carlosmiller.com — Seconds after BART police officer Johannes Mehserle shot and killed Oscar Grant, police immediately began confiscating cell phones containing videos that have yet to see the light of day. In fact, the only videos that have been seen by the public were filmed by people who managed to leave the scene before police confronted them.
Jan 21, 2009 View in Crawl 4
nic871Jan 23, 2009
My Pulitzer prize winning photojournalist teacher told us to when we are out taking pictures and this kind of thing happens we should "always listen to the man holding the gun". (if it is police at home or a soldier/rebel abroad). But no, an officer can NEVER (legally) destroy or take your images away from you (only a court could do this).
jlondJan 23, 2009
No, but in this instance, the footage has been leaked anyway and their response by confiscating cell phones has created a different incident that needs to be addressed. They in effect have created more problems for themselves by their actions.
gwaggy12Jan 23, 2009
As per your 4th amendment argument, you are correct. Probable cause has been used as an out for illegal police activity for decades. In this case though, they should have issued a subpoena for the videos and not simply confiscated the cameras, especially since the cameras were not actually being used in the crime. I would argue that this was most definitely illegal search and seizure.The first amendment issue in this case is freedom of speech and freedom of the press. The police force has everything to do with Congress. They are the ones who enforce the local and national laws which Congress enacts. If they are enforcing an unconstitutional law, then that law may be overturned in court. If their enforcement isn't backed up by a law, then they are violating a citizen's rights.FTA:But what can you do if you’re as stubborn as me and have a tendency to refuse unlawful orders?“Make sure you have an attorney that specializes in First Amendment law,” he said during Monday’s phone interview. “Make sure you have his cell phone and home number. Sometimes calling an attorney on the spot can be helpful.”
afruff23Jan 23, 2009
@fuzzmeisterLet's use your logic. By virtue of living within the imaginary boundaries that I define, I have the right to steal from you. Of course, you are free to move elsewhere (where you can be stolen from by someone else), which means it's okay to steal from you.
nerysJan 24, 2009
None. I am a pretty passive person in reality. It pretty hard to get me into a fight.Hitting me or violating my rights would be some of the few ways to get violence out of me and only if you persisted.but from an image perspective I can visually "look" menacing if want to. and the fact of the matter was I am 400 pound 6'3 he was no better than 150 pounds wet and maybe 5'8"Sometimes a wee bit of intimidation can go a long way.
afruff23Jan 24, 2009
@fuzzmeister"That's the way a nation works"At least you realize how illogical the concept of government is. Get back to me once you can provide arguments from first principles instead of saying something like "that's just the way it is"."I think you just want to "do what you want", and that doesn't square with the concept of government."So you're calling me selfish when I'm advocating that people be able to do whatever they want. On the other hand, you are not selfish when you are advocating control over other people's lives.
setecJan 25, 2009
The cameras were evidence. They have the right to seize video evidence of a shooting. The cop is being charged so what are you all complaining about? I know, you're upset because you didn't get to go home and upload it to YouTube. Those video cameras/cell phones, etc recorded the shooting death of a human being. The police had every right to take the cameras without a warrant because that type of evidence is movable and can be easily destroyed. They can seize the cameras, hold them and then get the search warrant to view them. They don't need to stand there guarding you and your camera while getting a warrant. If they let you hold the device, you might delete the video.
Closed AccountApr 3, 2009
That's what I would do in this situation if I couldn't run away with it. I would normally just tell them "no," but considering the police officer just shot someone...