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anomaly100Jan 30, 2011
This comment thread is so wrong.
blinker1315Jan 30, 2011Submitter
As opposed to most comment threads? I think it's a great article, and I wish Obama had the guts to tackle an unpopular issue and fast-track substantial immigration reform. The GOP's been disgraceful on the issue and it's a perfect opportunity for Obama to lead the country morally. He won't, though, because his advisers have obviously poll-tested the idea and gave it thumbs down.
anomaly100Jan 30, 2011
I couldn't agree more. As for the comment thread, it made me feel ill. Those opposing immigration reform are showing their true colors (no pun intended, well maybe a little). Obama should be proactive on this and with his inaction, the DREAM was killed.
adaguyJan 30, 2011
You won't find a political group that will tackle immigration. no one will do anything about it, as it will be the downfall of their party.
The republickin's had 6 years to address it and didn't do a damned thing. Why expect any miracles now?
Closed AccountJan 30, 2011
Republicans believe in states' rights. I support Arizona's immigration reform.
adaguyJan 30, 2011
Remember when Reagan said he was going to transfer more authority to the states? Did you learn nothing from that lesson? Or are you old enough to recall it?Comment is buried, click here to see the rest.
Closed AccountJan 30, 2011
I support Arizona's immigration reform. It's from a federal model. If chickens**ts in DC won't address this, the states most impacted by it SHOULD.
I wish Illinois would implement Arizona's law.
adaguyJan 31, 2011
Who do you know in DC that has the balls to endorse this, when they know they have toe votes to enforce it?
No one mentions immigration when they are in control, only when the opponent has control. They do this because it's a hot potato that no one wants to touch.
Closed AccountJan 31, 2011
We are TIRED of this. They MUST address it.
adaguyJan 31, 2011
'We are TIRED of this. They MUST address it.'
Expect to be disappointed.
adaguyJan 31, 2011
I would like to see you move to this area. If you think you have an immigration problem, move here. The poultry industry is big here, very big, and the immigrants work cheap. (they love that) Nothing gets done about it. For the last 20 years, the feds are doing less and less.
Closed AccountJan 31, 2011
I am in Illinois.
Google stats about illegals.
adaguyJan 31, 2011
Look back through the past,
Nothing is getting done now, nothing was done during Bush's administration. Before that Clinton did nothing. Prior to that, Daddy Bush did nothing. And before that, Reagan DID SOMETHING!
He cut the budget of the border patrol, and a few years later, he granted citizenship to 3 million illegal immigrants.
http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=128303672
Face it, this is a problem that they will never address!Comment is buried, click here to see the rest.
Closed AccountJan 31, 2011
We KNOW that Reagan did amnesty...that's WHY WE OPPOSE more AMNESTY NOW!
adaguyJan 31, 2011
Illegal Immigration along with the deportation of jobs has done severe damage to this nations economy, and we will not live long enough to see it corrected. You would be wise to look at who stood to gain the most by starting this mess.
Your endorsement of the GOP is a terrible mistake, but I guess you have nothing else to cling to. Quit voting for the party, and vote out every incumbent. ALL OF THEM!Comment is buried, click here to see the rest.
kinserJan 30, 2011
These comments suck. You guys need lives. You need to also not be so racist. Its like you think Whites are under attack. We're not.
Closed AccountJan 30, 2011
It's not specifically whites under attack, that's just a side effect. the truth is, for every single immigrant in and coming to this country, there is a loss of opportunity for a citizen of this country. opportunity and prosperity are not infinite things. the more people you add to the table, the less everyone gets. except in this case, even adding one individual to the table can completely remove the prosperity of another single individual. give a life take a life. so it doesn't necessarily take a little from all, but also can take a lot from just one. people may come to america for a better life, but at the suffering of american citizens. now who's the selfish one?
the masses of immigrants coming to america is synonymous with someone who can't swim, pulling someone under and drowning them to prevent themselves from drowning. except once they're drowned, that dead weight won't prop them up anymore and they'll soon drown themselves.Comment is buried, click here to see the rest.
Closed AccountJan 30, 2011
unstoppable - Dugg. So dugg.
I hear many on the left decrying some things in the constitution and some laws because "we live in a new day and we have to evolve with the times."
Ok, have it your way. We have TERRORISTS crossing our porous borders. People make a mockery of us by living here without residency. We graduate OVER 50,000 illegal high school students. WTF?
Mexico's immigration rules are tougher than ours, but they point the fingers at us.
When *I* say, "Hey, this is an untenable situation...we have to get serious!" Someone tells me, "You are an illegal immigrant! Go back to Europe!"
NO...I'm NOT an illegal immigrant. I CAN'T f**king go to Europe because I'm an American citizen.
This whole debate is completely rife with too much emotionalism and too little common sense.
eraptorJan 30, 2011
Bingo, you nailed the issue.
Illegal immigration is NOT about race, it's about economics. If people are genuinely concerned about the economic opportunities of illegal immigrants, then go to their countries and pressure the governments to enact economic and social reforms. That way, one would make a difference where it counts...the source.
In Egypt, Hosni Mubarak is learning this lesson the hard way. With the exception of geography, most Latin American governments are NO different than Egypt. Instead, they encourage their impoverished citizens to head North so they won't have to take care of them and enact the necessary social reforms.
Closed AccountJan 31, 2011
Good lord, people are burying a good and RIGHT conversation.
analogassassinJan 31, 2011
I know. It's sickening. I consider myself somewhere in the middle of the political landscape, but I try to read all comments and view the merits of the argument. I can't find one thing political about what eraptor said, it's all factual, yet there are people burying it. I wish that instead of being a chickens**t and burying a comment anonymously, they would instead try to debate it.
eraptorJan 31, 2011
Wow! Obviously, the fringe left is as fearful of the truth as the fringe right.
When are ideological morons going to learn that denying/hiding
objective truth does NOT make them CORRECT about their pet issues?
Closed AccountJan 31, 2011
What other country allows illegal immigrants to POUR into it and then provides them social welfare and free education?
Could this be a supply and demand issue?
If we cut off the supply...will the DEMAND go down?
To say that America is somehow NOT an integrated country is ridiculous. All we are saying is..."Hey, we're not patsies...stop taking advantage."
The SOLD US NAFTA with the caveat that it would prevent illegals from wanting to pour over the border.
It was a lie.
I am an AMERICAN CITIZEN and I demand that my government addresses this issue in a "tough love" fashion.
Again...over 50,000 illegals graduate from US public schools. This is bulls**t.
And this SPITS in the FACE of people who seek to come here the right way.
And don't you motherf**kers EVER AGAIN try to play to white guilt by telling ME.... a fourth generation American whose relatives came legally....that I should "go home." This IS my home.
gkiltzFeb 1, 2011
Now with the Channel Tunnel, The UK has a lot of the same problem from Albania and Turkey.
Germany and France have had that same issue since the collapse of communism in Albania. That was when they stopped offering Albanians political asylum, and they started coming anyway.
Closed AccountJan 30, 2011
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n7WJeqxuOfQ
very informative and professional explanation of the issue with immigration and the deleterious effects it has. notice the race and reactions of the audience.
eraptorJan 30, 2011
This is an excellent summary of the economic issues surrounding illegal immigration that EVERYONE should watch, regardless of their ideological positions on it.
Closed AccountJan 31, 2011
I went to Arizona this summer.
LEGAL hispanic Americans are PISSED.
Screw this political correctness.
Closed AccountJan 31, 2011
that is true, BUT the legal hispanic immigrants are also part of the problem. you see, america doesn't just have an illegal immigrant problem, it has an immigrant problem all together, and its had it for some time. the problem is too many legal immigrants are let in.
americans have to compete with legal and illegal immigrants on their own soil, when they shouldn't have to. we've got soon many legal immigrants that americans have a hard time competing. we've got soo many illegals here that even illegals are having a hard time competing with each other. that says a lot.
We have an unemployment rate, we don't have enough jobs for our own citizens, or the legals/illegals that come here. yet we still have people pouring in, not to mention the ones already here are multiplying by procreation further increasing their population count.
here's a fact: if you counted all US citizens starting 1970, and take into account their deaths and their descendants births/deaths, americans are, right now, outnumbered in their own country. So that means all of the immigrants, legal and illegal, coming here since 1970, have already outnumbered us within our own country. we're direly closer to 'too late' than we are to 'before it's too late'. right now, the US technically meets the established criteria of a third world country, literally.
there has already been at least several times where movements were made to make masses of illegals deemed legal. but these younger generations forget about that history and only serve to repeat. they figure 'oh lets give them a chance', but they forget that we give them at least 1 chance per generation already, making all the once illegals become legal, one step forward two steps back.
many of the legal mexicans in america today had parents or grand parents that came here by illegal means, and they were later given citizenship. relatively no mexicans that are american citizens came here the legal way. even if their family has been here for generations.
so yes those 'legal' born mexican americans might be pissed, but with their logic of being pissed, them simply being apart of america is apart of the same problem for everyone else. so americans have every right to view those 'now legal' mexican americans in the same light as legal mexican americans view illegal mexicans, because they BOTH (illegal and legalized) had the same effect on diminishing americans in their respective times. however, the effort isn't to reverse immigration, it's to slow it down or stop it. that is what MUST be done, or america will collapse under all of that immigrant weight.
Closed AccountJan 31, 2011
Perhaps we should limit immigration to those legitimately fleeing in fear of their lives and those who have higher education.
Closed AccountJan 31, 2011
@ quirkopatra
it's a good start, but it has to be stricter. it doesn't matter how smart the immigrant is, a job taken is a job taken. many americans are disadvantaged when it comes to higher education. Many foreign countries have very cheap to entirely free college systems, which means they don't have the same expenses and hardships that americans do.
The average american college grad will start his job (if he can find one) owing around 25K in student loan debt, while the immigrant worker will start his job with no debt and tax breaks and collateral free loans (courtesy of uncle sam). immigrants have more opportunity in the usa than americans do on their own soil.
and many foreign colleges may not exactly be up to snuff, so they could have a degree but still be inferior due to lack of proper education.
people that are fleeing for their lives (refugee's) are often very poor, whether already that way or poor because their area is in turmoil. they often have to leave everything behind. that means if we allow them to come to the US, we're basically supporting them to get them back on their feet.
right now we shouldn't be focusing on criteria for immigration, we should be focusing more on entirely closing off all immigration for a predetermined period of time or until otherwise noticed. A few years at minimal just to feel the effects. People can still come and go - but they can't live or work here. That is the best way to solve many current problems.
The US has been hit from all angles - since the 1970's, one could say that the US has lost over *150 million* jobs on it's own soil to legal and illegal immigrants. Then there's jobs shipped overseas by the tens of millions. It's no wonder why americans are hurting.
without the influx of immigrants, not as many new jobs will be needed. it will allow us to redistribute our workforce without having to compensate for unnatural population increases brought on by immigration. population inflation will begin to better align with job inflation.
crapolatimeJan 30, 2011
The hate is strong with some comments.
But don't forget that worldwide, is white people are a minority. But the other races will not prevent you from your daily tanning booth sessions to look more like them. Well other than the 10% tax for future medicalcare from the cancer.Comment is buried, click here to see the rest.
Closed AccountJan 30, 2011
No illegal immigrants should be given citizenship. We have immigration laws that must be followed, and following those laws is the pathway to being a legal resident in the U.S
Closed AccountJan 30, 2011
Hispanic Americans really only want immigration reform because they share the same ethnicity with 86% of the current illegal population.. If the current illegal population was, say, 86% Asian, African, or ( God forbid! ) European these same Hispanic Americans and La-Raza would be screaming like banshees about how illegal aliens are stealing hard working Hispanic Americans jobs and the government had better enforce the laws that protect working class citizens from illegal competition
bille3Jan 30, 2011
So True!
doskrautJan 30, 2011
most of the illegals entering the country is mexican.check the facts.and look at the crime rate abc,cbs, generally speaking the first five minutes of the news is violent crimes in mexican neighborhoods like santa ana.Comment is buried, click here to see the rest.
number23Jan 30, 2011
Why is is racist to insist foreigners enter and work in the country legally?
blinker1315Jan 30, 2011Submitter
It's not particularly racist if you apply that to ALL illegals. For example, in NYC and Boston there are a ton of Irish illegals working at pubs and the like and I don't see any animosity aimed at them.
Closed AccountJan 30, 2011
There should be animosity aimed at them.
kasha34Jan 30, 2011
You libs always say that. Please cite source.
erik1421Jan 30, 2011
http://www.foxnews.com/unicorns-and-irishimmigrants-do-exist-in-america.html
anomaly100Jan 30, 2011
"Libs"!! Blinker is most certainly not a liberal. He's just well mannered so you thought he was:-)
cosmicsurferJan 31, 2011
And thinks instead of quoting only talking points
anomaly100Feb 1, 2011
It's refreshing on digg to know you can talk to someone from another party without a flame war starting. It's so rare.
number23Jan 31, 2011
Ok, deport them first. Then may we deport the Mexicans?
erik1421Jan 30, 2011
I'm an illegal immigrant studying at a prestigious Texan university. After finishing my Masters in MIS and a bachelors in Accounting I won't be able to get a job. I will have to either go to another country (NOT MEXICO, f**k THAT) or wait for an immigration reform. I do not want unemployment benefits, free healthcare, nor any of the benefits you citizens get. What I want is to be able to get a job and contribute to this great country. I didn't choose to come here, my parents did and I am thankful that they did that. At the same time, it would've been better if they did it the legal way, unfortunately that is not my case. Pass the Dream Act, immigration reform and more border security as soon as possible!
Ask an undocumented student anything...
cristinamkJan 30, 2011
Aren't you cute? "I'm an illegal immigrant studying at a prestigious Texan university." I wonder how are you paying your tuition and fees? I bet you didn't come out with your own cash.
I suppose you went to high school here too. Did you knew that your education cost your home state around 100k?
I am an immigrant too. Legal one. I stayed in line for visa, fingerprinting, payed all my fees, work permit and health insurance.
Dream Act is actually a nightmare act. But it seems fare to you because it's so rewarding for your parents. Jumped the border, brought along all their offspring, got them into school, college and so on without being bothered with small things like paperwork.
It's appalling to me that an illegal immigrant can get MASTERS DEGREE.
Giving amnesty to you and your parents it's a face palm to me and other people who came here legally.
People who break the law should not be rewarded with the gift of American citizenship.
Excuse my English, i moved here less than 3 years ago. Still learning.
erik1421Jan 30, 2011
Well hello there, I received many private scholarships which are paying my tuition and fees. My parents are actually paying 25% of my total costs. I never said I jumped the border, we came here legally as tourists and the moment we decided to stay, thats when we became illegal. I am thankful that you were not brought here illegally, which is the sad case of 80,000 kids a year in the U.S. By the way, illegal immigrants DO pay taxes, which is what the usual argument of an anti reform person is (Sales tax, property taxes and some like my parents even pay income taxes) If they gave us a chance to pay those costs with a fee to become legalized, we would be glad to do so. Unfortunately there are people who fail to understand the issue and deny every possibility of agreement.
cristinamkJan 30, 2011
"...we came here legally as tourists and the moment we decided to stay, thats when we became illegal"
Riiiiight.. Your parents decided to stay only after coming as tourists. And there is NO WAY they planed it ahead. You take your kids on vacation in a foreign country, and suddenly you decide to stay there and leave behind your home, job, relatives, and friends. And all that without planing ahead.
And i repeat, there is NO WAY they consciously cheated the system.Comment is buried, click here to see the rest.
erik1421Jan 30, 2011
As I said, It wasn't my option...
anomaly100Jan 30, 2011
Careful there Erik1421. You're getting all facty.
eraptorJan 30, 2011
I'd be careful about making the tax argument unless ALL of the taxes paid by illegal immigrants equalled or exceeded the social costs generated by them. As someone who studies accounting at a university, this basic financial concept should not be foreign to you.
Just as in business, social infrastructure costs are unsustainable unless revenues equal or exceed costs. Since we all know they don't, most Americans oppose the practice. For the record, it would be no different if the roles were reversed.
The reason every country in the world has immigration limits is because there is a limit to what ANY society can absorb from outside its borders. However, rather than recognize the rational limitations of U.S. immigration policies, most illegal immigrants choose to ignore them in the name of economic self-interest and couldn't care less about the social/economic consequences which ensue. As a direct result, it creates a significant political backlash/resentment against them because the public perception is that it wasn't earned honestly/fairly.
Closed AccountJan 30, 2011
How are you affording your education? Did you receive a free education from the public school system?
Why don't you wish to return to your home country?
erik1421Jan 30, 2011
Mexico is a great country but the situation it currently is makes me not want to go there. I was born in one of the most peaceful cities in the country, yet today it is one of the most dangerous ones due to the drug/cartel problems it has. To go back would be unwise and unreasonable. I did receive education during my high school years in the U.S., but my parents paid property taxes which 70% of the money go toward education therefore; I wouldn't call it free education. For the rest of the questions please read the comment above.
Closed AccountJan 30, 2011
Did your scholarships take money away from legal American students?
If Mexico is a great country, why don't you want to return? There are certainly areas where you could have a good life.
You DID get a free education. Did they NEVER ask you, in public school, for proof of citizenship in the country that was paying for your education?
Are your parent still illegal residents here?
Why do you feel you are more important than the immigrant that goes through the proper processes?
erik1421Jan 30, 2011
No, the scholarships were granted by merits, so the more academically prepared you were, the more chances you had to get them.
I told you why I don't want to return already. Its unwise for me to go there.
No, they never asked me. Americans believe education is a human right, doesn't matter if you are legal, or illegal.
Yes, they are still undocumented citizens.
I don't feel anymore important, but if I tried to get my status fixed I would have to go to Mexico. And guess what, once I go back, I am automatically banned for 10 years with no possibility to get legalized. I would love to go back and apply again, but 10 years is just too long and unfair.
Closed AccountJan 30, 2011
"Americans believe education is a human right, doesn't matter if you are legal, or illegal."
It's time to change that. We shouldn't be educating 50,000+ illegal immgrants a year. It's insane.
"Yes, they are still undocumented citizens."
What's their address?
Just kiddin'.
kasha34Jan 30, 2011
You were not invited.
erik1421Jan 30, 2011
Hi, are you god?
Closed AccountJan 30, 2011
What will you do if your parents are deported? Should your parents be deported?
erik1421Jan 30, 2011
There is not a single day I don't think about this. I would probably finish my education then what happens next depends on if I stay, or if I go to another country. I will always help them and no, they should not be deported.Comment is buried, click here to see the rest.
doskrautJan 31, 2011
so when you turned 18 you could leave america,but you did not you stayed and leached off the tax payers.i dont receive free healthcare.no border security will stop people from entering a country.look at the Berlin wall. the Dream Act is nothing more than amnesty for illegal aliens.my idea is deport all illegals and if they want to be an american, do as my parents did .go through the immigration process.and watch the unemployment drop below 8% crime will drop as wellComment is buried, click here to see the rest.
doskrautJan 30, 2011
immigration reform is nothing more than amnesty for illegal aliens.
doskrautJan 30, 2011
after reading many comments i was wrong.most Americans see nothing wrong with people who brake laws.and it is ok when people by pass legal entry.so should i cut to the front of the line at the store,DMV and other places with a line.thats what w3t backs are doingComment is buried, click here to see the rest.
woollymittensJan 30, 2011
I wouldn't want to live in the USA even if they offered it. A country run by greed and lobbyists and where all public services have been privatised and exploited to the point of ruin.
Closed AccountJan 30, 2011
LOL.
kasha34Jan 30, 2011
Which paradise do you call home?
warlok480Jan 30, 2011
FTA : "Deport more criminal immigrants." --- ALL Illegal Immigrants are 'criminal' immigrants....we need to set a strict enforcement policy in place NOW, not later
linuxpersonJan 30, 2011
Dem illegals tuk er jerbs!!!
Closed AccountJan 30, 2011
This is all you need to know:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n7WJeqxuOfQ
Notice the reactions and races of the audience. You see, it doesn't matter what race you are. It matters if your a legal citizen or not, and more so, a born legal citizen because these are the people who are instilled with core American values, These are the people who have to watch their country crumble around them, which is not the same as being an legal immigrant who moved to a crumbling country. Every single American citizen has reason and right to be appalled.
The more immigrants we take in (legal or illegal) hurt this country in massive ways. We're already feeling the effects of it (and have been for some time), these effects can not be reversed - the damage is done. What we must do now is prevent further damage. So all of that prosperity we had? It would have literally be much greater if there had been a lack of immigrants, especially illegals.
If you were born with invisible leg weights, you wouldn't have known how much easier it would have been on you to be born without them. Due to the masses of immigrants, every american citizen for the past 50 years have been wearing those invisible weights.
Made-legal or illegal, they are citizens of other countries that come here to work. And even if they're legal, they STILL take more than they give. They might pay taxes, but the money they make at that job is always going to be more than they pay in taxes (for obvious reasons) so that means an American citizen was deprived of the opportunity to have that job.
For example, a mexican outside of home depot might get the job done for 1/5th or even 1/10th the price of an american worker or contractor. That mexican might have made $100, but he just deprived the American worker of $1000. And mexicans aren't the only illegals in America.
There are more illegal immigrants in America than there are Americans out of work. That means even despite all of the wars, all of the over spending, all of the bubbles, if there were no illegal immigrants in America, there wouldn't have been a job problem. Historically, we've never had a 0% unemployment rate, but that also means we never have enough jobs for every single person, yet we STILL have more and more coming in daily. If you think about it, the reason why we've never had a 0% unemployment rate is because we have masses of immigrants coming in daily.
Legal immigration has just as much a deleterious effect. Illegal immigration should be stopped entirely, legal immigration should be strictly limited. In fact, we shouldn't be taking in any immigrants, legal or illegal, until this country can get back on its feet. In fact, employment should determine our immigration policies. Until we have a 0% unemployment, we shouldn't be letting a single person become a citizen of this country or enter it illegally.
lawsnetworkJan 30, 2011
Immigration politics in 2011 are not more toxic than in 1500's
theunlearnJan 31, 2011
you mean when there were no immigration politics or for that matter, any restrictions at all on movement between two countries, except monetary?
dusanmalJan 31, 2011
Obama needs some balance here and it will be interesting to watch what he does. On one side, traditional Dem' support is behind legalization of illegal immigrants in order to get Latino vote. On the other side is extreme and long lasting unemployment which will be raised as counter-argument if he attempts any legalization process (appearance will be that we are helping illegal immigrants at the cost of unemployed Americans, no matter what spin anyone tries to make. It is the trivial and obvious interpretation). This choice might take away one of big Obama supporting blocks - blue collar mid- and NE- America. Weirdest case would be California: do not push it and Right might get some conservative Latino vote ad win it; push it and blue collar class under pressure might snap and again Right wins... Not a good issue for Obama in 2012 -damned if you do, damned f you don't.
alvarwillsJan 31, 2011
b
gkiltzJan 31, 2011
Reality Check:
We are ALL decedent from immigrants!!!
If you are a full-blooded American Indian or Eskimo, it was so long ago that we may never prove where or when.
Everybody else has been in the last 500 years or so.
To be anti-immigrant is to disrespect YOUR OWN ancestors!
The white middle class has had a birth rate below replacement level since the early 1970s.
We NEED immigration to keep the gene pool stocked.
The truth is, government WANTS illegal immigration.
Reason: They can control, almost to the person, but not quite, the total number of LEGAL immigrants.
They have NO CONTROL WHATSOEVER over the economic and political realities in other countries. THAT is what governs TOTAL immigration.
Right now, the US is better at making jobs than it is at making people. In the long haul , most unemployment will be of the "systemic" type. The typewriter and shoe repairmen, and glaziers. Job-training issues rather than lack of job issues.
Most of the world, including Mexico today, and Germany when my own ancestors arrived in the 1870s is much better at making people than at making jobs.
As long as that disparity exists, there WILL be immigration. No two ways about it. All countries like the US can possibly do is decide the ratio of legal to illegal immigration.
Right now the process of immigrating LEGALLY is so long, complex, intrusive, and emotionally torturous that, in effect the government has CHOSEN. illegal immigration, simply by making it such a bitch to immigrate legally!
Among my own ancestors, it was WWI, give or take a couple of years, before most of them could read and write. That makes it rather hard to learn a lot about them. Based upon what I have been able to glean, I can safely say that it is quite unlikely that they told the legal authorities the whole truth in every single encounter. None were ever deported. How many of you had ancestors in similar situations?
Until we face that reality, most immigration will continue to be illegal.