What is Digg?131 Comments
- Sun.Surfin, on 10/12/2007, -12/+143Z00k, why would you complain about this? I'm so glad that Apple got the ball rolling; finally, people are going to start getting DRM free music. That feature (shame it has to be considered a 'feature') shouldn't be exclusive to iTunes. If it were, it wouldn't be progress at all. These music "giants" will, hopefully, set an example of themselves and we'll start to see a lot of changes for the better.
Don't complain just because you don't like Microsoft... be happy that they're doing something positive that will offer more for the consumer. - cquinnd, on 10/12/2007, -11/+70Yeah, because Apple is the first company to sell music online without DRM.
The question is, will Zune non-DRM songs be priced higher as well? - klawz, on 10/12/2007, -10/+61quote
but a lot of pirates are ***** up my ability to enjoy entertainment
/quote
Seems like you have been brainwashed like many others. Just because the RIAA/MPAA bitch and whine about lost sales due to people downloading movies/music, doesn't mean those people would have bought the content in the first place, if they could not have downloaded it for free. I'm sick and tired of the RIAA/MPAA ***** up my ability to enjoy entertainment, the way I want to do it. If I want to pay to go see a movie/concert, then go and buy the same ***** content on DVD/CD, and then go buy it again on iTunes, I better be able to do damn well what-ever-the-***** I want with it since I paid or the same "license" 4 times over now. Until they do, I'll be damned if I pay for it more than once. - Wetzilla, on 10/12/2007, -16/+57Apple didn't announce that it would sell EMI's catalog without DRM, EMI announced they would be offering their entire catalog without DRM to every digital music retailer online. Apple had nothing to do with their decision, they just happen to be the largest retailer.
- chrono13, on 10/12/2007, -4/+44"They should drop DRM, price songs competitively (aka no ALBUM-ONLY sales), and up the punishment for illegal filesharing."
And if everyone simply bent over and swallowed DRM (as apposed to piracy) then what happens to your point 1? It doesn't happen.
Piracy is likely the reason driving these decisions. The content providers make their content unwieldy, strip us of our fair use rights and lock us into specific services and devices.
As an example, I can drive to the store to purchase a DVD. It comes with an unskippable 3 minute anti-piracy intro from the MAFIAA showing some movie-pirate stealing a car, breaking into a house, and setting children on fire, then I get a couple of FBI warnings. Next is the 10 minutes of unskippable advertisements and previews. And finally my movie will allow me to play it. But of course, only in a newer DVD player because the file structure has been altered. I then have to break the law to play my legally purchased DVD on my Linux system. I then break the law again (DMCA) by making it available in my media center.
Or... I could just torrent the movie, which is much more convenient than having to go buy the DVD. It comes as the Movie and Extras. No piracy warnings, no advertisements, and no restrictions. I can use it, view it and otherwise exercise my fair use rights all over it.
Piracy is forcing their hand. Soon there will be reasonably priced, DRM free, torrent enabled full DVD downloads. How could I possibly know this? Well, because it is their *only* option - Adapt or Die. - kaelyiesta, on 10/12/2007, -3/+31If DRM is being completely abandoned from the zune marketplace, then what will become of the subscription account that lets you listen to as much music as you want for $15/month? Surely they wont get rid of it, since last I heard, it was doing very well. I doubt very much that they will get rid of DRM content completely.
- klawz, on 10/12/2007, -8/+33quote
Apple is the first company to sell music online without DRM
/quote
F A R from the truth. Maybe they were the first to convince music labels to loosen up the grip on music-label content, but they were no where near the first company to sell drm-less music on the internet. Do some research. - S1ngular1ty1, on 10/12/2007, -5/+29emusic.com anyone ?
- RomulusX86, on 10/12/2007, -4/+28@Z00k
The first online music store to sell music without DRM was in fact emusic.com The site is mostly indie ,but props for apple to convincing the major labels to sell music without DRM. I still think apple should sell non-drm songs for the regular $.99 price tag. - kingfoot, on 10/12/2007, -5/+29while i dislike the zune and microsoft in general, i will tip my hat, because i hate drm more. also, it would take months for microsoft to negotiate this, so it's not really copycatting...
- chrono13, on 10/12/2007, -9/+31@yournamehere
""didn't MS save Apple from dying about 10 years ago?"
No. Microsoft purchased shares of Apple because it was legally bound to.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apple_computers#1994_to_1997:_Attempts_at_reinvention
"Macworld Expo, Steve Jobs announced that Apple would be entering into partnership with Microsoft. Settlement discussions regarding Apple's "Look and Feel" lawsuit and the "QuickTime piracy" lawsuit resulted in a five-year commitment from Microsoft to release Microsoft Office for Macintosh as well as a US$150 million investment in non-voting Apple stock. (This event is often inaccurately described as a "bailout" of Apple by Microsoft. Microsoft later sold its shares for a tidy profit.) It was also announced that Internet Explorer would be shipped as the default browser on the Macintosh. "
The first result on Google is Cnet's story: http://news.com.com/MS+to+invest+150+million+in+Apple/2100-1001_3-202143.html
"...they said they had agreed to work out a settlement to a long-standing dispute over whether Microsoft's Windows operating system infringes on any of Apple's patents."
IIRC it was filed over copyrights and not patents, but I could be wrong.
"you fanboys should understand that without MS they would have gone away."
I think the definition of a fanboy is making up false information to defend your choice of platform.
"they still own Apple stock."
I don't think that's true either...
"so no matter which way you swing it, there they are."
Unless you invite that killjoy 'Truth' to the party. - s-m-a-c-k, on 10/12/2007, -2/+23"I have to Re-Download all the songs again. Which can be done for Free a total of 5 times(After which you must Re-Purchase all the music again)..."
Please don't go spreading this *****... I just (today) switched PCs and upon trying to play a track downloaded on the other PC, the Zune software downloads music usage rights.... in this instance, I had already authorized three machines to use my Zune account, one of which was the machine I was moving from... you are provided the ability to deactivate any one of the three machines... you can do this once a month... this is the identical subscription model as Napster, Yahoo, and Rhapsody... no difference, probably because its MS's technology...
also, the Zune software realizes if you have Zune tracks that were downloaded from another PC even a different Zune user account and gives you the option of refreshing all the tracks en masse...
this is cool, because you can trade Zune DRMed tracks in the clear and get just get your software to refresh the media usage rights... this is the benefit of the subscription model...
so try reading reading... moron... - randomvictim, on 10/12/2007, -0/+19Not happening. Even if they could, they wouldn't.
- cquinnd, on 10/12/2007, -0/+17 @klawz
That was sarcasm.
I should have made it more clear I was responding to the first couple of comments in this thread. - pixelguru, on 10/12/2007, -5/+21only if you actually find someone else who owns a Zune, and who has the same taste in music as you. Odds anyone?
- johnpaul191, on 10/12/2007, -2/+16it sounds like nothing has actually had DRM removed yet... they just say they are working on it. from the article:
"Consumers have made it clear that unprotected music is something they want," Asher said. "We plan on offering it to them as soon as our label partners are comfortable with it."
that doesn't mean anything is available yet..... kind of misleading headline here. - DaffyDuck, on 10/12/2007, -2/+16foolfromhell,
Then sell your iPod and buy a Zune. And why are you repeating yourself? - s-m-a-c-k, on 10/12/2007, -4/+16I don't understand why all the bitching... it just goes to show you that the majority of diggs posters are ***** whiners and never satisfied....
- wonderchemist, on 10/12/2007, -6/+18The other question, will the Zune's wrap non-DRM songs with DRM 'feature' be disable for these songs?
- wazzledoozle2, on 10/12/2007, -2/+13All that's happening here is that you get a higher price, folks. WMA still doesnt run on Ipods, but AAC works on Zunes. Still the same low-bitrate, lossy files.
Maybe Apple will add support to syncing to Zune? - DaffyDuck, on 10/12/2007, -1/+11"If Microsoft did this first, people would bitch and moan that it was a desperate ploy for Microsoft to sell Zunes."
I don't think so. Removing DRM is a good thing no matter who does it. I'd congratulate Microsoft if they did it first. - foolfromhell, on 10/12/2007, -7/+17#1 Why does it matter that MS pays Universal for every Zune? It isnt affecting you.
#2 WHAT DRM ON VISTA? When Apple finally allows Blu-Ray or HD-DVD on their Macs, OSX WILL HAVE THE EXACT SAME DRM.
Blame the MPAA. not MS. The DRM is nessecary to run HDCP movies on ANY DAMNED OPERATING SYSTEM LEGALLY. In a year when Apple FINALLY introduces Blu-Ray/ HD-DVD to their Macs, only then will you shut up... but thats hoping too much. You idiots will continue bashing MS for their DRM in Windows when Apple is using the SAME DAMN CRAP DRM.
#3 since EMI decided to allow all their tracks DRM-less, ALL ONLINE STORES CAN SELL THEIR SONGS DRM-LESS. Meaning, the Zune store was going to be selling atleast EMI songs DRM-Less... - neuropsychguy, on 10/12/2007, -8/+18"Apple had nothing to do with their decision, they just happen to be the largest retailer."
Uh, I'm pretty sure Apple was the main reason EMI decided to offer DRM-free music. Why else was Steve Jobs making the announcement with the EMI people? Do you think EMI would have offered un-DRMed music if Apple hadn't pushed for it? Not a chance. - imcquill, on 10/12/2007, -2/+12Not so sure... in the post-EMI press conference, during the press conference the EMI exec said that they had always known Apple's belief that DRM was a bad idea, but they did their market research and came to Apple when they agreed.
- DaffyDuck, on 10/12/2007, -1/+9"It was Apple's idea to charge more."
And you know this how? Think about this. Prices for full albums are staying the same while bitrate is increasing. Only singles prices are increasing. Which one dislikes singles being sold, Apple or EMI? Record companies have been complaining about singles and their prices for a while. They prefer people to buy the full album. Apple doesn't really care as long as you buy something. - DaffyDuck, on 10/12/2007, -1/+9"The zune does not place DRM on anything it squirt. What is does is give music a 3x3 lifetime for anything that is received in the inbox. it's that simple."
So what you are saying is the DRM is added on the receiving end instead of the sending end. Same difference, really. - inactive, on 10/12/2007, -7/+14I think the music industry woke up when they realized their online revenue stream was in danger by governments angry at the non-interoperability of a lot of the music players. Sell non-DRM music online > not selling music online at all.
- soopafly, on 10/12/2007, -3/+10"they still own Apple stock. so no matter which way you swing it, there they are."
WOW!! I haven't heard that one in years. That was a pretty big hole you just crawled under from. - fkr3, on 10/12/2007, -3/+8Monkey see, monkey say. Go find another opinion, Apple isn't responsible for good outside of hardware and software.
- DaffyDuck, on 10/12/2007, -1/+6"No, what he is saying is that the Zune simply places the files into a folder and says to itself, "im just borrowing these, I have to delete them after three days or three plays". Its a 3 play song trial. Its no different from illegal file sharing if they let you keep them indefinitely."
But even if what you say is true (about the folders) then how is that not still digital rights management? We are arguing semantics here. One way or another, the shared files are DRM protected, whether it's in the file itself or in the location the file resides. Can you move the song out of the folder and have an unprotected file? - kirk06, on 10/12/2007, -1/+6Actually, it was EMI that said they raised the wholesale price of the tracks. They also stated they were keeping the wholesale price of full albums the same.
"EMI is introducing a new wholesale price for premium single track downloads, while maintaining the existing wholesale price for complete albums."
source: http://www.emigroup.com/Press/2007/press18.htm - EXIDY, on 10/12/2007, -1/+6"Microsoft says that it's dropping DRM from some of the catalog in the Zune store."
Is this a pre-announcement Zune Marketplace song purchases without DRM ... a new file format?
is that PlayForSure or something new?
will it be of the .WMA format?
will it play on the Zune player?
will it play on the iPod?
Can one "squirt" songs in a Zune social without DRM added?
Curious minds want to know - Jugalator, on 10/12/2007, -2/+7What would be particularly funny is if these are among the same people that complained about the new Zune music store with DRM'ed music.
- TomRemixed, on 10/12/2007, -3/+8DRM is essential and not really a bad thing when it comes to subscription music (Zune Marketplace, Rhapsody, Napster) and people who use it like me should know this. DRM shouldn't be on any purchased music though. If you pay for it you should be able to do what you want with it.
I hope Rhapsody will get these DRM free tracks also. - chrisutley, on 10/12/2007, -0/+4"All that's happening here is that you get a higher price, folks."
*****. In time DRM will be completely gone, and prices will go back down. This pricing discrepancy is only temporary. In the event the removal of DRM ultimately causes more piracy, then the industry will fight back with pricing or DRM as they should. - radiofrequency, on 10/12/2007, -1/+5Microsoft "says", but Microsoft has no official announcement and there is no agreement or partnership with a record label to provide DRM-free content, an announcement that is necessary because Microsoft doesn't actually own any rights to music.
This story is inaccurate. - EricJ2190, on 10/12/2007, -1/+4If Microsoft lives up to their word on this, I congratulate them. I do not really like Microsoft, but it is nice to see them do something right. Now we just need to get Sony to care about the customers, too. :)
- yensed, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3S-M-A-C-K, Please Re-Read my comment. "Which means after I install a fresh copy of Windows, Even thought I have a backup of my purchased music, I have to Re-Download all the songs again."
I "Purchase" my songs individually(Which I should have been more clear about). You use Zune Pass(Subscription). Totally different Digital Rights Management schemes.. - RatTrap, on 10/12/2007, -1/+4Take that RIAA.
- TheCheeks, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3@lukas88:
Music subscriptions are quite possibly the worst way to get music, ever. See what happens when you quit your subscription. Whoops, there goes your whole library, you'll never have access to it unless you give them more money. So in the end, you will never own your own music. - AppleSucks, on 10/12/2007, -16/+19
Apple didn't get the ball rolling out of any sense of fair play or listening to their users. Their hand was forced by eroupean countries banning or on the verge of banning the iTunes music stores and NOTHING else....... Apple have always been pro DRM that is until their bottom lines were threatened. Locking you into itunes locks you into ipods and draws you into Apple. MS have always had an anti-drm stance especially around the Media Centre but have been fored down that road by content providers. - Katana314, on 10/12/2007, -1/+4I think microsoft's a good company, they just screw a lot up. I certainly don't support any of the things they screw up, but this certainly isn't one of them.
- clyde2801, on 10/12/2007, -1/+4I agree with you completely, except for the 'good company' part.
- foolfromhell, on 10/12/2007, -3/+5Thats like saying, "Buy our songs and distribute them to ALL your friends and deny the deserving artists of money!!"
When you "squirt" without any DRM, you are DAMNED PIRATING.
MS shouldnt have ANY sympathy for pirates. They will never allow people to freely pirate. The Zune's squirt feature isnt for sharing songs. It is much more practical when there are 2 or more people and you want to show them a song. Then you can "squirt" the song and listen at the same time instead of sharing earbuds. The 3x3 "squirt"ing is MUCH more than the iPod.
I cant believe the idiocy of these fanboys. Yes... they ARE fanboys. A better term will be fanbots. They say the same damn thing again and again without any change in what they say, true or false. - superkendall, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2Note they didn't say anything about removing the 3x3 restrictions on sharing - after all, if they DRM files you ripped from a CD why would they do anything different just because the unprotected music came from somewhere else?
- jjesusfreak01, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2Zune pass songs would still have the DRM. Its not exactly the same. A WMA file in Windows can have many different attributes. You can have playback rights, sync rights, and if its a subscription, then they all will have timeouts depending on when the rights are renewed. If you buy a song from Microsoft with NO DRM, it has none of these attributes. It can be copied anywhere, played anywhere, whatever you want. Again, subscription services rely on DRM, and that isn't going to change, unless you can convince MS that if they let you download every song in their library that you will delete the files after canceling the subscription. People are only so honest.
- prockcore, on 10/12/2007, -4/+6"Uh, I'm pretty sure Apple was the main reason EMI decided to offer DRM-free music."
No. EMI has been experimenting with DRM-free music for a while. They did a couple of DRM-free albums on Yahoo's Music Store last year to gauge the market... well before Steve Jobs' letter. - Sonic84, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2This is another step in the right direction, hopefully Apple and Microsoft together will sway the music monolighs into dropping DRM.
- Tallon29, on 10/12/2007, -3/+5Comment abuse:
Here are a list of all EMI writers/artists if you're curious or would like to support those who encourage DRM-free music: http://www.emimusicpub.com/worldwide/global/_print-songwriters-list.html
Some very popular artists in that list, so this isn't just some small label doing this. - DeFex, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2just whan DRM seems to finally be dieing, they are starting to ruin streaming radio for no apparent reason.
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