siliconvalleysleuth.com— Sun Microsystems plans to release the first chunks of Java under an open source license by October this year, the company said at an event during the Linuxworld conference in San Francisco.
Aug 15, 2006View in Crawl 4
It's not open source unless you can see, use, modify and redistribute the code without restriction. Releasing code under NDA's and other favoured corperate methods of diluting OSS don't count.Whats the point of me improving a code base if I have to sign over all the rights to the modifications to a company who may or may not give me the ability to use my hard work.
"It's not open source unless you can see, use, modify and redistribute the code without restriction."I'm not even going to adress this except to say that first of all, the only thing you are doing is parroting a worn out tired old argument that you could have copied and pasted vertatim from some Web site. And second, open source predates Richard Stallman and his Marxist ideas about software. So I don't know who died and made him the final and ultimate authority on what is open source and what is not.I also don't know who made OSI the final authority, since open source had been around for years before OSI came along. So as far as I am concerned. Neitehr RMS or OSI have any authority whatsoever to determine what is considered open source and what is not.
"QUOTE Java remains the most popular programming language in the world. UNQUOTEwhat? Anybody want to explain?"Yeah, I will explain.As of November of last year, Java had surpassed both C and C++ for the number of projects on Sourceforge, and the gap is still getting wider. (prior to Java, C and C++ were the most popular languages. Java passed up C++ sometime in the middle of 2005, and then a few months later, passed up C as well).Also, when it comes to Job demand, Java is still the most in demand programming skill. Here are a few searches I did on Dice.com, listed in order from most demand to least demand:#1 Java: 15071#2 .Net: 12550#3. C: 8867#4 C++: 7948#5 Perl: 5144#6 VB: 2767#7 Python: 878#8 Ruby: 237That explain it?
Nice try at spinning it. But guess what? You got caught for the following reasons:1. The disclaimer at the front SPECIFICALLY says it does not reflect the views of NASA or the JPL. So you downright lied when you said it is what the guys at NASA think. It is what ONE guy who happens to work for NASA thinks.2. It did not highlight their thoughts on JAVA. It highlighted their thoughts on J2EE. if you don't know the difference, then you don't know what you are talking about anyway.3. Ruby demonstrated all to well last week what one of the major problems of using scripting languages to develop Web applications is. Namely, Rails got caught with its pants down, and a security hole large enough to drive a bus through.4. The Zope framework (which this video supports as the best) is often said to have a Z shaped learning curbe by those who have used it for complex projects. As in it is really easy for the kind of simple stuff done in the video, but as soon as you try to do anything complex, the learning curve gets very steep in Zope.5. Once you start getting into dynamic languages like Ruby and Python, large projects can become unmanagable and difficult to maintain because of the fact that automated refactoring tools simply don't work well with languages that are not statically typed. Furthermore, these languages can't warn you of type mismatches at write time like Java can. So simple bugs that should be caught by the IDE (and are caught by the IDE in Java) don't get caught until runtime in Ruby or Python, when they cause am application failure.6. Point #5, combined with the fact that neither Ruby or Python enforce error handling, mean that Ruby and Python suck for mission critical systems, and have serious problems with reliability. (There's a reason the Mars Rover software is written in Java and not Python or Ruby)7. Ruby scales horribly, It doesn't even support prepared SQL statements, which means the database has to reparse the query everytime it is run. This is a huge overhead on a busy site.Nice try, but sorry. Not only did you try to claim the video represented the view of a group of people it specifically says in the disclaimer that it does NOT represent, and try to spin it into a general take on Java when it was a take on J2EE. But the claims made in the video are easily debunked when dealing with real world complex applications, and not little "Hello world" type sample applications.The greater initially configuration that Java requires pays off in the long run in the form of a more reliable and more maintainable application (as well as one that performs better)
mv36Aug 15, 2006
Direct link to article,<a class="user" href="http://www.vnunet.com/vnunet/news/2162306/first-open-source-java-promised">http://www.vnunet.com/vnunet/news/2162306/first-open-source-java-promised</a>
beplacidAug 15, 2006
That and PHP I would have thought. I'm really interested not only in the license but what 'parts' of Java they're going to release first...
gmorganAug 15, 2006
It's not open source unless you can see, use, modify and redistribute the code without restriction. Releasing code under NDA's and other favoured corperate methods of diluting OSS don't count.Whats the point of me improving a code base if I have to sign over all the rights to the modifications to a company who may or may not give me the ability to use my hard work.
nofxjunkeeAug 15, 2006
A response to a web framework? Do you know what Java is?
s1mbaAug 15, 2006
"It's not open source unless you can see, use, modify and redistribute the code without restriction."I'm not even going to adress this except to say that first of all, the only thing you are doing is parroting a worn out tired old argument that you could have copied and pasted vertatim from some Web site. And second, open source predates Richard Stallman and his Marxist ideas about software. So I don't know who died and made him the final and ultimate authority on what is open source and what is not.I also don't know who made OSI the final authority, since open source had been around for years before OSI came along. So as far as I am concerned. Neitehr RMS or OSI have any authority whatsoever to determine what is considered open source and what is not.
s1mbaAug 15, 2006
"QUOTE Java remains the most popular programming language in the world. UNQUOTEwhat? Anybody want to explain?"Yeah, I will explain.As of November of last year, Java had surpassed both C and C++ for the number of projects on Sourceforge, and the gap is still getting wider. (prior to Java, C and C++ were the most popular languages. Java passed up C++ sometime in the middle of 2005, and then a few months later, passed up C as well).Also, when it comes to Job demand, Java is still the most in demand programming skill. Here are a few searches I did on Dice.com, listed in order from most demand to least demand:#1 Java: 15071#2 .Net: 12550#3. C: 8867#4 C++: 7948#5 Perl: 5144#6 VB: 2767#7 Python: 878#8 Ruby: 237That explain it?
s1mbaAug 15, 2006
Nice try at spinning it. But guess what? You got caught for the following reasons:1. The disclaimer at the front SPECIFICALLY says it does not reflect the views of NASA or the JPL. So you downright lied when you said it is what the guys at NASA think. It is what ONE guy who happens to work for NASA thinks.2. It did not highlight their thoughts on JAVA. It highlighted their thoughts on J2EE. if you don't know the difference, then you don't know what you are talking about anyway.3. Ruby demonstrated all to well last week what one of the major problems of using scripting languages to develop Web applications is. Namely, Rails got caught with its pants down, and a security hole large enough to drive a bus through.4. The Zope framework (which this video supports as the best) is often said to have a Z shaped learning curbe by those who have used it for complex projects. As in it is really easy for the kind of simple stuff done in the video, but as soon as you try to do anything complex, the learning curve gets very steep in Zope.5. Once you start getting into dynamic languages like Ruby and Python, large projects can become unmanagable and difficult to maintain because of the fact that automated refactoring tools simply don't work well with languages that are not statically typed. Furthermore, these languages can't warn you of type mismatches at write time like Java can. So simple bugs that should be caught by the IDE (and are caught by the IDE in Java) don't get caught until runtime in Ruby or Python, when they cause am application failure.6. Point #5, combined with the fact that neither Ruby or Python enforce error handling, mean that Ruby and Python suck for mission critical systems, and have serious problems with reliability. (There's a reason the Mars Rover software is written in Java and not Python or Ruby)7. Ruby scales horribly, It doesn't even support prepared SQL statements, which means the database has to reparse the query everytime it is run. This is a huge overhead on a busy site.Nice try, but sorry. Not only did you try to claim the video represented the view of a group of people it specifically says in the disclaimer that it does NOT represent, and try to spin it into a general take on Java when it was a take on J2EE. But the claims made in the video are easily debunked when dealing with real world complex applications, and not little "Hello world" type sample applications.The greater initially configuration that Java requires pays off in the long run in the form of a more reliable and more maintainable application (as well as one that performs better)