What is Digg?Sponsored by HowLifeWorks
How Private Online Shopping Clubs Work view!
howlifeworks.com - How to become a member and get discounts of up to 80% on must-have luxury goods
171 Comments
- Jdean0012, on 04/13/2009, -5/+153Who'd have thought there'd be shots at an AA meeting...
- TonyLocNE, on 04/13/2009, -5/+105Another violent crime prevented by responsible gun ownership.
2A FTW! - inactive, on 04/13/2009, -4/+100Maybe he was trying to kick the habit of robbing liquor stores
- badwithcomputer, on 04/13/2009, -2/+89if the guy already has a gun out, i don't think it's entirely unreasonable to assume he has at least some intention of using it. waiting for the robber to shoot somebody before you can fire at him is asinine. if he doesn't want to get shot, maybe he shouldn't be robbing people at gunpoint.
- pbostley, on 04/13/2009, -4/+87How exactly is using a firearm to rob someone NOT lethal situation? or are you a complete moron?
- Landthatilove, on 04/13/2009, -4/+80"Columbia Police say Helms walked into the meeting with a gun and demanded whatever those at the center had and was shot."
I guess he should have said "Except your bullets".
;-D - inactive, on 04/13/2009, -2/+70Lesson #1, Don't rob a person with DTs
- graahBrains, on 04/13/2009, -1/+66Why would somebody rob an AA meeting? "YEA! Recovering Alcoholics! Those ***** are rolling in cash." Moron.
- jayv2010, on 04/13/2009, -6/+68This is the exact reason for concealed weapons permits. The crooks never know who else has a gun because the crooks always have a gun. It is the Law abiding citizens that are licensed and permitted to carry guns for self defense that everyone should be thankful for. Stores that put signs out from saying "NO WEAPONS ALLOWED" don't do any good because all you prevent is the Permit holders from coming in. The bad guys don't care and if fact prefer to go to those types of buildings.....
Yes, I have a concealed permit and in this situation would have done the exact same thing equal force, now if he had a knife it would have been a different story. - Greengoo, on 04/13/2009, -1/+63Lesson #2, When picking targets to rob, don't pick people who are likely to be on edge, agitated or angry.
- Contradictions, on 04/13/2009, -2/+60It would have been nice if no one was killed, but if you try to rob someone at gunpoint you had better be ready to take the consequences.
- yfph, on 04/13/2009, -1/+46Umm the robber did more than simply wave a gun around while doing a happy dance.
- HCviolence, on 04/13/2009, -1/+44Hello I'm John and I'm robbing you.
- stevets, on 04/13/2009, -0/+38He could have shot any or all of those people at any moment. Why should anybody wait around for him to do it?
Pointing a loaded gun at someone and making them fear for their life is certainly punishable by death. Every. Single. Time.
How's that warm fuzzy blanket of hippie idealism treating you? - EndIsraelRacism, on 04/13/2009, -1/+38Are you serious? If a robber is not likely to hurt someone, why do they bring weapons and point them in a threatening manner?
Do you live in a cave or something in which you do not receive newspapers or television newscasts about how people have been hurt or killed by robbers?
Ignorance is amazing. - makkaveli19, on 04/13/2009, -2/+36heyoo!
- Dimensio, on 04/13/2009, -1/+34Brandishing a firearm creates a legitimate threat of grevious bodily harm, including death. As such, deadly force in response to that threat is legally justified.
- inactive, on 04/13/2009, -0/+31Its better to end it now and not have any innocents victims, than to have innocents victims and regret not ending it earlier.
- makkaveli19, on 04/13/2009, -2/+29don't feed the troll people.
- stevets, on 04/13/2009, -1/+26What was he supposed to wait for? The guy to pull the trigger? Since when is someone pointing a gun at people a non-lethal situation?
- Ubermann, on 04/13/2009, -0/+24I wonder what would have happened at an Anger Management Meeting.
- whitesaint, on 04/13/2009, -3/+27You know a lot of very religious people are quite fond of being responsible for their actions. Just because someone is very religious -- they're automatically going to do crazy ***** because they're not responsible for their actions? If anyone shouldn't be allowed a gun, it's you, sir.
- Samurai77, on 04/13/2009, -1/+25You are a ***** idiot!
If you brandish a gun at a police officer he will kill your dumb ass!
This is exactly what a CCW permit is for, and why I'm getting mine. - AmyVernon, on 04/13/2009, -1/+24Though that might have been equally disturbing.
- bradleyland, on 04/13/2009, -1/+24Heh. According to Friday night's 20/20, untrained citizens don't have what it takes to stop an armed assailant. They even did an experiment to prove it!
I almost threw my remote at the television several times during their openly anti-gun tirade. They had a *trained firearms instructor* raiding a room where he knew he would face an armed opponent, who just happens to be a student with an hour or two of firearms training and no idea someone is about to burst through the door.
Here's the thing. No matter how cool you are under pressure, or how well trained you are, if your opponent gets the jump on you (enters the room with weapon drawn and KNOWS that you're in there with a gun), you stand no chance. You cannot draw and fire quickly enough.
20/20's position is that a firearm is useless in these situations. To support this opinion, they present the usual arguments:
* Tunnel vision prevents proper situational awareness
* Fight/flight response deteriorates fine motor skills
* Impaired judgement under the rush of adrenaline
What their experiment fails to capture is that more often than not, the assailant is suffering from the same exact issues. In the 20/20 experiment, the assailant is well informed of the situation when he enters the room, and he has little reason to be amped up. He's trained, and he knows what he's walking in to. In real life scenarios, you have someone who has probably never done this before, and even if they have, they haven't "trained" for it. They are just as amped up on adrenaline as you are. The odds are much more even.
In the closing remarks they note that they couldn't find a single "credible" study on the topic of firearms used in self-defense. They must have summarily discarded any study from a pro-gun lobby, but formulated their entire argument on the basis of the anti-gun lobby. How incredibly irresponsible. Shame on 20/20. - buddamus, on 04/13/2009, -9/+31Alcoholics Anonymous is for quitters
- stevets, on 04/13/2009, -0/+22Let's say 5% of robberies result in violence carried out by the perpetrator.
If you were being robbed at gunpoint, would you be willing to bet your life that you wouldn't be one of 5 people in 100 that would be killed?
I certainly would not. - winry, on 04/13/2009, -2/+22YEAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
- Samurai77, on 04/13/2009, -1/+21***** THAT you rob me with a weapon you DIE! Every ***** time!
- azimir, on 04/13/2009, -2/+21Threatening my life is punishable by death. The robbery is merely ancillary to the point at hand.
- holyskeleton, on 04/13/2009, -1/+18praise the CWP
- sockpuppets, on 04/13/2009, -0/+16He'd be hugged into submission by a guy with bitch *****.
- ivosilva, on 04/13/2009, -3/+19instantrimshot.com
- joelsmif, on 04/13/2009, -4/+20Would this be considered natural selection?
- Stingwolf, on 04/13/2009, -1/+16Your entire argument is moot when you factor in people who -illegally- own guns. They will do so no matter what the legal status of firearms is. I'm sorry to say it, but it's the sad truth. It would be wonderful to live in a world where guns were unnecessary, but this is not that world.
- naner, on 04/13/2009, -0/+15Self defense is not murder. stevets nailed it on the head. If you point a gun at me, I'm going to assume (as would any judge out there) that you intended to do me harm. I have the right to defend myself, up to and including killing you if that's what it takes. Ideally, this would have been solved with no loss of life. However, situations like this are less than ideal.
- Samurai77, on 04/13/2009, -1/+15So do I!
Younger than that have killed many, so WTF is your point. - whitesaint, on 04/13/2009, -3/+17@ yttrstein
So we must have different ideas on what the definition of psychotic is. The majority of religious people are honest, hard working people. You're just letting a few bad apples speak for the entirety of their respective religions. Just because they believe in a "fairytale" doesn't mean they are out of touch with reality and want to murder everyone they see. For the most part, these are good people. - inactive, on 04/13/2009, -0/+13Another tard bites the dust. Good.
- DocSquidly, on 04/13/2009, -0/+13@MalaysianMafia
Don't have stats on all your criteria but, I can provide to some numbers.
According to "The National Self Defense Survey" conducted by Florida State University, guns for self defense 2,500,000 times per year. This is includes everything from simply showing the gun and having the attacker flee to shooting and killing the attacker, in situation where the "the defender believed that someone "almost certainly" would have died had the gun not been used for protection".
That comes out to a life protected by a privately held gun about once every 1.3 minutes compared to fatal accidents involving a firearm occurs in the United States only about once every 6 hours.
Note - figure does not include criminals killed while committing a crime.
http://hematite.com/dragon/gunclock_stats.html
In Dade county Florida, when they started issuing carry permits that started tracking crimes committed by people with the permits. Between September of 1987 and August of 1992, Dade County recorded 4 crimes committed by licensees with firearms.
In the state of Florida as a whole; 221,443 concealed carry licenses were issued in Florida between October of 1987 and April of 1994. During that time, Florida recorded 18 crimes committed by licensees with firearms.
http://www.justfacts.com/guncontrol.asp#Right-To-C ...
Unfortunately, information for all the states that issue permits isn't readily available on the internet.
As crimes; statistically people with concealed carry permits are less likely to be arrested for violent and non-violent crimes.
http://www.gunmyths.com/2009/04/03/myth-people-wit ...
Hope this answers some of your questions. Here some links for your reading pleasure.
http://gunowners.org/fs0404.htm
http://hematite.com/dragon/gunintro.html
http://www.guncite.com/ - ultraseamus, on 04/13/2009, -1/+14Not glad that someone had to die, but I do like stories such as this one coming out, stories that make committing crimes look dangerous. Worst thing that could happen now is for charges to be pressed, and for the the guy who stopped the robbery to be found guilty. That would make no sense, and would essentially tell people "do not defend yourselves, that's what the government is for" which is a scary thought. On an unrelated note, I saw "V for Vendetta" for the first time last night, good movie.
- CoD4, on 04/13/2009, -1/+13The barrels were emptied out
- joshuasmaximus, on 04/13/2009, -0/+11You are totally right. That segment was not a fair representation of "typical self defense situation" These kids were basically surprised by a swat team of one who knew they were armed and where they were sitting. Not only did they have no time to react, they were using retention holsters under very long t-shirts and they were wearing gloves. I dare even cops to draw from under a baggy-t with gloves on. How do you feel a t-shirt when you have no tactile sense? I also liked how the one guy who was experienced failed because someone sitting across the room from him (who he assumed was a fellow student) shot him while his focus was on the main assailant. Nobody is going to make it out of THAT situation alive gun or not.
This was the basic outline of the "fair discussion about guns"
Point # 1: Guns can't protect you.
Point #2: Your child WILL find you gun in a toy box and shoot another child or himself. (Video of little kids pointing unloaded guns at them selves and friends.)
Point #3: Teenagers WILL find your gun and shoot someone or themselves if dared to play with it by a 20/20 producer. Also, guns have a mind of there own and will go off if looked at the wrong way.
Point #4 There are entire Cities that go "Gun crazy" at night and shoot little kids and there dads. (Lots of video of scary black guys and black girls flashing guns around. The police are helpless against the problem.
Point #5 Law abiding citizens should not be allowed to buy or sell guns because crazy people can buy guns by the arm load no questions asked. Those crazies will go on a Virginia Tech style massacre and cannot be stopped. Why? See point #1. - Samurai77, on 04/13/2009, -1/+12Yup!
- ApokalypseNow, on 04/13/2009, -0/+11Murder is defined as unlawful killing. Self defense is legal. Therefore, self defense can not be murder.
- ThanatosST, on 04/13/2009, -0/+11Hi John.
- stevets, on 04/13/2009, -1/+12Usually it is the liquor stores that get robbed. Kind of ironic when you think about it.
- Samueul, on 04/13/2009, -2/+12I can tell you this much, you ever try to rob me and I get the jump on you, you are one dead *****.... I'll take my chances in a court of law over allowing you power over me in a hostile situation, a situation I might add that you created...
Live by the sword, die by it. - WraTH017, on 04/13/2009, -0/+10Sorry. Though I agree this is definitely not the best outcome (it being a completely uneventful AA meeting), you can't blame people for acting in self defense. Their lives were threatened, and you don't know if you're just going to get robbed without any harm coming to you... you just don't know.
- Shirt, on 04/13/2009, -1/+11You're just a moron with a superiority complex. Add that to your list of people who shouldn't be allowed to own guns.
I'm guessing your IQ is what 90 to 100? What a cute little tool. -
Show 51 - 100 of 175 discussions
© Digg Inc. 2009
— Content created and posted by Digg users is