pcper.com— id Software and Epic Games have both declared PC gaming second rate, if not dead altogether. I happen to know why they are both dead wrong.
Aug 27, 2007View in Crawl 4
To anybody that argues that dual analog sticks are better for FPS's, try to have them try to explain any other reason for the techniques used by the developers in the multiplatform-multiplayer game Shadowrun to make the console players handicapped.
I'm pretty sure Bioshock is upscaled, which isn't the same thing as native. The 360 would explode running Bioshock at native res of 1920*1080. I'll try and find a lick to back up my claim but im sure Bioshock is 720p, but the 360 will be upscaling it for your TV. How much did that 1080p display cost you anyway ;)I can't believe anyone is seeing a slide show on a "nearly new pc" or whatever you said. It runs very well and is very scalable.
Compare BioShock on a $400 console (360) versus a $400 dell desktop (w/o display). Go ahead, take a video of both, do the comparison, see what you come up with. Let me see how your keyboard/mouse combo is at 0.5 frames per second.
Yeah seriously I was thinking the same thing. I've been playing on the computer for years and just as long on consoles. And for that time period where I did not have a console, I found that computers are always a little more hassle. Either with drivers (some versions better than others.. sometimes needing older drivers.. fixes..), bugs, mods, game running crappy or PC can't get HIGHEST graphic settings. And this is coming from a computer programmer... I don't have trouble fixing any PC issues, installing hardware, overclocking.For those who say that PCs are the same price, and last just as long... where the hell do you live?! Ever since PCs have been in mainstream, there's been upgrades after upgrades and most of the time, the gains were minimal. Not only that, but right now, you buy a top of the line video card for what? 800$ ? And yet, you STILL can't play all games at highest settings? Seriously have no idea how you can come up with that. Games become bigger and bigger but not necessarly more efficient.. they just ask for higher requirements. That's what I hate about PCs. You always need more. Got a dualcore? Too bad, they aren't widely supported yet... SLI ? hmmm, sorry, still not enough..I agree PCs will eventually out-hardware the consoles, but considering that PCs get new and improved hardware every month... no wonder! Its not like your gonna buy every single upgrade everytime anyway...But, I have always preferred playing games sitting on my couch on an always bigger TV (compared to my PC monitor). Although, for the last few years where connecting the PC to a TV and now HDTVs , you can get the same experience through the PC (which I do quite often now for racing games etc...)As for "I finally upgraded to a 7600GT complete with a new mid-range processor/mobo for about the price of a console: 300-400. I am still playing today's best games to date at reasonable settings and speeds, and I have no complaints. In fact, I predict that I won't need to upgrade again for another full year at the very VERY least."You are not playing the games as nice as it would be on current consoles.. and lets say you ONLY have to upgrade in a "full" year.. that'll be 2 upgrades (lets say another 300-400) in 2 years and the consoles can more than keep up in a span of 2 years. And even when you DO upgrade in a full year, you will probably still not be able to play games at highest settings.I love PCs.. they do more than play games and are still essentiel.. but I have learned my lesson about upgrading to the top and never actually "experiencing" the top (unless you play 2 year old games) like I have with the 360. Might not always be better than the PC, but way more bang for your buck.
That article misses a very basic, very important point. Unreal Tournament 3 for the PS3 will have keyboard/mouse support. So the whole basis of the article falls apart.
I just recently built a system very similar to yours except I used the K9A Platinum motherboard and Radeon X1950 XT graphic card (5-10fps faster depending on benchmark). I also recycled the same parts, including the power supply, and I spent $506! About 4 months have passed and computer parts have gotten much cheaper! The argument against PC as being too expensive is soon going to be a thing of the past.
That article was ridiculous and juvenile asshattery. I have played both console and PC games since my ATARI 2600, and ATARI 400 (a very early PC), and my beloved Apple IIC (Zork anyone?). After the NES, I couldn't afford another console, and my parents refused to buy me one, so from middle school up until my mid-20's I strictly played PC games. I was excited when I got a PS2 after a long hiatus and later an Xbox. The most foolish statement was about how consoles had to copy the PC gamers joysticks and driving gear, when multiple types of input devices have always been a staple of consoles rather than PCs. I agree that PC games generally speaking, have the benefit of being able to be modded, and the mosue-keyboard combo offers complex controls not feasible with typical console controllers (of course, unless you shell out a lot of money, the analog control systems of console controllers allow supreme precision with any sort of vehicle control that can't be replicated on standard PC input devices.) and, yes there are more complex games like Civilization and Sim City that can't properly be replicated on a console. But to suggest that this is all due to console gamers being simple people while PC gamers are more intellectual is simply ignorant. PC games have consistently pushed users to upgrade their hardware every 2 years, unless they buy an extremely expensive system. I just bought an Xbox 360, but for the past 8 years, I have been still enjoying games on my PS2 and for the past 5 on my Xbox without having to buy any additional hardware (and can rent games, legally, from my local rental store, or buy them used for deep discounts). On my PC, I enjoy EVE online, Civilization IV, and Medieval 2 TW, but won't be buying any newer games anytime soon. Nowadays, I only upgrade my PC or buy a new one, if absolutely necessary. Although I have always enjoyed gaming on my PC, I have never, ever considered PCs a purely gaming system, and am not going shell out all sorts of money and deal with hardware headaches unless it is also necessary for other uses of my PC. Of course, he misses the biggest difference between PC and console games. PCs are designed to be used while sitting at a desk, solo, only to interact with others online. Console games are to be enjoyed relaxing on the couch, with many games designed to be played with people in the same room.
I'm surprised the Wii was barely mentioned, being that is the number 1 selling console of this generation, despite only being 480p. A lot of "hardcore" gamers have dismissed Nintendo consoles for the past several generations as a "kid's" console due to its numerous cartoony games like Mario, and lack of hardcore violence like GTA (although there are a few M titles out there). However, they are missing out on some of the best games every made. Ocarina of Time blows FFVII out of the water, but most gamers during that time hadn't even heard of it. While the popular PC games seem to be limited to a few genres (MMO's, FPSes, strategy), Nintendo has always innovated in ways that other developers haven't, because their emphasis is on the most enjoyable gameplay experience instead of just the best graphics.With all the talk about controller vs. kb+m, the Wiimote is conspicuously absent. Unless you actually own a Wii and have tried some of the newer games, you have no idea the potential this control system has to revolutionize gaming. It isn't quite there yet, but when it gets improved in the next generation, the Wiimote will make the mouse look like an old VCR.IF you think it is simply a gimmick for sports games, then you haven't played Pro-Evolution soccer (yes I know it's a sports game). The design of this game and use of the Wiimote, if other developers take notice, could be the springboard for RTS's to jump into the console world for real.
ignignokt01Aug 28, 2007
To anybody that argues that dual analog sticks are better for FPS's, try to have them try to explain any other reason for the techniques used by the developers in the multiplatform-multiplayer game Shadowrun to make the console players handicapped.
Closed AccountAug 29, 2007
I'm pretty sure Bioshock is upscaled, which isn't the same thing as native. The 360 would explode running Bioshock at native res of 1920*1080. I'll try and find a lick to back up my claim but im sure Bioshock is 720p, but the 360 will be upscaling it for your TV. How much did that 1080p display cost you anyway ;)I can't believe anyone is seeing a slide show on a "nearly new pc" or whatever you said. It runs very well and is very scalable.
vawkselAug 29, 2007
Compare BioShock on a $400 console (360) versus a $400 dell desktop (w/o display). Go ahead, take a video of both, do the comparison, see what you come up with. Let me see how your keyboard/mouse combo is at 0.5 frames per second.
bearingAug 31, 2007
Yeah seriously I was thinking the same thing. I've been playing on the computer for years and just as long on consoles. And for that time period where I did not have a console, I found that computers are always a little more hassle. Either with drivers (some versions better than others.. sometimes needing older drivers.. fixes..), bugs, mods, game running crappy or PC can't get HIGHEST graphic settings. And this is coming from a computer programmer... I don't have trouble fixing any PC issues, installing hardware, overclocking.For those who say that PCs are the same price, and last just as long... where the hell do you live?! Ever since PCs have been in mainstream, there's been upgrades after upgrades and most of the time, the gains were minimal. Not only that, but right now, you buy a top of the line video card for what? 800$ ? And yet, you STILL can't play all games at highest settings? Seriously have no idea how you can come up with that. Games become bigger and bigger but not necessarly more efficient.. they just ask for higher requirements. That's what I hate about PCs. You always need more. Got a dualcore? Too bad, they aren't widely supported yet... SLI ? hmmm, sorry, still not enough..I agree PCs will eventually out-hardware the consoles, but considering that PCs get new and improved hardware every month... no wonder! Its not like your gonna buy every single upgrade everytime anyway...But, I have always preferred playing games sitting on my couch on an always bigger TV (compared to my PC monitor). Although, for the last few years where connecting the PC to a TV and now HDTVs , you can get the same experience through the PC (which I do quite often now for racing games etc...)As for "I finally upgraded to a 7600GT complete with a new mid-range processor/mobo for about the price of a console: 300-400. I am still playing today's best games to date at reasonable settings and speeds, and I have no complaints. In fact, I predict that I won't need to upgrade again for another full year at the very VERY least."You are not playing the games as nice as it would be on current consoles.. and lets say you ONLY have to upgrade in a "full" year.. that'll be 2 upgrades (lets say another 300-400) in 2 years and the consoles can more than keep up in a span of 2 years. And even when you DO upgrade in a full year, you will probably still not be able to play games at highest settings.I love PCs.. they do more than play games and are still essentiel.. but I have learned my lesson about upgrading to the top and never actually "experiencing" the top (unless you play 2 year old games) like I have with the 360. Might not always be better than the PC, but way more bang for your buck.
carzorstelatisSep 4, 2007
That article misses a very basic, very important point. Unreal Tournament 3 for the PS3 will have keyboard/mouse support. So the whole basis of the article falls apart.
ultrakillSep 9, 2007
I just recently built a system very similar to yours except I used the K9A Platinum motherboard and Radeon X1950 XT graphic card (5-10fps faster depending on benchmark). I also recycled the same parts, including the power supply, and I spent $506! About 4 months have passed and computer parts have gotten much cheaper! The argument against PC as being too expensive is soon going to be a thing of the past.
mogobuffloJan 6, 2009
That article was ridiculous and juvenile asshattery. I have played both console and PC games since my ATARI 2600, and ATARI 400 (a very early PC), and my beloved Apple IIC (Zork anyone?). After the NES, I couldn't afford another console, and my parents refused to buy me one, so from middle school up until my mid-20's I strictly played PC games. I was excited when I got a PS2 after a long hiatus and later an Xbox. The most foolish statement was about how consoles had to copy the PC gamers joysticks and driving gear, when multiple types of input devices have always been a staple of consoles rather than PCs. I agree that PC games generally speaking, have the benefit of being able to be modded, and the mosue-keyboard combo offers complex controls not feasible with typical console controllers (of course, unless you shell out a lot of money, the analog control systems of console controllers allow supreme precision with any sort of vehicle control that can't be replicated on standard PC input devices.) and, yes there are more complex games like Civilization and Sim City that can't properly be replicated on a console. But to suggest that this is all due to console gamers being simple people while PC gamers are more intellectual is simply ignorant. PC games have consistently pushed users to upgrade their hardware every 2 years, unless they buy an extremely expensive system. I just bought an Xbox 360, but for the past 8 years, I have been still enjoying games on my PS2 and for the past 5 on my Xbox without having to buy any additional hardware (and can rent games, legally, from my local rental store, or buy them used for deep discounts). On my PC, I enjoy EVE online, Civilization IV, and Medieval 2 TW, but won't be buying any newer games anytime soon. Nowadays, I only upgrade my PC or buy a new one, if absolutely necessary. Although I have always enjoyed gaming on my PC, I have never, ever considered PCs a purely gaming system, and am not going shell out all sorts of money and deal with hardware headaches unless it is also necessary for other uses of my PC. Of course, he misses the biggest difference between PC and console games. PCs are designed to be used while sitting at a desk, solo, only to interact with others online. Console games are to be enjoyed relaxing on the couch, with many games designed to be played with people in the same room.
mogobuffloJan 6, 2009
I'm surprised the Wii was barely mentioned, being that is the number 1 selling console of this generation, despite only being 480p. A lot of "hardcore" gamers have dismissed Nintendo consoles for the past several generations as a "kid's" console due to its numerous cartoony games like Mario, and lack of hardcore violence like GTA (although there are a few M titles out there). However, they are missing out on some of the best games every made. Ocarina of Time blows FFVII out of the water, but most gamers during that time hadn't even heard of it. While the popular PC games seem to be limited to a few genres (MMO's, FPSes, strategy), Nintendo has always innovated in ways that other developers haven't, because their emphasis is on the most enjoyable gameplay experience instead of just the best graphics.With all the talk about controller vs. kb+m, the Wiimote is conspicuously absent. Unless you actually own a Wii and have tried some of the newer games, you have no idea the potential this control system has to revolutionize gaming. It isn't quite there yet, but when it gets improved in the next generation, the Wiimote will make the mouse look like an old VCR.IF you think it is simply a gimmick for sports games, then you haven't played Pro-Evolution soccer (yes I know it's a sports game). The design of this game and use of the Wiimote, if other developers take notice, could be the springboard for RTS's to jump into the console world for real.