What is Digg?Sponsored by Travelzoo
$52 and Up—Airlines Slash Fares On Peak Holiday Flights. view!
travelzoo.com - This year, waiting until the last minute is NOT the best strategy. See why.
176 Comments
- michaelpinto, on 02/22/2009, -4/+96alapoet I was following this - the students were asking for everything from tuition to getting aid for gaza (i.e. they were very unfocused on any single goal at all). I don't agree with with arresting them, but at the same time they could have come up with a better way to get attention for their cause (which still isn't clear to anybody). Frankly the students who I feel a great sympathy for are those in the CUNY and SUNY system - the state cuts are going to drive their tuition up and those kids can't afford to go to school anyplace else.
- rawnzilla, on 02/22/2009, -2/+68They should have barricaded in the girl's bathroom, I hear they have couches in there.
- poopsybythebay, on 02/21/2009, -9/+73What *****.
- dkm201, on 02/22/2009, -5/+55I went to NYU. These kids are an embarrassment. You know it's expensive before you get there, and it's a private school, they can charge whatever they want... I
- SteveMTyler, on 02/22/2009, -3/+49I can't believe their graduate TAs can't unionize. When I was in grad school, they switched payroll system to PeopleSoft, no grad students got paid for months. A lot of grad students live pay check to pay check, people were taking out emergency loans, borrowing money from their advisers, etc...
It wasn't until the union went on strike, after weeks of empty promises by the university, that emergency payroll checks were written off cycle to pay everyone up to date. - jnosanov, on 02/22/2009, -11/+55Here's an idea... if you don't like how a school runs things... don't go there! It's a PRIVATE school! They have no obligation to do what these students are asking. If you don't like it, transfer.
- coolcash2005, on 02/22/2009, -8/+49um...they barricaded themselves in a room and made demands on their website. I wouldn't call that asking, and that is not so simple as freedom of expression. NYU did what was right.
- ousthouse, on 02/22/2009, -7/+47They're free to express themselves on their own property
- MeatyMcBeef, on 02/22/2009, -1/+34You're free to express yourself, not free to take over buildings. There's a difference. If they had a regular protest that followed laws regarding peaceful protests there wouldn't be a problem.
- chinaman1212, on 02/22/2009, -7/+36Freedom of expression includes breaking in and entering and damaging property?
- ffoofighter2001, on 02/22/2009, -3/+32They occupied a private space owned by the school-which is a private school that the students pay to have the privilege of using. If they wanted to protest, they shouldn't have stopped up usage of the Kimmel center. That building is used as a cafeteria, conference center and other student uses...which were disrupted. The demands were ludicrous-they wanted immediate amnesty from any disciplinary action against them...it was really an embarrassing time for NYU-it's one thing to protest-that's fine-but to prevent the use of the building and to risk depriving the workers of the building of their pay for those days is obnoxious and selfish.
- learnfrompast, on 02/22/2009, -10/+36I think that the school should tell them where there money is getting spent. There is no oversight in schools and schools increase tuition each year without telling why. Also, several colleges choose to build outrageous architecture which causes tuition to increase. I think all colleges should have a breakdown of where the money is going to. I'm pissed that my college keeps on increasing tuition without justification. I commend these students for wanting to know this, but I think they should have done it in a more peaceful way.
- Onoskelis, on 02/22/2009, -8/+33They're protesting for transparency for a PRIVATE university? Lol, they deserved to be suspended. If they don't like it, they can leave.
It's a whole different story for public universities however, since those are funded by the public. - mbraynard, on 02/22/2009, -16/+35Student protests are as retarded as protesting any other commercial service provider in a highly competitive environment.
If you don't like your school, transfer. Vote with your feet.
No matter how much those whiny, spoiled punks protest, NYU will still have an acceptance rate of 15%.
Remember - just because your parents are professionals/white color, it doesn't mean that college is for you. - ffoofighter2001, on 02/22/2009, -5/+24WRONG-they weren't only asking for transparency of the finances
-they demanded that the Bobst private NYU library be open to the public (we NYU students pay a lot of money for tuition and one of the things we pay for is to have the library rooms open to only us-NYC has the best public library system available to anyone in the US)
-they also demanded that extra materials be sent to help rebuild Gaza University at the end of each year and that 13 or so Palestinian students receive scholarships ANNUALLY.
-the demands also included NYU paying the compensation for workers that couldn't work in the Kimmel center because of the protester's occupation...
selfish kids who didn't think this out and cost NYU more reputation and respect but hopefully not the wages of those poor Kimmel center employees - ssk84, on 02/22/2009, -20/+35These guys disrupted the community and had ridiculous demands. The group, Take Back NYU, consists of all of the kids who are paying 50K a year to major in film or art history, and consequently won't be able to pay off their student loans when they are inevitably unemployed. The NYU students with real, useful majors were not involved...probably because they were studying and trying not to waste their parents' money.
Read this - http://rumorsontheinternets.org/2009/02/20/nyu-pro ... - thegeniuz, on 02/22/2009, -8/+23As an NYU alum (Class of 2004) I am acutely aware of what these students are protesting, and while their methods are highly questionable, some of their goals are right on the mark.
I am currently a television producer but I went to NYU as a wannabe film director. For years I had heard that NYU was the number one film school in the country (some might argue USC, but that's another debate), and as Harvard is to an aspiring lawyer, or Johns Hopkins is to an aspiring doctor, NYU was THE school for an aspiring filmmaker.
After 4 years of an NYU education I am saddled with over $100,000 in student debt—having incredible difficulties paying my bills, even with a respectable salary. As a result, I look back on my education and have to wonder if I would have done it all over again. The answer, sadly, is a resounding NO.
Now, some might sit back and say, "Well, he knew how expensive that school was going to be," and they would be correct. But consider these few things for a minute:
1) From an early age, most of us have been indoctrinated to believe that college is not merely an option, but a necessary requirement to make it in this world. Further, it is also drilled into our young brains that one must go to the "best" college for our chosen field if we are to be successful.
Well, for those of us with rich parents or a trust fund, costs are an afterthought. But, for some less-fortunate citizens, we must confront the reality that student loans are among our only options to go that dream school. While scholarships are possible (and I received the highest possible school-sponsored scholarship for a student in the film program), they merely scratch the surface of the hole we have begun to dig, and will continue to dig out of for the rest of our lives.
2) With all of that expense, I then consider the sum of my pricey education. Did that cost pay itself back in high-quality education? Again, for NYU film school, the answer is an excruciatingly disheartening NO. The professors, with the exception of one or two, were uninspiring and uninformative—I learn more from most well-presented online tutorials than I ever learned in an entire semester of most classes.
The equipment, for the time, was outdated and detached from the industry standards. We were always told about how "commercial" USC was, what with their fancy production equipment... perhaps that was everyone's way of brushing over the fact that our equipment was so unimpressive for the money we were all paying.
So the question which kept popping up in my mind was, "How did NYU Film build such an amazing reputation with such inadequate resources?"
The truth is in its alumni. Martin Scorcese, Spike Lee, Jim Jarmusch, Brett Ratner, Martin Brest, Amy Heckerling, Todd Phillips, Todd Solondz, etc. etc. etc. The alumni list is a who's who of Hollywood—from commercial successes to critical acclaim. With Martin Scorcese's early successes, NYU's reputation was cemented early on leading to a self-fulfilling prophecy: A Spike Lee is looking for a school, enjoys Scorcese's work, discovers he's an NYU alum, decides to enroll, studies for four years, directs a masterpiece after masterpiece, and inspires the next generation of auteurs to repeat the cycle. Talented people want to study where other talented people have already—regardless of the quality of the education.
3) Having spent such huge amounts of money at this private university, with such a grave impact on my entire future, is it wrong to consider whether the money was worth the education? Is it wrong to expect the university to indicate where my tuition was being spent (as it surely was not being spent on cutting-edge equipment or quality professors)? Is it wrong to feel resentful when the university sends me emails asking for donations?
These students are beginning to understand what I already know: Something is amiss at this school—and at private universities, in general. IMHO, I believe that in-state universities are the way to go. They are comparatively inexpensive, and will leave you with a life unsaddled by mounds of debt.
If anyone agrees or disagrees I would love to see your replies. Thanks for listening...
-J - jnosanov, on 02/22/2009, -6/+20It's a private school. If you don't like how they do things, don't go there. They have no obligation to you in any way.
- bradharrelson, on 02/22/2009, -0/+14UTA is a state institution. NYU is not.
- Daniel591992, on 02/22/2009, -6/+19On private property?
- Barackalypse, on 02/22/2009, -3/+16Their list of demands goes from reasonable, to laughably arbitrary very quickly:
"Annual scholarships be provided for thirteen Palestinian students."
Why just Palestine, and why 13? Haven't the Rwandans or Sudanese suffered way worse, shouldn't they have scholarships? Shouldn't they have also made demands that the cafeteria serve only organically grown produce and all coffee on campus must be certified fair trade and carbon neutral? - Blackrobe, on 02/22/2009, -0/+12Travelsonic,
No... asking for transparency does not merrit suspension...
However, breaking into a privately-owned building, sending two workers to the hospital, and refusing to follow the policies of the university - to which the students agreed when they enrolled - does. - rotarychainsaw, on 02/22/2009, -2/+13Vietnam and the draft were not something you had a choice about.
If these kids don't like the way NYU is doing things, let their parents pay for some other institution. I'm sure there are a lot of students at their second choice school willing to take their places. - elnerdo, on 02/22/2009, -0/+11The difference is that Vietnam was horrible, and those protests were justified, and nobody chose to be drafted, while these kids chose to go to NYU, and chose to pay for NYU, and were protesting a ridiculous claim that students from the gaza strip aren't getting enough scholarship money from NYU.
- inactive, on 02/22/2009, -0/+11Peoplesoft = gigantic pos.
- ShadowofAres, on 02/22/2009, -2/+13white color or white collar?
Both work. - ffoofighter2001, on 02/22/2009, -0/+11not all of us at NYU are crying, just these guys
- bradharrelson, on 02/22/2009, -1/+11Assuming NYU has their own police force, failing to identify yourself would be against the law. Also, they are lucky they weren't arrested, and not just suspended.
- screwzluse, on 02/22/2009, -7/+17I'm confused. Was he forced to go to NYU? If he didn't like the financial aid offered there, the simple solution would be to choose another university. Barricading yourself on campus does not make you right.
- mac734, on 02/22/2009, -0/+10I'm going to disagree with you on this one. When I was at Pace University, a large part of the student body successfully led the campaign to force President Caputo to resign (over declining enrollment, poor fundraising efforts, and his ridiculously high salary). Student protests, and very poor handling of student protesters, helped get several faculty members involved. Within 2-3 months faculty issued a vote of no confidence, and he resigned that year. My graduating class also ousted SodexHo as the University's official contracted food vendor in 2005, because they sucked and weren't responsive to student concerns over the quality of their food offerings (they primarily contract with schools, hospitals and prisons...go figure). So yeah---students can pull some major weight if they organize effectively.
- elnerdo, on 02/22/2009, -0/+10Girls don't poop.
- thegeniuz, on 02/22/2009, -0/+9While I agree with you about transferring, when you have just spent $25,000 on a semester of college (around the yearly median salary of most individuals in this country), it's not such a horrible thing to want to know where that money went—although the scholarships for Gaza students is utterly ridiculous (as if there are no other deserving people in the world).
- siandt, on 02/22/2009, -0/+9I still go to NYU and I agree. ***** them.
- PatrickX, on 02/22/2009, -1/+9There's nothing fundamentally wrong with wanting to change something you're a part of rather than just running away from it. Maybe in this case they went about it the wrong way and their demands were pretty out there, but they have every right to try and protest whatever they want to. Hell, I'm an American and I hated having Bush as a president, but I didn't leave the country because of it.
- jack222, on 02/22/2009, -3/+11I would have thought NYU students are smarter then this. It's really not the right way to get what you want. Especially wheny the hold up inside the university until their demands are met.
And as much as these students can empathize with Gaza children, most of them have a lot of money, considering they have bad financial aid and it's expensive to go there. As someone pointed out, it's the CUNY and SUNY schools that should be protesting if anything. As everyone else said, it's a private university! Now they want the suspensions revoked and for their demands to be met? That's just silly. - pintomp3, on 02/22/2009, -10/+18That's pre-9/11 thinking.
- LordRedSnake, on 02/22/2009, -0/+7Schools are businesses, practically speaking. The student is a customer, and customers generally don't get to make demands of the businesses they frequent, especially not by seizing control of a building. The trustees are the shareholders and they're the ones who ultimately make such decisions.
Imagine customers barricading themselves inside a McDonald's because they want to know exactly what the ingredients in the special sauce are and demand the company to start giving a year's supply of Big Macs to 13 Gaza students every year. There are proper venues for requesting the ingredients in the special sauce, and maybe if enough customers wanted this information McDonald's might think it beneficial to disclose that, but they're not under any obligation to.
If these students really wanted to make a difference they could have organized a student group, had petitions signed, and educated the student body to their cause. But all of that would have taken time and dedication, and doesn't seem quite so "revolutionary" as taking over a building. Read the accounts of some of the students that were occupying the building, and you'll see how much emphasis they place on being revolutionaries rather than the importance of their demands. - pilzburybizkit, on 02/22/2009, -0/+7Goodbye
- acidwinter, on 02/22/2009, -1/+8Regardless of whether or not NYU is private, its students deserve an explanation for where their money is going. A lot of the demands for budget transparency are being made because NYU is suspected of paying female employees less.
Also, NYU lost $24 million in Madoff's ponzi scheme. If you were a student and saw your tuition raise, wouldn't you like an explanation as to how much of that money was actually going towards your education? - pintomp3, on 02/22/2009, -1/+8Is "rumorsontheinternets" a good source?
- SaladCactusKing, on 02/22/2009, -0/+6But it would suck pretty hard to be a girl taking a dump when they all would run in and bolt down the doors and windows.
- JaredMcCammon, on 02/22/2009, -1/+7I was asked to join this protest. I'm REALLY glad I didn't.
- dkm201, on 02/23/2009, -0/+6All of those high-profile people you mentioned are alumni of the graduate program.
But the bigger problem is that art school in general is a scam. You pay a school a ton of money to pretend you're a director. The classes are pretty devoid of serious criticism, because hey, you paid to be a pretend director! It's hilarious to look back and think about how everyone pretended they were the next Spike Lee...
You can't teach a talent, you can only refine it. The standards of admission at Tisch are: Can you afford it? There were a few talented kids there when I was there and a lot of them are working now, but the question is, would they have been working anyway?
It's funny, because the only thing that really benefited me when I was there was internships -- paying a school 100 grand to allow me to work for a company for free! - willster580, on 02/22/2009, -1/+7They have freedom of speech, but not the right to trespass and barricade themselves on private property. If this was at a public university it would be different, but NYU is a private school. They can take their money and go elsewhere if they're unhappy.
- thegeniuz, on 02/22/2009, -0/+5Are you saying film and television production isn't a useful major or just film history?
- shinedout, on 02/22/2009, -0/+5Im an NYU grad - the amount of money I paid to go to school there was crazy, but what's more F'ed is the amount of my money that actually trickled down to the school in which I studied under NYU (Tisch - drama department) was little to almost none. I found out most of my money went to the business school when I was attending the Arts school.
That part of the protest is definitely worth the fight. - SaladCactusKing, on 02/22/2009, -2/+7This is my favorite comment on the Take Back NYU blog after they started bitching about how they cut off electricity and internet access
NYU Grad 06
I saw a documentary about hostage/standoff negotiations in which the authorities cut the power to the people inside the building, and turned on floodlights to block their view of what was happening outside. It was really interesting. One of the hostages broke away, and called for help, culminating in an epic showdown with the terror group’s leader, who he shot and threw out a window. It was an amazing end to the crisis.
Oh, wait. That was Die Hard, and Take Back NYU is a bunch of idiots. - charlietuna, on 02/22/2009, -1/+6I have two degrees from NYU, and I might teach there soon. They charge a lot and they work very hard (after you get your degree) to set you up for a terrific career path. This is not selfless at all, as they will contact you in ten or twenty years and hit you up for serious donations. Is that a racket or a business model? Whatever, it seems to work.
- Ymeg, on 02/22/2009, -3/+8You don't have free speech on private property. NYU has absolutely no obligation to let them say what they want...
but don't let the facts stop you from leaving. - slimBoost, on 02/22/2009, -1/+6I am an NYU student and I watched most of this protest from outside Kimmel and on twitter. While the protest was highly disorganized and lacked solid leadership any student of this school who was around for the 2004-2005 grad student strike will tell you that this protest was not all bad. Yes, they asked for some absurd things relating to Israel/Palestine. Yes, the protest was poorly organized and lacked a distinct plan (Step 1 take over Kimmel, Step 2 ???, Step 3 change the world!). Yes, there were topless protestors and there was a definite party air to the whole thing.
But for all these failings, they proved one thing that I hope no one ignores. NYU is a business that thrives on shutting its students down. In 2005 the grad students went on strike to keep their union. The [newly]-Bush biased NLRB [union was established in early 2000 and valid for 5 years] gave NYU the power to ignore the grad students by a case instigated by Brown University. As a result they completely refused negotiations and after several months of striking the TA's (which NYU had the power to stop by simply agreeing to negotiate - the principle academic integrity clause was already in the collective bargaining agreement) were blacklisted and kicked off campus. If you think NYU is a school for academics, well 90% of classroom instruction is done by TAs and in 4 years you will have an actual professor grade maybe a handful of papers. So they blacklisted the majority of TA's who believed in their job enough to take a stand and risk this exact outcome. The result, good TAs were replaced by kiss-asses and schmucks who assign a full recitation of student presentations so as to avoid having to do actual work.
What does this have to do with protesting undergrads? Not a whole lot, except that the NYU administration responded the exact same way. I wonder, how much more is it going to take for the average student to realize they are being taken for a ride. So many alumni repeat the mantra, "I would not do it again if I had the chance." Also, NYU struggles to get alumni donations except from the few elites that to run the school. John Sexton and his oligarchical posse are NOT good for NYU. No one even remembers the grad student strike, it was the one and only chance at creating a community we had, but it has left an indelible black mark on Sexton's term. -
Show 51 - 100 of 179 discussions
The Digg Toolbar for Firefox lets you Digg, submit content, and keep track of Digg even when you're not on the Digg site. Download the official 
© Digg Inc. 2009
— Content created and posted by Digg users is