincerely believed the PS3 was the more powerful machine by a reasonable margin but he thought the PS3 was a pain int he ass to get that power out. Now that a lot of people have taken the time to squeeze the machine it gets easier for everyone else as those tricks and tips get out and those compilers and dev kits do as well.
The key difference is that the 360 is essentially a PC with higher memory bandwidth while the PS3 is a much different entity. The GPU on the 360 is easy to keep busy but slower than the PS3 one. The CPU on the 360 is similar in basic design but much different in principle as it's 3 symmetric cores vs 1 big core + 6 faster but less general purpose cores. They even differ in ram architecture. The 360 is a general purpose machine that has been slightly modified while the PS3 is a special purpose machine through and through. - mirunit, on 10/29/2009, -3/+18Well, graphics do tend to translate into better immersion - and having responsibilities that prevent you from playing all the time is not a bad thing at all. I get hardly any time to play, but sometimes on the weekend it is great stuff.
- Contradictions, on 10/29/2009, -1/+15Why do you think many of the good games on the PS3 are all native 720p?
- StealthGod, on 10/29/2009, -4/+18The 360 has parallel processors. The difference is that it's easier to run anything on them. The PS3 has SPU's which requires fairly specialized code to be packaged up and run on them. Same idea, but much harder to execute.
- BlackKnight6, on 10/29/2009, -2/+16The 360 is hot because they chose not to correct the quality of the chips in fabrication (yields), not because its a slow architecture and is "OCed" to match the PS3:
http://games.venturebeat.com/2008/09/05/xbox-360-d ...
Also, the Cell and the Xenon are both made by IBM and the main core PPC's are very similar. The PS3 has just one that has no SMT while the 360 has 3 PPC's with SMT which comes to 6 threads. Both CPU's are extremely tailored for multi-threaded code. The difference with the 2 CPUs is not multi vs single threaded, both are very multi-threaded. The difference is symmetrical (Xenon) and asymmetrical (Cell).
And the comment of "Small processors with a specific task are FAR more able than 1 big processor that can do everything." really depends on far more able than WHAT? specialized, fast processors are better at what ever they are SPECIALIZED for meaning they are limited or deficient or slow in other calculations unlike a general purpose processor. Physics, collision detections and branch intensive caluclations are extremely slow on the the Cell's available 6 SPE's (7th is dedicated to the OS and the 8th is disabled on all PS3 Cell's to improve yields) while they are very fast for sound processing and video decompression and so on... - forcedfx, on 10/29/2009, -0/+13I get it occasionally in COD5 as well. I think the biggest problem is that developers aren't coding to take advantage of the PS3's power. Instead they try to code for the PC, XBOX and PS3 all at the same time.
- kingmanic, on 10/29/2009, -3/+15Well I'm sure the fact that Sony owns naughty dog was also a consideration.
- clippclop, on 10/29/2009, -13/+25The other result was that Microsoft had to rely on a super fact processor that generates an ass tonne of heat in order to try to match the available power in the PS3. They still failed.
Sorry dude, but parallel dedicated processing is the way of the future. Sony hit the nail on the head by changing the architecture. Now, next generation it will be easier to develop for since there will be practiced developers and everyone will be asking why the hell microsoft isnt following suit.
Small processors with a specific task are FAR more able than 1 big processor that can do everything. - KingJoshi, on 10/29/2009, -7/+19Sony gets a bad rep for many deserved reasons. From CD rootkit fiasco, proprietary DRMed digital music for music players that had ***** software (which is why it never became popular), vendor lock-in (like Apple, Microsoft, etc), and overpriced hardware that is nowhere as good as its reputation. Obviously there are many specific reasons but that would get numerous. But Sony, like any other company, is made up of many departments and individuals. And sometimes the marketers probably veto the engineers.
Regarding the gaming division specifically, the marketing people always over promise and under deliver the launch of a gaming system. And if a system's potential still can't be exploited after a few years, maybe they made it too difficult to program for? If you want to be technical about optimization, given enough time, a person can always think of ways to optimize the algorithms and system.
However, just as the Wii was a risk for Nintendo given its low powered hardware but innovative style, Sony took a risk with high priced launch but with a very powerful system. Obviously, as the years go by, its more powerful system will have a greater value. Sony can add new controllers without changing the system and it can quickly be adopted, but if Nintendo came out with a more powerful system, it can't be adopted as quickly.
Sony also took a risk of having a built in Blue-Ray player and that also is paying off. That increased the initial launch price and it was derided by many. Most TVs couldn't take advantage of it but the pay-offs were always with the future in mind. Hard-core gamers spend thousands on gaming PCs so a $600 console really wasn't that expensive with that comparison. However, for general audience, the $250 Wii was a much better value for quick social gaming. Given that Sony had a relatively rough start but they designed with the future in mind, you have to give credit where its due.
Though I still hate the company for reasons mentioned above. But it's not like Microsoft or Nintendo are any 'friendlier' companies. - Trigonometron, on 10/29/2009, -3/+15♬♬ Backupinyourass with the-res-ur-rection ♬♬
- gcauthon, on 10/29/2009, -6/+17Who cares what a Sony-exclusive developer thinks about Sony hardware. It's not like his opinion is going to be taken seriously by anyone. That would be like Miyamoto suddenly putting out a press release praising the Wii hardware. They may privately think that their respective platforms are actually quite crappy, but they're never going to bite the hand that feeds them. How about an unbiased opinion?
- SageShini, on 10/29/2009, -2/+12@Ajajadude: Apparently he does. /s
To say its "completely maxed out" would be to say that games will NEVER look any better than they do right now. I ain't buying that. It hasn't been true since the SNES days, and even they found a way to make graphics for their games look slightly better. - mirunit, on 10/29/2009, -2/+12Except I didn't compare it to the price of anything. I basically just said 'it would be nice if we had consoles with more current GPU power' as the 7900GTX was prior to unified shader architecture. I am pretty sure everyone understands that a console is a locked platform - it is that way to make it easy to develop and debug.
- Raptor007, on 10/29/2009, -3/+12This is a stupid discussion. Whether or not the Cell CPU is maxed out is irrelevant, since the GPU can't handle high-detail scenes at 1080p. This is why most PS3 games run at 720p or lower, a feat easily managed by any 5-year-old PC.
- mirunit, on 10/29/2009, -3/+12Just imagine if it was using graphics hardware not equal to a 7900GTX. Uncharted 2 looked pretty good though, I would say that is currently as good as it gets on the PS3.
- fuzzynyanko, on 10/29/2009, -6/+14"Sorry dude, but parallel dedicated processing is the way of the future"
Um, the 360 CPU has 3 cores and uses multithreading. In fact, each core is based on the PPE of the Cell CPU - krets, on 10/29/2009, -4/+12I have a blast with my PS3 and playing online. Killzone 2 and Uncharted 2 are both excellent online games.
- fuzzynyanko, on 10/29/2009, -2/+10"We would have considered the 360" A Sony-owned company was actually considering to make it a 360 game?
- bigteebo, on 10/29/2009, -0/+8But with PC graphics hardware, there's something better coming out every 6 months, but you still have to code games for it.
- dsmx, on 10/29/2009, -4/+12The PS3's cell processor is where computing is heading so get used to it now. More to the point the difficulty in programming for the PS3 does mean you do get bigger leaps in graphics over the life of the console. Uncharted 2 showed the world what the ps3 can do when developers actually try.
- Spanq, on 10/29/2009, -1/+9Make a SSX for PS3, please! I can't even count how many hours of my life I devoted to the first one and Tricky.
- Raptor007, on 10/29/2009, -1/+8Mirunit and Norman619 are both correct here. You may be able to push a little more data through the Cell, but the rendering still has to be done by a GPU that's getting to be ancient by PC standards. Most PS3 games are already too complex for the GPU to handle at 1080p, so they render at 720p or less.
- clippclop, on 10/29/2009, -1/+8Uncharted 2 set the bar pretty damn high for just about everyone. My only problem with the game was how i was mashing on circle while running away so i could roll, and instead of jumped to the nearest wall in sight and let the ***** shoot him.
EVERY game to date could take a bunch of notes from the visuals and voice overs in the game. The voice overs set it apart from anything i've played to date. It really changes the game when there is good acting. - pixelate, on 10/29/2009, -0/+7For most titles it's going to come down to money, and they'll make more if they release it for both platforms (unless there's exclusivity cash to factor in). If it makes one or both versions slightly worse, they've shown it's an acceptable tradeoff.
- master69better, on 10/29/2009, -7/+13The next CryEngine debuted its tech demo on the PS3
- clippclop, on 10/29/2009, -8/+14Because the SDK is so similar and easy to work with, i am going ot go ahead and say that the 360 is basically maxed out at this point.
- inactive, on 10/29/2009, -2/+7All those "maxed out" gaming PC's you build are usually a waste of money as well because most games that will take advantage of that 500 dollar videocard you just bought won't be out until a good 1-2 years after it's release
- Sniper, on 10/30/2009, -0/+5You'd need a big ass TV to tell the difference.
- zephyrprime, on 10/29/2009, -2/+7Most game machines are cutting edge when they come out. That just hasn't happened this generation because the SKU prices for computer graphics hardware became super high and allowed for a level of performance the consoles couldn't match. In the future, console hardware will probably continue to not be cutting edge.
- douglasr007, on 10/29/2009, -12/+17News update: Full functionality and capacity of video consoles not found until years after its release, more at 11.
- NeoTechni, on 10/30/2009, -1/+6ati said it was impossible
- kingmanic, on 10/29/2009, -2/+7The 360 is really nice for developers but the hardware quality is flaky. The PS3 is a nice piece of hardware but like it's older brother; it's a mess to optimize for. I'm not sure but it seems the flaky hardware has caught up to the 360's brand and the optimization got easier as more people worked on it. I think the competition is ultimately good for us (consumers) so while Microsoft may make your life easier I would hate to see Microsoft as the only player in the market. Sony is/was arrogant and odd with their design and marketing decisions but I think the beat down they got made their product better in the end.
As a programmer I'm pretty glad I'm not a PS3 programming grunt because I don't think I could hack the frustration. But I hear it's been getting easier all the time. It seems they have a handle on it and most of the big studios can put out a multi platform game that is the same on both platforms. - frostydf2, on 10/30/2009, -1/+6Maybe it's just me, but I feel that 1080p and 720p are just numbers. Uncharted 2 ran in 720p and was the most beautiful game I have ever played (train sequence). I really don't care if it was optimized in 1080p or not. The fact is - the game is absolutely beautiful as is most PS3 games.
- apothekari, on 10/29/2009, -3/+7"Hey, Peter-man, Turn't on channel 5, Breast exam's on!"
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