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More Bioshock stupidness: you can only install the game twice. WTF!!

kotaku.com — As if 2K wasn't taking enough flak from yesterday's widescreen debacle, now gamers who have spent their hard-earned cash on the PC version of BioShock are finding that they can only install the game twice, ever.

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  • Sopoed, on 10/10/2007, -61/+20What the hell? Thats horrible! I suppose I should definately get the 360 version.. well first I need a 360. Looks like a great game though, why would they ruin all that with something so stupid? I am NEVER buying the PC version now.. Thanks man :)
    • Akaji, on 10/10/2007, -18/+47Would people PLEASE, for the love of crap, RTFA BEFORE POSTING. Your kneejerk reactions just serve to fuel the stupidity of the masses.
      • MegatonSamurai, on 10/10/2007, -12/+25Whatever. The 360 version you can carry around and play on any 360 you come across. You can't with the PC version.

        I refuse to support this. Why the hell would I want a legit copy when the pirated version is superior? All this intellectual property ***** pisses me off. I bought it, It's not yours anymore. I can install it wherever I want.

        I haven't touched Half-Life 2 because of steam, and now I won't touch Bioshock because of this.
        • Walkboss, on 10/10/2007, -4/+19What's your beef with Steam?
          • Sophistifunk, on 10/10/2007, -5/+1Steam sucks. It hosed my computer (ironically while trying to download bioshock so i could purchase it on release day). Instead of going "Hey dude 4gb isn't enough to download this" it simply filled the drive, then ***** itself. There's no "cancel and delete files" option on locked games in steam, and I couldn't even uninstall it because the uninstaller tries to copy a bunch of *****. BOO STEAM, NO COOKIE FOR YOU
          • Ricky8765, on 10/10/2007, -0/+1So you're just plain smart... why the ***** would you fill up your entire hard drive to begin with? Here's an idea, delete some ***** or buy another hard drive for $50
        • Mejogid, on 10/10/2007, -4/+16Steam gives you all the freedom of a console (ie. one instance at a time) with no discs to lose or swap, automatic patching, no hastle with having to go to the shop, no worries about disk scratching, the ability to backup multiple games to a few DVDs, frequently cheaper prices (especially for those outside the US) and a decent interface to see all your installed games and launch whichever you feel like. Now tell me, in an age where broadband is nearly ubiquitous, what's your issue with steam?
          • spudnic, on 10/10/2007, -0/+3There's also the ability to manage game mods with it. Steam is great, how many other companies let you download the game again so easily if you can't find the disk or serial?
          • molochi, on 10/10/2007, -0/+1Seriously. I mean I've purchased all the Valve stuff, Id stuff, Prey, Dawn of War, and now Bioshock on steam. The full install (~33GB) is backed up to a usb drive and to a secondary drive on the gaming computer. Ive got a "lite" install (just the steam client and CS) on an 8GB Flash Drive that'll work on almost any computer.

            Now of course Valve could ***** this up (ala Google Video or by changing the rules) or go out of business and I would probably be screwed and pissed. But I'm happy so far.
      • supaklaw, on 10/10/2007, -3/+7That's right, instead of kneejerk anti-bioshock posting, become one of the ravenous mindless pro-bioshock posters...
        • gforce42, on 10/10/2007, -2/+3While I don't doubt that there are some people who "mindlessly" post positive things about Bioshock, it is one of the best rated games of all time. I'm just sayin'...
        • supaklaw, on 10/10/2007, -1/+1Best rated... before it was released... I'm just sayin'....
      • slcsu, on 10/10/2007, -6/+11There's been an updated to the original article (read the bottom). This is false info. For more info see:
        http://www.digg.com/pc_games/BioShock_BioLocked_To_Two_PCs_The_Real_Story
        • peevegrider, on 10/10/2007, -3/+29No its still *****. What if you have a hardware failure, thus you are rendered unable to uninstall the application. There would be no uninstall registered and you'd be dicked. article dugg because 2K are install-nazis
          • Amablue, on 10/10/2007, -5/+4You should read closer. Even if your comptuer crashes before you uninstall you can still just call up and have them fix it. It's hardly going to be a problem for most people. You're not jumping through a whole lot of hurdles unless you have a computer that crashes a lot.

            It's understandable why they put it in. It might cause some trouble for a minority of customers, but it's going to stop people from just making a copy of the disc and giving it out. It's like a lock on a door. Any one who really wants to get in your house can just lock pick the front door no problem. But most people don't go through the trouble and the simple lock is enough to deter them from entering.
          • GliTCH82, on 10/10/2007, -0/+6That's still not a viable solution. As if you weren't already frustrated enough that your system crashed and you need to reinstall 200 programs and games, having to call a company every time that happened is not my idea of fun. What if everyone followed suit? 200 programs, 200 companies to call, all thanks to Securom. That's just suicide.

            I'm not saying they shouldn't protect their game... but seriously now, you know this is gonna be on BitTorrent in about a week, and none of the pirates are going to have to jump through hoops, so why are the legitimate owners getting punished here? It's not like everyone is sharing CDs, and even if they were, they have an online activation system. Plus it only takes one CD to get a torrent up on the web, and one release group to crack it, so they're just putting the burden of their paranoia on their fans.
        • Dimensio, on 10/10/2007, -0/+5There's been an update to the update. 2k forum posters have tested Elizabeth's claim. It's a lie. Uninstalling does not allow for additional activations.
        • rabidbob, on 10/10/2007, -0/+1Even worse you need to be connected to the net to play the game for the first time. What happens in five or even ten years time if I'm a bit nostalgic and want to fire up Bioshock again?
      • DocHoliday22, on 10/10/2007, -0/+20This is a really stupid copy protection scheme. A lot of people don't plan PC formats, it's out of our hand when the PC screws up and you can't do anything on it. So two formats without uninstalling first and you have to call Securerom for a serial key? That's just messed up.
        • scabbers, on 10/10/2007, -2/+21That's even assuming Securerom even exists 10 years from now when you might want to play it.
      • Misos, on 10/10/2007, -0/+3All forms of copy protection are absurd. They will be circumvented, no way around it. Copy protection methods only make things more painful for consumers who pay for software.
    • StriderNemesis, on 10/10/2007, -14/+8Comment automatically buried for saying something against the PC version of Bioshock. Gotta love Digg.
    • PAPAsoMEAN, on 10/10/2007, -20/+4this is definitely a M$ move
      • slcsu, on 10/10/2007, -13/+6@ PAPAsoMEAN... no u moron. The DRM is backed by $ony, the KING OF DRM.

        This uses Sony's SecurROM software:
        http://www.sonydadc.com/news.pressrelease.go?id=29

        Did we already forget about the 2005 Sony DRM Rootkit Fiasco?
        http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sony_BMG

        This is also why Blu-ray is NOT REGION-FREE like HD-DVD. Yay DRM!

        • samdu, on 10/10/2007, -3/+7How the HELL did you bring Sony into this?
          • theseaweedking, on 10/10/2007, -1/+9SecuROM is a Sony technology. Bioshock uses SecuROM as a copy protection system, and henceforth requires activation. Bioshock, via SecuROM, can only have two active activations. It's partially Sony's fault that this is happening and it'll probably be the standard on other future SecuROM protected games. Of course, this is merely what I get from the Kotaku article and they could be absolutely wrong. Go figure.
        • Dereliction, on 10/10/2007, -3/+2*applauds* You hit it right on the nose--the only reason I can imagine that you are being dug down is because of Sony fanboys.

          I truly hope that HD-DVD wins as the standard. ***** Sony, ***** SecurROM, and ***** Blu-ray.
    • ayeroxor, on 10/10/2007, -10/+3"I suppose I should definately get the 360 version"

      defin-ate-ly? Do you say it like that?
      • Weebs43, on 10/10/2007, -0/+5Extremely lame to point out a spelling error -.- Pronouncing it that way wouldn't sound weird at all either, I say it defin-it-ly, and it's not too far off from his spelling.
    • 501337, on 10/10/2007, -3/+1http://www.d-e-f-i-n-i-t-e-l-y.com/
    • battletrax, on 10/10/2007, -0/+3Microsoft paid them money to put this code in the game. More 360 sales.

      Jerks..
      • norman619, on 10/10/2007, -0/+2LOL!!!! Sure they did. You have a link?
      • supaklaw, on 10/10/2007, -0/+1Yeah, that makes sense. Or maybe they didn't want it to get bootlegged but didn't bother beta-testing the anti-piracy software and have a PR disaster on their hands. Oh wait, because so many lemming are claiming this is the second coming of jeebus in game form, not to worry. They'll sell plenty. 2K is an awesome company, I think Bioshock is way overhyped but whatever, hopefully they do fine by it, good designers deserve props. Keep making football games 2K dammit, Madden sucks.
  • JJ77, on 10/10/2007, -35/+28This sucks! I was going to buy this game, but now I don't know.
  • Unrefined, on 10/10/2007, -38/+531No PC Owner should buy this game until they get rid of this awful software protection policy. If you buy this, and the game is successful every game that comes after it will only let you install it twice. We can't allow this to happen. PC Gamers Unite!
    • rebrad, on 10/10/2007, -45/+19What's so hard about uninstalling it before you install it on another system. Seems reasonable to me or is it that you object to paying for it in the first place?
      • AndyVenus, on 10/10/2007, -3/+65Say I forget and just format my pc, or I can't access the pc to uninstall it because of any number of reasons. I am *****.
        • airwalkery2k, on 10/10/2007, -5/+17Well, they say you can call that company in charge of this. Something tells me, however, the customer service will be poor, because they won't really care. (Plus, you never had to call up to reinstall a game before this.)
          • VeganG, on 10/10/2007, -0/+18And if that company goes out of business?
          • Mothrog, on 10/10/2007, -0/+11Or maybe the company can just not ***** over the people that legitimately buy the game. You can bet the people the pirate Bioshock won't have to deal with this *****. Why should I have to if I pay $50 for the game?
          • Jebral, on 10/10/2007, -1/+1If that company goes out of business you can always pirate it. :p
      • tonaros, on 11/14/2007, -3/+51My hard drive crashed recently. If I had had Bioshock installed, I wouldn't have been able to uninstall it.
        • imbetterthanu, on 10/10/2007, -27/+2No, but I'm sure that's why they give you two re-installs. You will still have one left.
        • AndyVenus, on 10/10/2007, -0/+21That, quite simply, is not good enough.
        • TaeBoX, on 10/10/2007, -20/+3Then call securom to get your old install deactivated.
          • samdu, on 10/10/2007, -0/+27For ***** SAKE why are you people defending this?!?!?
      • loungechair, on 10/10/2007, -0/+14I think the problem is that this type of software protection inconveniences only legitimate users. People will still find a way to pirate the game, and those people won't have to go through all of this copy protection *****, calling if their hard drive crashes, etc. They are inconveniencing their legitimate customers while doing very little to actually stop the piracy that all of this is supposed to stop.
      • pauleric, on 10/10/2007, -0/+7Let one company do this, and they'll all start doing this. So the effect is if I have, oh...say 50 different proprietary software programs installed on my PC, you're saying that it is reasonable to uninstall each one prior to buying a new computer. Or if you have a hardware failure, keeping all of your contact info up to date and organized so you can get responses from a bunch of companies (which may no longer support the product).

        Looks just like google's recent foray into un-selling things (like that makes sense) and on top of that trying to give credits rather than refunds.
      • rebrad, on 10/10/2007, -0/+9You know, I think that you've proved your point. Don't buy this game or any other protected game. There are plenty of other games out there, you don't need this one. After all, it's only a game.
      • Tarl, on 10/10/2007, -0/+0Please tell me you are just confused on the myriad of problems with a copy protection setup such as this. Confused or dumb. But I always give the benefit of the doubt.
    • btgoss, on 10/10/2007, -4/+66The only sane comment here. Don't buy games with overly complex protection. End of Story.
    • 68024, on 10/10/2007, -22/+4You might actually want to read the article. This is happening because you need to uninstall before re-installing. Otherwise the software thinks you're trying to install on another system.

      So nothing to do with a policy of only allowing to install twice.
      • NnyCW, on 10/10/2007, -1/+29Again, in case of a hard drive crash, you don't have the option of uninstalling. When protection treats the purchaser as a theif and can be negatively impacted for supporting the product, while the theif never even has to worry about whatever protection it was, something is wrong.
        Personally, I bought it off of Steam so I can re-download as many times as I want and install on as many different PC's as I want, long as I'm only online with one copy of BioShock under that name at a time. But this is a very bad system for those who bought the boxed version and there is no getting around that.
        • Zeonix, on 10/10/2007, -0/+8That's what I thought, but the Steam version uses the same system as the retail version.
    • eshiki, on 10/10/2007, -3/+20Dyslectics Untie!
    • Protonz, on 10/10/2007, -2/+77Too late, bought it yesterday.

      Typically the only time I reinstall is when windows gets really messed and won't boot anymore. Kinda makes it tricky to uninstall a program in that situation.

      I am not happy about having to do an extra step just for their copy-protection scheme. The people who buy the game legally are treated like criminals, if I wait and download the cracked version on bit-torrent I won't have to deal with any of this *****.
    • dillibob, on 10/10/2007, -2/+14what about on steam?
    • Kypt, on 10/10/2007, -1/+7So, if you have a hd crash or for w/e reason you format your machine without FIRST uninstalling, does it count as one?
      • sinrtb, on 10/10/2007, -0/+3Regardless of what happens it counts as one.
    • Radan, on 10/10/2007, -0/+35Though, I don't know how they are going to handle this, but if it's anything like the protection system in iTunes, then I guess there wouldn't be any problems with unsubscribing the computers from an account on their webpage.

      But either way, this is exactly where the anti piracy system fails. Everyone knows that this game, like all other games out there, will be cracked and pirated, which leads us the conclusion that everyone who wants to pirate this game, will pirate this game, and everyone who actually legally buys the game like good citizens, will get ***** over. Tell me again, why should I pay money for this game again. Protection systems are completely useless, they only makes it harder for the ones who actually buys the game.
    • sh4rkb1t3, on 10/10/2007, -2/+49I was going to go out and buy the game today, but now I think that I'll just wait for it to be cracked so I can pirate it.
      • Toupee, on 10/10/2007, -3/+15I was so ready to buy this game with all the 10/10 reviews and then I find out that it doesn't work on X800 cards. X800!!! That should NOT be the bottleneck of my PC! This might be a brilliant game, but talk about running through hoops to play it. This, the widescreen thing, the video card thing - what a mess.
        • sirber, on 10/10/2007, -0/+1X800 only supports shaders v2. The game uses v3 or v4 (DX10).
        • ironrex, on 10/10/2007, -0/+1do X850's work?
        • Smills, on 10/10/2007, -1/+1You still have an x800? I have an x1800XT and i am just about to replace it due to it being hopelessly out of date. It can't do DX10 or even run Bioshock on max graphics. Maybe you need to update...
      • BigFont, on 10/10/2007, -0/+4ARRRR!
      • supaklaw, on 10/10/2007, -2/+13 2K's BioShock is easily the most overhyped game so far this year, though it is quite beautiful.

        What they're no doubt underhyping as best they can is the fact that the PC version of the game is packaged with SecuROM copy protection, a piece of third party anti-copying software that phones home and prevents installation on more than 2 PCs.

        The PC demo of BioShock causes AVG to go nuts at it for containing trojans. It wouldn't install or load on a winXP partition until AVG antivirus was completely uninstalled. *Presumably* this is due to SecuROM, which also demands that other perfectly legit processes stopped:

        Worse yet, game maker 2K is telling people to call Securom, and Securom is telling people to call 2K. Steam is affected as well. You can only install the game on 2 PC's, period. (Confirmed by steam employee.) So, if you use your steam account on 3 PC's, you'll only get to play on 2. You're required to right click the game in the steam menu and choose 'delete local content' before you can transfer the game to another PC. If you delete the game without following this procedure, you may end up in the same ordeal as retail buyers.
      • GoldYoshi, on 10/10/2007, -6/+2It's been done, don't worry.

        http://rapidshare.com/files/50644839/paul.dll.rar
      • norman619, on 10/10/2007, -0/+2Arg, avast ye maties!!
    • Layne, on 10/10/2007, -16/+4From Bioshock Rep
      "you can have the game on 2 computers at the same time. if you are changing the computer completely, like changing out a motherboard, uninstall the game before you do it. if you are just upgrading a video card or something, you will be able to keep the game on your system without a problem.

      if by some chance you end up activating and not uninstalling or keeping the game on more than 2 machines and then losing the machines to some disaster, you can email or call securom, and they will give you a new key. but for most people (and i've been testing this today) uninstalling and reinstalling will be all right.

      this is a measure to make sure people don't pirate the game, not to stop users from playing it.

      i hope that helps"

      settle down people.
      • Arramol, on 10/10/2007, -0/+22I might settle down slightly, but not much. This is still ludicrous. I don't want to feel like I'm going through airport security just to re-install a game!
        • Smills, on 10/10/2007, -0/+2For that matter, I don't want to feel like I am going through airport security when I go through airport security.
    • Dimensio, on 10/10/2007, -6/+92k's response has been confirmed as a shameless lie. Uninstalling does not allow for additional activations. 2k is lying rather than addressing a real problem. All people knowingly involved in allowing this to occur should be killed.
    • samssf, on 10/10/2007, -0/+10I don't know the numbers... but the thing is I doubt that these anti-piracy measures actually prevent many pirates from pirating the game. What it does do, however, is piss people off and cause people to say negative things about the company. It IS a huge annoyance for legit consumers. There are people who DO use Alcohol 120% or Process Explorer on their computers that won't be able to play the game unless they remove or turn off other pieces of software on their computers before playing Bioshock or other "protected" software. What happens is that people who purchase the game become resentful. "Dude, Bioshock is pissing me off because blah blah" Friend: "Just download it man! I'll give you the site. If you download it its free and you don't have to deal with the BS".

      There's nothing wrong with trying to prevent piracy. But this method doesn't work well at all. Fighting crime by (trying to) prevent someone from doing what they desire doesn't work. You have to find ways around that... find incentives to people who purchase the title. Find ways to make people WANT to purchase rather than steal. Charge less. If a college student doesn't have the cash and cant afford the game, current protection isn't going to make them able to buy the game. Just use some other tactic than installing BS programs in the background, etc.
    • atlex2, on 10/10/2007, -5/+1You're still gonna get it.
    • nakp88d, on 10/10/2007, -6/+2WTF! Why don't you read the entire article,assuming you did read it.There won't be any problems if you unistall the game and then install it again.What more you can have the game running simultaneously in two different rigs without facing a problem.Now if somebody could confirm online multiplayer too being playable then you could probably give your key to one of your friends for a price,best deal ever!
      • Dimensio, on 10/10/2007, -1/+7".There won't be any problems if you unistall the game and then install it again"

        Yes, yes there will. 2k's response is a LIE. Uninstalling the game does NOT allow for additional activations.
        • Dimensio, on 10/10/2007, -0/+6Digging my post down will not change the fact that uninstalling the game does not credit an activation for the same serial number. 2k lied. Digging my posts down will not make their lies magically become truth.
    • snapcase, on 10/10/2007, -1/+10Well here I was actually debating if I wanted to go out and drop 50-60 bucks on this game after playing the demo. Needless to say with ***** like this going on there's no chance in hell I'll buy the game now. I'll probably pirate it eventually though. I'm amazingly disappointed in 2K.

      I'm quite sick of stupid ***** DRM like this that only servers to cause problems for the paying customer. It does absolutely JACK ***** to stop piracy. ANY game now matter how tough the DRM will eventually be cracked if there's a great enough desire for it to be cracked. After it's cracked all anyone has to do is download it. If anything tough DRM just promotes piracy. Tough DRM that inhibits the use of the product by the average user will create demand for a cracked version and will make certain that it will be cracked.

      Just ***** face it, DRM is pointless. It's as effective as using sugar water as an insect repellent. In the end it's just money wasted for the game makers. They have to spend extra resources to make a DRM for their game and have it amount to nothing. And of course those costs get passed on to the consumer in some small measure at least.

      I find it just unacceptable that games nowadays are as overpriced as they are, and just ***** unbelievable that the game makers then go through extra measures to make sure that I can't use the game that I payed way too much for the way I please, or worse make it so I can't use it the way it's intended to be used.

      So yeah to sum it all up as I've already said, 2K can ***** off until they pull their heads out of their asses, because they won't be getting my money.
  • blup3ace, on 10/10/2007, -21/+9such a great game...one stupid decision...
    hopefully it can be fixed.
  • RogueJediX, on 10/10/2007, -14/+195Oh, please let this be some sort of cruel, tasteless joke. I was really looking forward to playing this and I'd turn the other cheek if this were a straightforward game, but open-ended games usually get reinstalled after a while and replayed. I tend to agree with Alalu: This almost justifies piracy.
    • mrASSMAN, on 10/10/2007, -11/+21You can re-install if you uninstall it first. This just doesn't allow simultaneous installs of 2 computers.. you can install and uninstall as many times as you want.
      • reed311, on 10/10/2007, -7/+8According to the article, 2k says you are allowed to have it on 2 pc's if you wish.
      • ayeroxor, on 10/10/2007, -4/+30No its still *****. What if you have a hardware failure, thus you are rendered unable to uninstall the application. There would be no uninstall registered and you'd be dicked. article dugg because 2K are install-nazis
      • ChildeRoland420, on 10/10/2007, -1/+10Actually it does allow simultaneous installs of 2 comps, just no more than that.
    • PAPAsoMEAN, on 10/10/2007, -6/+5ha, anything to let out the pirate in you!
    • Aadain, on 10/10/2007, -2/+45Actually, I can guarentee there will some increased piracy because of this measure. Someday, someone, somewhere will have their computer crash and go to reinstall all their games, only to find that they can't play BioShock anymore because they didn't uninstall their game before their computer was a smoking pile of circuits. Then they'll get the runaround and be treated like criminal by the powers that be when he calls in to get the situation fixed. After hours of no help, he'll pirate the game and never worry about this crap again.

      Game companies: treat your customers like pirates, and they will start acting like pirates.

      BTW, does this affect the Steam version?
    • jobias, on 10/10/2007, -2/+9This does not affect the Steam version, due to how all games on Steam are distributed and installed in the same way. Fortunately or unfortunately, all the standard restrictions apply to Steam. So playing simultaneously on two computers, while possible with the boxed version, is impossible with Steam (at least, not legally or without some tweaking). But installing on more than 2 computers (ie. laptop, den and HDTV-connected PC) is possible with Steam but not with the boxed copy. Also, if you are unable to uninstall because your computer crashed, you won't have to call SecuROM to "free" up your install slot with Steam.
      • nogami, on 10/10/2007, -1/+5Are you sure about that? There's a lot of discussion going on over at the Steam forums that seems to indicate that the Steam version is also restricted to two installs, and that you must "delete local content" on one machine before being able to install it on a second machine.

        And if that is indeed the case, Valve has made a big mistake because I used to trust Steam for the policy of allowing multiple loads, but only one copy in play at any given time. I won't be making that mistake and pre-purchasing again until I'm told if they've bastardized Steam's activation system with additional DRM.
        • Modiga, on 10/10/2007, -0/+4I doubt VALVe had much choice in the matter, either they distribute it with the Securerom software or they don't distribute it at all.
          • tech42er, on 10/10/2007, -1/+3True. I don't blame Valve. 2K are the real assholes here. Hope it gets pirated.
      • jkneuper, on 10/10/2007, -0/+7Yes, it does affect the steam version: http://forums.steampowered.com/forums/showpost.php?p=6623735&postcount=25
    • spoiled1, on 10/10/2007, -0/+8Talk about shock...
    • AttackingHobo, on 10/10/2007, -3/+15"This almost justifies piracy"

      You are wrong.

      This most definitively justifies piracy. If I want to go out of my way and go to the store and purchase something with my money. I do not want to have a copy that restricts me in any way. I have had multiple computers die on me in the past. I have had hard drive failures, I have had viruses that ruined the system, all sorts of things that required me to set up windows again. I do not want to have the game become worthless because my computes dies twice without me uninstalling the game. I am sorry 2K games, you will not get a sale from me for your magnificent perfect game.
      • panzergeist, on 10/10/2007, -0/+6Or more rationally, it justifies not buying it in the first place. But if someone were to buy it and it was not in any documentation that the game contained this type of DRM, then you can start a civil suit or try to get your money back. It does not, however, justify pirating it.

        Seriously, do you really feel so entitled that you should break the law just to play a video game? If you don't like it, don't buy it. If you got suckered into it, try to return it, take civil action, or if all else fails, suck the $50 up and be more careful the next time (which includes not buying that companies products again until you get confirmation that they don't engage in that practice anymore.)
        • AttackingHobo, on 10/10/2007, -0/+2I am going to get the game without DRM. Don't ***** with me, I am ***** crazy.
        • korvan504521, on 10/10/2007, -0/+1I'm going to buy the game. . . then download the pirated version to actually install like I typically do. I hate having to switch CDs in and out.
    • KungFuJesus, on 10/10/2007, -4/+1Just get the steam version
    • lsatkins, on 10/10/2007, -0/+2Are you serious? That's like saying it's ok to steal someones car because they cut you off on the interstate this morning. If you don't like the drm then don't buy the ***** game. You don't have to steal it.
  • ahatter, on 10/10/2007, -22/+13this is why i prefer console gaming
  • truspector, on 10/10/2007, -30/+130One more reason why console gaming is taking over. Upgrading your system yearly, upgrading drivers for new games, and these activation hurdles you have to jump through just to get a game to work are not worth it to the average consumer.
    • Kavok, on 10/10/2007, -3/+26Once I can get the same depth and control in a console game I will switch. Until then I will sit infront of my computer. :)

      Certain games I really can't imagine playing on a console. Starcraft, Hearts of Iron 2, Civilization IV etc..
      • Casedot, on 10/10/2007, -1/+17Oblivion, Counter-Strike, HL2, Far Cry, [insert other FPS game]. Console gaming is awesome and I own a lot of them, but you can't beat the PC's control.

        Oblivion on the PC was 1000x better than console for the single fact that you could mod it.

        Graphics quality in FPS games is important (I'm not a graphics whore, but FPS and RTS games are much better at higher resolutions), and you can't beat a PC. My current PC blows away PS3 and X360, and in 2 years when I upgrade there will be even more of a difference.

        "not worth it to the average consumer." reminds me of a George Carlin quote: "Think about how stupid the average person is, then realize that half of them are stupider than that."
        • korvan504521, on 10/10/2007, -0/+1As far as control goes, it would be trivial for the Xbox to allow people to use mice and keyboards for games, its a usb port and it already works fine with a keyboard.
      • tnoy, on 10/10/2007, -2/+6What would you need outside of having a keyboard and mouse attached to a console? Its an honest question, as I feel that it would be more than sufficient for me. It should be fairly easy for developers to include such support in those games on a console.
        • Casedot, on 10/10/2007, -0/+3Seriously if they let me use a keyboard and mouse i would stop complaining, but they don't even though it should be "fairly easy". All they need to do is include a USB port and generic drivers too. They can barely release a working game the first time anymore though, so I am not putting too much hope in that area...

          I'm a pretty hard core gamer and I have been for a long time, and I won't even bother playing an FPS on a console because you will never be as good as you could be with a keyboard/mouse. I played Halo with a control and then played it on PC and the PC version was insanely better just because of the controls.
        • Radar3D, on 10/10/2007, -1/+9The result is a game like Deus Ex 2. The PC controls were abysmal, very obviously just copied from the console port. Everything felt sluggish, which makes sense when you use a controller that can't turn or aim as quickly as a keyboard/mouse combo.

          * C O N S O L E D *
        • Tinmanau, on 10/10/2007, -2/+3tnoy, you realise there are "consoles" with a keyboard a mouse already, right? they call them "computers"...

          Add a keyboard mouse to a console and that's effectively what they turn into....a cheap-ass PC....heck, a PS3 takes the mouse/keyboard and even lets you install Linux....
        • blaket, on 10/10/2007, -0/+2I'd gladly buy FPS games on my 360 if I could use a keyboard/mouse combo, as I can't hit the broad-side of a barn with the controller.
    • 0ddity, on 10/10/2007, -1/+6I guess you never played Starcraft64. It was as bad as you imagine.
    • maj0rm0j0, on 10/10/2007, -4/+5If you use upgrading your PC as a reason not to buy PC games, then let us know when you have to go spend $1000 to buy the PS4 to play a game not made for the PS3, oh and don't forget they will all together stop making games for whatever console your currently playing games on so you have to upgrade to a whole new system. I play both, and trust me it's cheaper in the long run to gradually upgrade your PC.
      • NoQuarter, on 10/10/2007, -1/+4A new console is released every 4-5 years in a normal cycle (there are obviously exceptions, xbox1-360 was very short while PS2-PS3 was very long). My 360 cost me £280 in a bundle with three of the top games (still retailing at £85 for all of them) and two official wireless controllers. My last graphics card cost me £250 18 months ago (about the same time the 360 came out). It can't run Bioshock to anywhere close to the standard that my 360 can (60fps at 720p). And I'm ignoring the cost of upgrading my CPU, RAM, etc. which together makes it prohibitively expensive to even think about continuing with PC gaming. It's currently in a state where it's suitable for internet and work use with some gaming and that is where it shall remain.
        • YojimboJango, on 10/10/2007, -3/+018 months ago yes, the best thing you could get for your money was a 360. Today you can upgrade your computer for less. Don't believe me, here's a list that I made in 15 minutes browsing newegg.com.

          Motherboard: ASUS P5NSLI LGA 775 NVIDIA nForce 570 SLI
          http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131032
          $89.99

          Processor: Intel Core 2 Duo E4400 Allendale 2.0GHz 2M shared L2 Cache LGA 775
          http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819115014
          $125.99

          Video Card: MSI NX8600GT-T2D256E OC GeForce 8600GT 256MB 128-bit GDDR3 PCI Express x16 HDCP Ready SLI
          http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814127286
          $114.99

          Ram: 2x CORSAIR ValueSelect 1GB 240-Pin DDR2 SDRAM DDR2 667 (PC2 5300)
          http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820146580
          $69.98 ($34.99x2)

          Hard drive: Western Digital Caviar SE16 WD2500KS 250GB 7200 RPM 16MB Cache SATA 3.0Gb/s
          http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16822144701
          $67.99

          Power Supply: Thermaltake TR2 W0070RUC ATX 430W
          http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817153023
          $39.99

          Case: RAIDMAX xB ATX-528B Black SECC Steel ATX Mid Tower
          http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811156053
          $19.99

          DVD ROM: Sony NEC Optiarc Black 16X DVD-ROM 48X CD-ROM IDE
          http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16827101131
          $17.99

          Total Cost: $540.91

          Without Hard drive, Case, and DVD ROM: $434.94, That's cheaper than your xbox 360 right there, and you've got better performance.

          My point really is that if you haven't bought a 360 already it's cheaper just to upgrade your PC.
          • Smills, on 10/10/2007, -0/+1That is significantly worse than my one and a half year old computer... And I can't beat an xbox 360 when it comes down to games like bioshock and world in conflict. Also, you are missing out some of the most expensive parts, and the fact that an xbox is played on a generally larger screen than a PC.
        • panzergeist, on 10/10/2007, -3/+3@ YojimboJango

          You forgot the Windows OS in that. Add at least another $100 for an OEM copy of XP that is non-transferable to any other hardware. At least $200 if you go retail. So your total cost is still almost $700 before adding games, and it won't perform even marginally better than the 360 does. The CPU isn't as powerful as the 360's while the GPU is only slightly faster. The memory is a LOT slower than what is in the 360, and so overall bandwidth is a joke by comparison. It is saved somewhat because you've got a lot more of it to go around.

          Irregardless, even if pirating Windows, your $540 (+ tax + shipping) PC still doesn't perform as well as a 360. Get over it. Now if you slapped an 8800 with a Quad Core, then you'd have room to talk, but you'd also be paying a hell of a lot more too.
          • DROWE859, on 10/10/2007, -1/+1Because you can do all the things on that $540 (granted) PC that you can with your 360.
        • DROWE859, on 10/10/2007, -0/+3*misplaced comment*
    • ut2k4king, on 10/10/2007, -6/+1And then we see Crysis graphix and it's all worth it
    • dBLiSS, on 10/10/2007, -7/+2There is a key issue everyone seems to overlooking. I just spent 6 hours playing the game it was a lot of FUN. I ENJOYED it.
      • drachemorder, on 10/10/2007, -1/+8Some people prefer a life of principle above one of mere gratification.
    • tkilljoy, on 10/10/2007, -2/+3i havent upgraded a single component yet (bought my system 18 months ago.) by the way, and my system surpasses the recommended requirements of BioShock (not minimum).. i would have had to buy me a new console just to play this game. (and still would have missed out on a long list of regular play games that i just cant get for consoles.)

      and then, like you, i'd still own a computer anyways....

      forgot that part didja?
    • dorkino, on 10/10/2007, -1/+3FPS on consoles suck, plain and simple. You can't beat the precision aiming of a mouse vs. a joystick controller.
  • saltinekracka20, on 10/10/2007, -35/+10The only reason people have discovered this flaw is because they're all giving it to their friends so they can install it on their computers, too. Too bad for them, they screwed themselves over. I will agree that it sucks in the long run, but you know all these kids are just pirating this thing.
    • Audiophile27, on 10/10/2007, -7/+7you do realize if you have to reformat after buying the game you have 1 chance to install and if that install crashes (unlucky) or you need to re-install you are *****
      or buy a new system in say 2 months same thing
      • Gustomucho, on 10/10/2007, -1/+6You are wrong, because you enter the code after the install, when everything is done. So unless you hack the system so you enter the code before you install, which would be utterly stupid and make no sense at all, you can do it. I admit the multi-format scenario is bad tho.
    • MxM111, on 10/10/2007, -1/+4So, can it play without CD in the drive? If not, then you would not give it to your friends - you need it for yourself. And then, why not do the same for XBox? register a particular game to particular console...
  • Audiophile27, on 10/10/2007, -32/+48***** 2kGames
    • gcnaddict, on 10/10/2007, -2/+9I'm still trying to give them a chance. The console release kicked ass after all.
      • dBLiSS, on 10/10/2007, -1/+1Agreed Xbox version kicks ass. Been a lot of FUN so far.
    • kenok, on 10/10/2007, -0/+2Don't dis 2k Games.

      ***** 2k Games for choosing securom!
    • zjordan04, on 10/10/2007, -1/+5Well, at least ***** them gently.

      They did make an awesome game.
  • hurt911gen, on 10/10/2007, -17/+75I cant believe 2kGames had the balls to pull this kind of *****.
    • wageslaven, on 10/10/2007, -26/+5I cant belive that Digg and Kotaku are full of such sensationlist asses.

      #1) There is no Widescreen bug in Bioshock.
      #2) Read the update, this article is INACCURATE.
      • nreynolds, on 10/10/2007, -3/+17The widescreen thing isn't a bug, it's just 2K decided to ***** widescreen owners, who should (as they made a large investment) get the larger picture. Standard def shouldn't get a bigger view of the game, period.
        • Tippis, on 10/10/2007, -0/+1Why should they get a larger picture just because they chose a shorter screen?
          If I play my game in 1920x1440 (4:3), I should get to see more than if I play it in 1920x1080 (16:9), right?

          The problem with that complaint is that they are stuck in a TV/DVD mode of thinking. They assume that "WS = high def", when, in fact, on digital monitors (which is the target display for this kind of content) Wide Screen is equivalent to "lower vertical resolution". On these displays, "High Def" simply means more pixels, and has absolutely nothing to do with the shape of the display.
      • hightower77, on 10/10/2007, -1/+7wageslaven to the rescue...

        You can call the kettle black 1,000,000 times and yet, you sir, the pot are still black.
    • psg188, on 10/10/2007, -5/+2Buy it from steam and you won't have this issue, screw the publisher! Buy from Steam!
      • rebotfc, on 10/10/2007, -0/+3The secuROM is still on steam...
      • Sarevok9, on 10/10/2007, -0/+2Steam has been having more issues with securom then the store-bought versions, check 2k forums before posting more misinformation.
  • OminousG, on 10/10/2007, -3/+133The best part is that even after you uninstall the game, the Securom protection is left in your system. You can not remove it without a format, even Sony (owns Securom) has stated they will not provide help for removing Securom.
    • Plopfish, on 10/10/2007, -1/+71I think it should be illegal to not let you remove files/programs from your computer without destroying the OS and all data.
      • student69, on 10/10/2007, -7/+3I agree that it should be removable from within windows, but anything can be removed without destroying data if you know how. For example a live distro of linux.
    • HPCELarry, on 10/10/2007, -3/+33Another sony stunt? Its like that rootkit they did earlier, which you couldn't uninstall either.
      • panzergeist, on 10/10/2007, -0/+4The "rootkit" you're referring to is actually an older, nastier version of SecuROM. Essentially, SecuROM still behaves "like" a rootkit in that it hides its processes from the OS and user to help prevent easy circumvention. However, that rootkit fiasco had to deal with a security vulnerability in that particular version of SecuROM that could allow a third party to take advantage of it and "root" your system. You can read more about it on the tweakguides forums.

        SecuROM by itself is actually one of the "nicest" DRM schemes out there in that it doesn't bork your system, but it can cause your game to crash.
    • AnotherThought, on 10/10/2007, -0/+48In other news, Suprnova is back.
    • student69, on 10/10/2007, -5/+3Anything can be removed without a format, just boot to a linux cd or miniPE and delete the files, and any registry keys linking to them.
    • samssf, on 10/10/2007, -0/+4That's the thing though. The people that know how to remove securom won't care about this. People who know how to pirate and crack the game will do so and get around the protection. The people getting hurt are people who aren't as tech savvy and just want to install the game three different times.
    • panzergeist, on 10/10/2007, -0/+6Actually, could you please site a source for that information (that it's not removable except by format). I would like to read about that if true.

      As far as I know, SecuROM hasn't changed since the last time I researched it, and if that's still the case, look here for instructions on how to remove it: http://forums.tweakguides.com/showpost.php?s=c52420a68b3db4e2a8a9c0662ed9405c&p=44210&postcount=2
    • sirber, on 10/10/2007, -0/+1Can't find that service on Vista64
  • Sirocco, on 10/10/2007, -5/+312Newsflash: Copy protection doesn't work. Ever.
    • merreborn, on 10/10/2007, -1/+59There'll be a crack for the activation process out by the end of the month, if not the end of the week. The only people this will hurt are legitimate users.
    • SnuKs, on 10/10/2007, -6/+1Hahah but it sure as hell works at pissing off everyone after reading what diggers have to say.
    • tnoy, on 10/10/2007, -3/+17Copy protection works... It prevents people from downloading and playing it for that first week until a crack is released.
      • vertinox, on 10/10/2007, -0/+4Actually, DRM makes a legitimate customer pay for the product twice.
      • kazamx, on 10/10/2007, -1/+2You make a fair point. I believe may people who would have downloaded it will end up buying it if it takes more than a few days to crack. I really want to play this game and didn't bother buying it because I thought there would be a torrent out quickly. I have a feeling that the next time I am in town I will end up buying it.

        Yes they still lose some sales to piracy, but I guess the week/month delay does get the some more sales.
    • blaaguuu, on 10/10/2007, -1/+5Copy protection is effective in stopping the average consumer from copying a game. It will, however always be circumvented by advanced users. The problem here is that it doesnt matter if you use the most basic cd-copy protection, or the most advanced Secu-Rom or Starforce protection - You are blocking the same people. So the advanced measure are a waste of money for the publishers, and a huge hassle for legitimate customers.
    • Urusai, on 10/10/2007, -0/+4Sometimes after the first few weeks the developer releases a patch that turns off the draconian copy protection system. The publisher wants the copy protection during the initial release period to help lock in those people who don't want to wait for the pirated copy to hit the Internet; after that, most piracy is in theory by people who wouldn't pay for the game anyway, so the sales impact is minimal. I hope that the soon-to-be-coming widescreen patch also deals with this.
    • samssf, on 10/10/2007, -0/+2Sure it does. It work's against people who are playing the legit copy and get screwed over somehow by this, heh. Of course, the people who actually desire to circumvent copy protection can do so easily.
  • wrenchone, on 10/10/2007, -54/+91Read the whole article. You can install the game as much as you want, as long as you remember to uninstall it for reinstalling it. Doesn't seem that unreasonable.

    • OminousG, on 10/10/2007, -3/+147who is going to uninstall their game collection before a format?
      and god forbid hardware failure
      • Shelter22, on 10/10/2007, -34/+5you are, if you want to be able to play your ***** game
      • mrASSMAN, on 10/10/2007, -17/+6You would probably just need to call them up..
        • ldkronos, on 10/10/2007, -1/+12Great idea. Companies should have been doing this for year. You know, then the next time I want to install Descent 3 I just call up Outrage Games and get it straightened out. Now, what was their phone number again....oh yeah, that's right! They shut down 4 years ago.
      • kittell, on 10/10/2007, -8/+2Most software with a licensing policy like this will let you call them if you have an issue where you can't uninstall, such as hardware failure. I'm not saying that's the policy here, but you'd be surprised. I've had software before where that was the case, and they simply deactivated the old serial and gave me a new one.
    • gotamd, on 10/10/2007, -0/+21I don't usually bother to uninstall software if I'm going to format the whole drive and start over anyway. Perhaps it would be ok if I had to do this with only one piece of software, but Bioshock is setting a dangerous precedent. If other software makers use similar systems, it will become unmanageable. It's a big PITA as it is.
    • ScionAltera, on 10/10/2007, -1/+19I don't usually reinstall my OS until my hard drive dies and I have to, or I want to upgrade to a new version, etc. So what happens when my computer blows up and I /can't/ uninstall the software? Do I have to call up SecuROM and somehow prove to them that my hardware failed and my machine is inoperable? Yeah, I don't think so. I'm gonna vote with my wallet and skip this game.
    • Smegzor, on 10/10/2007, -0/+6Uninstalling is only good if you CAN uninstall. If you can't you are hosed.
    • fuliginosus, on 10/10/2007, -1/+1Yet there are many reports on 2K forums saying that uninstalling DID NOT gave back install credit.
  • Audiophile27, on 10/10/2007, -19/+2in other news Bioshock official price 340$ .for a core xbox360 and the game
    • SnuKs, on 10/10/2007, -4/+7in other news PC's users pay $200 annually to play Bioshock to replace unusable disks.
  • XHashmeerX, on 10/10/2007, -39/+17Well, i was concerned at first too, but apparently if you uninstall it, it's fine. That's OK by me. You just can't have it running at once on more than one machine. If you're playing it on 3 machines...I'm going to ask why? Two makes sense (laptop-desktop) It's so you don't go and give the game to all your friends. It makes sense for a way to handle a single player only game.

    Most commercial software, 3ds Max for example, is one license per purchase. You can do license transfers to other machines if you'd like no problem.

    I don't know where people get off on the idea that they own the software and can do whatever the hell they want with it. It's a license, permission to use it. Read a EULA once in your life.

    Tell me I'm not the only one that gets this?
    • humanerror, on 04/03/2008, -5/+9Dear XHashmeerX, eat a polonium sandwich and die, you *****.
    • Kinjiru, on 10/10/2007, -2/+7EULA's are not enforceable dumbass.. what rock have you been hiding under?
      • Amablue, on 10/10/2007, -1/+3Yes they are as long as certain conditions are met. Look it up, there are plenty of court cases that have upheld EULAs.
        • mrFREEZE, on 10/10/2007, -0/+2Depends on the (US) state, let alone country.
    • shinynew, on 10/10/2007, -0/+11read the other comments, If anything fails so you cant uninstall it then you have just lost one computer

      lost your laptop? that sucks, harddrive failed? that sucks, reformated and forgot? that sucks...
    • peevegrider, on 10/10/2007, -1/+5*cough* my hard drive crashed last week *cough*
    • tnoy, on 10/10/2007, -0/+5You're not. A lot of people have a problem with developers/publishers forcing us to install copy protection that can cause a significant amount of problems to their machines, not with the fact they cant install it on more than one computer. I'm fine with mechanisms that prevent me from making copies, not with something that can cause a deal of instability in my system.
    • MxM111, on 10/10/2007, -0/+6>I'm going to ask why?

      I am sorry, but it is really none of your business. It is my game and if I want to play it on 5 computers I should be able to do it.
      • JudgeMonkey, on 10/10/2007, -0/+1and as long as only one copy is in use at a time, that is usually fine with most EULAs. This is ridiculous.
  • Gustomucho, on 10/10/2007, -61/+147hey guys,

    first, let me say this. you DO NOT NEED TO USE THE INTERNET EVERY TIME YOU PLAY THIS GAME. it is only the first time.

    second, you can uninstall and reinstall this game, and if, by chance, you have 2 computers you want to simultaneously play this game on, you also can do that.

    if by some chance you are reinstalling this game without uninstalling it first, a lot, there is a chance you may have to call securom and get a key, or deactivate some older installations.

    but if you upgrade your hardware next week, you'll still be able to play the game. if you revamp your system and need to reinstall bioshock, just uninstall it before you go through the overhaul, and then do your reinstall.

    calling it "hardware fingerprinting" is a bit alarmist. we do not transmit any of your data to any companies.

    really, the only people who will be concerned about any of these security measures are those who are rapidly putting bioshock on many pcs... if you use the game as you normally do, you won't notice this at all.
    -----2k Games----

    Enough with sensationalism crap.. give the fact
    • saltinekracka20, on 10/10/2007, -26/+4"really, the only people who will be concerned about any of these security measures are those who are rapidly putting bioshock on many pcs..."
      Nuff said.
      • MrSteamTank, on 10/10/2007, -1/+17hahahaha! Securom is a piece of garbage and if you've ever bought a game legit you'd realize how awful it is for legitimate buyers. The games are so easy to copy and pirate yet incredibly picky when you have the legit version.

        When I had alcohol 120% on my computer I was unable to start various of the games I purchased with securom due to DRM issues. I don't mind security in my games to prevent pirating but when I have to wait 3-4 days for a return cd-key e-mail from securom due to their DRM refusing to play games I purchased legitimately it really pisses me off.
    • GoatBn, on 10/10/2007, -5/+26@Gustomucho

      Thanks for an official explanation. I have been waiting for 2k to respond...funny it was in a digg.

      Now, I appreciate your right to thwart piracy. Here is the problem. Your attempt is really only throwing fuel on the fire. You are promoting piracy. The person who buys this game (and pays your salary) gets *****, while the person who downloaded the torrent gets total access, all the perks and didnt spend anything except a few clicks. *****, he probably even gets it faster than Steam can download it.

      If you think this game is not going to be cracked? Your nuts. The more you try to prevent piracy, the more you make the hackers drool over a good challenge.

      I personally know about 5 people who were going to buy this game retail. Now, they are already downloading the torrent. Please stop being so arrogant, and target the consumer who paid $$, not the pirate.
      • blaaguuu, on 10/10/2007, -0/+13I agree with your sentiment that overzealous copy protection only servers to anger customers, and promote piracy. But just so you know, Gustomucho isnt from 2K, he just copy/pasted their response that was posted on the 2K forums.
        • GoatBn, on 10/10/2007, -0/+6oops...oh well my point still stands.
    • Casedot, on 10/10/2007, -0/+48I'm still going to get a cracked version because you guys use securom. GTFO my computer.
    • tehmoth, on 10/10/2007, -9/+4sensationalist stories from kotaku? how can it be?
    • kilooneniner, on 10/10/2007, -0/+16This is fair enough, but it kinda misses the point for me. I for one will never buy a PC game that requires activation. Period. It's the same reason I haven't played Microsoft's latest flight sim. I refuse to be held hostage by a company that can choose to drop support when the game gets old. I have a lot of old PC games lying around that I paid for and I still play now because I still can. If this is the direction that the industry is going, than there is now one less PC gamer in the world.
    • rebotfc, on 10/10/2007, -2/+241. It installs Securom Malware which cannot be uninstalled.

      2. 2 HDD crashes and you lose the game you paid for.

      Thanks , but no thanks...
      • tech42er, on 10/10/2007, -0/+21. Get a LiveCD.*

        2. Class Securom.**

        *But who's going to do that, honestly?

        **And pray they believe you and want to help you. And when they're out of business, you're *****.
    • JombieZesus, on 10/10/2007, -1/+9Thanks but no thanks. I was going to buy this game but I'll download it now instead. I won't give one penny to companies that do this kind of crap.
    • vertinox, on 10/10/2007, -0/+10Why have the DRM at all? You know it will be broken by a hack? I don't pirate games, but I won't buy games from companies that use intrusive DRM.

      DRM only punishes those who buy the game anyways.

      And by intrusive... I think Steam is ok. Anything more complicated or troublesome than Steam will get thrown in the trash and I'll never buy from that company again and I'll tell everyone I talk to never to buy from that company ever again.
    • ldkronos, on 10/10/2007, -0/+12I can't believe you can be so blinded that you can't even foresee the possibilities. What happens some day in the future when both your company and securom go out of business.
    • gcnaddict, on 10/10/2007, -0/+13"Enough with sensationalism crap.. give the fact" -- enough with the moronic DRM. Stop ***** with what we paid for.
    • wakkow, on 10/10/2007, -0/+12"if you revamp your system and need to reinstall bioshock, just uninstall it before you go through the overhaul, and then do your reinstall."

      Yeah, that's exactly what I think to do before revamping my system... "Gee, which applications should I uninstall first?"
      • Deputydon, on 10/10/2007, -0/+3Yeah, not to mention that last time I had to format my harddrive it was because my computer got so ***** up some how from my little brother that I couldn't even boot Windows in Safe mode. Yet i'm expected to somehow uninstall the game before I whip out the xp disk reinstall windows and then call windows activation because I've also reinstalled windows xp too many times and I have to get a new code everytime I do it. I'm not talking to those foreign piece of ***** twice every time i format....
      • Deputydon, on 10/10/2007, -0/+0yeah, I clicked it once but apparently that means twice.


        - My bad.
      • Gizza, on 10/10/2007, -0/+3This could also get really bad if more companies see this work on a popular game and decide to do it as well. I could just imagine you want to format and you have 6 or so games installed and you have to try and remember/figure which ones you will need to uninstall just so you can reinstall them. Then giving up and spending the next 30mins uninstalling them all.
    • bobbles, on 10/10/2007, -0/+8Securom SUX
    • jdaniel284, on 10/10/2007, -0/+11Seriously dude, I was going to buy this one. It's already cracked though, so I am going to download the free version. If there was someway I could get you the $49.99 for the pirated version I would, because I seriously want to pay for this game. But it will be a cold day in all seven of the burning hells before I buy a game that comes with a mandatory virus and spyware.

      I'll tell you what, I'll donate $49.99 to charity in your name after I download the cracked version. How'd that be?
    • method3, on 10/10/2007, -0/+7Why the ***** can't you do what you want with software legally bought with your computer?

      1. Why the ***** should I need internet the first time I play a single player game?
      2. Why the ***** should I have to uninstall something before I reinstall it? "call securom and get a key, or deactivate some older installations"... Oh, OK. That sounds like a ton of fun! Instead of playing a game, I get to dick around with securom! WOOHOO!
      3. Why the ***** should I think about uninstalling stuff if I'm going to reformat and reinstall everything fresh? "we do not transmit any of your data to any companies." It's good that you say that here, because if you didn't we can just take your word for it right? Or is it clearly labeled somewhere on the box, "Hey, by installing this software you could be exposing private information to the company that created this game. But don't worry, we promise not to do anything too bad to your computer. You can trust us!"

      Seriously, as stated above by Casedot, games that use securom cannot GTFO fast enough. Don't question paying customers about why they want to do something with software they already bought, we have the right to use our computers as we wish. None of your god damned business why I want to install Bioshock on a machine more than twice without uninstalling, I might be having software/hardware problems. I shouldn't have to explain that to anyone to play a game that I bought.
    • stinger666, on 10/10/2007, -0/+4Why when I buy food I don't have to register it on the internet?
    • Math, on 10/10/2007, -0/+3What happens if Securom goes bankrupt, or they stop supporting the game? That means that your can't install the game anymore.

      2K should come clean and admit that they are actually renting the game to the consumer for a limited time. The consumer doesn't own the software anymore.
      • gerryk, on 10/10/2007, -1/+0The consumer never did. Ever read a EULA? All you get is use of the software, you never own it.
      • sirber, on 10/10/2007, -0/+1Usualy they remove protections after some months with game updates.
    • MatttK, on 10/10/2007, -0/+4I reformat my PC every so often for whatever reason. It'd be pretty stupid if I had to uninstall software before wiping the drive...
    • magic6435, on 10/10/2007, -0/+4"there is a chance you may have to call securom and get a key, or deactivate some older installations."
      Yea because thats what i want to do, spend my time calling everytime i want to install a game...
    • Davolo, on 10/10/2007, -0/+1After the Sony rootkit debacle and now reading about the finer detail of Sony developed SecuROM you can take the installing DVD and ram it up the ass of the guy that green lighted this as Steam was sufficient. If you work for 2K Gustomucho I hope you can relay that back because I won't be purchasing anymore games from Take2 and it's subsidiaries.
    • Eevee, on 10/10/2007, -1/+0And just where the ***** do these people get off TRACKING when and what I install or uninstall? Why is this even REMOTELY excusable? Why is the gaming industry trying to FORCE me to pirate games just to get their slimy paws off of MY goddamn computer?
  • tchawla, on 10/10/2007, -15/+32Way to take a game that has tons of acclaim and hype, and ***** it all up. The reason I was going to buy this on PC alongside my roommate's xbox360 copy was to have it long term. Guess I won't be buying it any more. Even with the uninstall first clause - what happens if your computer crashes and you can't uninstall? I don't want to have to think about, "Oh *****, I need to uninstall Bioshock before I format my computer."
    • Sirocco, on 10/10/2007, -5/+13No problem. Buy it, then apply a crack to remove the protection. They get paid, you get a good game sans the DRM *****, everybody wins.
      • knightboat, on 10/10/2007, -4/+16Except this supports them for ***** you over and funds the next idea they'll have to bend over the paying consumer.
      • FredFredrickson, on 10/10/2007, -18/+1Or you could just read the article and realize that you can use it as much as you want, as long as you uninstall it before reinstalling it later. Tool.
        • WoollyMittens, on 10/10/2007, -0/+5How childish of you to start calling names. How do you uninstall after a harddrive failure, pray tell? Uhm... retard?
        • achoo5000, on 10/10/2007, -0/+1retard is a name
        • Dimensio, on 10/10/2007, -0/+1"Or you could just read the article and realize that you can use it as much as you want, as long as you uninstall it before reinstalling it later. "

          And you can check 2k's forums and see that THIS DOES NOT WORK. 2k LIED about this.
      • shinynew, on 10/10/2007, -1/+3have fun getting the patches to work.
  • monkeycatDx, on 10/10/2007, -11/+42Why do company's ***** the buyers :'..(
    • wageslaven, on 10/10/2007, -8/+1UPDATED:
      Elizabeth from 2K has repsonded on the forums, clarifying the copy protection issue. The key lies in uninstalling before you reinstall. Uninstalling registers the same as installing does, so if you do not perform an uninstall first SecuROM thinks you are just installing the game on different systems over and over again.
      • WoollyMittens, on 10/10/2007, -0/+5So I have to carefully consider uninstalling all my games before reformatting my drive when it won't boot into windows anymore... wait... how?
      • Dimensio, on 10/10/2007, -0/+2Elizabeth lied, as has been confirmed on the forums. Uninstalling does NOT allow subsequent activations.
        • Tippis, on 10/10/2007, -0/+1Link to the discussion? I want to watch the fireworks ;)
    • rebotfc, on 10/10/2007, -0/+7And what about a HDD crash?, why the hell are SecuROM snooping into my habits anyway, get the ***** out of my computer.
    • postalblowfish7, on 10/10/2007, -10/+1because zit faced diggers are too cheap to buy *****, and pirating is sabotaging gaming how it's already destroyed the music industry.

      that's why.
      • Tarl, on 10/10/2007, -0/+0Whatever, guy.
        I buy my games. And I buy them to last. I can still play all my original disks from 5, 10, and 15 years ago. So I ask you: WTF?
    • aldenhg, on 10/10/2007, -1/+2Probably because you rape the use of apostrophes.
  • blorc, on 10/10/2007, -7/+110This is ***** retarded. I don't care if you can "alleviate" or "avoid" the problem by uninstalling first. Why should I have to go through this ***** just to play the game I ***** paid for? I'm not a pirate. I'm not lending out discs or uploading the game to the Internet. It's inevitable that someone is going to get around it and do it anyway. All it does is harass and annoying legitimate paying customers.

    I was considering buying this after I finished building my new computer in a few months, but I will probably avoid it all together. If I do play it, I'll either play it at someone else's place or find some other way to do it without paying them a dime.
    • enforcerpsu, on 10/10/2007, -1/+13I completely agree. Another solution which does NOTHING to curb piracy but instead places an additional burden on the legitimate consumer.

      I will not be buying the PC version of this game. Perhaps the 360 version but this news is enough to warrant I not play this game period. DRM and the like are completely unnecessary. When will these clueless companies wake up and realize that THIS DOES NOT STOP PIRACY!
    • Thepirateking, on 10/10/2007, -6/+1play it without paying a dime? Now where's that flash video?

      Oh yeah! http://www.i-am-bored.com/bored_link.cfm?link_id=18812
    • Tallon29, on 10/10/2007, -7/+9"I'm not a pirate."

      ...

      "If I do play it, I'll ... find some other way to do it without paying them a dime."


      Uh-huh
      • blorc, on 10/10/2007, -0/+9Fair enough. My point, however, was that I would do something like that out of protest rather than practice. I own all the games I have installed on my computer. I am more than willing to purchase a game like Bioshock, but not when the company is going to treat me like a would-be criminal and make it a hassle for me to use the game. We all know it's going to get cracked anyway. It's the same argument with gun laws. Why should I have to be the person who doesn't own a gun when a criminal is going to get one anyway?
      • Casedot, on 10/10/2007, -0/+8so now playing it at a friend's house is illegal too?
    • wageslaven, on 10/10/2007, -13/+2UPDATED:
      Elizabeth from 2K has repsonded on the forums, clarifying the copy protection issue. The key lies in uninstalling before you reinstall. Uninstalling registers the same as installing does, so if you do not perform an uninstall first SecuROM thinks you are just installing the game on different systems over and over again.
      • WoollyMittens, on 10/10/2007, -0/+6If windows screws up, you can't uninstall it.
        • slcsu, on 10/10/2007, -4/+0That's why you can do it twice. And after a period of time, it expires. Is your windows going to crash 3 times in one day?
        • CatalystGhost, on 10/10/2007, -0/+4@slcsu

          Yes, it can. And has. :/
    • blaaguuu, on 10/10/2007, -0/+16Another point. I still occasionally grab an old CD or even Floppy of a game i purchased years ago, to play around with. What happens in 10 or 20 years when i think "Oh, remember that BioShock game? that was awesome... I wanna play through it again", only to realise that 2k games went bankrupt, and their servers are long gone... I'm sure someone will figure out a hack for it (which makes the whole thing pointless to begin with), but I should be able to play a game that i bought, without having to ask their permission every time I install it.
      • kilooneniner, on 10/10/2007, -0/+710-20 years is giving them too much credit. At this rate it won't take nearly that long.
    • Hoinah, on 10/10/2007, -2/+1Simple:
      Step 1: Buy a 360
      Step 2: Less QQ and more pew pew
  • Piedramente, on 10/10/2007, -14/+11This ranks right up there with DRM. I hate limitations like this and having to call to get a key after a couple installs.
  • grkgod, on 10/10/2007, -11/+0if u try more than twice they send a big daddy after u. just make sure u get the lil sis ADAM.
  • stronglikedan, on 10/10/2007, -30/+13This is highly inaccurate. The real story is that you can only hvae two ACTIVE installations of the game. When you uninstall the game it DEACTIVATES one installation so that you cn activate it again when you reinstall it. You can have it actively installed on 2 PCs at a time. If you get a new PC, you uninstall it from the old one before installing it on the new one.

    Buried for inaccurate.
    • Piedramente, on 10/10/2007, -2/+9What about reformats? The only times I 'uninstalled' a few products were when the OS went south. Yet they still count it as an "active installation"

      Have a couple of those, and you're in for trouble.
      • Hed77, on 10/10/2007, -6/+2The information from 2K specifically states:
        "if by some chance you are reinstalling this game without uninstalling it first, a lot, there is a chance you may have to call securom and get a key, or deactivate some older installations."

        So if you have a hardware crash you contact them and get the older version deactivated, reading an entire post helps clarify things so that redundant questions are not asked.
        • Piedramente, on 10/10/2007, -1/+3Have you considered that perhaps some of those posts to which you are referring may not have existed at the time of my post?

          The practice you are referring to is very common, but is still an inconvenience that I would rather do without.
      • ScionAltera, on 10/10/2007, -0/+6I don't want to have to ***** call anyone when my computer dies on me, nor do I want to uninstall my software before I reinstall my OS.
    • Psychrist, on 10/10/2007, -2/+6And has been said above you, what happens if your hard drive crashes? does the old copy deactivate itself?
  • JKVM, on 10/10/2007, -3/+43I preordered the game on Steam before I knew about this, or the fact that the game itself would crash rather than run... I tried installing on some of the other machines in my house in order to troubleshoot my crashing issues and ran into the activation limit. Unbelievable. I want my money back.
    • lordsandwich, on 10/10/2007, -1/+33I can't believe they actually put Securom protection on the Steam version. One of the few things I liked about Steam was that it would install my purchased games as many times as I liked, since they have to authenticate to my account anyway. This is ***** ridiculous.
    • gotamd, on 10/10/2007, -1/+19Wow... they even put that ***** on the Steam version. What the *****? Steam already has protections built into it. Thanks for the warning though. I'll be sure and not purchase Bioshock over Steam as I was planning to do.
    • dillibob, on 10/10/2007, -1/+8do u know for a fact that its on your steam version?
    • Beaver6813, on 10/10/2007, -0/+7Wow that is really really pointless.. Steam encrypts, decrypts whatever the hell it does and authorises your account, why in God's name would you need Securom as well!?
    • MatttK, on 10/10/2007, -0/+1I can't even get my Steam version to run properly. I have to put it in dx9 mode to even start a new game but now it crashes every time it loads the second level. If they don't fix this soon, the developer will be joining Peter Molyneux on my list of people to never buy PC games from ever again.
  • Sube6491, on 10/10/2007, -14/+3Sorry if I'm being too noobish, I haven't played PC games for a couple of years, security was more lax back then, but couldn't they just install the game, copy the already installed folder where Bioshock is onto a DVD, then if they want to reinstall they could just copy that file folder back onto the PC? Hell it isn't even installing then, it's just simply pasting the folder into the program files and you're off. Am I right or wrong?
    • Audiophile27, on 10/10/2007, -4/+4its secuRom look it up
      • web.phreak, on 10/10/2007, -0/+2Well not only that, but he's forgetting all the registry entries... along with whatever shared data and profile data may be present.
    • web.phreak, on 10/10/2007, -0/+1Nope.
  • cyberdecker, on 10/10/2007, -17/+3UPDATE - Elizabeth from 2K has repsonded on the forums, clarifying the copy protection issue. The key lies in uninstalling before you reinstall. Uninstalling registers the same as installing does, so if you do not perform an uninstall first SecuROM thinks you are just installing the game on different systems over and over again. Hit the jump for the full text of Elizabeth's message, and thanks for everyone who followed up on the issue.
    • dalittle, on 10/10/2007, -0/+5What do you do if your harddrive crashes 5 years from now when 2k and securom are out of business. No incentive to buy the game. Dumb.
      • saltinekracka20, on 10/10/2007, -4/+1You wont be playing this game in 5 years.
        • dalittle, on 10/10/2007, -0/+2I still play fallout. That is well over 5 years.

          Truely great games hold their own and I think this is one. Sad to see it go to the pirates, I would like to see more of these games.
  • tedhead2k, on 10/10/2007, -1/+27Out of curiosity, what if you buy the game through Steam? Steam usually lets you re-download and re-play the game whenever you like, did they change that for this game?
    • FredFredrickson, on 10/10/2007, -4/+9No, because on Steam, you can only be logged in in one location at a time... alleviating the need for this.
      • gotamd, on 10/10/2007, -0/+9An earlier reply actually mentioned that they did include the SecuROM protection in the Steam version as well and it has the same issue.
    • rebotfc, on 10/10/2007, -0/+15Read above this secuROM crap is on the steam version as well.
    • FredFredrickson, on 10/10/2007, -6/+2But you can't use your Steam account on more than one computer at once, so you would never encounter this issue using Steam...
      • Vektuz, on 10/10/2007, -0/+3You would still reach this issue if you reformatted your hard drive or reinstalled it on a new computer.
      • tech42er, on 10/10/2007, -0/+2Yes, but 2K sucks, so they forced STEAM to apply the SecuROM DRM as well.
    • MatttK, on 10/10/2007, -0/+1Don't buy it from Steam. A LOT of Steam users are experiencing insane amounts of crash bugs. I haven't heard of non-Steam people are too but if they are, just don't even buy the game for now. I wish I hadn't.
    • Braingoo, on 10/10/2007, -0/+1I bought on steam and its actually running just fine. go figure.
  • DAVIBE, on 10/10/2007, -12/+3THE GEEK SQUAD will have its revenge on you 2K games. Guerrila style!!!
  • rooftopsuicide, on 10/10/2007, -21/+2if you guys read the reply from 2K, they explain how it works. the headline is alarmist, and WRONG.
    you idiots always shoot first and ask questions later.
    • mrFREEZE, on 10/10/2007, -0/+1Read the ***** comments. If your copy of windows craps out or your hard drive crashes or your registry get corrupted, or your boot sector goes bad, etc, etc, etc, etc,

      Then you won't be able to officially uninstall and you'll still have an ACTIVE installation. If it happens again, you're *****. What happens when 5 years down the line 2K games goes out of business? Where will you call then?
      • rooftopsuicide, on 10/10/2007, -1/+0where will i call? ghostbusters. now, go back to talking ***** on XBL, and searching your daddy's closet for porn. i'm gonna go play with the grown ups now. please go DIAF.
        • magic6435, on 10/10/2007, -0/+1Way to not answer and make yourself look like an ass hole.
  • Janus67, on 10/10/2007, -22/+5Buried as innacurate. you can install it twice, as many times as you like, as long as you remember to uninstall it first. I don't see what th big dea is.
  • combustion8, on 10/10/2007, -4/+24Glad I decided to hold off on this one.
    • klank, on 10/10/2007, -0/+7Me too....I canceled my Pre-order a month and a half ago....What a good decision as I hate to support companies that do this crap to the consumers.
  • legion, on 10/10/2007, -19/+3I dont find this unreasonable and the title is inaccurate . Buried as inaccurate and for the retarded WTF in the title.
    • wageslaven, on 10/10/2007, -9/+2UPDATED:
      Elizabeth from 2K has repsonded on the forums, clarifying the copy protection issue. The key lies in uninstalling before you reinstall. Uninstalling registers the same as installing does, so if you do not perform an uninstall first SecuROM thinks you are just installing the game on different systems over and over again.
  • mbthompson, on 10/10/2007, -1/+10Great, so basically this is the same crap iTunes pulls by making you "de-activate" an account on your computer before you reformat your hard drive and install the OS again. You just hope and pray that you can actually get to iTunes in order to do such a measure before the format. I can't tell you how many times I've forgotten to do this only to find out I now have 4 of 5 machines activated etc. It's not a game killer, but it certainly wasn't a wise move either.
    • Drorel, on 10/10/2007, -0/+4Apple actually had the sense to make it so you can de-authorize all of your accounts at once in a more recent version of iTunes. I have run into the same problem that you describe and was quite glad when they added this feature.
      • FredFredrickson, on 10/10/2007, -0/+3You can only do that once a year, though...
    • chicaneuk, on 10/10/2007, -0/+1As drorel says, this is no biggie on iTunes.. i've authorised my max amount of devices before without thinking about it (formats, changing machines around, installing iTunes at work, etc) and you simply have the option to just nuke your auth'd machines and start again. It works fine and has never given me problems.

      This SecureROM ***** is something else :(
  • afairjudgement, on 10/10/2007, -20/+6Guys, this isn't true. This story is BS. I'm a moderator on the 2k Forum and I know for a fact it can be installed/activated as many times as you want. It's a matter of how often (how many times within a certain time period) you uninstall and activate it before it decides to lock you out.
    • digiguy, on 10/10/2007, -4/+0Where is my order? I pre-ordered a week ago
      • afairjudgement, on 10/10/2007, -0/+2lol ask the retailer you pre-ordered it from.
      • blaaguuu, on 10/10/2007, -0/+1You would only have it by now if you used 1 day shipping, silly. the game only came out yesterday.
      • slcsu, on 10/10/2007, -1/+0You don't deserve this game. Now go play in traffic.
    • blaaguuu, on 10/10/2007, -0/+3Yes, I understand that all the sensational reporting (ie "OMG< YOU CAN ONYL ISTALL TWICE, EVER!") is greatly exaggerated, and there are measure in place to make sure we can always install the game (atleast unless 2k goes bankrupt and their authentication servers go down), but this is mroe a matter of principle. The copy protection is unnecessarily strict, and will doubtlessly give many legitimate customers problems, while stopping no more pirates than some very basic copy protection. And there is simply the matter that when we purchase a game, we should not have to ask the publishers permission to use it every time we want to install. All of the digital entertainment mediums are trying to move towards a business model of "you don't own it, you are just licensing a right to use it", and that is just unacceptable.
    • WoollyMittens, on 10/10/2007, -0/+7Will your activation server be online in about 5 years? I heard this game was reviewed as a classic.
      • MrESaulved, on 10/10/2007, -0/+3A true Classic, Starcraft is still as strong as ever and Battle.net survives with only a serial key system: Install the game as many times as you like, but only one serial online at a time. However One serial key will seat 3 LAN players, two keys at least 6. Nice, eh?

        If Starcraft can thrive with such a system so many years later, Bioshock doesn't have a chance. Starcraft never pisses off its players with DRM, partly reason why they come back.
    • stotty, on 10/10/2007, -0/+4you sir, are a marketing tool
  • BluesFan, on 10/10/2007, -5/+4Well that is *****,before you know it you will only be able to play the game until you finish it then they will only let you play online for a price.
  • mkameli, on 10/10/2007, -3/+19So foolish. The more companies distrust their customers and lock down on them, the more likely the customers are to rebel and feel piracy is justified. Copy protection to an absurd degree like this only begets piracy. Why punish the masses of people who really want your product because of the criminal actions of a marginal few?
  • Fincher, on 10/10/2007, -11/+2This just doesn't make sense. As long as you uninstall any trace it left on your hard disk, you should be able to install it as many times as you like.
  • StriderNemesis, on 10/10/2007, -11/+6With all the reported bugs and crashes, and now this crap, I'm laughing at this:
    http://www.digg.com/pc_games/Review_PC_BioShock_Outshines_360_Version
  • treas, on 10/10/2007, -2/+13I'm probably going to break monitor or two because of this. But it won't be because SecuROM is limiting me to two installations. It will be because 5 years from now I probably won't be able to play the game. I enjoy playing Half-Life 9 years after it was released, and I hope I'll be able to say the same thing about BioShock.
  • yoritomo79, on 10/10/2007, -14/+2I expect the faux outrage to continue until the game is cracked. For now just make sure to uninstall the game if you want to install it on more than 2 machines.

    Poor pirates can't play bioshock yet.
  • camaroz06, on 10/10/2007, -16/+1Topic should be buried
  • DeFex, on 10/10/2007, -7/+4The game while looking quite cool is just more of the same old thing anyways.
  • enforcerpsu, on 10/10/2007, -2/+41And for the record...

    Most people I know format their drives without uninstalling everything. I have one friend who formatted his computer 7 friggin times last year. He's a moron for doing so, but he did it anyway. So yes, it happens and yes this would screw him over.

    Thanks for ruining this game, 2k.
    • OutThisLife, on 10/10/2007, -2/+3How's he a moron for that? I reformat 2 times a month, at minimum.
      • samssf, on 10/10/2007, -0/+1For what reason....?
      • method3, on 10/10/2007, -0/+3This is a perfectly acceptable practice, I know a few people who like to keep backups as ghosted images. Every time something goes awry, it's actually fairly fast getting thing up a running by just wiping it all and ghosting. Then they just get into the habit of doing it a once or twice a month because they like to tinker.
      • tomis, on 10/10/2007, -3/+1Or you could just get a Mac and avoid all the hassle...
        • dorkino, on 10/10/2007, -0/+2He's right. Because you can't do anything with a Mac anyway, so there's no point in reformatting it.
        • magic6435, on 10/10/2007, -0/+1Currently on a mac .... reformat about once a month..... what crack are you smoking.
  • smurf22, on 10/10/2007, -2/+5What about instals on steam?
    • Pr0v0st,