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79 Comments
- bungoman, on 06/17/2009, -0/+17I would have awful taste in music were it not for p2p.
- borez, on 06/17/2009, -1/+18As a recording artist and label owner, I can safely say that the major players in the music business could not give a flying ***** about finding new talent or making music “richer as an artform,” They care about one thing and one thing only... the bottom line i.e. money. And not money from new and expressive talent that needs nurturing and guiding musically over a few albums, money from instant, saleable, homogenised, chicken in a basket *****.
To explain fully the gravity of current Major label thinking I'll use my own example: About 3 months ago we were asked to remix a track from an established artists new album for one of the big four, EMI. We did the remix, tested it in the clubs through our DJ's and handed what we thought was a great club mix over to EMI ( FTR we specialise in underground Breaks tunes)
The response was and I quote: " The band loves it, the A&R love it, the management loves it, but... the business managers ( I.e. the accountants ) don't like it and want it to sound a bit more Justin Timberlake," To which we replied in not so many words... Go ***** yourselves, it ain't what we do. Period. Therefore It never got used.
Note to EMI: We make music for clubbers, not ***** accountants.
The money is controlling and ruining what you and I get to hear in the mainstream, and that to me is ***** sad. - ANA1OG, on 06/17/2009, -0/+12Fleet Foxes are an incredible group. Even more respect for them now!
- stonebone4, on 06/17/2009, -0/+11They played on Saturday Night Live a while back and were at the top of Amazon, eMusic, and Pitchfork best-of lists last year.
- CobraClutch, on 06/16/2009, -0/+8Reminds me of when Tribal Ink's album was leaked as Linkin Park's "Minutes to Midnight." They thank the leaker on their myspace: http://www.myspace.com/tribalink2007
- sabach, on 06/17/2009, -1/+9A microscopic fraction of a band's income is from record sales, they make their money from touring. Most of the money from a record sale goes to somebody who really has nothing to do with the music itself. Look at Frank Zappa, he released dozens of albums over the years but he himself stated that he would never have been able to feed his family without almost constant touring. Any band that bases their business model on record sales is going to be disappointed.
- tattoojoo, on 06/17/2009, -0/+7dugg for fleet foxes
- inactive, on 06/17/2009, -0/+6Just do what you do my man. I'm sure you already know this, but you'll never be able to make those retards happy. I don't even work in music and I hate my managers. Somehow the manager knows more about the product than the engineer! Business people are only happy when they're in control, which is why I don't like them. They are also the kind of people who just love red tape and technicalities. If they catch you on a technicality, their day is made.
- Stingwolf, on 06/17/2009, -0/+6Well, they did play SNL a few weeks ago...
- RyomaNagare, on 06/17/2009, -0/+6Bruce Dickinson said in a concert he's got no problem with people sharing it with their friends.
so you can find most Iron Maiden's concerts available as bootlegs in bittorrent.
Of course most maiden fans go to the concerts and buy the records anyway. - tdogg241, on 06/17/2009, -0/+5Just because you haven't heard of them doesn't mean nobody else has. Stop listening to the Jonas Brothers for a few minutes and check out some of the actual music the world has to offer.
- neelshiv, on 06/17/2009, -1/+6Love the fleet foxes
- tgc1, on 06/17/2009, -0/+5Glad you guys stood up for yourselves. That is exactly the response i'd have handed them.
- 64705, on 06/17/2009, -1/+5But stealing records and file distribution over p2p are two different things. The modern equivalent would be if Bob Dylan stole your Hard Disk Drive instead. The son of a bitch.
- bdbr, on 06/17/2009, -0/+4I only buy music I've heard and like. I only hear the music because I download it.
Coincidentally, I've purchased both of Fleet Foxes' albums. - adventureindia, on 06/17/2009, -0/+4P2P always helps to explore more untouched part of your personal area of interest...This really a great way to know more people , their working and we always get something new with a new link...
- borez, on 06/17/2009, -0/+3Nope, ( much to EMI's dismay ) we walked away. I refuse point blank to compromise what I do for the sake of some accountants balance sheet, I'd rather keep my reputation as a remixer intact, even if it means never getting any more work from EMI. Period.
- danjwray, on 06/17/2009, -0/+3There are lots of typos in this article.
- MarkOfTheDead, on 06/17/2009, -0/+3Whatever, I stole his heroin. Joke's on him in a few hours.
- nasium, on 06/17/2009, -0/+3I tend to think that as the p2p generation continues to age, file sharing will be praised more and more for it's musical influence.
- seanoneil14, on 06/17/2009, -0/+3That's horrible. Is it possible for you to release/leak the remix?
- tdogg241, on 06/17/2009, -0/+3"If not, then their care about the bottom line didn't affect the music."
It didn't? borez refused to compromise his integrity by making it sound the way the accountants wanted. As a result, *the remix wasn't released.* If that's not affecting the music, I don't know what is. - borez, on 06/17/2009, -0/+3OK mate it's like this, most artists make their money from syncs i.e. somebody uses a piece of your music in a commercial or a film, a TV programme or a video game... That's where the money is, so the more your music is out there, the more chance it has of being picked up. You can forget about ever seeing a penny from a major label as they've already spent it for you on remixes/poducers/entertaining/production costs/cocaine etc.
Now what the majors hate about this fact is that the money from a sync goes to a publishing company and not them... they don't see a penny of it. That my friend is the problem... In a nutshell. - bdbr, on 06/17/2009, -0/+3Do some searches on independent label contracts; what you're saying often isn't true. A common contract has a minimum album sales requirement (to cover the label's costs), and after that they split the earnings 50/50 with the artist. This all hinges on album sales.
- SurlyDuff, on 06/17/2009, -0/+3Yeah I downloaded their album via P2P, but now I'm dishing out $190 for Lollapalooza tickets largely because they're playing. I think that's a fair trade and I'm glad the Fleet Foxes know that fans like me exist.
- tdogg241, on 06/17/2009, -0/+3File sharing is what made me the music enthusiast I am today (though I started on IRC long before Napster).
- bdbr, on 06/17/2009, -0/+2I have to wonder how any other business (cars, clothes, whatever) would do if they did business like the major labels - you aren't allowed to try something until you buy it, and once you buy it you can't return it. In this day of "satisfaction guaranteed", they still work in the "screw your satisfaction" mode. Its really no wonder that they are shrinking and independent labels are growing.
- Aliwalla, on 06/17/2009, -1/+3Apparently Bob Dylan swiped about 400 records from the local folk music fanatic when he was a punk kid trying to get his start.
- tdogg241, on 06/17/2009, -0/+2Truth. This article inspired me to throw on their album for the first time in a few months. So ***** good!
- seroevo, on 06/17/2009, -0/+2Bands make their money off of touring and merch anyway (and even concession), not their music sales.
Even a band like U2 gets less than 10% of their record sales, but will make millions every single night they perform.
Of course, an opening band might only make 5-10% of what the headliner gets paid, but it's still more then they'll get from their sales, save for the odd huge advance which just makes them the label's bitch. - sgxyay, on 06/17/2009, -0/+2The headline is weird too....it helps ARTISTS discover music? Or listeners?
- Bilbobaggins, on 06/17/2009, -0/+2tdogg was saying they've released only 1 LP (an album) and 2 EPs (not albums).
- zeq2m9, on 06/17/2009, -0/+2"Peckfold"? It's Pecknold. And I'm pretty sure that's them in the photo.
- 471776, on 06/17/2009, -4/+6Good for them. But that doesn't make other artists who do want to be paid petty. Artists can do whatever they want with their work. If they want to give it away for free, that's their decision. But I fail to see what this has to do with other artists who do choose to make a profit from their work.
- aliensporebomb, on 06/17/2009, -0/+2Let's see, I discovered Porcupine Tree thru p2p back when nobody knew who they were, had to buy their live CD as an hard to find import from italy. Now I've got every CD and most of the remasters plus the 24-bit remasters plus the DVD. Who says the record companies aren't making money in the 2000s? That being said, there's lots of good music out there I'm perfectly happy to pay for. My CD collection is getting way too big though. It's getting to the point where I've encoded most everything and then the CDs sit on a shelf.
- neelshiv, on 06/17/2009, -0/+2Artists. The person who was interviewed was an artist, and they say that P2P helps artists like himself expand his or her horizons and make better music.
- kingofthisnight, on 06/17/2009, -0/+2I did not know that. I will have to see if I can turn up a video of it.
- Zanrook, on 06/17/2009, -3/+5Without the internets I would have never discovered Einsturzende Neubauten, Throbbing Gristle or Merzbow.
God bless file sharing! - antimatroid, on 06/17/2009, -0/+2Plus the beetles, being pretty much the most successful band ever, is a very poor example to make a point about making a liveable income off record sales.
- Aliwalla, on 06/17/2009, -0/+2I wasn't making a negative moral comment about p2p file sharing. I was suggesting that Bob Dylan became such a great artist by being exposed to so much.
- kingofthisnight, on 06/17/2009, -0/+2I don't know if anyone has watched this video of Fleet Foxes yet but it is amazing. It is from a video series called "Take Away Shows".
http://www.vimeo.com/groups/5914/videos/2143576
Such good acoustics on this video. Wait for them to do Blue Ridge Mountains inside the building. - borez, on 06/17/2009, -0/+2Yes, If we want to get slapped with a nice big lawsuit. Although I may leave it a year or two and reuse the vocal and parts in another mix, under another name, not on my label.
- bdbr, on 06/17/2009, -0/+1Actually they've released the "Fleet Foxes" album and the "Sun Giant" EP (see Sub Pop web page). I'm not sure what you call albums + EPs together.
My point though was that people (not just me, of course) use downloads as a way of trying out music. - tdogg241, on 06/17/2009, -1/+2Huh? They have one album and 2 EPs.
- shrudheuie, on 06/17/2009, -0/+1Shhh. If the RIAA hears you they won't "Defend" your profits by keeping them.
- Travelsonic, on 06/17/2009, -0/+1They wouldn't be saying that just because you thought you could dictate what they could/would be saying, Bijah.
- turnuon, on 06/17/2009, -0/+1Don't get all upset because of some diggers being a little self entitled.
Oh hi Travelsonic! I am still waiting for your logical response to our last arguments!
I would have to disagree 1 download equals to 1 lost sales though. But its not because the price is too high, or they think its crap so they would download it instead, or other justifications some hypocrites proclaim. Its because of there are tons of alternatives out there, because of the unlimited flood of supplies. If we can't find any torrent for a particular song, then we will just wait, and proceed to find other songs that are available for pirate. It's a sad truth... - Coffeedemon, on 06/17/2009, -1/+2solid12345: How many bands have approached the level of the Beatles in terms of recognition? You're probably looking at *maybe* 1% of the total number of bands/artists that can make any real money off record sales alone.
- ivanalbright, on 06/17/2009, -1/+2Bottom line, artists should have the choice on how their work is distributed.
If P2P is so great for publicity, the market will eventually change so that more artists choose, on their own volition, to distribute this way.
IMO file sharing (illegally) is a useful tool to encourage adoption of new technology and push the industry forward, but it can't last forever in its current state or the quality of music produced will drop drastically. -
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