arstechnica.com— Annoying DRM rarely rears its head in gaming, but people who update their 360s with Elites are going to have a rough time with their Arcade downloads.
Apr 30, 2007View in Crawl 4
@MAJORstrasserWow! Nice story--too bad it's all bulls**t! I had the exact same thing happen to me. Xbox died after 15 months, I sold my old one, minus the HDD and bought a new Core system. When I saw my games didn't work online, I called MS and they told me they'd refund my points so I could repurchase all the games under another account. It took about 5 days from the day I faxed in my receipt to get an email containing 5 codes redeemable for 4000 points each, and 1 code redeemable for 1600 points. Since I'd only spent 25,960 points so far, I actually came out 640 points ahead. From what I can tell, this is pretty much their standard procedure.Maybe if you weren't such a jackass, it wouldn't be as fun for customer service reps to screw you?
Ugh, I told y'all about this in my previous post about the 360 DRM, saying its the only thing I dislike about the Arcade and I got dugg down. Oh well, hopefully we'll see no DRM like the future of the Zune Marketplace (minus additional cost to have no DRM)
For Clarity:"The Xbox 360 120GB Hard Drive includes a data transfer kit to easily migrate all of your saved data from your 20GB HDD to your 120GB HDD."<a class="user" href="http://www.xbox.com/en-US/hardware/x/xbox360harddrive120GB/">http://www.xbox.com/en-US/hardware/x/xbox360harddrive120GB/</a>If you bought a Whole New Elite Console, you'll need to request a cable, as MS rightly sees this to be a less common occurance. But dont let that keep you all from running around spraying FUD like blood from a headless chicken. By all means, keep repeating half-truths and blatant falsehoods.
Yes, compare Sony's history of DRM. Remember the Music CD Rootkit fiasco? Remember their fascist director saying this:"Sony is going to take aggressive steps to stop this. We will develop technology that transcends the individual user. We will firewall Napster at source - we will block it at your cable company, we will block it at your phone company, we will block it at your [ISP]. We will firewall it at your PC."<a class="user" href="http://www.theregister.co.uk/2000/08/23/we_will_block_napster/">http://www.theregister.co.uk/2000/08/23/we_will_block_napster/</a>You _DO_ know that PS3 is built from the ground up to implement DRM at the lowest possible level, and at all times -- you know this I hope. That Bluray is yet another attempt by MPAA to foist ever-more-restrictive DRM on the movie-watching public? You do know this eh?Have a look here son:<a class="user" href="http://arstechnica.com/news.ars/post/20060413-6600.html">http://arstechnica.com/news.ars/post/20060413-6600.html</a>1 SPE of 7 constantly reserved, 1 SPE of 7 able to be "taken" by the OS at a moments notice (games have to give it up if requested). As PS3 Portal report points out, it has long been public knowledge that the PS3 will reserve one SPE for use by the OS. We've also known that at least part of the function of this reserved SPE was security- and DRM-related. Each SPE's local store can be walled off from the rest of the system for trusted access by only authorized threads. Thus the SPE is ideally suited for security and DRM-related purposes.""In the case of the PS3 this equates to 12.5% of the available Cores on the CPU always reserved, an additional 12.5% sometimes taken by the OS, 12.5% of the available RSX memory and 25% of XDR Cell memory. Balancing these out, one could argue that Sony has removed up to 25% of the available CPU power and 18.75% of RAM for these features as well as others that are not mentioned here or will be added in future updates to the PS3 Operation System."Much of that reserved-1/4 hardware is suspected to be DRM related.If your game implements ANY online functionality, your game looses a processor core that game writers are never notified if it is needed by the OS. So, 1/4 of your computing power runs the OS and online-stack.Go, have a look here: <a class="user" href="http://ozymandias.com/archive/2007/03/22/More-Context-on-Memory-Reservation-Issues-on-PS3.aspx">http://ozymandias.com/archive/2007/03/22/More-Context-on-Memory-Reservation-Issues-on-PS3.aspx</a>If you want to know how much PS3 memory & CPU of the PS3 is dedicated to for Sony to implement DRM. Its a goddamn laugh-riot to hear someone suggest that PS3 is "so good about DRM" when the whole thing is absolutely designed for DRM as a top priority. This idiot blog-posted-article is an extremely rare occasion, and can easily be avoided if he follows Microsoft's instruction. Take the time to check your facts before you start on about how PS3 is so DRM-free.
Yep, anyone who got their 360 replaced for warranty already figured this out. I still haven't did it yet because I don't need the hours of hassle and days of waiting to get my points to repurchase what I had.
@MAJORstrasserI agree with you and then disagree with you. I myself replaced my 360 recently, but I chose to get the EB warranty because it is A LOT cheaper and more convenient. Now I already knew the risks this posed as I had tried to play my full Geometry Wars when I took my HDD over to my friend's house. After I saw it was only the trial version I called Microsoft and they told me it was tied to my system's memory not my HDD.So I figured, new system, means no new content. But you see thats f**ked up, I lost the 800 point GRAW update, the 400 point PDZ update, over 4000 points worth of arcade games, my Oblivion updates, and about 4 themes. And considering the French-Canadian based company Microsoft contracted to handle all their calls is hardly understandable, resolving this situation is difficult.But I can see what good this is doing. There has yet to be a system hack that compromised the security of online games. I know you're all going to say, "YES THERE HAS!!" but honestly, no there hasn't, that guy is really just that good at GoW and you just suck that bad. The DRM is stopping games that haven't been okayed by Microsoft from hitting consoles. There are hacks for burned games to run on the system, but if only only one prompt or action is modified, the Microsoft signature goes away, making the disc unreadable. So I guess the DRM and me will just have to co-exsist in a hit and miss relationship.
Are you saying that if you already downloaded full arcade games on your white Xbox 360 and then redownloaded the same games on your Xbox Elite 360 you can only play them as demos unless you're online (that's happening to me) but if you delete those arcade game downloads off your white Xbox 360 and then download the same arcade games on your Elite they will then work online or offline?
pxltApr 30, 2007
Good article... it's a shame that people have to jump through these kinds of hoops.
theakolyteApr 30, 2007
The problem is finding games worth playing.
kylesellersApr 30, 2007
@MAJORstrasserWow! Nice story--too bad it's all bulls**t! I had the exact same thing happen to me. Xbox died after 15 months, I sold my old one, minus the HDD and bought a new Core system. When I saw my games didn't work online, I called MS and they told me they'd refund my points so I could repurchase all the games under another account. It took about 5 days from the day I faxed in my receipt to get an email containing 5 codes redeemable for 4000 points each, and 1 code redeemable for 1600 points. Since I'd only spent 25,960 points so far, I actually came out 640 points ahead. From what I can tell, this is pretty much their standard procedure.Maybe if you weren't such a jackass, it wouldn't be as fun for customer service reps to screw you?
ashkc88Apr 30, 2007
Ugh, I told y'all about this in my previous post about the 360 DRM, saying its the only thing I dislike about the Arcade and I got dugg down. Oh well, hopefully we'll see no DRM like the future of the Zune Marketplace (minus additional cost to have no DRM)
wageslavenMay 1, 2007
For Clarity:"The Xbox 360 120GB Hard Drive includes a data transfer kit to easily migrate all of your saved data from your 20GB HDD to your 120GB HDD."<a class="user" href="http://www.xbox.com/en-US/hardware/x/xbox360harddrive120GB/">http://www.xbox.com/en-US/hardware/x/xbox360harddrive120GB/</a>If you bought a Whole New Elite Console, you'll need to request a cable, as MS rightly sees this to be a less common occurance. But dont let that keep you all from running around spraying FUD like blood from a headless chicken. By all means, keep repeating half-truths and blatant falsehoods.
wageslavenMay 1, 2007
Yes, compare Sony's history of DRM. Remember the Music CD Rootkit fiasco? Remember their fascist director saying this:"Sony is going to take aggressive steps to stop this. We will develop technology that transcends the individual user. We will firewall Napster at source - we will block it at your cable company, we will block it at your phone company, we will block it at your [ISP]. We will firewall it at your PC."<a class="user" href="http://www.theregister.co.uk/2000/08/23/we_will_block_napster/">http://www.theregister.co.uk/2000/08/23/we_will_block_napster/</a>You _DO_ know that PS3 is built from the ground up to implement DRM at the lowest possible level, and at all times -- you know this I hope. That Bluray is yet another attempt by MPAA to foist ever-more-restrictive DRM on the movie-watching public? You do know this eh?Have a look here son:<a class="user" href="http://arstechnica.com/news.ars/post/20060413-6600.html">http://arstechnica.com/news.ars/post/20060413-6600.html</a>1 SPE of 7 constantly reserved, 1 SPE of 7 able to be "taken" by the OS at a moments notice (games have to give it up if requested). As PS3 Portal report points out, it has long been public knowledge that the PS3 will reserve one SPE for use by the OS. We've also known that at least part of the function of this reserved SPE was security- and DRM-related. Each SPE's local store can be walled off from the rest of the system for trusted access by only authorized threads. Thus the SPE is ideally suited for security and DRM-related purposes.""In the case of the PS3 this equates to 12.5% of the available Cores on the CPU always reserved, an additional 12.5% sometimes taken by the OS, 12.5% of the available RSX memory and 25% of XDR Cell memory. Balancing these out, one could argue that Sony has removed up to 25% of the available CPU power and 18.75% of RAM for these features as well as others that are not mentioned here or will be added in future updates to the PS3 Operation System."Much of that reserved-1/4 hardware is suspected to be DRM related.If your game implements ANY online functionality, your game looses a processor core that game writers are never notified if it is needed by the OS. So, 1/4 of your computing power runs the OS and online-stack.Go, have a look here: <a class="user" href="http://ozymandias.com/archive/2007/03/22/More-Context-on-Memory-Reservation-Issues-on-PS3.aspx">http://ozymandias.com/archive/2007/03/22/More-Context-on-Memory-Reservation-Issues-on-PS3.aspx</a>If you want to know how much PS3 memory & CPU of the PS3 is dedicated to for Sony to implement DRM. Its a goddamn laugh-riot to hear someone suggest that PS3 is "so good about DRM" when the whole thing is absolutely designed for DRM as a top priority. This idiot blog-posted-article is an extremely rare occasion, and can easily be avoided if he follows Microsoft's instruction. Take the time to check your facts before you start on about how PS3 is so DRM-free.
inajeepMay 1, 2007
Yep, anyone who got their 360 replaced for warranty already figured this out. I still haven't did it yet because I don't need the hours of hassle and days of waiting to get my points to repurchase what I had.
jinxsedMay 1, 2007
@MAJORstrasserI agree with you and then disagree with you. I myself replaced my 360 recently, but I chose to get the EB warranty because it is A LOT cheaper and more convenient. Now I already knew the risks this posed as I had tried to play my full Geometry Wars when I took my HDD over to my friend's house. After I saw it was only the trial version I called Microsoft and they told me it was tied to my system's memory not my HDD.So I figured, new system, means no new content. But you see thats f**ked up, I lost the 800 point GRAW update, the 400 point PDZ update, over 4000 points worth of arcade games, my Oblivion updates, and about 4 themes. And considering the French-Canadian based company Microsoft contracted to handle all their calls is hardly understandable, resolving this situation is difficult.But I can see what good this is doing. There has yet to be a system hack that compromised the security of online games. I know you're all going to say, "YES THERE HAS!!" but honestly, no there hasn't, that guy is really just that good at GoW and you just suck that bad. The DRM is stopping games that haven't been okayed by Microsoft from hitting consoles. There are hacks for burned games to run on the system, but if only only one prompt or action is modified, the Microsoft signature goes away, making the disc unreadable. So I guess the DRM and me will just have to co-exsist in a hit and miss relationship.
wormgrassSep 22, 2007
Are you saying that if you already downloaded full arcade games on your white Xbox 360 and then redownloaded the same games on your Xbox Elite 360 you can only play them as demos unless you're online (that's happening to me) but if you delete those arcade game downloads off your white Xbox 360 and then download the same arcade games on your Elite they will then work online or offline?
xbugsJan 6, 2008
The EULA does not state that when your Xbox blows up, you will not necessarily be getting your original system back from the repair center.