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361 Comments
- rocketman42, on 06/14/2009, -15/+126Opera will not be happy until the only browser offered with Windows is Opera.
- AboveandBeyond, on 06/15/2009, -25/+128Windows belong to microsoft, they can do whatever the ***** they want....I don't see anybody telling apple to bundle winamp with itunes, or firefox with mac.....***** double standards.
- gigi52, on 06/14/2009, -7/+88kind of damned if you do and damned if you don't. if people are not intelligent enough to install the browser they want, then they complain if nothing is offered. stupid leading stupid
- yomer333, on 06/15/2009, -15/+89This is the same as if Ford released all of their vehicles with the radio presets assigned to WFRD, the All Ford All the Time station, which people would be perfectly able to change.
The other car companies would say "Whoa whoa, Ford. You're making an miniscule amount of money from this. We won't settle for it".
Ford would then say "Fine, we won't have the presets assigned to anything by default and people can choose themselves"
"What?!? THIS IS AN OUTRAGE. We demand that you have the radio presets assigned to the stations we run too. Otherwise this just isn't fair at all."
Microsoft has done plenty of evil, but jesus ***** christ, they bundle their browser in their OS. If you don't like it, you can:
Buy a computer with no OS installed
Build your own computer
Buy a computer WITH Windows installed and format it
Buy a mac
Or do what a sensible person would and not ***** care. Start -> Run -> appwiz.cpl -> Add/remove features -> Uncheck the ***** IE box. - valis, on 06/14/2009, -8/+64It's rather odd, this whole thing. Perhaps the solution is for the EU to require OEMs (such as Dell and HP) to bundle a selection of browsers with Windows 7. (We all know how fond the OEMs are of bundling.) It seems to me to be a reasonable solution. It isn't reasonable, however, to force Microsoft to bundle any more software than it already does; considering how upset the EU seems to be with their current default offerings, IE and Media Player.
I think the EU is shooting the wrong foot. - rda1441, on 06/15/2009, -25/+81I'll say it again. Microsoft should stop selling all products in Europe and immediately stop supporting sold products, perhaps even putting out a patch to disable European based computers until the EU stops screwing around.
- ErickStevenson, on 06/15/2009, -12/+61Seriously, WTF do EU really want? They complain that Microsoft is unfair for bundling IE and WMP but then when Microsoft removes them they complain about it? Microsoft is doing the right thing in my opinion, and most likely they will provide a way to download IE without a browser.
- BalancingAct, on 06/14/2009, -5/+45"...is a move to discredit antitrust regulators"
That has occurred to me, and is most likely to be right. - inactive, on 06/15/2009, -0/+39I hope the other 999 were better.
- GaltShrugged, on 06/14/2009, -11/+49The best part is how are they going to download a browser. They don't have a browser to get on the net with. They're pretty much *****.
- ArthurSucks, on 06/15/2009, -7/+44Without IE how will people download Firefox?
- KungFooJesus, on 06/15/2009, -14/+50The EU is selectively enforcing a ***** rule on an American company with mediocre PR just because they could. The ruling makes NO sense. Why no force all auto manufacturers to offer cars with headlights in case someone didn't want the factory brand. Oh, you can't drive without headlights? Kind of like trying to get on the internet without IE bundled so that you can freely acquire another browser you weasely douche bags?
MS should sue the EU for improper conduct resulting in financial losses. - vtnerd, on 06/15/2009, -14/+47They deserved to be discredited. The lawsuits against MS in the EU are RIDICULOUS. And, as an American, I've read about plenty of ridiculous lawsuits.
- TheSabre, on 06/15/2009, -9/+41nesagwa, should McDonald's also sell Whoppers for people that want a choice? Should GM dealers also sell Fords and Toyotas? Maybe Target should also offer mortgages, livestock, and cars. Or maybe everyone should stop telling a company how to run its own business and its own product line.
- GMH24, on 06/15/2009, -11/+40EU is just looking for more cash. I'm sick of them stealing money from American companies.
- CaptRR, on 06/15/2009, -1/+28While that's a great emotional response, and one that I have to admit I have felt a time or two after hearing about the EU treatment of microsoft in this case. The problem is that Europe, love them or hate them, holds a huge population above the third world level. Giving up Europe would be like cutting off 40% of your business. Microsoft will not do that.
- rda1441, on 06/15/2009, -15/+39The problem is that the Opera browser for Windows kinda blows monkey balls. It's a decent mobile browser, but that's about it. If they spent 1/2 the time they spend being dill-holes on development, they may have a case.
- afx1, on 06/15/2009, -2/+26among other reasons, getting their search engine/msn portal in front of all those users...
- Cloud7654, on 06/15/2009, -0/+24They weren't. I'm a tragically uncreative individual.
- GaltShrugged, on 06/14/2009, -10/+33Yeah because he should just let politicians destroy his business.
- doom777, on 06/15/2009, -0/+22it's not about hardware.
- ttforum, on 06/15/2009, -6/+28When the ***** will the EU tell Apple to stop bundling Safari, Quicktime, Itunes, and iLife? When will they tell Apple to not try to force iTunes and Safari on people who are just doing a quicktime software update? Apple abuses locked down systems more than any other computer manufacturer and nobody gives a *****.
- Metalcard, on 06/15/2009, -4/+26"The Commission had suggested to Microsoft that consumers be provided with a choice of Web browsers," EU regulators said today in a statement.
That is a stupid suggestion. Why would MS provide people with a competitors product from the get go? If people really don't want IE, they can easily download FireFox, Opera, Safari, or Chrome and never use IE again.
They had better go after Apple forcing people to use Safari and iTunes as well, since they are "tying" these products with OSX and "shielding" them from competition like IE and WMP in Windows. - kernel16, on 06/15/2009, -4/+25How can anyone call Microsoft a monopoly, Linux offers their product for FREE (predatory pricing much). How much more competitive can anyone get in a market? If people still don't want their products, then it must be seriously horrendous at meeting people's needs. But this is all besides the point because this is regarding browsers, so let's get to that.
IE is a crucial part of Microsoft Windows, ever tried uninstalling that thing? So I don't think it's really bundling, also when you remove the IE in Windows 7 all it does is remove the .exe, but not the whole thing so it must play a huge roll in Windows 7 overall as well. I suspect this Windows 7 without IE will be the same thing.
Besides all browsers are free, so what commercial competition are they preventing? - loper, on 06/15/2009, -1/+21ftp://ftp.mozilla.org/pub/mozilla.org/firefox/releases/
Although a large % of people probably have no idea what that means ... - jjones20, on 06/15/2009, -8/+28This is kind of funny, now when this all turns to ***** Microsoft can go "see, its ***** stupid, we've been telling you that"
- reposado, on 06/15/2009, -8/+28This is why there is very little innovation in Europe compaired to US and Asia.
Instead of building a superior product to compete with MS(ie. Firefox, Linux, apple's Leopard, etc), the Europeans at Oprah cries to their nanny government(aka EU) instead.
EU then comes in and fines MS a BILLION+ ***** dollars. I wonder how many jobs that move cost.
http://www.infoworld.com/d/security-central/update ... - ingotanarchist, on 06/15/2009, -3/+21It's actually an option on Windows 7. You can uninstall almost all Microsoft features.
- AlienMushroom, on 06/15/2009, -14/+32Uh oh, the EU is about to lose a significant source of income.
- NeoTechni, on 06/15/2009, -7/+25So the more successful a company is, the less it can do? that makes no sense
- Kazbaeden, on 06/15/2009, -7/+24Any reason why you feel this way? I use and enjoy opera myself. I find it fast, stable, and it has all the features I need.
However I am not happy about their position on this issue. - 1hrSleep, on 06/15/2009, -10/+26Unwarranted? Really?
- mithrasinvictus, on 06/15/2009, -6/+22off the top of my head:
1) they get to pick the default start page, theirs (ad revenue)
2) they get to pick the default search engine, theirs.
3) as long as they remain the dominant browser they can keep mangling web standards which would ultimately mean that, to use the web, you need their browser which only runs on their OS.
4) their browser could integrate functions from other products (like their office suite and server products) but not from competing products.
5) many people choose the default option to "check" each visited site with redmond. Access to all this data is valuable. - sathias, on 06/15/2009, -5/+21Yeah I'm sure every business in Europe which uses Windows servers would be thrilled about having to replace all their business infrastructure because of the ideological whim of the EU.
- vtnerd, on 06/15/2009, -6/+20No, mithra, and that analogy is flawed.
The presence of IE does not prevent other browsers from installing. - Brassbud, on 06/15/2009, -1/+15EU puzzled? I thought this is exactly what they wanted MS to do. I mean, when you sue the crap out of someone for doing something, and then they stop doing it, it seems strange to wonder why.
Now they want MS to bundle competitor software? That's like requiring Dell to put Gateway computers inside their boxes. - fandyllic, on 06/15/2009, -3/+17It's Anti-trust law and the reason the EU is doing this is because there is no Netscape.
- inactive, on 06/15/2009, -9/+23Monopolies in and of themselves are NOT illegal. Improperly using your monopoly to thwart competition is illegal. Microsoft was determined to be guilty of the latter well over a decade ago. And for some reason, the EU thinks that what happened 14 years ago gives them free reign to punish them forever. It is *****, plain and simple. Bundling your own browser with your OS is not an anti-competitive practice. Trying to force computers from including competition (like Netscape in the 90s) IS anti-competitive.
Until/uless the EU can provide ANY evidence that Microsoft is again apply pressure on computer manufacturers to not include Firefox, etc. then the EU has no case. At least not to any sane person - Octanus, on 06/14/2009, -0/+14dugg, but Microsoft said there will be ways of obtaining IE without the use of a browser such as FTP, and CDs
- mrsteveman1, on 06/15/2009, -1/+15Windows comes with something called background intelligent transfer service built in, it is what Windows Update uses. There is no reason Microsoft couldn't setup a service for downloading browsers just because IE isn't there.
They shouldn't do it anyway, because it isn't necessary, but the technical argument is invalid. - rahga, on 06/15/2009, -10/+23No matter what Microsoft does, they will be fined by the EU, and they will be fined a massive amount of money. They will be fined in one way or another by simply releasing Windows 7. When the EU has fined Microsoft in the past, it has directed the proceeds to things like farm subsidies. Microsoft can not win, and indeed know very well that they are going to take a hit. I can't fault them for doing this, since it really only hurts lawyers. (OEMs don't take a major hit from this, installing a browser is not hard)... there's no way the hatred at the EU is unwarranted in this case
- alais, on 06/15/2009, -3/+16douche
- kernel16, on 06/15/2009, -8/+20lulz?
- ak47ak47, on 06/15/2009, -4/+16i agree with rda, opera is such a weird browser. yeah it's fast, that's great, but so is chrome, firefox, and safari.
the settings are odd, the interface is unappealing, the password remembering feature is annoying (the dialog pops up in your face instead of out of your way like in FF and most other browsers), and that's just what i can think of off the top of my head, and it's a deal breaker. - Metalcard, on 06/15/2009, -3/+15Standards should be the same for all companies, no matter the size.
- redxii, on 06/15/2009, -0/+11Windows comes with TCP/IP, MS can make a program that downloads IE or other choices if you want them, or thru Windows Update.
Oh, and I do believe MSHTML remains intact (IE's rendering engine). Parts of Windows wouldn't work without it. - leakus, on 06/15/2009, -3/+14You have to be aware that the most important companies who sued, were actually the American companies Google, Oracle, Sun and IBM. So the EU is acting in American interest here. This is not a case of the EU hating on American businesses.
But you are right, nobody can force Microsoft to do business in the EU, but if they want to do business in the EU they have to oblige to European law. Just as European companies have to go by US law when they are selling in the USA. - DeanMix1234, on 06/15/2009, -8/+18FU** the MO****F****** EUROPEAN UNION..F*** THEM ALL...
I know, I'll get flagged..but you know what...F THE EU..
EU is bringing the Union countries..down..Who the hell are they to make such calls for the general public..Cummon ppl of EU wake up..take matters in your own hand... - chicagospur, on 06/15/2009, -0/+10The last time I looked, Norway was not in the EU.
- 1hrSleep, on 06/15/2009, -9/+19Nothing. The EU is just a useless farce of a governing body looking to cash in through whatever ways they can.
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