computerworld.com — No one ever said they wanted to be a Webmaster when they grew up and with good reason... they make just $50k/year. According to Computerworld's latest IT salary survey, entry level programmers should be making about $65k/year, but the real money is in database management ($90k+). What's the average Digg employee's salary?
Oct 24, 2005 View in Crawl 4
lesliOct 24, 2005
> No one ever said they wanted to be a Webmaster when they grew up and > with good reason... they make just $50k/year.Pfft.. I'm a Webmaster and I'm not even close to making $50k/year :|
jay314Oct 25, 2005
@linsys:You're on the system administration side of things, where theory doesn't matter so much as knowing the syntax for adding a cron job. But you're being closed-minded if you think that's all there is to the computer industry. Honestly, a guy with a CS degree is probably in the wrong place in a Unix administration team if he hasn't taught himself unix on the side.His government contract job probably entails many skills you couldn't even come close to getting from the "real world". Software design principles and engineering methods, true object oriented design, algorithm analysis, algorithm design, data compression theory, database normalization. The truth is, the two of you should never be interviewing for the same job, because you have completely different skillsets.And stop being so c**ky. It makes you seem like a dick.
shortstickOct 25, 2005
It seems like everyone is falling into the trap that they think whatever worked for them will work for everyone. Or if one guy makes X dollars for a job, everyone else should too.If only life was that simple. For example, if you have 10 years experience as an Oracle DBA, but you refuse to shower, you may stand to make a lower salary. If you have only ever worked at McDonalds and have no higher education, but Bill Gates is your uncle, you may stand a chance to get a good job. Where are you living? It matters. Silicon Valley might be good, some places might be having real difficulty creating and sustaining tech jobs. It's hard to say where. One reason it's so difficult to maintain tech jobs or whatever good jobs is, everybody wants in on the action, and it can get a little bit hot that you are making good money when other people aren't. All the sudden, the guy at the deli counter really wants to prove he's just as smart as you are. Etc.
ironmonkeeOct 25, 2005
I am 27, left the military after 8 years (USAF...C-130 aircrew member...loadmaster for those in the know) to return to school to complete my degree in MIS, and have one year left until I am finished. I recently was hired on in an entry level position at a regional hospital where I live working at their help desk making $10.50 an hour plus differential for nights and weekends (which I work since I am still attending school full time). I figured I just killed the biggest Catch-22 out there for college grads-getting experience and my degree at the same time. It definitely is not all what you know, though. Motivation, teamwork, and an ability not to f**k up the King's English when communicating with another person all help in landing a position and allowing folks to move up. I have only been there three months and I've been asked to help out on some projects that have been able to get me seen by folks in positions where, after school, I could definitely move up. Those things may sound cliche, but people repeat them for a reason: because it's true. While on the subject of school, I see/hear folks all the time say that you don't have to go to college/technical school to get a good job. While it is true that learning this stuff on your own will still allow you to land a gig somewhere, school (and college specifically) does give a person an upper hand. It shows discipline, commitment, and the fact that you can apply yourself to learn. Alot of times, it even shaves off time you'd have to have work experience for. Read some applications: you may have to have 5 years of experience in a position (or more in some cases) where as Joe College over here only needs to walk in to it straight from the frat house. College also gives other benifits such as networking. Sorry to burst your bubble, Mr. Idealist, but the saying "It's not what you know, it's who you know" is true. Alot of folks get jobs because they knew someone who somehow got their foot in the door for an interview when they normally wouldn't have. So while you don't have to go, don't downplay someone with a undergrad degree because you don't have one. I say why work harder when you can work smarter? Go to school. It won't hurt. Besides, chicks in dorms are hot. Who could pass that up? Well, a gay man, but that's not the point. I say go to school, work hard, be disciplined, show an interest in what you do (which I do and I enjoy it), and never hesitate to ask if you can do something more (if you can do it in the first place that is.) Some of these thoughts may have been echoed earlier, but adding one's own two pennies to the bank is what this is all about. Enjoy.
lowfiOct 25, 2005
Certifications get you past the HR people *if* you lack experience.Experience > CertificationsAlso, your personality will get you *much* further than any amount of certs or experience. Being "liked" is the most important skill you have in a larger corporation. It would be nice if everything was based on technical merit, but it isn't. Smaller companies will negate that a little, IMO. To anyone starting in tech, I recommend starting at the bottom and working up. Get a cert or two if you'd like, but make it something that not everyone and their dog has. Something in security, VoIP, Unix, DB, etc. CCNA's and MCSE's are, well, easy to get and everyone knows it, so you don't get many brownie points for them.To get back on topic...Central Florida.1995-96 - Helpdesk - 23k1996-98 Contractor in a large company doing windows admin stuff- 35k ish1999 - same - raise - 41k2000 - permanent - Senior NT admin - 62k2001 - Switched within the same company to a networking/Cisco group - 67k2002-05 Incremental raises bring me to 77kI have a CCNA that's about to expire at the end of this year. I have a really old Checkpoint 3.x cert. That's it for certs. Experience, longevity (not job hopping), and making friends has worked for me.
mckirkusOct 25, 2005
I'm 27 making about $50K doing all sorts of stuff - Linux/Win admin, web design, databases, etc. I was working on a computer science degree but switched to Business/Finance, I figure money will never be obsolete, and I think it was a good decision.Automation will soon kill any IT job that doesn't require knowledge of the big picture. That's why DB Admins are making a killing, they have to understand the data, not just how to store it. Many times that requires a basic understanding of business. It's scary reading Slashdot comments from obviously smart people who have absolutely no idea how businesses operate.So my prediction for the IT job of tomorrow will require these skills: Know SQL like the back of your hand, know how to use classes in PHP - the rest you can learn on the job, know what a balance sheet is. Retire young.
inrevOct 26, 2005
It's really pathetic. And if someone tells me that outsourcing jobs isn't partially involved I'll just scream.Outsourcing is more than partially involved, though I think the cost of outsourcing is now on the rise(dont get me wrong its still cheap), I think there will be a boom in IT in the US in the next couple years(I'm optimistic). Background: BS in CS, and MCAD certified. I have to disagree about NOT learning MSFT tools, go to dice.com and type in C#.NET, you'll find quite a few jobs. Maybe not as many as before but surprisingly more than ya think. The big companies use both windows and linux and oracle. But mid size and smaller companies ALL use MSFT products.I also have to disagree with learning a lot of tools, or languages. Though its good to have a broad understanding, you should have a single focus of expertise (maybe 2). Mine is Visual FoxPro and c#.net. So I am a lead software engineer doing foxpro to c# conversions, on high transaction distribution/RFID software systems. Prior to this I did foxpro and java work at a small HR software company.I make 55K in Cali and I'm 25.
adiagaOct 28, 2005
nice, I would like to make someday that much.
ljhollandNov 1, 2005
A couple of points....If it's possible, find a job where you might get a DoD security clearance. The demand for cleared IT people is intense. It may take a couple of years to obtain but it's a sure way to add $$$$$ and you have significantly better job security. On certifications...I'll have to agree - many aren't worth the paper they're printed on (especially Microsoft). When I hire sys admins, I usually consider real experience much more important. However, there are a few exceptions. Java and Oracle. (especially true if coupled with a clearance). Oracle DBA and Java people w/web experience and clearances typically make six figures.Finally, one certification that IT pros (10 years of experience or more) should seriously consider if they're doing any sort of management or are getting ready for that next "big move" - get a Project Management Professional certification (PMP) from PMI.org. It's now becoming a real discriminator for management positions - many new contracts require it actually.
fauxcasterNov 8, 2005
Where can I hire US/Canadian programmers so cheap as those in this thread? I've never found such cheap hires.
drzeusDec 4, 2005
I just graduated with a degree in CS a few months ago. I went from making $8.50/hr at a help desk to $48k a year as a Software Engineer.
cwjacklinDec 26, 2005
Everyone, get out of IT. There is no money in IT.I went to a top Computer Science school in the US. With some years of experience, you can make up to 120k, 130k at a tech company, but the ceiling is there. Get into finance, investment banking, you will be making 100+ with less than 5 years experience.
savage5150May 27, 2007
I have been in the IT industry for over 10 years. The one thing that holds to be true today is that, employers are looking for experience and an AS or CS degree above certs. The problem is, the books in colleges are NOT up-to-date with what is really going on in the "real world" and, this holds true for taking certification exams as well. This is especially true in the IT industry due to the fact that computer technology is moving forward at such a rapid pace. Hire clean, willing, ethical non-criminal background types and your business has won half of the battle.Furthermore, employers really need to hire people with a basic aptitude for computer technology as well as demonstration of class "A" work ethics (which is NOT really taught in school). Follow that up with hiring people who can demonstrate superb "instincts" as well as superb "Judgment" skills and that brings about a "successful" business.Time to go back to the "hiring basics" of the "hands-on" training in the business world. It worked for many decades. Here's a thought: The world has more education, now more than ever before, and take a look at the poor customer service, unwillingness to work hard and solve problems, no sense of urgency and everything depends on whether you get the "right technician" at the "right time and place". Bottom line: The caveman was cold; the caveman found a way to build a fire, ,built a shelter and hand-made clothing. The caveman was starving; The caveman sought food from animals and picked fruit and vegetation and gathered water from the grounds. All in all, it didn't take a degree or cert for him to figure this out. Hands-on, people. I encourage people to change the way employers look at hiring.
drpaulmagicMay 18, 2009
i play the survey game..works for me<a class="user" href="http://budurl.com/drdigby">http://budurl.com/drdigby</a>