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Kiss Caught on Camera Raises Issues of Big Brother Surveillance

truthera.com — The dean of students said he saw two girls kissing. He checked the surveillance tape then shared what he saw with the parents of one of the girls. They then pulled her out of school, which then pulled the peninsula school district into a big controversy.

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  • TheShad0w, on 10/11/2007, -12/+118Isn't this something that the Nazi's were known to do? Spy on their people looking for anything they seemed a "fault"?
    • Jaymoon, on 10/11/2007, -39/+4Oh no! That means every casino surveillance team are Nazis!!
      • rattenmaus, on 10/11/2007, -0/+35Yesss, because surveillance in a public place and in a private business are absolutely the same thing.
        • DivisibleByZero, on 10/11/2007, -19/+2Oh no! That means the security guards at City Hall are Nazis!
      • richmessenger, on 10/11/2007, -0/+10you sir, are an a**hole
    • hambyrya, on 10/11/2007, -3/+39It isn't the camera's fault. It is the abuse of power by the principal.
    • DruSam, on 10/11/2007, -8/+51Godwin's Law in record time!
      • ThndrShk2k, on 10/11/2007, -7/+1At least we have not had Dogwin's Law yet. The chance of the discussion to halters.
      • Sharpezor, on 10/11/2007, -2/+1nobody was arguing anything..
        • soogy, on 10/11/2007, -0/+1Godwin's Law has nothing to do with arguments, you conversation Nazi.

          Ah, argumentum ad nazium at its finest.
    • ruley, on 10/11/2007, -11/+4Godwin's Law
      • psilanthropist, on 10/11/2007, -1/+1this isnt usenet anymore ? stop pretending the godwin's law is relevant.
      • psilanthropist, on 10/11/2007, -1/+1and since when did digg have rules anyways ?
    • spurtle, on 10/11/2007, -5/+5More of what the Communists did in Russia.
    • TheAkolyte, on 10/11/2007, -1/+14See when it happens in America it's "patriotic" but when it happens anywhere else its a bunch of godless towel heads with nothing better to do then ruin the perfect American life.
    • oxdeltaxo, on 10/11/2007, -5/+9There's nothing wrong with the camera's, they're there to record any wrong doings such as theft or violent crime. They are not there for an authority figure to enforce his personal values. In this case the person behind the camera is whats wrong with this picture, because he used it in a morally reprehensible way.
      • bonhoeffer, on 10/11/2007, -0/+0Who are you to judge the morality of how the person-behind-the-camera used it?
    • bIuebonics, on 10/11/2007, -6/+1wow, first comment too... :P
    • mdhauke, on 10/11/2007, -1/+3What the British are doing now
    • donelson, on 10/11/2007, -0/+1=
      =
      Ah! Amerika.
      =
      =-
    • bonhoeffer, on 10/11/2007, -0/+0No, NAZI's were not known to put camaras in public schools.
  • ahpro, on 10/11/2007, -17/+64So some homophobe seen them kissing and went and reported them and then they actually folowed this up. Its stupid, they should just do something about it if its a proper crime.

    Total idiots.

    And on that note, i'm going downstairs for a jam teacake. :-)
    • goodposter, on 10/11/2007, -4/+21why would anyone care if you are going to eat a jam tea cake?
      • SenorCardgage74, on 10/11/2007, -4/+24Was helpful to me. I'd never heard of a jam teacake before, and now I think I'd really like to try one. Dugg up for that.
    • underdog5004, on 10/11/2007, -25/+6Has it occured to anyone else that homophobe is one of the most misused words in the english language?
      Homophobe literally means "one who fears (the) same".
      Homosexualphobia means "the fear of (the) homosexual"

      When I say that I don't want to see two guys kissing, it's not because I'm afraid of them or their act of affection. It's because homosexual affection grosses me out, and I don't want to see it. Please don't call people who don't like homosexual acts "homophobes", because it's inaccurate, and almost starts to feel like a slur.
      • GenVoss, on 10/11/2007, -3/+12The whole point of this is not about homosexuality or homophobia, it is about "Big Brother" spying.
        • ArgusSmith, on 10/11/2007, -0/+14But would the dean of students have reported it if it were a guy and a girl kissing? People in high school, kissing? CRAZINESS, I SAY!
        • UnknownCzar, on 10/11/2007, -1/+11Argus is right. I don't think the school would have gone to the trouble of running over tapes and calling the parents of student if it was a hetero couple. they would literally need dozens of people on the job in that case.
      • gromnie, on 10/11/2007, -3/+15Guess what, underdog5004. You *are* a homophobe, and it *is* a slur.
        • bonhoeffer, on 10/11/2007, -0/+0Guess that makes you a homophobephobe. And that is a slur.
      • UnknownCzar, on 10/11/2007, -3/+3The reason you are grossed out is because your brain fears the different. its a natural instinct that helped stop us in our monkey years from eating a poisonous spider or frog we never saw before. So just like arachnophobia, this is still a fear.
      • ThndrShk2k, on 10/11/2007, -5/+2so being attracted to females is homophobia? Wow. I thought it was just because I'm not attracted to males because I personally find them ugly.
        Thank you internet.

        Note: Homophobia and disgust with homosexual actions are two different things. Phobia of such is long standing disgust that mingles with fear, or just fear itself. Either way it's an extreme reaction. Please next time before you decide to combine the two, remember: If i find a sandwhich that looks and tastes very digusting, am I afraid of it? Do I want to prevent it's creation?
    • tehpwnrate, on 10/11/2007, -11/+2Actually, he told their parents. They are high school students, not adults. The principal can tell the parents anything they do at school. It's the parents' jobs to be kind and considerate, not the principal or school officials.

      If anything, knowing my kids were at a school where surveillance catches stuff like this would make me feel better about the school. Now, if this were a college or a workplace, I would feel differently.
      • AxeSwinger, on 10/11/2007, -0/+4So lets just record our childen forever, to keep them safe of course. Never alone never have to worry about solitude or being alone in ones thoughts someones watching you anytime you leave the house.

        Kids, especially teenagers, experiment and do stupid stuff that no one needs to know about or needs to be reported to the parents. It's called growing up and trying to figure out your place in the world, they have to be able to socialize autonomously from the family. As long as no laws are being broken or getting hurt who cares. Plus if you're close with you teenager (I understand that's near to impossible) you don't have anything to worry about.

        This is just another intrusion into our lives that does not need to be there.
    • GliTCH82, on 10/11/2007, -1/+10Wow man if jam tea cake makes you happy enough to throw a smiley at the end of that, I sure as hell wanna try one.
  • hashaplenty, on 10/11/2007, -28/+19PICS or it didn't happen.
  • tallulah14, on 10/11/2007, -11/+65Frackin' homophobes.
  • purple99, on 10/11/2007, -11/+108Two highschool girls caught kissing on camera? You know that principal is keeping an extra copy of that tape for 'personal' use.
    • goodposter, on 10/11/2007, -4/+15I will be waiting for the youtube.
    • tektalk, on 10/11/2007, -0/+3Vids or it didn't happen.
    • bonhoeffer, on 10/11/2007, -0/+0Not that there's anything wrong with that.
  • felchdonkey, on 10/11/2007, -7/+92“I think that that’s fine if they’re doing something they shouldn’t be doing. The surveillance is fine,” said Heidi Holmes, a Gig Harbor parent.

    So is she saying that a girl kissing another girl = "something they shouldn't be doing?"

    Would this parent like to make a list of all the things that she'd like video copies of, in case her kids do any of them?

    • GMorgan, on 10/11/2007, -1/+32It comes back to the whole nanny state thing. The reason most things that are considered 'morally' wrong that are actually cultural preferences are banned is because parents want to be able to dictate what their kids do, even into adulthood. That's what it comes down to, parents don't like the fact there's a magical line over which they can no longer dictate so they get the state to do so instead.

      It's a morally bankrupt way of thinking yet it is a dominant line of thought. People don't care who they trample on provided that their way of thinking is imposed on others.
      • GliTCH82, on 10/11/2007, -0/+9That is a brilliant argument, and one I never considered. Dugg up.
    • HunterTV, on 10/11/2007, -2/+18"Would this parent like to make a list of all the things that she'd like video copies of, in case her kids do any of them?"

      Maybe we should put a camera in her bedroom, so when her husband is giving her that anal sex that's technically illegal in her state, she can be arrested. Or smoking the stash they found in their kid's room. ***** hypocrites. Parents haven't changed I see.
  • macaca, on 10/11/2007, -9/+141 "The man who trades freedom for security does not deserve nor will he ever receive either"..... Benjamin Franklin
    • Nateon, on 10/11/2007, -2/+19If only our politicians actually paid attention in history class.
    • s0u1man, on 10/11/2007, -4/+44"Stop misquoting me."
      -Benjamin Franklin
      • TheShad0w, on 10/11/2007, -6/+4Stop complaining about a misquote. The exact wording isn't the important part. Its the meaning and power behind them.
        • GliTCH82, on 10/11/2007, -1/+10What? So suddenly it's OK to misquote people and say things they never said as long as the message is to your liking?
        • LMaxey, on 10/11/2007, -0/+4Well duh when was the last time you watched the state of the union address?
    • bonhoeffer, on 10/11/2007, -2/+0The girl who trades kisses in public doesn't deserve privacy.
  • wildfire, on 10/11/2007, -7/+6The issue is why don't I have a direct link to the Big Brother surveillance network?
    • eazhar, on 10/11/2007, -4/+7you need to pay extra for that channel
    • weezel32, on 10/11/2007, -3/+1You do. It's called YouTube.
      • GliTCH82, on 10/11/2007, -0/+2Really? Well I guess we need more of these Big Brother networks then.
  • Battleloser, on 10/11/2007, -42/+4For all we know this was a christian private school were they wouldn't let a boy and a girl get away with something like this.

    People have a right to raise their kids how they like. I may disagree with some of their beliefs, but I applaud the parents for taking action.
    • Me1on, on 10/11/2007, -2/+23Gig Harbor High School is a public school: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gig_Harbor_High_School
    • wildfire, on 10/11/2007, -8/+1Depends, as the article says:

      "They then pulled her out of school, which then pulled the peninsula school district into a big controversy."

      "They" being the parents or the school or both? It's ambiguous as to the actual situation. The school could have kicked her out after showing the parents, but who knows.
      • crugg, on 10/11/2007, -1/+7It clearly states that the parents pulled her out of school. "They" referring to the parents. This is stupid why should the taxpayers have to pay for this kind of crap anyway. If it was not a safety issue then what was it shown to the parents for? Also the superintendent now says, “We obviously made a mistake,”. Well that may have cost the student that left, high school career.
    • rattenmaus, on 10/11/2007, -3/+23And kids should have a right to be homosexual and to be not discriminated because of it. :p
    • kroenecker, on 10/11/2007, -2/+10Wrong. Forcing your world view on a minor is wrong. Sure it happens all the time and is a large part of what "parenting" is, but that doesn't make it proper. Teaching your child how to make their own decisions is the only way to go. Here we go, falling down the slippery slope as people decide that surveillance cameras aren't simply for preventing crime. If enough of these backwoods retards take over, we're screwed.
    • GMorgan, on 10/11/2007, -4/+8"People have a right to raise their kids how they like."

      No actually they don't. They at best hold the kids life in trust. They do not have the right to enforce beliefs on them. If they cannot accept this basic premise then they shouldn't have kids since they clearly aren't mature enough to handle them.
      • Tabris, on 10/11/2007, -3/+3Except enforcing their beliefs is part of raising them. Until the children are 16/18 depending on the state, the parents have every right to bestow their beliefs on them. Hell, raising your child in your beliefs is what parenting IS.
    • Battleloser, on 10/11/2007, -1/+1Hippies, I laugh at you!
    • kobewan0824, on 10/11/2007, -5/+0i agree. i have an infant daughter. if i found out she was making out with girls in school one day, id be *****. id certainly want to know what was going on. not that im a homophobe, but i certainly wont encourage my kids 2 be gay.
      • ben_nushmut, on 10/11/2007, -2/+1Don't kid yourself. That makes you a homophobe. Wake up and realize that we live in a new era where so-called "alternative" lifestyles are acceptable in our society. Remember, if freedoms like this are taken away, the terrorists will win.
  • VocalFX, on 10/11/2007, -10/+2Nice!
  • Arbus, on 10/11/2007, -2/+55Surveillance in public places isn't necessarily a bad thing, but the recordings shouldn't be looked at by anyone unless a crime is reported; at which point the recording can be reviewed for evidence related to that crime. They should be automatically deleted after a week.
    This story is pretty sad. That principal should be fired and never allowed to work in a school again.
    • thall, on 10/11/2007, -4/+4"That principal should be fired and never allowed to work in a school again."
      Ouch....seems a little extreme for this case. How about just place extra supervision over him for a year to make sure he doesn't abuse the CCTV?
      • Arbus, on 10/11/2007, -0/+4That seems far too reasonable for digg!
    • vap0r, on 10/11/2007, -0/+9Yeah like maybe hire a guy to watch the principal on CCTV, to make sure he doesn't abuse the CCTV...
    • jm1234567890, on 10/11/2007, -2/+2But it was reported that the 2 girls were kissing.

      I'm not saying this is a crime, but the tape wasn't just looked at for no reason.
    • kobewan0824, on 10/11/2007, -2/+0yea the guy doesnty deserve to have his life ruined. jesus ***** christ man. u ***** hippie liberals are pretty damn ***** up. always calling for people 2 be killed or put out of a job. one day ur gonna do something people wont like, and i wont be calling for ur job. but ur hippie liberal pals will be
    • Wacer, on 10/11/2007, -0/+2That is how it's where I work. I have access to the area the records the data but nobody ever looks at it unless there is a reason to such as a crime.
  • gannondork, on 10/11/2007, -7/+1I wanna youtube link damnit.
  • Jennifurret, on 10/11/2007, -6/+48What crap. I'm sure the principal isn't snitching on every heterosexual couple that kisses in school.
    • xile, on 10/11/2007, -0/+1Actually, they're pretty conservative on heterosexual PDAs too. --2006 Gig Harbor HS grad

      Oh, and cell phones. Not even supposed to have them at school. I had to run off school grounds to answer a search and rescue call (I do volunteer SAR for Pierce County).
  • otep, on 10/11/2007, -4/+28

    ......Bigotry emerges with a new head, & its got a zoom lens.

    .
  • zephc, on 10/11/2007, -5/+58"The dean of students said he saw two girls kissing. He checked the surveillance tape then shared what he saw with the parents of one of the girls after he finished beating off...."
    • xile, on 10/11/2007, -0/+2He's Mormon. I don't think he knows he has a penis.
  • KillerKitten, on 10/11/2007, -3/+8why have people been freaking out over teenage girls kissing lately? it seems to be a pattern nowadays
    • Chyeld, on 10/11/2007, -0/+4For the same reason they got in a huff over it 50 years ago, and 100 years ago, and a hundred years before that.

      [sarcasm]Young women are sexless innocents, who only explore the seedy dark side of sexuality when tempted by nasty, evil, horrible, hormone driven men. Of whom, the men's only desire is to defile and destroy all that is pure.

      Obviously if two young women were to be curious and experimenting with themselves, this facade of ***** would be destroyed. As sex is inherently bad, evil, and worse than unsafe drug use, serial murders, and racism, this must not happen. Women must be kept pure till they are shielded from evil by being married to an upright, GOOD and HONORABLE man. One who can properly instruct his new wife in the sacrament of marriage and the joys of self-denial.[/sarcasm]
  • Threlly, on 10/11/2007, -11/+5I Know...
    Lets ALL become Muslim, there you go, no CCTV required ha ha ha
    • GliTCH82, on 10/11/2007, -0/+2"Eat ***** and die" - this Muslim

      I think this Dean is a douche, and really had no business calling anyone's parents unless an actual crime was committed.
  • biotch, on 10/11/2007, -4/+40It seems we should be rewarding people for acts of love and kindness rather than causing a huge uproar and making it a miserable experience for the youngsters
  • pixelwerx, on 10/11/2007, -5/+62Two girls kissing on camera? Go on....
  • docsimmons, on 10/11/2007, -12/+4so where is the pic?
  • kevintozer, on 10/11/2007, -12/+5pics or it didn't happen..
  • DivisibleByZero, on 10/11/2007, -8/+14I think the first line of the article summed up the "big brother" issues nicely: "Surveillance cameras in schools are meant to keep children safe and in-line"

    If two girls kissing each other is considered "out of line", the security cameras served their functionality.

    Now, I don't think it's the public schools place to decide that sort of thing, unless they're going to ban all students kissing. At a private school, I'd be OK with it.

    But the thing is, the security cameras are irrelevant in this story. If they had kissed in view of the dean, he undoubtedly would have done the same thing.
    • Tonamel, on 10/11/2007, -1/+5My high school did indeed have rules against 'public displays of affection.' I hope that's all this is about.
  • yoda17, on 10/11/2007, -2/+14PDA was quite prohibited at my school also.
    • Tabris, on 10/11/2007, -5/+1IF YOU WANT SOME PDA, I'LL GIVE YOU SOME PDA! WOO, BABY!
  • odst117, on 10/11/2007, -6/+5That's ***** up
  • HallEffected, on 10/11/2007, -3/+30I was going to this school when it happened. The dean (keith nelson) is a huge dick and mormon. he was just helping out his mormon church friends who asked him if anything fishy was going on with their daughter. You can view a blog fundamentalist parents put up after the incident here: savekeithnelson.wordpress.com/ (it does require login now after all the vandelism from the GHHS's students. haha. BTW, this happened months ago. Old news.
    • AxeSwinger, on 10/11/2007, -0/+3So does the school have a policy against kissing and public displays of affection?
      • xile, on 10/11/2007, -0/+2Sure does. I've been warned for hugging. --2006 GHHS grad
  • veeshy, on 10/11/2007, -4/+18link to video?
  • Melf26, on 10/11/2007, -5/+3" “We obviously made a mistake,” Superintendent Terry Bouck said."
    "This is a debate that is not likely to end with the superintendent saying they made a mistake."

    wtf?
    • spectre_25gt, on 10/11/2007, -0/+1I was confused by that too, at first. I think they meant that there's more to come. Him saying they made a mistake wasn't enough.
  • easy4lif, on 10/11/2007, -17/+4my guess is they have a zero tolerance policy against any kind of touching (which they normally don't enforce). the girl got caught kissing another girl and got suspended. parents came in all ***** thinking she was suspended for kissing a boy, principal pulled video showing why he suspended her, parents pull her from school to stop lesbian affair.


    I can understand the parents pulling the girl from school. like it or not, there's still a stigma for being homosexual in this country & that stigma can negatively effect the rest of her life.


    as for the camera's use, grey area, it definitely caught someone doing something they shouldn't be doing on my dime. i say my dime because I'm a taxpayer and I want kids (all kids) to go to school and get an education not kissing in hall ways. do what ever you want on your time, when your in school go to class
    • CrimsonBlur, on 10/11/2007, -2/+6Except you are completely and utter wrong, sorry. I know exactly what happened. This guy knew the parents of one of the girls, they were in the same church. This guy took the footage and showed it to the parents of one of the girls. Then parents then pulled her out of school. And the rest is history...
      • easy4lif, on 10/11/2007, -9/+2right or wrong the girl is a minor, if he had let this go, he would be held libel if anything bad happened to her as a result of this relationship. this is a "im gonna sue you" country, and people would have sued the school ditrict / county for allowing or permitting this to go on in public schools eventually costing millions to defend against. Trust me, I work for a local school district in socal and we document eveything when an incident on our school happens incase of a lawsuit


        believe it or not, not everyone is cool with lesbians or gays in our society
        • rationalist, on 10/11/2007, -0/+4"he would be held libel if anything bad happened"
          "I work for a local school district in socal"

          Clearly, basic English comprehension and spelling are not requirements for working your school district.

          "believe it or not, not everyone is cool with lesbians or gays in our society"

          Believe it or not, the US Constitution doesn't give a ***** if you are "cool" with it or not.

        • LMaxey, on 10/11/2007, -0/+3Bravo rationalist very well said
          And I'm kind of curious what sort of bad things as a result of this relationship easy4lif has in mind
          Like...Gay Marriage?! It's High School who gives a *****
    • kinseyincanada, on 10/11/2007, -0/+1its was probably at recess or maybe lunch......so i say hurray for lesbians
  • mr1337, on 10/11/2007, -9/+3Video or it didn't happen.
  • CrimsonBlur, on 10/11/2007, -4/+20I went to this high school. If this had happened when I went to school, it would have been an absolutely huge issue. It was a controversy in Gig Harbor, but only a few students joined the other girl in protest outside the school. That is such utter *****, a majority of the student body should have felt obligated to walk out, and I know when I was going to school there, we would have, no doubt about it.

    It's sad how badly these conservative Christian, power-drunk, overbearing parents have damaged communities across the country. This mentality has become so commonplace and accepted that kids today don't even really see any reason to do anything about it. It's helped along by the current administration eroding our freedoms every chance they get and blatantly pushing conservative Christian values, something that should never be tolerated in this country. Separation of Church and State, anyone?

    The surveillance is a tough issue, and the only circumstance under which it is acceptable is if it is used only as a means to catch students committing illegal acts. Anything beyond that is totally inappropriate for the school to be trying to control through these cameras. The worst part is, the school district didn't even fire this guy! They just transferred him! Are you ***** kidding me? This guy should be fired and never allowed to work in any school district ever again. Absolutely asinine, and the Peninsula School District and parents with children still in the Peninsula School District that are letting this fly should be ashamed of themselves.
    • aukxsona, on 10/11/2007, -1/+4Dear we are a different generation than this one. I know in my school they would have had a literal riot, complete with burning desks and gangs. Of course, I went to a North East school where kids knew how to make some noise and parents were ok with being gay...most any way.

      My concern is that EVERY facet of public life is overtly Christian. I have children...(I am only a Gen Xer and just barely) but I can not send them to public school because of the disgusting over tones of Christianity and hyper invasion I see. They pop drug tests on kids with out permission from parents ... at the drop of a hat. They do psych evals, and make demands of Ritalin if your kids doesn't sit like a good little zombie. Not to mention my children are not allowed to say the pledge, yet any child that doesn't is picked on. They have Christmas break and Easter break...not Winter break and spring break. So I have to pay money for a school system my children can't even use. I home school and pay taxes so "THEY" can have a brand new high school for their kids while I pay 1000 dollars in books a year for my kids. They do not offer any support what so ever even though I have to pay taxes.

      That is the choice, be a part of the crowd or pay your own way. Most people don't want to take on the huge responsibility of teaching their children to avoid this crap.
      • thegreathal, on 10/11/2007, -2/+1I am this generation just graduating, and it wasn't me. Somewhere along the line, these adults and this passive society, someone sold out. Because I would always flip out for this indecent harassment, and anyone who wouldn't is damning everyone else as well as themselves.
      • kuzotz, on 10/11/2007, -0/+4Its been over a year since I've graduated. I didn't go through the crap public system. I ended up in a charter school that was ran on a Turkish curriculum in highschool(got me completely ready for college).. The problem with my generation really only lies within White Americans that are in my generation the current youth. I'm an African American, and I come from a working class family. Our neighborhood wasn't middle class, but dammit we fought to make sure gangs stayed the ***** out. Anyway seeing that white americans make up the overwhelmingly majority of this country. One thing I have come to notice is that they are very afraid of confrontation. The middle class anyway. I didn't realise this until my first year in University. My god a girl freaked when she cut in front of m in line, and I had something to say about it. Of course they weren't afraid to try and talk crap to you when they were in some small form of power. such as working behind a counter. Having a say on rather to refund me or not. You see they're mostly self-centered, and the same goes for African Americans my age.. We're just as self centered, but we aren't afraid of confrontation though we purposely choose to not act out our aggressions. That's just the middle class for you. You see America is very racist, but classism is overwhelmingly a big deal int he US.. Its to the point where one class doesn't want to rub shoulders with the others. In Europe as you know. This is just impossible you must rub shoulders with each other no matter what. This causes everyone to separate themselves from others. Thus the fears and xenophobia creeps in. The Christian overtones is just a catalyst towards this hysteria. The current youth 18-25 will not be the ones who will be the sheeple. It will be the ones that were born between 1994-present Those of us born during the 1980s-1993.. Well we're that transitional generation where some people will fall in line, but an overwhelmingly majority of us will be ***** at the younger generation for being such pushovers.
      • thall, on 10/11/2007, -2/+1I think the over tones you describe vary greatly depending on where in the continent you're talking about, and I've always viewed public school as anti-Christian, actually more atheist based these days. Some Christians are left-wing socialists, which I think is what you're describing (have the schools do the teaching AND parenting). But other Christians are right-wing individualists and would quickly transfer their kids to a private school if their public school started doing surprise drug tests and recommending Ritalin.
        • rationalist, on 10/11/2007, -0/+2"Some Christians are left-wing socialists, which I think is what you're describing (have the schools do the teaching AND parenting). But other Christians are right-wing individualists and would quickly transfer their kids to a private school if their public school started doing surprise drug tests and recommending Ritalin."

          Wow - reverse spin worthy of Rove himself. Of course, it is right-wing fundamentalists who believe in government intrusion into private lives, men deciding what women can or cannot do with their own bodies, and limited civil liberties for "law and order", and it is civil libertarians on the left who oppose government intrusion into private matters and support freedom of speech, expression and individual choice.

          It is remarkable how Orwellian your comment is.
          War is Peace, Freedom is Slavery, Ignorance is Strength.
  • MrCrumbles, on 10/11/2007, -9/+12Maybe this kind of surveillance is a positive thing, if we can catch these girls in the act and, umm, discourage them. We could also use this footage to build a browseable archive so that people will know what this behavior looks like when it happens so they can stop it.
    • Arbus, on 10/11/2007, -2/+5Yes, I think this is a good idea! When these dastardly rulebreakers are apprehended, they could be punished by spankings, which would be administered by their peers. The videos of these punishments would also be added to this database to discourage further affronts to our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ, blessed be his name.
    • shortidancer, on 10/11/2007, -2/+0I really hope you're kidding.
      Why would you want to discourage affection? If she was kissing a boy, would it be just as bad? Is that something we should discourage too?
      This world needs more affection anyways.
    • Mfok, on 10/11/2007, -4/+0"and, umm, discourage them" um... why?
      "so they can stop it." Also.. um.. why?

      Seems to me like you're trying to forcefully impose your anti-homosexual views onto others...

      Besides, freak, Europeans kiss each other all time, we really need to get out more.
  • Suplyndmnd, on 10/11/2007, -4/+2*sigh* Am I the only one who was thinking "Wow, Kiss was caught on camera doing something bad?" and thought of the band?
  • ThatGirlTasha, on 10/11/2007, -3/+1"The dean of students said he saw two girls kissing. He checked the surveillance tape. . . " His office surveillance tape of this time period appears to be missing.
  • CrimsonBlur, on 10/11/2007, -3/+15OK, I keep seeing comments here that make no sense. Obviously people are not aware of exactly what happened here. The security cameras caught these two girls kissing. Then this guy shows the footage to the parents of one of the girls. He shows them because they are both part of the same conservative Christian church, and being homosexual is a sin *gasp*. So he goes directly to the parents and shows them the tape, and the parents pull the girl out of school.

    Despite his despicable actions (borderline illegal, if you ask me), he wasn't fired, simply transferred to another job in the district. They should have immediately fired his ass, and that's the least the district should have done about this blatant misuse of district resources.
    • easy4lif, on 10/11/2007, -8/+2so you want to dictate what others can believe in

      good comrade good.
      • CrimsonBlur, on 10/11/2007, -0/+8No, what the hell are you talking about? My point is that this guy had absolutely no business taking the footage and showing it to anyone if there wasn't anything illegal going on. Do you really think if it was a guy and girl kissing this would happen? Hell no, those cameras catch people making out every day, I garuntee it. This guy completely crossed the line, specifically because he believed it is wrong to be homosexual, and he knew the parents would also object. He grossly misused his position at the school, this is not what these cameras are for.
      • rationalist, on 10/11/2007, -2/+3On the contrary, this is about authoritarian inhibition of freedom of expression.
        Ironic how all you "freedum luvers" turn authoritarian when it comes to other people's freedoms.
      • Mfok, on 10/11/2007, -0/+2What the hell are you talking about?! No, HE'S trying "to dictate what others can believe". As a superintendent, its completely out of question for him to use his powers to help a religious friend privately, especially when its regarding the privacy of others. I don't care. Maybe some schools prohibit PDA, but that wasn't the case. The case was that asshat squealed on the girl because his mormon friend asked him to.
    • shortidancer, on 10/11/2007, -2/+0He was mormon. Not Christian.
      • CrimsonBlur, on 10/11/2007, -0/+1Mormons are Christians. Look it up if you don't believe me.
        • ThatGirlTasha, on 10/11/2007, -0/+2I'll never understand how people can think Mormons aren't Christians--Mormon is a nickname- the church is called The Church of Jesus Christ of Ladder Day Saints;LDS- I don't know what this guys problem was, I grew up Mormon and I can tell you, Joseph Smith never had a problem with two girls kissing.
          • sabach, on 10/11/2007, -0/+1Latter, it's Latter. You didn't grow up Mormon, dickhead.
    • arjie, on 10/11/2007, -1/+1Wait, where's the homosexual part? I thought you said they were kissing.
  • ArgusSmith, on 10/11/2007, -2/+3"The Holmes said surveillance cameras are a way of life. Helping prevent crime, identifying suspects and just giving folks a sense of security knowing the cameras are always watching."

    >_< I, for one, don't feel secure knowing cameras are watching my every move.
  • audioslavery, on 10/11/2007, -5/+2Did anyone else digg this to see the pics?
  • maiku00, on 10/11/2007, -4/+14POLICE STATE
    • easy4lif, on 10/11/2007, -5/+2hey you want to complain to someone, complain to all the other kids that went before you that made it this way. all the school shootings, gangs, drugs, fights, lawsuits. all that made the schools the way they are, it didn't happen over nite
      • LMaxey, on 10/11/2007, -0/+1Your right but why was he watching this tape? If a camera or laptop or iPod was stolen or there was a fight then it would be perfectly logical to check the tapes. He just an old man that's a little full of himself.
  • AaronMan24, on 10/11/2007, -3/+1"I want to rock and roll all night and party every day."
  • crzdmn, on 10/11/2007, -1/+4Yah.... "The Holmes said surveillance cameras are a way of life." who's life, they sure as hell aren't in mine, I hate cameras, I hate surveillance and I hate privacy invasion.

    These days the only privacy you can get is in the woods and even that isn't private at times.
    • stearic, on 10/11/2007, -0/+0If you live in the UK it's a way of life, but fortunately we don't live there. This is the USA and not a police state, yet anyways. No clue what they are talking about as them being a way of life. At work maybe, in certain places where security is needed/required. But as for an everyday thing, i think not.
  • Almadiel, on 10/11/2007, -5/+4Schools were never private places to begin with. At the risk of sounding cliche, get a room. Otherwise expect that someone might be watching, and the school has every right to set rules on its own property.
    • Mfok, on 10/11/2007, -0/+0True. But I don't see anywhere it stating that the school prohibits PDA or homosexuality. This isn't about the school's rules. Its about that superintendent using his government issued powers for helping his friend when he shouldn't have.
  • warispeace21, on 10/11/2007, -1/+3What's next? Cameras in the dorm rooms?
  • Smegzor, on 10/11/2007, -3/+10What a gay use of technology.
  • Flashman, on 10/11/2007, -1/+9'“I think that that’s fine if they’re doing something they shouldn’t be doing. The surveillance is fine,” said Heidi Holmes, a Gig Harbor parent.'

    Sweet - I think we just got permission to follow the Holmes kid around with a video camera. It's for their own safety.
  • penguinshome, on 10/11/2007, -2/+1www.duggmirror.com
  • MrCrumbles, on 10/11/2007, -2/+7What would Jesus do if he caught two girls making out on camera? My Jesus would probably be cool with it.
  • localzuk, on 10/11/2007, -0/+12In the UK we have something called the 'Data Protection Act'. This outlines that using CCTV can only be used for predefined and reasonable things, combined with the Human Rights Act (which outlines the right to privacy) this means CCTV can only be used for the prevention and detection of crime and for reasonable management of a school (so, seeing which parts of the school are a major blocking point in fire drills etc...).

    So, this action would have been completely illegal, and it would also have been illegal for the parents to pull the kid from that school due to it - as she would have been able to take her own parents to court...
    • felchdonkey, on 10/11/2007, -0/+7Yes, well, in the US we're working on turning this country into a "faith-based" nation, you know, kind of like Saudi Arabia or Taliban-controlled Afghanistan, but with Mormons and Christians instead of Muslims.

      Ironic that we broke away from Great Britain to secure our freedoms, then a couple centuries later, we're giving them up as the UK gains more and more of their own.
    • CrimsonBlur, on 10/11/2007, -0/+4This is exactly the kind of legislation that should exist in the US. I'm not fond of the thought of having cameras all over the place, and I have to say I have a problem with how extensively this system is being used in the UK. However, as longs as laws like the one you state are actually being enforced, then at least the system is being used sensibly. Of course it only takes a few minor changes to the laws some time in the future to catapult you in the a "1984" type situation, which is why I hate the idea of cameras in public places and do not think it's a good idea at all.
      • thall, on 10/11/2007, -0/+3Big brother is only a good thing if he's truly looking out for you and not for himself. Until the greed and lust for power these days dies off, I'd rather not have any big brother.
    • Mfok, on 10/11/2007, -0/+0As much as I dislike the ideas of camera's in the first place, those Acts sound like something that really should be in place in one of the world's biggest superpowers...
    • kobewan0824, on 10/11/2007, -1/+0the human rights act is *****. people dont have the right 2 live if they cant afford it. ***** em
      • localzuk, on 10/11/2007, -0/+1Huh? I would recommend that you have a read of the Human Rights Act. It is nearly entirely based on the European Convention on Human Rights. The convention states 'Everyone's right to life shall be protected by law. No one shall be deprived of his life intentionally save in the execution of a sentence of a court following his conviction of a crime for which this penalty is provided by law.' and the UK Act states '(1) In this Act "the Convention rights" means the rights and fundamental freedoms set out in-
        (a) Articles 2 to 12 and 14 of the Convention,
        (b) Articles 1 to 3 of the First Protocol, and
        (c) Articles 1 and 2 of the Sixth Protocol,'

        And breaking those articles is a crime...

        If you mean people shouldn't have the right to live if they can't afford it, then you are possibly the biggest asshole I have met on this site, or indeed, I have had the misfortune to communicate with.
  • TheTaoOfBill, on 10/11/2007, -3/+6All these homophobes in the news are acting like a bunch of faggots.
  • napsack, on 10/11/2007, -5/+2Who else thought this article was about the rockband Kiss?
    • Mfok, on 10/11/2007, -0/+0Sadly, yes.
    • AnarchyReigns, on 10/11/2007, -0/+0That was my first impression too. Does that say something about my personality or what?
  • felchdonkey, on 10/11/2007, -0/+3Here's a gallery of the whitest protesters you've ever seen, supporting the dean, Keith Nelson: http://picasaweb.google.com/SaveKeithNelson/DemonstrationSchoolBoardMeeting
  • funkychesta, on 10/11/2007, -3/+1pics or it didnt happen
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