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couragewulfSep 27, 2010
Drove down to San Felipe awhile back and had Federalies waiving machineguns in my face and s**t asking if I had "Drugas." Why would I bring drugs IN to Mexico? I'm here for your hookers bro, gtfo.
No I didn't say that, I actually almost shat myself. Won't drive across the border again.
cuishi14Sep 28, 2010
And we wonder why so many mexicans dont want to live in that region
card51shortSep 28, 2010
they should fight for their country instead of running away.
luv2luvSep 27, 2010
They're all bank robbers, drug dealers, and wall-street crooks probably
meetjoewhiteSep 27, 2010
I'd love to go hide out on a beach in mexico, because honestly that is what these people are doing. They leave and the leech, Mexicans come to America and work hard.Comment is buried, click here to see the rest.
immatellyouwhatSep 28, 2010
Haha you obviously don't live in a border town. Yes some mexicans come over here to El Paso, TX to work in general construction but a lot of them live off the system here. My friend is an RN at a hospital here and one of his patients told him she loved having babies because of all the free medicaid and benefits she gets just for having 5+ kids and no job. I don't mind people who come here to work and become legal, but it's all the moochers that are wasting our system. I've seen it myself and lived with it in this city so it's not heresy.
cuishi14Sep 28, 2010
Its not becoming legal thats going on. it supporting a family, The majority of mexicans coming across are the ones you see at Home Depot. trying to make a living however they can.
YOUVE obviously never lived in arizona during the housing boom. s**t everyone hired illegals and underpaid them. My stepfather works his ass off anytime someone will let him build a house and they dont pay him s**t
timbuc1Sep 27, 2010
We've come for the cheap beer and cheap women
cranelakeSep 28, 2010
I'd build a fence to keep those wetback Yankie social security scroungers out...
NWPAGuySep 28, 2010
I'm guessing there are at least 500 illegal Mexicans in America for every 1 illegal American in Mexico.
chrisvazquez1Sep 28, 2010
Insert: [citation]
robbh66Sep 28, 2010
Google "Guess"
wf80diditSep 28, 2010
Maybe 500,000 : 1
markglSep 28, 2010
s**t, it's higher than that!
w0lfcakeSep 28, 2010
Prison break.
amishmackSep 28, 2010
Kenny Powers!
sandersdamnitSep 28, 2010
Steve the c**k-fighter.
Closed AccountSep 28, 2010
stop it! americans can live where ever they want! that is a perk of being american... we can do no wrong! we are the conquerers... i mean protectors of the worldComment is buried, click here to see the rest.
atomheartmotherSep 28, 2010
FTA: "Many Americans, like Barbara Rudd, find Mexico appealing as a retirement option, with its warm climate, rich culinary tradition and affordable property. A smaller number come for work or vacation and decide to stick around. And still others fall in love and eventually end up marrying and remaining in the country."
In other words, US citizens in Mexico are spending money and contributing to the Mexican economy rather than gobbling up public services. Thanks for clarifying.
al3efromanSep 28, 2010
Yes, those are other words, but they don't say the same thing. This statement just says that Americans living illegally in Mexico eat and live there. The same is true of Mexicans living illegally in the United States. The fact is, people eat and pay rent/mortgages regardless of what country they're in. The rest is your commentary, not the obvious meaning of the words you have needlessly chosen to "clarify".
Be intellectually honest and hold Americans to the same standards with respect to the immigration laws of sovereign countries that we expect from others. Anything else is a shade of hypocrisy, is it not?Comment is buried, click here to see the rest.
atomheartmotherSep 28, 2010
No one's disputing that aliens inhabiting any country eat and pay for housing- that's pretty obvious. The point you're either missing (or intentionally omitting) is the reality that there are large drains on public resources and funds from Mexican illegals here in the US, and there's no indication the reverse is true with regard to Americans in Mexico- in fact there's reason to conclude the exact opposite.
In terms of immigration lawbreaking, yes it's wrong here and it's wrong there. I think most Americans would agree this minute to a deal wherin illegal Americans in Mexico come home in return for all illegal Mexicans in this country returning to Mexico. Think that'd be Mexico's stance as well?
al3efromanSep 28, 2010
But these points are not evident in the quote you re-phrased. You have debatable points, you're just linking them to the wrong article and seemingly bringing them up to fit some agenda. My issue is your use of the term "in other words". Make your own argument and stand by its merits, don't twist someone else's.Comment is buried, click here to see the rest.
frankoceanSep 28, 2010
Actually atom, has a public official in a state where more americans live that any other state in Mexico (around 50 k) americans do take many public services that if we were rigurist they dont qualified to.
Case in hand.
Seguro Popular, or Popular Insurance.
A public option in health services that protects you and family members (for free) for about 97% of common illness and really heavy ones like cancer (breast, uterus, leuchemia, prostate) AIDS, full treatment, full medicines, with top of the art facilities.
As a deputy in my city of the program, I can assure that many americans, white, black, latino, come into my office asking me to get them into the program
I do it, everysingle time.
We mexicans, are not douchebags after all.Comment is buried, click here to see the rest.
atomheartmotherSep 28, 2010
al3: "But these points are not evident in the quote you re-phrased."
Because they're largely agreed-upon, and not in debate. And really, it's the article itself which is attempting to further an agenda, and doing so based upon analogies which don't hold muster. It's valid to point out that the comparison isn't apples vs apples, and it's also perfectly legitimate to challenge it based upon the claims being made.
@frank, no one's suggesting that Mexicans are douchebags, just that the comparison of US citizens living in Mexico versus the huge illegal problem we have here in the states isn't an apt one.
al3efromanSep 28, 2010
" it's also perfectly legitimate to challenge it based upon the claims being made." I wholeheartedly agree, but you chose to do it by twisting a quote, rather than make your own, independent statement. Responding with a well reasoned counter-argument is a far more valuable and nuanced endeavor, like your most recent comment.
Now, onto the "largely agreed upon" part. This strikes me as a conveniently vague turn of phrase. Where is your quantitative support for this statement? Am I right in understanding that you are saying is agreed upon that Mexican immigrants don't contribute to the US economy? Do you mean, don't spend (as much) cash? All day long I see Mexican immigrants working their butts off and contributing to the economy. Don't confuse disposable income with economic contribution. The gentleman who mows my neighbors lawn is not only contributing to the economy by selling services (crucial to any economy). He also drives a Ford and tows a trailer with his lawnmowers and equipment. I will assume he didn't steal all of these things and actually contributed to the economy when he purchased them. The same goes for the gas he buys to power them. Does this not count, for some reason?
atomheartmotherSep 28, 2010
al3: "...but you chose to do it by twisting a quote, rather than make your own, independent statement."
Sorry, but that's not correct; I quoted a sentence which illustrated that the comparison the writer was trying to make really isn't a valid one. That isn't "twisting" anything.
"Am I right in understanding that you are saying is agreed upon that Mexican immigrants don't contribute to the US economy?"
No you're not correct at all, as I was referring to your statement about the fact that immigrants (and everyone else for that matter) tend to "eat and pay rent." And if you don't think that illegal immigrants as a whole (though many do contribute to the economy) don't cost taxpayers a boatload of money then you're sadly mistaken about that as well. Your example of the hardworking neighbor's lawn man aside, "A study done by the Federation for American Immigration Reform (FAIR) found the cost of illegal immigrants in California to amount to $10.5 billion annually. This figure includes the cost of incarceration, health care, and education of illegal immigrants."
http://www.usimmigrationsupport.org/california-...
That's 10 billion with a "b" and that's just one state.
al3efromanSep 28, 2010
"I quoted a sentence which illustrated that the comparison the writer was trying to make really isn't a valid one. That isn't "twisting" anything." Yes you quoted, and then you twisted using the term "in other words" to bridge between the two thoughts. It's intellectually lazy, but you seem to have moved on to more concrete, actual arguments.
I apologize, I took your original comment to mean that Mexicans in the US do not contribute to the economy, as you brought up the comparison with American's in Mexico. I now see that I was mistaken and that it is simply that you are comparing apples to oranges. You are arguing that American immigrants to Mexico contribute to the economy while arguing that Mexican immigrants to the US eat public resources. Nowhere do you provide any insightful comparison between the costs of Americans in Mexico or the economic contributions of Mexicans in America. These are not analogous data points. I'm certainly not arguing that there is likely not a disparity, but your comparison, at best means that the gap is artificially inflated, at worst it means absolutely nothing, as it lacks meaningful comparators. You have grossly oversimplified the complexity of the comparison as you have gone and compared two disparate points of data.
I would challenge you to quantify the comparative economic contributions or costs of each group, but that is a fools errand. Businesses don't, as a rule, report their undocumented workers so it somewhere between a herculean effort and impossible to put an accurate value on their contribution. Again, you may have a point, but you are choosing a line of reasoning that can provide no definitive proof of the validity of your opinion. I'm not saying that it disproves it either, but I'm not the one spouting on about "largely agreed upon" facts. I can only speak from my personal experiences as a citizen of a border state.
Also, your dead link is less than impressive supporting evidence. Did you mean http://www.usimmigrationsupport.org/california-immigration.html ?
atomheartmotherSep 28, 2010
"Yes you quoted, and then you twisted using the term "in other words" to
But it wasn't "two thoughts" at all, it was simply the original point which was at odds with the article's premise. It's really not a difficult concept- reflect a bit.
"Nowhere do you provide any insightful comparison between the costs of Americans in Mexico or the economic contributions of Mexicans in America."
Well despite the fact that the link I provided was dead, you proved adept enough correctly link to it. Nonetheless, I notice you didn't address the information it provided- that illegals in CA alone cost the state over $10 billion in taxpayer funds alone. There are other credible studies which show the drain on the US economy as well if you'd like them, but strangely I can find no similar data which indicates that US citizens in Mexico are causing any kind of similar, deleterious financial impact upon their system.
"You have grossly oversimplified the complexity of the comparison as you have gone and compared two disparate points of data."
I really don't think the comparison's all that complex, but by all means please enlighten me as to how that's the case.
al3efromanSep 29, 2010
"I really don't think the comparison's all that complex, but by all means please enlighten me as to how that's the case"
I did, you just left it out of the quotes in your response. You are comparing the costs of one group with the contributions of another. A meaningful comparison would be between the contributions of both populations to the respective economies. One might also compare the costs of both populations to those economies. Ideally one would compare both using a unified model.
That, however, is the problem. These numbers don't appear to be available. As I mentioned before, I assume this is because of the obvious incentives not to report these numbers.
All I'm saying is this argument isn't very convincing. I honestly don't know what the answers are to the very real problems created and/worsened by illegal immigration, but I'm certain I don't want to use poorly conceived analysis and hyperbole to color the discussion.
atomheartmotherSep 29, 2010
"One might also compare the costs of both populations to those economies. Ideally one would compare both using a unified model."
One might, were they doing a scientific study rather than commenting on digg. In lieu of that, try employing a bit of logic and common sense.
"I'm certain I don't want to use poorly conceived analysis and hyperbole to color the discussion."
Awesome, that means I can welcome you joining me in condemning this absurd and ridiculous excuse for an article.
artworkz918Sep 28, 2010
americans can't drain the system in mexico because no foreigners are allowed access to ANY, govt help. They are not allowed to vote or participate in politics in any for or fashion nor can they criticize the govt in any way or they are deported
karlhSep 28, 2010
Dear World,
If "Americans" now only mean people from the US, then please come up with a new name for those continents out west.
robbh66Sep 28, 2010
Dear karlh,
Americans has referred to US citizens exclusively for quite some time now. Please get over it.
Shizno2000Sep 28, 2010
At first...when i read the title.... i thought this story came from "The Onion News Network"
iagainstiSep 28, 2010
But we're Americans. We can go wherever we damn well please! It's the way the founding fathers wanted it. /s
evoldicaSep 28, 2010
Why would you go to Mexico for hookers? Drugs.. sure..
p0011010Sep 28, 2010
The difference between our two situations is Americans bring more money into Mexico while Mexicans take money out of America.
Closed AccountSep 28, 2010
exactly