On the flip side, the bias kind of does go both ways when it comes to someone getting kudos for having natural talent; because it is more expected that males are better than math and science you have to be quite exceptional to to really get any sort of praise. Of course, that is only relevant if you are doing it to get a pat on the back or not, but it is one curious aspect of the cultural bias.
Hm. I am not sure what you're trying to imply? The fact that you're unable to establish a line of credit is somehow the fault of men in sciences? Most women's awards are still merit based, its not enough to be a woman, you have to kick ass in your classes and research. The main point is, however, that men don't even have a way to compete for these awards and scholarships. Your comment just goes to show how women in sciences still feel some sense of entitlement simply because of their career choice.
I'm a female in my early 20's working on my PhD in Atmospheric Science (no, not to be a weather girl, no one spends years in computationally-intensive physics-based research to be on TV). I consider myself fortunate to have yet to run into any bias that really affected my career path--my parents, teachers, and college professors have all been nothing but supportive thus far. My female professors and older women in the field, however, have been the ones to warn me about discriminating situations they've found themselves in. Example: Going to an interview and being told "I don't know why you're here because women aren't even good scientists" and "I really wish you women didn't wear those pantsuits, I'd rather see you in a skirt because I like the way your legs look."
I have buddy whose wife went to a mediocre med school and after her fellowship she landed a job at Kaiser as a psychiatrist making $285k/year. She is not that smart--rather mediocre with some things and just plain stupid with others. This was about 6 years ago, now she makes well into the $300s. Contrast this with top computer science profs at Berkeley (its where i went to grad school) that make in the $60s-70s (its public record). Granted this is a nine month salary and summers are padded with grant and corporate contribution money, but still...youre right, science never has and never will be about the money.
I am sorry to point out the obvious, but what you're doing right now is exactly "bitching and moaning." College is hard, life is even harder; get used to it. It shouldn't be all sunshine and happiness when you're in college, but it is easier for women in science - that is a fact; even if you're not feeling the effects personally.
I suppose it just means we're great at everything, but we're also nice enough to let our other halves have their little areas they can control themselves, if we want to not get involved there. ;-)
But what about the claims that the scientists all conspire to say that we cause climate change for those big fat grants (which they don't personally keep anyway)? You mean scientists *aren't* in it for the money? /sDisclaimer - I know a lot of people in science and they are all paid f**king peanuts. It's insulting frankly, given how much work they've put into it.
Knowing how to bridges would have been fascinating. It is a feat of the human imagination and a triumph of man's ingenuity. I stand amazed at the bridge builders of the world, down through the ages. I recently saw of photo of a bridge built in 64 BC that is still in use (electrical lights and all). If I could choose one thing, it would be to have the perspective and knowledge of a physicist. Physicists are not afraid not to know. Or an astronomist. Or a microbiologist. Or a pharmacologist. Or a dreamer. So much to know. I embrace it all. Even the entropy of the universe? Frankly, yes. tinyurl.com/y9b3ktk. But since I can't understand or wrap my mind around the concept of wind in space (which has been bothering me for quite some time) - just can't get it - I may as well go back to washing dishes. Wish I could live out of a garden and never have dishes to wash so I could have more time to do what is important. ~Sigh. In my dreams.~ Oh well. It is a practical manifestation of entropy, no? Breathe in breathe out. There, now.
I never really experienced any bias while in college (as a female majoring in Computer Science), except for off the internets. :PI think a lot of the reason women don't go into these fields as much is because, as kids, we get to see movies where girls are princesses, and are conditioned by media and school peers to stay away from some fields and go towards others. Similarly, you'll notice that on almost all cartoons they always talk about how math is lame, or school is boring, so kids of any gender watching these shows start thinking that, too.
darkstar949Mar 22, 2010
On the flip side, the bias kind of does go both ways when it comes to someone getting kudos for having natural talent; because it is more expected that males are better than math and science you have to be quite exceptional to to really get any sort of praise. Of course, that is only relevant if you are doing it to get a pat on the back or not, but it is one curious aspect of the cultural bias.
axb156Mar 22, 2010
Hm. I am not sure what you're trying to imply? The fact that you're unable to establish a line of credit is somehow the fault of men in sciences? Most women's awards are still merit based, its not enough to be a woman, you have to kick ass in your classes and research. The main point is, however, that men don't even have a way to compete for these awards and scholarships. Your comment just goes to show how women in sciences still feel some sense of entitlement simply because of their career choice.
metnightowlMar 22, 2010
I'm a female in my early 20's working on my PhD in Atmospheric Science (no, not to be a weather girl, no one spends years in computationally-intensive physics-based research to be on TV). I consider myself fortunate to have yet to run into any bias that really affected my career path--my parents, teachers, and college professors have all been nothing but supportive thus far. My female professors and older women in the field, however, have been the ones to warn me about discriminating situations they've found themselves in. Example: Going to an interview and being told "I don't know why you're here because women aren't even good scientists" and "I really wish you women didn't wear those pantsuits, I'd rather see you in a skirt because I like the way your legs look."
fantasyflamzMar 22, 2010
I work in the video games industry and it's a sausage fest here too.
homercles337Mar 23, 2010
I have buddy whose wife went to a mediocre med school and after her fellowship she landed a job at Kaiser as a psychiatrist making $285k/year. She is not that smart--rather mediocre with some things and just plain stupid with others. This was about 6 years ago, now she makes well into the $300s. Contrast this with top computer science profs at Berkeley (its where i went to grad school) that make in the $60s-70s (its public record). Granted this is a nine month salary and summers are padded with grant and corporate contribution money, but still...youre right, science never has and never will be about the money.
axb156Mar 23, 2010
I am sorry to point out the obvious, but what you're doing right now is exactly "bitching and moaning." College is hard, life is even harder; get used to it. It shouldn't be all sunshine and happiness when you're in college, but it is easier for women in science - that is a fact; even if you're not feeling the effects personally.
frostekMar 23, 2010
I suppose it just means we're great at everything, but we're also nice enough to let our other halves have their little areas they can control themselves, if we want to not get involved there. ;-)
frostekMar 23, 2010
But what about the claims that the scientists all conspire to say that we cause climate change for those big fat grants (which they don't personally keep anyway)? You mean scientists *aren't* in it for the money? /sDisclaimer - I know a lot of people in science and they are all paid f**king peanuts. It's insulting frankly, given how much work they've put into it.
frostekMar 23, 2010
Men barely get praise for anything.
ireneattoliaMar 24, 2010
Knowing how to bridges would have been fascinating. It is a feat of the human imagination and a triumph of man's ingenuity. I stand amazed at the bridge builders of the world, down through the ages. I recently saw of photo of a bridge built in 64 BC that is still in use (electrical lights and all). If I could choose one thing, it would be to have the perspective and knowledge of a physicist. Physicists are not afraid not to know. Or an astronomist. Or a microbiologist. Or a pharmacologist. Or a dreamer. So much to know. I embrace it all. Even the entropy of the universe? Frankly, yes. tinyurl.com/y9b3ktk. But since I can't understand or wrap my mind around the concept of wind in space (which has been bothering me for quite some time) - just can't get it - I may as well go back to washing dishes. Wish I could live out of a garden and never have dishes to wash so I could have more time to do what is important. ~Sigh. In my dreams.~ Oh well. It is a practical manifestation of entropy, no? Breathe in breathe out. There, now.
lusikkamageMar 24, 2010
I never really experienced any bias while in college (as a female majoring in Computer Science), except for off the internets. :PI think a lot of the reason women don't go into these fields as much is because, as kids, we get to see movies where girls are princesses, and are conditioned by media and school peers to stay away from some fields and go towards others. Similarly, you'll notice that on almost all cartoons they always talk about how math is lame, or school is boring, so kids of any gender watching these shows start thinking that, too.