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Closed AccountAug 22, 2010
This needs to be mass produced now.
68024Aug 23, 2010
Everybody should have one of these in their home... just like a fridge or a washing machine.
BoldDragonAug 26, 2010
I would buy one.
az0707Aug 23, 2010
Probably that won't happen because of the big oil companies.
freckleearsAug 23, 2010
What grade of oil is created though. Plastic isn't created from 89 octane petrol. If all they are doing is reversing the process, then you won't have a usable fuel on a consumer level and big oil companies shouldn't be that worried. Consumers would also have no purpose in having one. A city or community having one at a landfill however, would be very good. The result could be refined into other usable fuels.
That being said... f**k big oil companies in the ass.
marytormeyAug 23, 2010
I did not find the source credible so here is a better link.
http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn12141-giant-microwave-turns-plastic-back-to-oil.html
dibbkdAug 23, 2010
Meh, if it does actually work, then people would start making, buying, and selling cheap plastic bricks to turn into oil.
stinky0Aug 23, 2010
Why would that be bad? It'd be made out of trash...no reason to make plastic just to turn it back into oil.
Closed AccountAug 23, 2010
That makes no sense. Why would you refine crude oil into plastic, then melt that plastic into oil again to be refined... again? This machine is for the TONS of plastic that is already out there.
All of this could create hundreds of gallons of fuel:
http://www.greatergoods.com/store/images/uploads/Crane_plastic_garbage.jpg
http://planetsave.com/files/2010/04/ocean-of-plastic1.jpg
http://susty.com/image/plastic-bottles-chris-jordan-photograph-phtographer-junk-waste-garbage-pepsi-brands-labels-aquafina-coke-photo.jpg
http://cdn.physorg.com/newman/gfx/news/hires/a2ndgarbagep.jpg
And that's just a few places. My street alone could probably fill several cars up.
worldnickAug 23, 2010
dibbkd, oil makes plastic. So if you want oil you can just use the oil in the first place. There is no need to turn it into plastic first. In fact that would be wasting a ton of energy. This device is to get the oil BACK out of the plastic. This is for reclaiming trash like burning old furniture instead of chopping down a new tree for firewood. What you are saying is since old furniture burns and you want a camp fire we should make a bunch of old furniture specifically to burn in the camp fire. Wow. You have got to be kidding.
dibbkdAug 23, 2010
@all of you - My point was that people are stupid, and that they'd make the plastic bricks cheap in China or somewhere to sell to us other stupid people to turn back into oil...
whooshh
Comment is buried, click here to see the rest.
Closed AccountAug 23, 2010
@dibbkd
Then why not say that in the first place. Nice cop out. /s
I'm sure you just weren't thinking.
letterqAug 23, 2010
How much electricity does it use? If the local electrical grid is supported by fossil-fuel-powered generators, this device could be consuming more oil than it's creating, and causing the release of more CO2 than it's preventing. Until we have an abundance of clean electricity (solar, wind, hydro, etc.), this device is a lot less useful than the video makes it sound.
Closed AccountAug 23, 2010
I may be wrong in this, but I believe a large portion of the attractiveness of this machine is that it takes plastic waste out of trashcans and makes it back into a usable commodity.
buckygradAug 23, 2010
From the information below the video:
"One kilogram of plastic waste produces almost a liter of oil while using about 1 kilowatt of electricity."
I don't see how this reduces the "usefulness". It may reduce the effectiveness as a global warming reduction agent but that is not the only reason for a machine like this (less land fill usage for example).
bozmillarAug 23, 2010
It's great that they can claim it uses 1 kilowatt, but that is the wrong unit. how many kilowatt hours does it require to convert a kilogram?
Saying that it takes only 1 kilowatt to run is like saying that Alaska isn't far from where I live because the speed limit is 60mph.
bewareofthecowAug 23, 2010
@bozmillar
Apparently it takes 3 hours to produce this 1 liter of oil, so I suppose 3 kWh would be the cost of 1 liter.
That being said, you still only get a semi refined liter of oil for your 3 kWh. If you want something useful like gasoline, I'd imagine you'd need even more energy.
My question is if you had his plastic to oil machine AND an oil to gasoline machine both running off a gasoline powered generator, would be producing enough gasoline to power the generator? And if you are barely breaking even, what is the purpose other than reducing the volume of waste in a landfill?
diggimatorAug 27, 2010
Consider the alternative of transporting oil from the middle east. All that travel must consume energy. The conversion machine could also be useful when oil prices are high.
letterqAug 23, 2010
@bewareofthecow - "what is the purpose other than reducing the volume of waste in a landfill"
That is exactly why I said it's not very useful unless there's a "green" power source (solar, wind, hydro, etc.) to run it with. Converting plastic into generator exhaust doesn't seem worthwhile, and I would bet it doesn't even come close to making enough fuel to run the generator that powers it anyway.
mz00mAug 23, 2010
It is being installed in a number of locations in the US right now. This is the company that is producing them: http://www.envion.com/
Full article here: http://www.gizmag.com/envion-plastic-waste-to-oil-generator/12902/
eraptorAug 23, 2010
Envion's ties to the Carlyle group does not bode well for its prospects in the U.S.
msparks789Aug 23, 2010
That dude is going to make a s**tload of money.
aliwallaAug 23, 2010
a kw costs 12p in the UK and petrol retails for 110p
hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm
bewareofthecowAug 23, 2010
Apparently it takes 3 hours to produce this 1 liter of oil, so I suppose 3 kWh would be the cost of 1 liter.
That being said, you still only get a semi refined liter of oil for your 3 kWh. If you want something useful like gasoline, I'd imagine you'd need even more energy.
My question is if you had his plastic to oil machine AND an oil to gasoline machine both running off a gasoline powered generator, would it be producing enough gasoline to power the generator? And if you are barely breaking even, what is the purpose other than reducing the volume of waste in a landfill?
ckailiAug 23, 2010
I think the idea would be to couple this with clean/renewable energy sources.
trailmix10Aug 26, 2010
It still takes more energy to run than it produces.
maxjanAug 22, 2010
A must have for any zombie survivalist. And a step closer to Mr. Fusion.
cajungator3Aug 23, 2010
And a step farther from Mr. Coffee.
hobofatsAug 23, 2010
what about Mr Radar?
cooldude777Aug 23, 2010
Where were going we don't need roads!
cooldude777Aug 23, 2010
f**k, missed the apostrophe.
tallestskilAug 23, 2010
Go back in time and insert it!
psiphreAug 23, 2010
that's what she said!
33percentgodAug 23, 2010
Leaving Mr. Manager out of it?
(Just manager)
dirtyfriesAug 22, 2010
Next war will be in the South Pacific for the garbage patch
nosecohnAug 23, 2010
It's in the North Pacific.
Closed AccountAug 23, 2010
Theres a few of 'em but you're correct about North Pacific being the f**king huge one.
Closed AccountAug 23, 2010
they won't make it all the way to the patch before they start fighting.
troyfoleyAug 23, 2010
You're just trying to throw us off the trail.
brettmjohnsonAug 23, 2010
As others have pointed out, its in the north pacific.
Considering how sparsely distributed the plastic particles are, if scooping them up then converting them to oil yields just enough energy to power an automated plastic-collecting-converting vessel, then we have a winner.
A bunch of robot ships going round an round, cleaning up the plastic. Unfortunately, by the time the plastic runs out, the robot ship will have achieved sentience and will come after us.
korvan504521Aug 23, 2010
Imperative: Eliminate plastic waste.
Processing:
Observation: Waste continues to accumulate.
Processing
Observation: Source of plastic waste identified.
Processing
Observation: Elimination of source of plastic waste will eliminate all future plastic waste
Processing:
New Imperative: DESTROY ALL HUMANS.
heliumflashAug 23, 2010
Too bad it will probably also scoop up thousands of fish and wildlife.
mrfishAug 24, 2010
Scooping up a few fish vs s**t load of plastic that will never breakdown... hmmm which is better.
louayAug 23, 2010
i believe it hasn't been said yet but its in the north pacific...
slashdotordiggAug 23, 2010
And then BP is going to spill billions of tons of garbage patch all over.....back to where it was..oh well then.
worldnickAug 23, 2010
Do not tell the hoarders about this... or do I'm not sure
apackofmonkeysAug 23, 2010
No blood for garbage!
preweddingSep 15, 2010
you are right bro....make better world
regards
www.idophotograph.com
anomaly100Aug 22, 2010
That's brilliant.
eshinnAug 23, 2010
...and selling it back to the oil Tycoon for $200 a barrel is even better ;.)
craftyguyAug 23, 2010
lol @ $200 a barrel, it's more cost-effective for them to ignore you and keep doing what they've been doing since the late 1800s.
Closed AccountAug 23, 2010
42 gallons of oil to a barrel, ~4 liters to a gallon, and being extremely generous with electricity provided at 15 cents a kW-hr (reasonable in most areas for a corporate electric bill), that's 60c to produce a gallon of oil, or about $25 per gallon to produce oil from plastic. An oil well costs maybe $10 to produce a barrel of oil, but more difficult sources that require more drilling or refining (like getting oil from the tar sands of Arizona and New Mexico) can cost $30-50.
Ultimately, this probably isn't a good major source for oil because there's probably also a lot of labor involved, and I doubt the machine can be scaled to the extent where it becomes profitable for a big oil company, but it definitely could help our plastic problem.
ronpauliskingAug 23, 2010
I bet ya the oil companies try to buy the patent so no one can use it
Closed AccountAug 23, 2010
If that seriously happened. A Cee-lo F**k You! to the oil companies and screwing over the earth even more.
goweigusAug 23, 2010
is that a Crank reference?
Closed AccountAug 23, 2010
Oh s**t they're gold diggas!
bipolarruledoutAug 23, 2010
But capitalism is the greatest system in existence! You must hate america!
vdoogsAug 23, 2010
ooo oo oooo!
kaveti6616Aug 23, 2010
The patent could be stricken in court if it could be proven that the technology is a public necessity. At least that's what I hope.
bipolarruledoutAug 23, 2010
Uh.... when was the last time that happened?
innovatiAug 23, 2010
patents in what country? the world is bigger than america…
soupgfxAug 23, 2010
I was thinking the same thing. How much do you think the oil companies will pay this guy for this world changing machine? 100 mil? 1 billion? 2 billion? Drop in the bucket for them to squash something that might actually allow us to do something nice for the world.
eshinnAug 23, 2010
Yeah, but wouldn't being able to give big oil the finger be priceless?
brezzzAug 23, 2010
That's the idea of buying a patent.
worldnickAug 23, 2010
Down with patents. Seriously I believe they are a really bad idea and inhibit progress more than they motivate it. The original purpose of patents were to lure inventors to England by the Monarchy to profit from their work. Scientists and inventors will always innovate. Real inventors don't care who uses their inventions. They want the whole world to use them. A law prohibiting the use of an invention by anyone, but the registered inventor in a country of 300 million is strictly the realm of lawyers and aristocrats.
Free science from corporate ownership. Be ready for wild and rampant progress and production. We never needed the patent system. It is a simple system of control imposed by those who control capital to hold on to that capital. If anyone could build and sell whatever they wanted there would be too much competition and a loss of control from our corporate masters. A window of 30 years or so keeps them safely ahead and progress at a slow manageable speed.
As long as they can pay for the rights, the scientists, the convoluted registration system it guarantees the rest of us will be digging around in the dirt with sticks forever.
tk0680Aug 23, 2010
I think some sort of system that ensured ideas (and credit) aren't stolen is necessary, but yes the current system is a terrible one. Take the GPL (investigate the open source world, those who are unsure as to what the GPL is) - you cannot restrict usage of something covered by it, but equally you must give credit to the original author if you use his work yourself.
Why not patent things in such a way?
artworkz918Aug 23, 2010
if there's no money in it, there's no incentive to invent in the first place. people gotta eat
heavenfallAug 23, 2010
@worldnick I think you have a naive view of the world, and the progress of a country's economic possibilities.
First off, companies invest huge amounts of capital into research. Where would this money come from, if the companies weren't allowed to keep what they researched? Secondly, scientists and inventors are directly paid by that capital. Sure, some would probably do some fun things in their spare time, but that's not the same thing as mapping the human genome, or inventing a cure for AIDS. Third, technological progress drives the economy of a country just as much as having a functional banking system, or a government.
In macroeconomics, the basic formula for figuring out a country's economic wealth is (technology * workforce skill * capital). A solution where companies couldn't keep their patents would directly hamper the progress of technology, as well as the desire for people to educate themselves to become scientists.
Government grants vs company funding vs private experimentation is an interesting discussion, but it is completely moot. Company funding increases the overall amount of research monies available to the world, and I therefore have no choice to see it as something extremely positive.
I'm not arguing that patent laws should be ludicrous. I'm all for a reasonable time period, in order for the company to have a chance to regain its investment(+profit). But no patents allowed is insane.
d1ckinaboxAug 23, 2010
On the surface this seems like a breakthrough of the century if it catches on...
shwaavayAug 23, 2010
Did you not consider the amount of energy being used by the machine? Did you think about the fact that most of that energy is going to come from fossil fuels?
I guarantee that this is less efficient as far as CO2 handling, than not doing it.Comment is buried, click here to see the rest.
itsnickkAug 23, 2010
the point could be more to just getting rid of the plastics that strangle the environment then more oil.
ryokuchaaAug 23, 2010
Who said the machine needs to run on a fossil fuel?
Solar or wind power would be great alternative means to power the machine, in fact it would make more sense in those third world countries without reliable sources of power. I think this is really just a demo model to show that it works.
Of course I agree with you, if it remained as it was on coal or oil based power, it would be pointless since it would use more fuel causing a bigger CO2 impact then not doing it at all.
But I think it is obvious that a green machine would be designed around green energy sources in final production models.
nevariusAug 23, 2010
A solar furnace comes to mind. If a solar furnace can reach temperatures to melt steel, then plastic should be cake.
artworkz918Aug 23, 2010
mmmmm cake...
shinzenAug 23, 2010
You lie!
About the cake.
xsubmergedAug 23, 2010
Personally, I don't know why you're getting dugg down, and I don't care that I will either. You have a good point! Also, we could power it with solar, wind, hydro power...but that's still taking away renewable energy from something else and since most of our electricity comes from burning fossil fuels, in the big picture, it's just like burning oil to create oil. I would be interested to see how efficient the machine is....
seenbymanyAug 23, 2010
FTA:"One kilogram of plastic waste produces almost a liter of oil while using about 1 kilowatt of electricity."
Based on some quick Google math.....it takes ~ 0.0273 gallons (or 0.10334174 liters) to produce 1kilowatt of electricity. So from the 1L of oil that you create using this machine, you would have 0,9L left.....seems economical to me
08stiAug 23, 2010
Wow, this is amazing -- wonder why it hasn't been nationally publicized yet? Major break through!
gemlarinAug 23, 2010
It is not a new invention.
http://www.gizmag.com/envion-plastic-waste-to-oil-generator/12902/
The reason you don't see it being used vary often is 3-fold.
...
1. It has a negative energy potential. It takes more energy to do the conversion than the oil produced will provide. This means that you burn more petrochemicals (natural gas, coal, diesel) at power plants to generate the power to run the conversion process than you would ever get from the plastic.
2. It is incredibly expensive to dispose of the waste products. Once you remove the oil, you are left with byproducts like Chlorine, Ethers, and BPA that are much more harmful and dangerous to animals (and humans) than when it is bound in the plastic chemical chain. These chemicals will end up being stored in containers and buried just like they do with other dangerous waste chemical.
3. It requires less energy to extract petrochemicals from the earth than it is recover them from plastics.
giantbirdcrapAug 23, 2010
Invent something to dispose of the byproducts and turn it into oil.
smacksawAug 23, 2010
And then invent a machine to turn this machine into oil once we've converted all of the plastic into oil.
worldnickAug 23, 2010
I'm sure there are industries that could use chlorine and ether. I have put chlorine in my pool and I think it is used in water purification as well. I know there are uses for ether... can't think of any off the top of my head. Anyway the point is that if they are extracting these chemicals from the environment currently then maybe this process could be another more green way to get them.
worldnickAug 23, 2010
Another point is that this is a different way to produce oil. In fact clean energy like solar could be used to produce this oil. Meaning solar power could indirectly be used to run your petrol car at least until you get an electric or start riding the train. (The sun indirectly produced the oil in the first place) The point is that oil is like a battery. It is like a battery that a lot of us are already using and this is a novel way to get that battery new and help out the environment a little. It is by no means a long term solution, but I can see it's usefulness.
Closed AccountAug 23, 2010
Chlorine, chlorinated organic compounds, and ethers are EXTREMELY dangerous to those who don't know how to handle them properly. They belong in a lab or a hazardous waste facility, not out on a farm or in a street.
Many of these easily and instantly vaporize, are colorless and odorless, and are very carcinogenic. You don't want untrained people trying to store or handle them.
tona107Aug 23, 2010
Ethers are used as solvents in many industrially applicable chemical reactions.
reallynotnickAug 23, 2010
#1 and #3 are basically the same thing, because if oil took more energy to get out of the earth then we got back it too would be a total waste of time, otherwise great points.
lngarrettAug 23, 2010
So let me get this straight..
Oil + Plastic = Less Oil + Chlorine + Ethers + BPA
reduce...
Oil + Plastic = Chlorine + Ethers + BPA
So it's a plastic to toxic chemical converter than runs on oil? That doesn't sound good.
s1ngular1ty1Aug 23, 2010
4. A lot of plastics don't melt. They are called thermosets.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thermosetting_polymer
kanockAug 23, 2010
5. People want plastic, hence why oil is made into it in the first place. You could simply recycle the plastic for use as plastic, and save all this expensive process.
crimsonflashAug 23, 2010
I doubt the Japanese would sell it to big oil companies. They seem like people who would want everyone to have access to it, not just two or three companies.
Closed AccountAug 23, 2010
2.2 lbs of plastic converted into 34 fl oz of oil for about $.15
I'm sure the oil would be only good for a furnace since it would be "dirty" oil.
Still...Not bad...I gotta think home heating oil costs more than $.60/gallon.....Comment is buried, click here to see the rest.
fuzzynyankoAug 23, 2010
He said it could be refined to gasoline, kerosene, and diesel.
Closed AccountAug 23, 2010
...do you have a refinery?
deadpoetic333Aug 23, 2010
No, but rumor has it they exist.
thcobbsAug 23, 2010
@deadpoetic
Unfortunately due to environmental regulations and NIMBY movements, there hasn't been a refinery built in the USA in about 30+ years.
brettmjohnsonAug 23, 2010
From another article about the company:
"Since the oil resulting from the first machine is unrefined, Blest also manufactures machines to refine the oil, the BOR-20 and BOR-50, so that it can be used in other applications such as running your car."
leftamiAug 23, 2010
Unfortunately due to Oil Companies not wanting to cut into their profits, there hasn't been a refinery built in the USA in about 30+ years as they won't build them unless they can cut corners and pollute the environment.
deadpoetic333Aug 23, 2010
USA isn't the main benefactor of technology like this. Our gasoline is relatively cheap when compared to other countries. Here's an out of date comparison (2007) I found with a very quick Google search:
http://peoplesgeography.com/2007/06/18/world-petrol-price-comparison-its-a-gas-gas-gas/
If we don't bank on this technology because of one reason or another, plenty of other countries with more incentive (like we didn't have enough) will. Even if we have laws in place that make building a new refinery practically impossible, other countries won't.
thcobbsAug 23, 2010
"Unfortunately due to Oil Companies not wanting to cut into their profits, there hasn't been a refinery built in the USA in about 30+ years as they won't build them unless they can cut corners and pollute the environment."
Bulls**t. I used to work for a technology company that was owned by another oil company. They spent a DECADE shelling out money hand over fist for environmental studies, wildlife impact, geological surveys, economic impact studies, licenses for the same....
And even though they showed they'd bring hundreds of high-paying jobs to a depressed area and they would have been able to capture 95%+ of "greenhouse gasses" that were produced by the facility, they could never get final approval... So they just quit trying to do things the right way, bought an old refinery, automated it, and went on with business.
1packerAug 23, 2010
I would be curious as to how much effort would have to go into the oil in order to make it run in a car. If it takes a traditional amount then this wouldn't really be practical in the home, but it still solves two major problems, plastic waste, and extending our supplies of oil.
wilywondrAug 23, 2010
I can tell you that heating oil this past January was selling for $2.59/gal here in the midwest US. It is going for about $2/gal wholesale right now.
http://www.wtrg.com/daily/heatingoilprice.html
smacksawAug 23, 2010
This stuff + methanol + lye = cheap driving in your VW TDI
vilestruAug 23, 2010
let's make sure we focus on profit... not saving the planet... idiot.
propethicAug 23, 2010
This isn't new.
brettmjohnsonAug 23, 2010
This article references a 16 month old OurWorld article, which in turn is about an announcement made in 2007. I am guessing the process is not scalable, or every recycling plant in the U.S. would have one.
knucklesAug 23, 2010
Even if it was scalable, my thoughts go towards the amount of energy it would take to convert plastic back to oil. If it takes close to, or more, energy than the value of the gas that comes out the other end then no-one will consider this as an option.
brettmjohnsonAug 23, 2010
In another article, an auto wrecking facility was using a similar machine to separate scrap metal and plastic, and the hydrocarbon gas and oil produced was enough to run the machine itself, plus all the other machines in the facility. So it looks like a net positive when used on small to medium scale.
justinscientistAug 23, 2010
Or there really is more than CO2 in the exhaust. I saw him cramming some styrofoam in there. Are we basically burning plastic and styrofoam in liquid form? And what other solids were still left in the chamber? Surely it didn't vaporize everything in there.
propethicAug 23, 2010
It may not even be about scalability. We already have large facilities that process waste in similar ways like gassification or pyrolyzation(sp?). The problems with those types of plants is 1.) you're using more energy then you're getting out 2.) when you do this to impure trash you are left over with all of the impurities and sludge that is in the plastic but isn't oil, this sludge is in many cases toxic and radioactive.
acrantradAug 23, 2010
YAY! Ocean pollution turned into air pollution!
tyrghastAug 23, 2010
Did you even read the article?
fuzzynyankoAug 23, 2010
I hope it comes here soon. I heard recycling plastic bottles isn't worth it, and finding another use for them is just brilliant
thrillki1lAug 23, 2010
I've also heard that it is more expensive to recycle plastic bags than it is to make new ones. Plastic bags are a way bigger problem than bottles.
kyanAug 23, 2010
Recycling can also meaning the same one over and over again. Also, if you use a cloth bag that will last for years, no-one had to either make you a new plastic bag or recycle your old ones - cua you just stopped using them!
frostekAug 23, 2010
"I've also heard that it is more expensive to recycle plastic bags than it is to make new ones."
You're forgetting you still have to pay the disposal costs of the original bottle.
shwaavayAug 23, 2010
This is recycling, and it's also not worth it.
thrillki1lAug 23, 2010
If this guy doesn't get a nobel prize I'll be outraged.
shwaavayAug 23, 2010
Have you ever heard of recycling plastic, same thing. No breakthrough here.
tokeliAug 23, 2010
Lol, holy f**k, you think recycling plastic turns it back into oil?
shwaavayAug 23, 2010
It's one of the many uses of waste plastic... HOLY f**k!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plastic_recycling#Monomer_recycling
s1ngular1ty1Aug 23, 2010
This is not a huge break through and he isn't the first person to think of it.
fountaindewAug 23, 2010
It helps at a small scale, but like so many people have said already: The oil you get back is less energy than was required to boil it in the first place. Its the same dilema as converting salt water to drinking water. This is not a solution to the problem yet.
tntbassAug 23, 2010
Which is why anyone who would have one of these would power it using alternative energy like solar or wind. I could see these coming with their own solar cells to use to power the device.
What to do with the gas/oil/etc that gets generated is another thing. I'd still prefer to buy my gas at the gas station, but I'd like to be able to sell off these byproducts and dispose of the waste someplace too. Maybe at the same gas station you could have a waste disposal area and an area to sell off the oil by products.
boardthisAug 23, 2010
And when you see the J-Man, you tell him, "Bosco says we're even." And up your ass with Mobil Gas.
danwgreAug 23, 2010
Plastic in a proper landfill is a carbon sink, greenies.
phylaxerAug 23, 2010
Japan may not have room for huge landfills. Land is more scarce. This would be an improvement over burning.
danwgreAug 23, 2010
The japanese could probably make an island out old plastic and then have more land to live on.
mitcheypooAug 23, 2010
They actually do this. ^
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Land_reclamation
afastingartistAug 23, 2010
FTA: "One kilogram of plastic waste produces almost a liter of oil while using about 1 kilowatt of electricity."
Am I the only nerd that gets super-annoyed reading this? Tell me how much energy it takes, not how much power! Or how long it takes to convert using that power.
tevatronAug 23, 2010
They probably mean kilowatt-hour. 1 kwh = 3,600,000 joules
woollymittensAug 23, 2010
No, why would they mean a kilowatt-hour? What a dangerous assumption. Your microwave uses a kilowatt as well, but you'd have to run it for an hour at full power to go through a kilowatt-hour.
srs2000Aug 23, 2010
http://www.blest.co.jp/seihin-1.html
Product name Be-h (Bieichi)
Processing capacity 0.7 ~ 1.0kg / times
Oil rate 80% (about 3 hours time)
Mechanical Dimensions 560 (W) × 320 (D) × 500 (H) mm
Weight Approximately 50kg
Power AC100V / 14A maximum
゙ cost Ranninku 1KW / hour (as a guide.)
Feature Eye can see - we are made of oil
- You begin the oil out from around one hour
How easy to use - anyone!
Home - 100V power available?
They have larger units as well.
Closed AccountAug 23, 2010
Better translation.
http://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=ja&u=http://www.blest.co.jp/seihin-1.html&ei=twhyTLxIw4LyBqSF_eQL&sa=X&oi=translate&ct=result&resnum=1&ved=0CBYQ7gEwAA&prev=/search%3Fq%3Dhttp://www.blest.co.jp/seihin-1.html%26hl%3Den%26client%3Dopera%26hs%3DUOQ%26rls%3Den
Closed AccountAug 23, 2010
"Processing capacity 0.7 ~ 1.0kg / times"
I think that should read Processing capacity 0.7 ~ 1.0kg at a time.
bipolarruledoutAug 23, 2010
It takes three hours to process one kg? How much is the thing?
boodaddy69Aug 23, 2010
Really dont think it matters, since they were making the comparison based on the fixed amount of one liter. Producing one liter of oil from this machine uses 1 kilowatt, regardless of how long it takes. if it took 2 years, it still only used 1 kilowatt to produce the liter of oil.
So, for your nerdiness satisfaction: the machine uses 1KW of energy / 1 Liter of oil produced.
Heres some more food for thought:
There is about 1.7MWh of power in a barrel of oil. (See the BOE for details).
There is about 158 liters in a barrel of oil. (one barrel = 42 US gallons)
So, a liter of crude oil you have somewhere around 10KWh of power.
That seems like a good conversion to me, it would take 10 hours of processing before the machine would become ineffecient.
friedjellyfishAug 23, 2010
Sorry, but that doesn't make any sense. W is a unit of power. Wh is a unit of energy. Not the other way round. And comparing volume to power makes no sense. Either you have to compare "volume per time" to power (="energy per time"), or volume to energy.
tevatronAug 23, 2010
I'm skeptical about the energy efficiency of converting plastic back to oil but if the article is correct in saying that it only takes one kilowatt-hour to create a liter of oil, this machine might actually be pretty useful. A liter of oil nets about 9.6 kwh assuming I'm doing my conversions correctly and this source is valid: http://www.ocean.washington.edu/courses/envir215/energynumbers.pdf
Of course, it's not clear to me if the oil made by this process has that kind of energy yield. Anyone with a bit more knowledge care to comment?
afastingartistAug 23, 2010
It does not say it takes 1kW-hr.
neutron7Aug 23, 2010
The machine uses 1KW but does not say for how long.
brettmjohnsonAug 23, 2010
As srs2000 mentions above, it is 1kw/h for 3 hours.
brettmjohnsonAug 23, 2010
As srs2000 mentions above, it is 1kw/h for 3 hours. So if electricity costs $0.20 per kwh, then 1 liter of unrefined oil costs $0.60 to produce (about $2.25 per gallon for non-metric US residents). Almost worth it for end users that would pay that retail for fuel oil. Definitely not worth it for oil companies.
Closed AccountAug 23, 2010
@brettmjohnson
1Killowatt for 3 hours would be 3kw/h
Closed AccountAug 23, 2010
@brettmjohnson
20 cents/kwh? Really? I only pay 9.3 cents/kwh.
bipolarruledoutAug 23, 2010
No, no, no. It's 1kw for the ENTIRE 3 hour process or 1kw total PER CYCLE.
shinzenAug 23, 2010
ITT, people who don't understand units of measurement.
kylerodenAug 23, 2010
Watt - rate of energy (joule per second)
Joule - amount of energy
watt / hr - rate that energy changes
watt * hr - energy (3600 joules)
The relevant unit here is watt*hr, energy.
shwaavayAug 23, 2010
Did you catch the part where he says burning 1kg of plastic releases 3kg of CO2? That's pretty much impossible.
brettmjohnsonAug 23, 2010
Not really. CO2 means one carbon atom combined with 2 oxygen atoms. Since the atomic weights of carbon and oxygen are close (12 and 16), 1kg of carbon atoms from plastic will combine with nearly 2kg of oxygen atoms (from the atmosphere), to produce nearly 3kg of CO2.
phylaxerAug 23, 2010
You know that oxygen has mass, right?
shwaavayAug 23, 2010
Good point, I hadn't thought of that.
brettmjohnsonAug 23, 2010
PET plastic is about 2/3 Carbon and 1/3 Oxygen, so Shwaayvay has a bit of a point.
schwab002Aug 23, 2010
Ya this machine is only useful if it's an energy efficient process. Of course as oil becomes more and more expensive this machine could become more and more viable.
bipolarruledoutAug 23, 2010
How efficient are trucks at moving plastic to landfills?
tevatronAug 23, 2010
Yeah, I made the assumption that the writer made the common mistake of leaving out the hour when saying "One kilogram of plastic waste produces almost a liter of oil while using about 1 kilowatt of electricity" Probably a bad assumption but kwh IS a common energy unit.
I wonder if the 1kg of plastic to 3 kg of CO2 was supposed to be "1kg of plastic to 3 liters of CO2" as in the previous statement they were discussing how many liters of oil 1 kg of plastic produced. It's unfortunate that the video and article have so these errors. Makes it really hard to fully appreciate how useful the device is.
shwaavayAug 23, 2010
It makes it easy to spot the bulls**t though.
I've been reading the Pure Energy Systems, free energy newsletter for years now, BS like this is common and I have developed an internal filter for it.
http://peswiki.com/index.php/Main_Page
bipolarruledoutAug 23, 2010
Half that site is crackpot news articles!
srs2000Aug 23, 2010
http://www.blest.co.jp/seihin-1.html
Product name Be-h (Bieichi)
Processing capacity 0.7 ~ 1.0kg / times
Oil rate 80% (about 3 hours time)
Mechanical Dimensions 560 (W) × 320 (D) × 500 (H) mm
Weight Approximately 50kg
Power AC100V / 14A maximum
゙ cost Ranninku 1KW / hour (as a guide.)
Feature Eye can see - we are made of oil
- You begin the oil out from around one hour
How easy to use - anyone!
Home - 100V power available?
tevatronAug 23, 2010
Cool. Unfortunately the translation is a bit unclear. If I understand the translation correctly, it takes approximately 3 hours to get 80% of your oil, and the maximum amount of plastic you can put in is 1kg. So you'd net ~.8 liter of oil for 3kwh of electricity. Definitely not as nice but it'd still supposedly result in a net gain.
srs2000Aug 23, 2010
That is their smallest unit.
I believe, from translations of their other products, that it processes about 1 kilo an hour. But I'm not 100% sure on that.
The larger machine: http://www.blest.co.jp/seihin-3.html
Processing capacity 10kg / hour
Feature - Can be operated continuously 24 hours!
- All driving touch panel operation
- Residue (oil, raw materials can not be) is automatically discharged!
Rate of 80% or more - oil!
They have a jpeg with more info.. but google chrome can't translate a picture... yet.
tekdemonAug 23, 2010
Well it takes 1kW to make it into "oil" but it'll take further energy to make it into a refined product like gasoline. You'd probably still gain some energy but it does seem pretty energy intensive. Also it's not likely that you're gonna go dig through the dumps for plastic so it's mostly going to be about diverting currently recycled plastics towards this end instead and I suspect that some of the other current uses for recycled plastic are a bit more energy efficient. Cool idea though.
bertqbAug 23, 2010
Throw Heidi Montag through that thing.
smacksawAug 23, 2010
The silicone would gum up the machine.
lightphoenixAug 23, 2010
The problem with this is that (most) plastics aren't simply oil, especially modern ones. If that were the case, we wouldn't have problems like plastics recycling or BPA leeching. They're complex chemicals, and thus require complex solutions.
myztryAug 23, 2010
PVC releases acids as a byproduct. You would end up with pretty nasty bong water...
idiggaponyAug 23, 2010
"Burning plastic releases tons of CO2 into the atmosphere contributing to global warming.... Akinori Ito, the CEO of Blest, a Japanese company, has somewhat of a panacea."
So we turn the plastic into oil, and THEN we burn it? I'm no environmental engineer, but I have a feeling "panacea" might not be an applicable term here.
elburro88Aug 23, 2010
I'd guess oil would be easier to store than plastics, and easier to re-use.
sumdogAug 23, 2010
well we'd use the oil anyway, so you're removing the transportation and mining/drilling costs, plus reducing the pollution that comes from leeching in landfills.
I'm still skeptical about the whole process though. Can his machine do non 1/2 plastics? Why has recycling always been such a huge problem? How does his machine overcome the current systems?
Closed AccountAug 23, 2010
well, you are right, as i saw the video, that oil released so much dark smoke after he burnt it.
but there are still other ways to use that oil without burning it.
- using as machine oil for lubrication and decreasing friction.
- making them oil for sex, good lotion for lubrication.
- or producing baby ass oil out of that.
- could be used as cooling oil in transformers or heaters.
-could be used as heating oil in home heating machines.Comment is buried, click here to see the rest.
bipolarruledoutAug 23, 2010
That's because of other byproducts in the plastic. This oil is really quite nasty and really shouldn't be used near the body (or perhaps even burned) unless you want your balls to fall off via BPA.
phylaxerAug 23, 2010
I believe when you combust gasoline you get a lower ratio of CO2 emissions than when you burn plastic. That's why it's beneficial.
bipolarruledoutAug 23, 2010
That's because gasoline is highly refined for low emissions, especially in the US.
krandenAug 23, 2010
This is pretty amazing
neutron7Aug 23, 2010
1 kilowatt hour? or 1 kilowatt for 5 minutes? how much power does it use to convert 1 kilo to oil?
and once we know that, how much power can you get out of 1 liter of oil, is it more or less than the machine uses? and can diesel cars run on it?
hokies499Aug 23, 2010
If that could work on a mass scale, can u imagine how much a landfill would suddenly be worth?
s1ngular1ty1Aug 23, 2010
A negative amount seeing the machine uses more energy then it recovers in the form of oil.
artworkz918Aug 23, 2010
ummmm nothing
Closed AccountAug 23, 2010
BREAKING (future) NEWS!
Monday, August 23, 2010:
Akinori Ito, the CEO of Blest, a Japanese company, who has invented a machine that converts waste plastic into usable oil like fuel, was found dead in his home this morning. At first it was thought to be a murder, but then it was revealed that he had heart complications. Now we're receiving word that it was most definitely a suicide. Yup, it was a suicide no doubt about it....... nothing to see here so turn the page.
smacksawAug 23, 2010
Why won't Julian Assange deny that he might have raped and killed Akinori Ito in 1995?
Closed AccountAug 23, 2010
Actually Julian and Rand Paul got together, raped him, killed him and then sacrificed infants and baby seals on the same day.
boomchockalockaAug 23, 2010
Shot himself in the back of the head... twice.
/old joke
neutron7Aug 23, 2010
I wonder if home furnace could run on that oil. if it is actually 1KWH per KG of plastic(which they do not tell you) you could heat your house pretty cheap.
Closed AccountAug 23, 2010
It can run on this oil. One of the more refined products is kerosene, along with gasoline and diesel.
Closed AccountAug 23, 2010
Good, we can get rid of all the plastic and focus on biodegradable alternatives like cellulose.
f**king plastic.
s1ngular1ty1Aug 23, 2010
Hahhahhhahah...
Oh wait, you're serious... :8
ohitsdomAug 23, 2010
How does it work?
teamelectricAug 23, 2010
this is definitely a step in the right direction but the sooner we get off our oil dependency the better
fattehboiAug 23, 2010
Into_Oil
denelson83Aug 23, 2010
With a o_O in the middle of that.
jeffnessAug 23, 2010
We would never run out of a place to dump plastic waste. every single once of american waste could be fit into a single large landfill that would take up no more space than a few dozen square miles. I'm all for recycling and stuff, because we should always strive to reuse our non renewable resources, but please don't support these efforts with false facts.
stinky0Aug 23, 2010
This is a very uninformed response though I have a feeling you improperly hit reply so it looks worse than it is. For one - obviously there's more space on the earth than oil-based plastic because all that plastic fit inside the earth as oil before we extracted it. Do you think it would be efficient to have one huge landfill? It would take a LOT more resources to do that so instead we have thousands of them. There's also heaps of trash that never make it to the landfills and a lot of trash is also very toxic. There's trash islands in the oceans where currents meet and small pieces of worn-down plastic are present in alarming quantities in open oceans.
zumieznoskateAug 23, 2010
Did anyone else think that this is where mr. Fusion comes from?
soleblazerAug 23, 2010
Holy s**t, its Mr Fusion for real people (back to the future)
http://bttf.wikia.com/wiki/Mr._Fusion
inactiveuserAug 23, 2010
Thermal depolymerisation is not new. There are several American and European companies trying to get government to legislate a change in land fill laws to allow total recycling of all garbage. Wood, plastics, metals and organics.
bewareofthecowAug 23, 2010
There is some complicated math when figuring in the amount of energy required to convert these materials back into a usable form.
heyalanAug 23, 2010
Garbage Disposal Fields are now Oil Fields, Energy Fields.
woollymittensAug 23, 2010
A kilowatt gives no information on the amount of power used. Does the machine take a minute or a week to process the plastic? This process could actually use up more oil than it produces in the form of electricity.
srs2000Aug 23, 2010
Product name Be-h (Bieichi)
Processing capacity 0.7 ~ 1.0kg / times
Oil rate 80% (about 3 hours time)
Mechanical Dimensions 560 (W) × 320 (D) × 500 (H) mm
Weight Approximately 50kg
Power AC100V / 14A maximum
゙ cost Ranninku 1KW / hour (as a guide.)
Feature Eye can see - we are made of oil
- You begin the oil out from around one hour
How easy to use - anyone!
Home - 100V power available?
kylerodenAug 23, 2010
KW/hour refers to the rate that power is changing.
energy consumed would by KW * hour
In this case, if 3 hours, 100kW * 3 hours = 1.08 giga joules (which is the total energy used)
The article says 1 liter of oil. according to the internet, 1 barrel of crude oil(42 gallons) is 6.1 giga joules of energy. so one liter of crude oil is 0.03 giga joules of energy.
So, for 1.08 GJ of energy you get 0.03 GJ worth of oil. yes, lets start mass producing this immediately!
(I know the energy content of the oil produced is probably not the exact same as crude oil, but it should be close enough)
inactiveuserAug 23, 2010
The gas in a larger system is more than enough to drive it.
For each kg of plastic you can extract 3kw of energy as gas.
kylerodenAug 23, 2010
3kw is not a measurement of energy
tevatronAug 23, 2010
Yeah, I made the assumption that the writer made the common mistake of leaving out the hour when saying "One kilogram of plastic waste produces almost a liter of oil while using about 1 kilowatt of electricity" Probably a bad assumption but kwh IS a common energy unit.
I wonder if the 1kg of plastic to 3 kg of CO2 was supposed to be "1kg of plastic to 3 liters of CO2" as in the previous statement they were discussing how many liters of oil 1 kg of plastic produced. It's unfortunate that the video and article have so these errors. Makes it really hard to fully appreciate how useful the device is.
goatmonkey2112Aug 23, 2010
I know something similar was posted before about a microwave to turn plastic into oil. I remember making some comment about landfills being future goldmines. It is worth reposting though. A lot of people obviously missed it.
brettmjohnsonAug 23, 2010
From another article about the company:
"Since the oil resulting from the first machine is unrefined, Blest also manufactures machines to refine the oil, the BOR-20 and BOR-50, so that it can be used in other applications such as running your car."
co7926Aug 23, 2010
My question is:
Is the cost ($) of electricity required to convert plastic to oil, and subsequently gas/diesel/kerosene, lower than the price the product can be sold for (plus all other expenses that come with the process)?
If it is not lower, and this guy is just trying to get attention, then that is why it is not a widely accepted technique.
I'm very skeptical about this
brettmjohnsonAug 23, 2010
The original OurWorld article mentions that the cost of electricity to convert 1kg of plastic is US $0.20. However, that may be an incorrect calculation, based on faulty units conversion (the non-specific "one kilowatt" of electricity, vaguely mentioned in that same article).
http://ourworld.unu.edu/en/plastic-to-oil-fantastic/
inactiveuserAug 23, 2010
1kw/h US retail is around 24 cents.
A bigger system is self powering so its does not need input. If anything you can export energy.
bipolarruledoutAug 23, 2010
Maybe if you live in Hawaii.
virinixAug 23, 2010
Yay! Lets convert oil into plastic, and then back into oil again! This is really solving our oil shortage problems..
Closed AccountAug 23, 2010
we dont have a shortage problem... we have a surplus problem... welcome to reality, you get f**ked every time you are at the pump...
Closed AccountAug 23, 2010
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thermal_depolymerization
Thermal depolymerization isn't new. It just isn't used the way it should be.
hawveeAug 23, 2010
Wasn't this in Jimmy Neutron?
srs2000Aug 23, 2010
For those who wont look at the sites webpage and translate it:
Product name Be-h (Bieichi)
Processing capacity 0.7 ~ 1.0kg / times
Oil rate 80% (about 3 hours time)
Mechanical Dimensions 560 (W) × 320 (D) × 500 (H) mm
Weight Approximately 50kg
Power AC100V / 14A maximum
゙ cost Ranninku 1KW / hour (as a guide.)
Feature Eye can see - we are made of oil
- You begin the oil out from around one hour
How easy to use - anyone!
Home - 100V power available?
http://www.blest.co.jp/seihin-1.html
That is their small unit. They have 24 hour continuous ones as well.
kanockAug 23, 2010
So 3 kWh, maybe £0.30, for 0.8 litres of unrefined oil?
kakarot1232001Aug 23, 2010
lol, Japanese Copy Cat strikes again.
3-4 years ago, Digg run another similar article. About USA based company that doing exactly the same. I think word Invented is misused ones again.Comment is buried, click here to see the rest.
fongobongoAug 23, 2010
Care to cite what you're talking about or is trolling just a lot easier.
Closed AccountAug 23, 2010
Plastic - Big problem because it contaminates landfills and oceans.
Oil - Big problem because burning it contaminates the atmosphere.
Seems like we're simply trading one big problem for another. How about a device that makes people want to buy less cheap plastic crap?
peekmanAug 23, 2010
..............You would burn x amount of oil regardless of where it came from. So if part of this x amount comes from plastic doesn't that actually help solve a problem????
stinky0Aug 23, 2010
I don't like how commonly plastic is used either but we've already made plenty of it. Would be nice to clean up at the least.
bipolarruledoutAug 23, 2010
You mean like banning advertising? Yeah.... why don't you just abolish capitalism while your at it.
pfhayterAug 23, 2010
Don?
dougm68Aug 23, 2010
Stop driving your car Nifty.
pfhayterAug 23, 2010
Glass?
skeloothAug 23, 2010
Wouldn't it be more efficient to just recycle the plastics into new plastic products? I can't help but feel there's a serious loss of energy in that process.
Closed AccountAug 23, 2010
It takes energy to recycle the plastics too, no?
Plus, the overhead of running these recycling factories, having sorters, running cars to pick up these plastics/running recycling depots for the plastics take energy.
Recycling in general does reduce waste but at the same time causes lots of emissions to achieve the effect.
atai1638Aug 23, 2010
Unlike aluminum or glass, plastics can hardly be recycled into materials of same quality. Recycled plastics are of lower grade and also requires more energy than making virgin plastics. That's why recycling plastics aren't really a good idea.
fongobongoAug 23, 2010
Start at the consumer level and then you have change. You change the way people think and then you can move forward.
Closed AccountAug 23, 2010
why dont we just use hemp to create 100% biodegrageable plastics? oh thats right, because we are afraid of people getting high...
abreemanAug 23, 2010
It's okay we can use corn instead!
Closed AccountAug 23, 2010
inferior product over a superior one... yup... sounds like american thinking to me
bipolarruledoutAug 23, 2010
Which is more expensive but not to worry, your tax dollars HEAVILY subsidize it.
ayracon8907Aug 23, 2010
Just wait til November. We'll move forward then.
bmarofskyAug 23, 2010
So what's left in the machine after you extract the oil? What do you do with it?
hereticoftruthAug 23, 2010
Why , the same thing that they do with the skimmed Gulf oil. Burn it or bury it in a landfill.
bipolarruledoutAug 23, 2010
Well, you can use it to give your enemies cancer. Other than that I'm not seeing many practical applications.
ancientshoesAug 23, 2010
it's not contributing to anything, man-made global warming doesn't exist, but let's not let that stop the alarmist sheep
netneutralityAug 23, 2010
Yeah damn all those sheep who want to clean up garbage.
stinky0Aug 23, 2010
I'm so tired of hearing this. REGARDLESS OF GLOBAL WARMING we need a healthy environment and energy. We rely on our environment for all things life-sustaining - food, medicine, clothes, shelter. By saying global warming doesn't exist you are not only making a bold statement that goes against solid evidence without having the burden of explanation, but you totally disregard the value of nature and our dependence on it. We need to be environmentally conscious for our own sake, not just the pretty animals and plants and so you can go on hikes.
johnomazzAug 23, 2010
Whether or not global warming exists, there is a problem with trash.
fongobongoAug 23, 2010
I'm tired of pompous assh**es like you who think they're better than other people. So what if global warming is cyclical. Don't you think that we as a species need change how we live. We're in a situation of death by plastic. This is great news. Comment is buried, click here to see the rest.
boomchockalockaAug 23, 2010
It's a shame science doesn't agree with you.